List 17 new mtDNA sequences from FTDNA customers have appeared on the GenBank database. They belong to Haplogroups: H, H1a, H1a6, H3v, H6a1b4, H6c, HV0-T195C, HV4, I1a1b, I3a1, J1c1b1, T1a1q, U3a1c, U5a1b1, U5b2a1a1, V, V5 As usual I have added the data to my 'Checker' program  to ensure accuracy of transcription. Ian www.ianlogan.co.uk ----------------- MG436773(Swedish) FTDNA Haplogroup H6c 25-NOV-2017 T239C A263G 315.1C A750G A1438G A4769G C6869T A8860G G9804A A15326G T16362C A16482G MG436774(Norwegian) FTDNA Haplogroup H 25-NOV-2017 G185A A263G 315.1C A750G A1438G T4639C A4769G A8860G A15326G A15751T A16162G T16519C MG457776(Swedish) FTDNA Haplogroup T1a1q 25-NOV-2017 A73G T152C T195C A263G 309.1C 315.1C G709A A750G A1438G G1888A A2706G T4216C A4769G A4917G C7028T G8697A A8860G T9899C T10463C A11251G C11266T G11719A C12633A G13368A C14766T G14905A A15326G C15452A A15607G G15928A T16126C A16163G C16186T T16189C C16294T T16519C MG488279(German) FTDNA Haplogroup H3v 25-NOV-2017 A263G 309.1C 315.1C T408A A750G A1438G A4769G T6776C A8860G A15326G T16519C MG496254(Portuguese) FTDNA Haplogroup J1c1b1 25-NOV-2017 A73G G185A A188G G225A G228A A263G C295T 309.1C 315.1C C462T T482C T489C A750G A1438G A2706G G3010A T3394C A3796G T4216C A4769G G5773A C7028T A7184G A8860G A10398G A11251G G11719A A12612G G13708A C14766T T14798C A15326G C15452A C16069T T16126C C16192T T16422C MG496255(Swedish) FTDNA Haplogroup U3a1c 25-NOV-2017 A73G C150T T152Y A263G 315.1C A750G A1438G A1811G A2294G A2706G G3010A T4703C A4769G C6518T C7028T C7400T A8860G G9266A A10506G A11467G G11719A A12308G G12372A T12738C C13934T A14139G C14766T A15326G C15418T T15454C G15734A A16343G T16356C G16390A T16519C MG496256(Swedish) FTDNA Haplogroup U5b2a1a1 25-NOV-2017 A73G C150T A263G 315.1C A750G A896G A1438G C1721T A2706G T3197C A4732G A4769G G5585R C7028T A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G G11719A A12308G G12372A T13617C A13637G T14182C C14766T A15326G T15511C C16239T T16311C MG517557 FTDNA Haplogroup H1a6 25-NOV-2017 A73G C151T A263G 315.1C A750G A1438G G3010A A4769G A8860G A11893G A15326G A16162G T16189C T16519C MG518475(Swedish) FTDNA Haplogroup H1a 25-NOV-2017 A73G A263G 315.1C A750G A1438G G3010A A4769G A8860G A15326G A16162G T16519C MG518521(France) FTDNA Haplogroup I3a1 25-NOV-2017 A73G T152C T199C T204C G207A T239C T250C A263G 315.1C 523.1C 523.2A 523.3C 523.4A 523.5C 523.6A 573.1C 573.2C A750G A1438G G1719A A2706G G2849A A4529T A4769G C7028T A8860G T10034C T10238C A10398G G11719A G12501A C12705T A13395G A13780G C14766T G15043A A15326G A15924G T16086C G16129A C16223T G16391A T16519C MG519781(Finnish) FTDNA Haplogroup V5 25-NOV-2017 T72C A93G A263G 309.1C 315.1C A750G A1438G A2706G G4580A A4769G C7028T A8860G T14550C A15326G C15904T A16203G T16298C MG520372(Finnish) FTDNA Haplogroup U5a1b1 25-NOV-2017 A73G A263G 315.1C A750G A1438G A2706G T3197C A4769G C7028T A8860G G9477A A9667G A11467G G11719A A12308G G12372A T13617C C14766T A14793G A15218G A15326G T16093C C16256T C16270T C16291T C16292T T16311Y A16399G MG546004(English) FTDNA Haplogroup HVO-T195C 25-NOV-2017 T72C T195C A263G 309.1C 315.1C A750G A1438G A2706G A4769G C7028T A8860G A15326G T16298C MG546008(Bulgarian) FTDNA Haplogroup HV4 25-NOV-2017 A263G 309.1C 309.2C 315.1C A750G A1438G A2706G A4769G C7028T T7094C A8860G A9355G A15326G MG548630(Irish) FTDNA Haplogroup H6a1b4 25-NOV-2017 T239C A263G 315.1C 523.1C 523.2A A750G A1438G G3915A A4727G A4769G A8860G G9380A G10589A C10697T A15326G T16249C T16362C A16482G MG548631(Swedish) FTDNA Haplogroup V 25-NOV-2017 T72C A200G A263G 309.1C 315.1C A750G A1438G A2706G A2775G T3386C G4580A A4769G G5460A A6116G C7028T A8860G C14521Y A14914C A15326G C15904T T16298C MG548632(Welsh) FTDNA Haplogroup I1a1b 25-NOV-2017 A73G T199C G203A T204C T250C A263G 315.1C 455.1T 573.1C 573.2C 573.3C 573.4C A750G A1438G G1719A A2706G A3447G C3990T A4529T A4769G G6734A C7028T G8251A G8616T A8860G G9947A T10034C T10238C A10398G T10915C G11719A G12501A C12705T A13780G T14182C C14766T G15043A A15326G A15924G G16129A T16172C C16223T T16311C G16391A T16519C

Eric Shared matches can still be valuable clues, not just as definite about where the shared ancestry is as a TG. I have many tested cousins of assorted flavours, and as expected, not all of us match our (now) known "cousins" at the same spots but we do share a lot of ancestors and have expanded our trees, demolished brickwalls, regardless. Yes I really like having a TG to fully confirm the DNA and tree but shared matches with trees to compare that also connect aren't just "chaff". If one of the "chaff" matches showed up with a tree attached and a known relative in it, you wouldn't be ignoring them, they might be the clue to what happened to great uncle Harry when he disappeared from xyz. it would be better if the Relatives in Common had some sorting/filtering  options though, I do agree. Lorna Henderson http://LornaHen.com On 27/11/17 13:37, Eric S Johnson wrote: > So I can't help but wonder whether I'm missing something: 23andMe's "new > experience" provides, at the bottom of a match page's left-hand pane, > "relatives in common." As I understand it, anyone for whom "yes" is marked > is part of a "triangulated group" consisting of "me," my 23andMe "DNA > cousin," and all the other "yes"-marked folks in this RiC list. Correct? > > > > So, why does this list include anyone marked as "no"? Aren't those "no"s > just chaff? In which case, why's 23andMe include them (thus forcing us to > click through page after page of RiCs in order to find the few "yes"s)? > > > > Best, > > Eric > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I support every part of Tammy's message. Bill Australia -----Original Message----- From: GENEALOGY-DNA [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tammy Sent: Monday, 27 November 2017 11:06 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [DNA] Questions about Autosomal Tests Hi Lindsey, I have tested oh, probably more then 15 people in both my biological family and my adopted family, (since they couldn't have children, I wanted to preserve their dna record, might help other people someday). I've done all my testing at FTDNA, (sale on now). I prefer the cheek swab at FTDNA to the saliva test of ancestryDNA. I feel that more cells are collected with a cheek swab. I've tried to test my oldest living people on my lines, sort of as a gift to their future descendants. Once their gone, the chance to preserve that is also gone. I think the more people who test, and as time goes on, the larger the databases get, the better it will be for all researchers, going forward. FTDNA is not membership based, so no membership fees. They keep some of your dna, should you want to order different tests that they order, later on... so you don't have to do swabs again. I recommend everyone who tests, (at any company) download their raw data, and upload it to http://gedmatch.com, so many people from, I think, up to 4 or 5 different testing companies can compare their results there. Again not a membership based site, you just register, log on and enjoy the community. I refuse to use ancestryDNA, so I'm hoping that many people who do, will upload to gedmatch.com, so that I might have a chance to find my match to them, should there be one. I think that ancestry gets a lot of people to purchase their tests, because of the marketing they do. I hope my thoughts have helped you decide what you need to. If it comes down to how useful first cousin testing can be. I'd say yes it can be very useful now, and as more people test and add themselves to the databases... the better it will become. I've also tested my youngest grandchildren, hopefully the mix of their dna will again help some other people in their quest to find out more. Take care, Tammy BC Canada ~ ~ ~ Webmaster http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cotyroneireland/index.html http://tammymitchell.com [email protected] On 11/24/2017 6:04 AM, Lindsey Britton wrote: > Last week I used two coupons to order FF for 2nd cousins of the half blood who share a great-grandmother. Both descend from her daughter, one from the daughter's son, the other from the daughter's daughter. Consequently both are on the great-grandmother's X line. > > This great-grandmother was from Prince George County and loss of records has prevented me from identifying her grandmothers. I'm hoping that X line information from the two half-blood cousins plus my results (I descend from the son of the great grandmother's son) will help me find others related on this line. > > Later generations of these families frequently married their cousins so I wouldn't be surprised if the parents of this great-grandmother were related. The grandparents of my half-blood cousins were first cousins. > > I see that FF is a Black Friday special and am considering a test for my first cousin who descends from my father's sister and is also on this great-grandmother's x line. > > I think buying tests for cousins in the pursuit of elusive ancestors is pure speculation and am not happy about doing it. How much value does the list think the first-cousin comparison would be likely to add? > > Another question. Ancestry tests are on sale for Black Friday. Is it true that Ancestry sells results to medical researchers and that those who don't subscribe do not get full access to matches or cannot contact their matches? > > Lost Cousins is promoting Ancestry over FTDNA because of the larger database but if you don't have full access to the database unless you subscribe its size is irrelevant. Furthermore, I don't need 9000 matches many of whom know nothing about their ancestors or have Ancestry trees full of mistakes--I need only a few good matches with sound pedigrees. > > The main advantage I see at Ancestry is Mt-DNA information which, in this case, could be useful. > > Lindsey > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

So I can't help but wonder whether I'm missing something: 23andMe's "new experience" provides, at the bottom of a match page's left-hand pane, "relatives in common." As I understand it, anyone for whom "yes" is marked is part of a "triangulated group" consisting of "me," my 23andMe "DNA cousin," and all the other "yes"-marked folks in this RiC list. Correct? So, why does this list include anyone marked as "no"? Aren't those "no"s just chaff? In which case, why's 23andMe include them (thus forcing us to click through page after page of RiCs in order to find the few "yes"s)? Best, Eric

I agree with Tammy but will add one point. Testing first cousins is almost as important as testing siblings. Each person gets his own personalized ration of DNA representing all the previous generations. Just as siblings get a different mix from each parent, so does each cousin. Hidden in everyone's genes are tiny clues to the past that you may only find in one individual... and you'll never know that unless you test. Finding matches is just as dependent on having access to the testees' DNA. Only by testing everywhere and uploading to Gedmatch can you be sure you're maximizing your chances. Doris On Sun, Nov 26, 2017 at 7:06 PM, Tammy <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Lindsey, > I have tested oh, probably more then 15 people in both my biological > family and my adopted family, (since they couldn't have children, I wanted > to preserve their dna record, might help other people someday). > > I've done all my testing at FTDNA, (sale on now). I prefer the cheek swab > at FTDNA to the saliva test of ancestryDNA. I feel that more cells are > collected with a cheek swab. I've tried to test my oldest living people on > my lines, sort of as a gift to their future descendants. Once their gone, > the chance to preserve that is also gone. I think the more people who test, > and as time goes on, the larger the databases get, the better it will be > for all researchers, going forward. > > FTDNA is not membership based, so no membership fees. They keep some of > your dna, should you want to order different tests that they order, later > on... so you don't have to do swabs again. > > I recommend everyone who tests, (at any company) download their raw data, > and upload it to http://gedmatch.com, so many people from, I think, up to > 4 or 5 different testing companies can compare their results there. Again > not a membership based site, you just register, log on and enjoy the > community. > > I refuse to use ancestryDNA, so I'm hoping that many people who do, will > upload to gedmatch.com, so that I might have a chance to find my match to > them, should there be one. I think that ancestry gets a lot of people to > purchase their tests, because of the marketing they do. > > I hope my thoughts have helped you decide what you need to. If it comes > down to how useful first cousin testing can be. I'd say yes it can be very > useful now, and as more people test and add themselves to the databases... > the better it will become. I've also tested my youngest grandchildren, > hopefully the mix of their dna will again help some other people in their > quest to find out more. > > Take care, > Tammy > BC Canada > > ~ ~ ~ > Webmaster > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cotyroneir > eland/index.html > http://tammymitchell.com > [email protected] > > > > > On 11/24/2017 6:04 AM, Lindsey Britton wrote: > >> Last week I used two coupons to order FF for 2nd cousins of the half >> blood who share a great-grandmother. Both descend from her daughter, one >> from the daughter's son, the other from the daughter's daughter. >> Consequently both are on the great-grandmother's X line. >> >> This great-grandmother was from Prince George County and loss of records >> has prevented me from identifying her grandmothers. I'm hoping that X line >> information from the two half-blood cousins plus my results (I descend from >> the son of the great grandmother's son) will help me find others related on >> this line. >> >> Later generations of these families frequently married their cousins so I >> wouldn't be surprised if the parents of this great-grandmother were >> related. The grandparents of my half-blood cousins were first cousins. >> >> I see that FF is a Black Friday special and am considering a test for my >> first cousin who descends from my father's sister and is also on this >> great-grandmother's x line. >> >> I think buying tests for cousins in the pursuit of elusive ancestors is >> pure speculation and am not happy about doing it. How much value does the >> list think the first-cousin comparison would be likely to add? >> >> Another question. Ancestry tests are on sale for Black Friday. Is it >> true that Ancestry sells results to medical researchers and that those who >> don't subscribe do not get full access to matches or cannot contact their >> matches? >> >> Lost Cousins is promoting Ancestry over FTDNA because of the larger >> database but if you don't have full access to the database unless you >> subscribe its size is irrelevant. Furthermore, I don't need 9000 matches >> many of whom know nothing about their ancestors or have Ancestry trees full >> of mistakes--I need only a few good matches with sound pedigrees. >> >> The main advantage I see at Ancestry is Mt-DNA information which, in this >> case, could be useful. >> >> Lindsey >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

List Bernard Secher has kindly told me the paper accompanying these sequences is now available under a different title at: http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/284/1867/20171540 Ian -------------------------------------- > List >> >> A set of 14 mtDNA sequences from ancient remains in Poland >> have appeared on the GenBank database. >> >> The sequences are to accompany a paper (unpublished so far): >> >>  Tassi,F., et al. >> 'The Kurgan migrations revisited: Genome diversity >> in the Globular Amphorae culture' >> >> 7 of the sequences are described as 'complete' >> and are listed here (a further 7 sequences are 'partials'). >> >> The 'complete' sequences belong to Haplogroups: >> H28a, J1c2, K1b1a1, U5b1d1a, U5b2a2b1, U5b2b1a1 >> >> I have added the sequences to my Checker program; >> but allowance has to be made for the strange handling >> of the 3106- mutation and missing bases at the ends of the sequences. >> >> Ian >> www.ianlogan.co.uk >> -------------------- >> MF114212(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup U5b2b1a1 21-NOV-2017 >> A73G C150T A263G C307-314N A750G A1438G C1721T G2129N A2706G >> T3197C A3861G A4769G C7028T G7396N A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G A11653G >> G11719A A12308G G12372A A12634G T13617C A13630G A13637G T14182C >> C14766T A15326G >> G15497A C16270T C16292T T16362C >> >> MF114213(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup H28a 21-NOV-2017 >> C186A A263G A302N A750G A1438G A4769G T8715C A8860G C11191T A15326G >> T16093C T16519C >> >> MF114214(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup U5b1d1a 21-NOV-2017 >> A73G C150T A263G T742C A750G A1438G A2706G T3197C A3441G A4769G >> C5437T A5501N A5656G T5918C C7028T A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G G11719A >> A12308G G12372A T13617C T14182C C14766T A15326G G15355A T15721C C16270T >> >> MF114220(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup H28a 21-NOV-2017 >> C186A A263G A750G A1438G A4769G T8715C A8860G C11191T A15326G T16093C >> A16374N T16519C >> >> MF114221(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup K1b1a1 21-NOV-2017 >> A73G T152C A263G A750G T1189C A1438G A1811G A2706G A3480G A4769G >> G5913A C7028T C8429T A8805G A8860G G9055A T9698C G9962A A10289G A10398G >> A10550G T11299C A11467G G11719A A11923G A12308G G12372A C13967T >> C14167T C14766T >> T14798C G15257A A15326G C15946T T16093C T16224C T16311C G16319A >> A16463G T16519C >> >> MF114222(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup J1c2 21-NOV-2017 >> A73G G185A A188G G228A A263G C295T C462T T489C A750G A1438G >> A2706G G3010A T4216C A4769G C7028T A7245G A8860G A10398G A11251G A11654G >> G11719A A12612G G13708A C14766T T14783C T14798C A15326G C15452A >> C16069T T16126C >> T16519C >> >> MF114223(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup U5b2a2b1 21-NOV-2017 >> A73G C150T A263G A750G G1393A A1438G C1721T A2706G A2757G T3197C >> C3212T A4732G A4769G C4843T C7028T A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G G11719A >> A12308G G12372A T13617C A13637G T14182C C14766T T14956C A15326G >> T16189C C16192T >> C16270T G16398A

Dear Eric, The answer to your first question is "yes". The reason that 23andMe includes the people in the "no" category is that this information can be helpful if you are trying to organize clusters of related people. Let's say that you are one of 4 people who have tested at 23andMe and that these 4 people are all 4th cousins to each other on different lines of descent from a shared ancestral couple. Let's call these 3 cousins of yours A, B, and C to keep them straight. Let's say that you share the same segment of DNA with A and B and thus the 3 of you form a triangulated group. Let's say that C shares a different segment of DNA with you than the one you share with A and B and that C also shares a DNA segment with both A and B. It is helpful for you to know if A and/or B share DNA with C. In such situations 23andMe will enter a "no" in the Shared DNA column under C's name on the rows for A and B when you pull up C on your match list in DNA Relatives. A secondary question has to do with the probability that a small percentage in the column under C's name is genealogically significant when A and B share an HIR with C. There are several possibilities here: 1. The HIR that C shares with A or B is a false match. 2. The HIR that C shares with A or B represents a true shared segment (IBD) passed down through the same ancestral line that you share in common with A, B, and C. 3. The HIR that C shares with A or B represents a true shared segment (IBD) passed down through a different ancestral line than the one you know you share in common with A, B, and C. It is up to you to sort out which of the above the possibilities is the correct one. Chromosome mapping and using phased data can help you sort these issues out. I have often wondered what the probability is that cousins such as A, B, and C will have either option #1 above occur or option #3 occur. The probability of option #3 will of course depend to a significant extent on the degree of endogamy among A, B, and C. The higher the degree of endogamy, the higher the probability of option #3 occurring. The probability of option #1 is probably reasonably high if the shared percentage is 10% or less. So there is definitely some degree of "chaff" in the "no" column. It is up to you to sort the wheat from the chaff. I would like it if 23andMe would allow us to sort the Shared DNA column and the column next to it, but they haven't created that option yet. Sincerely, Tim Janzen -----Original Message----- From: GENEALOGY-DNA [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Eric S Johnson Sent: Sunday, November 26, 2017 4:38 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [DNA] 23andMe TGs So I can't help but wonder whether I'm missing something: 23andMe's "new experience" provides, at the bottom of a match page's left-hand pane, "relatives in common." As I understand it, anyone for whom "yes" is marked is part of a "triangulated group" consisting of "me," my 23andMe "DNA cousin," and all the other "yes"-marked folks in this RiC list. Correct? So, why does this list include anyone marked as "no"? Aren't those "no"s just chaff? In which case, why's 23andMe include them (thus forcing us to click through page after page of RiCs in order to find the few "yes"s)? Best, Eric

List A set of 14 mtDNA sequences from ancient remains in Poland have appeared on the GenBank database. The sequences are to accompany a paper (unpublished so far):  Tassi,F., et al. 'The Kurgan migrations revisited: Genome diversity in the Globular Amphorae culture' 7 of the sequences are described as 'complete' and are listed here (a further 7 sequences are 'partials'). The 'complete' sequences belong to Haplogroups: H28a, J1c2, K1b1a1, U5b1d1a, U5b2a2b1, U5b2b1a1 I have added the sequences to my Checker program; but allowance has to be made for the strange handling of the 3106- mutation and missing bases at the ends of the sequences. Ian www.ianlogan.co.uk -------------------- MF114212(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup U5b2b1a1 21-NOV-2017 A73G C150T A263G C307-314N A750G A1438G C1721T G2129N A2706G T3197C A3861G A4769G C7028T G7396N A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G A11653G G11719A A12308G G12372A A12634G T13617C A13630G A13637G T14182C C14766T A15326G G15497A C16270T C16292T T16362C MF114213(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup H28a 21-NOV-2017 C186A A263G A302N A750G A1438G A4769G T8715C A8860G C11191T A15326G T16093C T16519C MF114214(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup U5b1d1a 21-NOV-2017 A73G C150T A263G T742C A750G A1438G A2706G T3197C A3441G A4769G C5437T A5501N A5656G T5918C C7028T A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G G11719A A12308G G12372A T13617C T14182C C14766T A15326G G15355A T15721C C16270T MF114220(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup H28a 21-NOV-2017 C186A A263G A750G A1438G A4769G T8715C A8860G C11191T A15326G T16093C A16374N T16519C MF114221(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup K1b1a1 21-NOV-2017 A73G T152C A263G A750G T1189C A1438G A1811G A2706G A3480G A4769G G5913A C7028T C8429T A8805G A8860G G9055A T9698C G9962A A10289G A10398G A10550G T11299C A11467G G11719A A11923G A12308G G12372A C13967T C14167T C14766T T14798C G15257A A15326G C15946T T16093C T16224C T16311C G16319A A16463G T16519C MF114222(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup J1c2 21-NOV-2017 A73G G185A A188G G228A A263G C295T C462T T489C A750G A1438G A2706G G3010A T4216C A4769G C7028T A7245G A8860G A10398G A11251G A11654G G11719A A12612G G13708A C14766T T14783C T14798C A15326G C15452A C16069T T16126C T16519C MF114223(Poland-ancient) Tassi Haplogroup U5b2a2b1 21-NOV-2017 A73G C150T A263G A750G G1393A A1438G C1721T A2706G A2757G T3197C C3212T A4732G A4769G C4843T C7028T A7768G A8860G G9477A A11467G G11719A A12308G G12372A T13617C A13637G T14182C C14766T T14956C A15326G T16189C C16192T C16270T G16398A

Hi Lindsey, I have tested oh, probably more then 15 people in both my biological family and my adopted family, (since they couldn't have children, I wanted to preserve their dna record, might help other people someday). I've done all my testing at FTDNA, (sale on now). I prefer the cheek swab at FTDNA to the saliva test of ancestryDNA. I feel that more cells are collected with a cheek swab. I've tried to test my oldest living people on my lines, sort of as a gift to their future descendants. Once their gone, the chance to preserve that is also gone. I think the more people who test, and as time goes on, the larger the databases get, the better it will be for all researchers, going forward. FTDNA is not membership based, so no membership fees. They keep some of your dna, should you want to order different tests that they order, later on... so you don't have to do swabs again. I recommend everyone who tests, (at any company) download their raw data, and upload it to http://gedmatch.com, so many people from, I think, up to 4 or 5 different testing companies can compare their results there. Again not a membership based site, you just register, log on and enjoy the community. I refuse to use ancestryDNA, so I'm hoping that many people who do, will upload to gedmatch.com, so that I might have a chance to find my match to them, should there be one. I think that ancestry gets a lot of people to purchase their tests, because of the marketing they do. I hope my thoughts have helped you decide what you need to. If it comes down to how useful first cousin testing can be. I'd say yes it can be very useful now, and as more people test and add themselves to the databases... the better it will become. I've also tested my youngest grandchildren, hopefully the mix of their dna will again help some other people in their quest to find out more. Take care, Tammy BC Canada ~ ~ ~ Webmaster http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cotyroneireland/index.html http://tammymitchell.com [email protected] On 11/24/2017 6:04 AM, Lindsey Britton wrote: > Last week I used two coupons to order FF for 2nd cousins of the half blood who share a great-grandmother. Both descend from her daughter, one from the daughter's son, the other from the daughter's daughter. Consequently both are on the great-grandmother's X line. > > This great-grandmother was from Prince George County and loss of records has prevented me from identifying her grandmothers. I'm hoping that X line information from the two half-blood cousins plus my results (I descend from the son of the great grandmother's son) will help me find others related on this line. > > Later generations of these families frequently married their cousins so I wouldn't be surprised if the parents of this great-grandmother were related. The grandparents of my half-blood cousins were first cousins. > > I see that FF is a Black Friday special and am considering a test for my first cousin who descends from my father's sister and is also on this great-grandmother's x line. > > I think buying tests for cousins in the pursuit of elusive ancestors is pure speculation and am not happy about doing it. How much value does the list think the first-cousin comparison would be likely to add? > > Another question. Ancestry tests are on sale for Black Friday. Is it true that Ancestry sells results to medical researchers and that those who don't subscribe do not get full access to matches or cannot contact their matches? > > Lost Cousins is promoting Ancestry over FTDNA because of the larger database but if you don't have full access to the database unless you subscribe its size is irrelevant. Furthermore, I don't need 9000 matches many of whom know nothing about their ancestors or have Ancestry trees full of mistakes--I need only a few good matches with sound pedigrees. > > The main advantage I see at Ancestry is Mt-DNA information which, in this case, could be useful. > > Lindsey > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

With autosomal DNA, you do not need to restrict the test to males. Any of the descendants of your great-grandfather, male or female, are likely to have some of his atDNA. So you should test female descendants as well as males. On Sat, 25 Nov 2017 13:12:08 -0700 Gail Schinnerer Jorgensen <[email protected]> wrote: I have tested my brother at all the major testing companies. He is the only male from my Dad's line who is alive. My first cousins from that side are all from my father's sister. I however, just followed my great grandfather's line and realized that there is one male 2nd cousin that perhaps I could persuade to test! Gail ~ Gail Schinnerer Jorgensen ~ On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 11:41 PM, Tim Janzen <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Gail, > In addition to Stephanie's excellent suggestions, I would also suggest > that testing the oldest generation of the descendents of your > great-grandfather using autosomal DNA tests with the major genetic > genealogical testing companies maximizes the amount of autosomal DNA from > your great-grandfather you can acquire and this data will hopefully help > you determine who your great-grandfather's parents were.  If your father > isn't alive, then I would also do autosomal testing on your brother, as > well as any of your father's siblings or first cousins who might be alive. > Sincerely, > Tim Janzen > > On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > > During my research of my dad?s family, I discovered that my dad?s > father?s > > father (my dad?s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband > > and given his mothers husband name. > > What this means to me is my great grandfather?s ancestors need to be > > found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches ? One of > > them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic > > distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have > not > > figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know > > where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common > > ancestor as I mentioned so far I can?t figure it out. > > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the > places > > we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have > > uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > > Any help is appreciated, > > Gail Jorgensen

For many of my mtDNA matches, the person tested has not added their oldest known female ancestor. Some have even put up their oldest known male ancestor. I believe showing the oldest known female ancestor would be helpful. What do you readers of this list think? If yes, maybe some of the FTDNA staff reading this message could get FTDNA to send an e-mail to each person having done the mtDNA test and suggest they record their oldest known female ancestor. Thanks. Tom Howle

Tom, There is a difference between an oldest known female ancestor, and the oldest known female on your maternal line of descent. I inherited my mtDNA from my maternal line great-grandmother, 1856-1926. I know almost nothing about her, except she was maybe German and in the V3c haplogroup. On the other hand, my father's maternal ancestry is ancient, but none of those women will match my mt haplogroup. I list my maternal great-grandmother as my oldest known female ancestor. Marleen Van Horne

Dave, I did forget to mention the number of DNA markers that we tested on my brother. It was Y-DNA 111. I had already signed my brother up for ysearch BUT I am so new in understanding DNA as a genealogy tool that the ysearch felt overwhelming to me. I will go ahead an explore it again using your examples. Gail ~ Gail Schinnerer Jorgensen ~ On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 3:14 AM, Dave Hamm <[email protected]> wrote: > Gail, > > You didn't mention how many Y-DNA markers you tested for, but if you > have 37 markers or more, then you should be able to get a reasonable > estimate of the male line from ysearch.org. > > With proper analysis, ysearch will also give pretty good clues for the > country of origin. > > Basically, you want to look for your closest matches, so select "Search > for genetic matches" > > Here is an example I did 10 years ago, estimating that my match for > country of origin would be near Crewkerne, England. My eventual actual > match was living about 20 miles from Crewkerne in Somerset. > > However, I should say that the ysearch web site is not very well > maintained, and sometimes gives an error. > > Just try again. Here is my study from 10 years ago: > > http://ham-country.com/HamCountry/HAM_DNA_Project/Groups/HAM_DNA_Group001_ > ANCESTRAL.html > > It is easiest to repeat that by skipping down to step #5. > > - At ysearch, do the "Search for genetic matches" > If you get an error screen try again until you get the error free screen. > > Next, in the screen for "Search for Genetic Matches" > - click on the "Click here > <http://www.ysearch.org/search_search.asp?uid=&freeentry=true>to enter > any sequence and search by Haplotype. > > and then enter your Y-DNA results. > > There are parameters at the bottom of this page for adjusting how close > of a match that you would want to see. > > Then, as I did in the Ancestral study, add up the surnames (just as I > had added up the 'countries of origin' - I had ignored those in the > U.S., and added up those in foreign countries). The highest total > surname should be your most likely surname. > > - Dave Hamm > > RE: > On 11/25/2017 12:14 AM, [email protected] wrote: > > Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 21:56:49 -0700 > > From: Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: [DNA] Finding father of paternal great grandfather > > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > > > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > > During my research of my dad?s family, I discovered that my dad?s > father?s father (my dad?s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers > husband and given his mothers husband name. > > What this means to me is my great grandfather?s ancestors need to be > found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches ? One > of them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic > distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have not > figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know > where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common > ancestor as I mentioned so far I can?t figure it out. > > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the > places we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have > uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > > Any help is appreciated, > > Gail Jorgensen > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I have tested my brother at all the major testing companies. He is the only male from my Dad's line who is alive. My first cousins from that side are all from my father's sister. I however, just followed my great grandfather's line and realized that there is one male 2nd cousin that perhaps I could persuade to test! Gail ~ Gail Schinnerer Jorgensen ~ On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 11:41 PM, Tim Janzen <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Gail, > In addition to Stephanie's excellent suggestions, I would also suggest > that testing the oldest generation of the descendents of your > great-grandfather using autosomal DNA tests with the major genetic > genealogical testing companies maximizes the amount of autosomal DNA from > your great-grandfather you can acquire and this data will hopefully help > you determine who your great-grandfather's parents were. If your father > isn't alive, then I would also do autosomal testing on your brother, as > well as any of your father's siblings or first cousins who might be alive. > Sincerely, > Tim Janzen > > On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > > During my research of my dad’s family, I discovered that my dad’s > father’s > > father (my dad’s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband > > and given his mothers husband name. > > What this means to me is my great grandfather’s ancestors need to be > > found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches – One of > > them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic > > distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have > not > > figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know > > where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common > > ancestor as I mentioned so far I can’t figure it out. > > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the > places > > we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have > > uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > > Any help is appreciated, > > Gail Jorgensen > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Stephanie, That is my hope, that through aDNA tests in many places that the puzzle will eventually be solved. Gail ~ Gail Schinnerer Jorgensen ~ On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 10:14 PM, Stephanie Ray <[email protected]> wrote: > Gail, just really briefly, I can tell you you that male Y-DNA is so stable > that it will give you matches from before the time that last names came > into use (circa 1400AD). > > In other words, with cousins that are so distant that they will have other > names. > > Given that, however, the correct name may show up... and can be > corroborated with short-term aDNA tests through Ancestry or 23andMe... > > Best regards, > Stephanie > > Admin, Cobb DNA project > Member #5587, Guild of One Name Studies > > On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > > During my research of my dad’s family, I discovered that my dad’s > father’s > > father (my dad’s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband > > and given his mothers husband name. > > What this means to me is my great grandfather’s ancestors need to be > > found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches – One of > > them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic > > distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have > not > > figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know > > where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common > > ancestor as I mentioned so far I can’t figure it out. > > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the > places > > we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have > > uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > > Any help is appreciated, > > Gail Jorgensen > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Lindsay, if you are looking for related descendants from early ancestors you need as many different DNA results from relatives as you can get, particularly if you are looking for connections at the third cousin level and beyond. I personally prefer FTDNA, as it has the widest range of test types, and the invaluable ICW tool, plus the ability to download to GEDmatch to compare with people who have tested elsewhere. The older 23andMe tests would be good, but V5 recent ones are less valuable as, although they can be downloaded to Gedmatch, they can only be used in one-to-one tests there. I tested at 23andMe in the days of V2 tests, and results up to V4 are fine for modern comparisons but I wouldn't recommend new tests there. Ancestry tests are useful, particularly if you are all North American testers, and they are also downloadable to Gedmatch, and FTDNA. Whatever you do, I would suggest you download all tests you have access to, or can influence, to GEDmatch, where you can compare yourself and your relatives to everyone else in that database, plus you have control over default values, which can be very useful if you are looking for distant cousins. Belinda -----Original Message----- From: GENEALOGY-DNA [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Lindsey Britton Last week I used two coupons to order FF for 2nd cousins of the half blood who share a great-grandmother. Both descend from her daughter, one from the daughter's son, the other from the daughter's daughter. Consequently both are on the great-grandmother's X line. This great-grandmother was from Prince George County and loss of records has prevented me from identifying her grandmothers. I'm hoping that X line information from the two half-blood cousins plus my results (I descend from the son of the great grandmother's son) will help me find others related on this line. Later generations of these families frequently married their cousins so I wouldn't be surprised if the parents of this great-grandmother were related. The grandparents of my half-blood cousins were first cousins. I see that FF is a Black Friday special and am considering a test for my first cousin who descends from my father's sister and is also on this great-grandmother's x line. I think buying tests for cousins in the pursuit of elusive ancestors is pure speculation and am not happy about doing it. How much value does the list think the first-cousin comparison would be likely to add?

Gail, You didn't mention how many Y-DNA markers you tested for, but if you have 37 markers or more, then you should be able to get a reasonable estimate of the male line from ysearch.org. With proper analysis, ysearch will also give pretty good clues for the country of origin. Basically, you want to look for your closest matches, so select "Search for genetic matches" Here is an example I did 10 years ago, estimating that my match for country of origin would be near Crewkerne, England. My eventual actual match was living about 20 miles from Crewkerne in Somerset. However, I should say that the ysearch web site is not very well maintained, and sometimes gives an error. Just try again. Here is my study from 10 years ago: http://ham-country.com/HamCountry/HAM_DNA_Project/Groups/HAM_DNA_Group001_ANCESTRAL.html It is easiest to repeat that by skipping down to step #5. - At ysearch, do the "Search for genetic matches" If you get an error screen try again until you get the error free screen. Next, in the screen for "Search for Genetic Matches"   - click on the "Click here <http://www.ysearch.org/search_search.asp?uid=&freeentry=true>to enter any sequence and search by Haplotype. and then enter your Y-DNA results. There are parameters at the bottom of this page for adjusting how close of a match that you would want to see. Then, as I did in the Ancestral study, add up the surnames (just as I had added up the 'countries of origin' - I had ignored those in the U.S., and added up those in foreign countries). The highest total surname should be your most likely surname.  - Dave Hamm RE: On 11/25/2017 12:14 AM, [email protected] wrote: > Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2017 21:56:49 -0700 > From: Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: [DNA] Finding father of paternal great grandfather > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > During my research of my dad?s family, I discovered that my dad?s father?s father (my dad?s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband and given his mothers husband name. > What this means to me is my great grandfather?s ancestors need to be found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches ? One of them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have not figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common ancestor as I mentioned so far I can?t figure it out. > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the places we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > Any help is appreciated, > Gail Jorgensen

Dear Gail, In addition to Stephanie's excellent suggestions, I would also suggest that testing the oldest generation of the descendents of your great-grandfather using autosomal DNA tests with the major genetic genealogical testing companies maximizes the amount of autosomal DNA from your great-grandfather you can acquire and this data will hopefully help you determine who your great-grandfather's parents were. If your father isn't alive, then I would also do autosomal testing on your brother, as well as any of your father's siblings or first cousins who might be alive. Sincerely, Tim Janzen On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> wrote: > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > During my research of my dad’s family, I discovered that my dad’s father’s > father (my dad’s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband > and given his mothers husband name. > What this means to me is my great grandfather’s ancestors need to be > found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches – One of > them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic > distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have not > figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know > where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common > ancestor as I mentioned so far I can’t figure it out. > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the places > we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have > uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > Any help is appreciated, > Gail Jorgensen

I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. During my research of my dad’s family, I discovered that my dad’s father’s father (my dad’s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband and given his mothers husband name. What this means to me is my great grandfather’s ancestors need to be found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches – One of them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have not figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common ancestor as I mentioned so far I can’t figure it out. If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the places we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. Any help is appreciated, Gail Jorgensen

Gail, just really briefly, I can tell you you that male Y-DNA is so stable that it will give you matches from before the time that last names came into use (circa 1400AD). In other words, with cousins that are so distant that they will have other names. Given that, however, the correct name may show up... and can be corroborated with short-term aDNA tests through Ancestry or 23andMe... Best regards, Stephanie Admin, Cobb DNA project Member #5587, Guild of One Name Studies On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 8:56 PM, Gail Jorgensen <[email protected]> wrote: > I am hoping that this is not too basic a question for this group. > During my research of my dad’s family, I discovered that my dad’s father’s > father (my dad’s grandfather) was adopted at birth by his mothers husband > and given his mothers husband name. > What this means to me is my great grandfather’s ancestors need to be > found. My question is what do I need to do to discover who this man is. > My brother did a Y-DNA through family tree DNA and has 3 matches – One of > them is that a genetic distance of 2 and the other 2 are at a genetic > distance of 7. None of them have my brothers surname and so far we have not > figured out a match that would give us our paternal great grandfather. > Through ancestry DNA there are possibly a few matches that I do not know > where the connection is so one of these could be a descendent of a common > ancestor as I mentioned so far I can’t figure it out. > If anyone has any suggestions on how I can maneuver through all the places > we have DNA to figure this out I would appreciate it. > I have tested at ancestry DNA and family tree DNA and 23 and me and have > uploaded raw data to GEDmatch and my heritage. > Any help is appreciated, > Gail Jorgensen > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message