On 2013-07-08 07:33:51 +0000, wtwjgc (Joe) said: > Tickettyboo <tickettyboo@mail2oops.com> wrote: >> On 2013-07-07 22:44:33 +0000, Charles Ellson said: >> >>>> I am way out of my usual area here <I have a long line of Ag Labs and >>>> Anchor Smiths and haven't ever needed to venture up the 'posh end'> >>>>>> Trying to help a friend who is researching the history of a previous >>>> owner of a military sword, one John Duncan Bertie Fulton (1876-1915) >>>> In amongst the masses of paperwork he has collected about this man's >>>> career etc is confirmation from The Central Chancery if the Orders of >>>> Knighthood saying that, in 1914, he was amongst those "To be Ordinary >>>> Members of the Military Division of the Third Class, or Companions, of >>>> the Most Honourable Order of the Bath". >>>>>> Okay, so that is confirmed, but would this entitle his wife/widow to >>>> style herself as 'Lady Fulton'? >>>>> IMU there isn't actually any prohibition on a woman styling herself as >>> "Lady XYZ" as long as there is no fraudulent intent or actual/implied >>> false claim to anything titular other than the simple use of "Lady" >>> before a normal variation of her name. If I've read various sources >>> correctly then a mere Companion (distinct from a Knight Companion) is >>> not a Knight so while she might have been free to be a "Lady" her >>> husband wasn't a "Sir". >> >> Thanks. She seems to be billed as Lady Fulton in the various things I >> have read about the building of the Fulton Block, but there again, she >> was forking out £250,000 in the 1930s so I suppose the recipients would >> have called her anything she liked :-) > > A bit more background info you most probably have already found:- > > Captain John Duncan Bertie Fulton RFA Date: 15 November 1910. Used a Farman > Biplane at Salisbury Plain. He was awarded the third R.Ae.C. Special > certificate on 6 December 1911. > Later a Lieutenant Colonel and Chief Inspector of the Aeronautical > Inspection Department of the Royal Flying Corps when he died 11 November > 1915. > This from > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pilots_awarded_an_Aviator's_Certificate_by_the_Royal_Aero_Club_in_1910> > > > According to 'Flight' magazine he left £6,191 when he died. > <http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CDQQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.flightglobal.com%2Fpdfarchive%2Fview%2F1916%2F1916%2520-%25200181.html&ei=umjaUd-AMYLa0QW63YDAAQ&usg=AFQjCNGKQYUUUE7_3AspY6oh-djj-y4K7Q&sig2=Iwn9c-C2gEBWE8cVujG1cA&bvm=bv.48705608,d.d2k> > Cheers Joe, but I was 'very' impressed with what my friend has about this man's career, he has records of most of his military career and various patents etc which he took out, plus copies of the magazine you mentioned amongst others. One or two books in which JDB F gets a mention too. Its just the family type bits I am looking at, which are proving to be difficult. The fact that he was born in San Francisco was interesting, but unproductive so far in the way of records to verify that event. He did attend school in England , at Malvern, but I am still trawling through to see if I can spot him/ his parents in passenger lists to and from the US. We do have a copy of his death cert, but apart from the address no clues to family there. His CWGC entry says he was the son of Frederick George Fulton - no mention of a Mum or a wife. -- Tickettyboo

On 08/07/2013 11:21, Tickettyboo wrote: > Its just the family type bits I am looking at, which are proving to be > difficult. The fact that he was born in San Francisco was interesting, > but unproductive so far in the way of records to verify that event. He > did attend school in England , at Malvern, but I am still trawling > through to see if I can spot him/ his parents in passenger lists to and > from the US. We do have a copy of his death cert, but apart from the > address no clues to family there. His CWGC entry says he was the son of > Frederick George Fulton - no mention of a Mum or a wife. The Malvern Register: John Duncan Bertie Fulton; born 1876; son of Mrs. Fulton of 76 Longridge Road, London, S. W. Entgered May 1890. Huntington House; Army Side. House Prefect. Left Midsummer 1893. Passed into Woolwich; Royal Artillery. He appears in the 1891 census at Malvern College, Worcestershire, then aged 14 and given as born in California, but a British Subject. That he was in the Army Side at Malvern shows his family or sponsor also had army connections, probably in the R.A. His mother, J Elizabeth Fulton (indexed as Tulton on FindMyPast) was a widow aged 43 in 1891, living on her own means and born in Yorkshire. She had a cook and two housemaids living with her at 76 Longdridge Road, Kensington, London. Jane Elizabeth Fulton died in 1910 leaving £8,000 and her executor was John Duncan Bertie Fulton, Capt. R.A. She was aged 73 and had aged 10 years since the 1891 census. John Duncan Bertie Fulton died in 1916 leaving £6,000. Bertie Fulton sailed from Liverpool and arrived in New York on 20 Dec 1880 on the ship City of Chester, in which he was classed as an American Citizen aged 4. He was with his 30-year-old mother, Mrs Fulton, on the main deck. Bertie was back in England in time for the 1881 census, when he was living in Victoria Avenue, Harrogate, Yorkshire, at Straylea Villa, with 3 servants and Edmund Faber, a 44-year-old lodger, who was a banker born in France, but a British Subject. Bertie is given as born in California. Visiting, were Walter Faber, aged 24, a Lieut in the Royal Artillery who was born in Cockfosters, Hertfordshire, and John Davison, aged 21, also a Lieut R.A. Bertie had no family living with him at the time. Walter Vavasour Faber (1857-1928) was M.P. for Andover 1906-1918. He was educated at Malvern and served in the R.A. as Captain. He was the brother of Edmund Beckett Faber, 1st Baron Faber, also an M.P. for Andover 1901-1905. They were the sons of Charles Wilson Faber (D.L. of Hertfordshire) and Mary Beckett, daughter of Sir Edmund Beckett, 4th Baronet. Charles Wilson Faber died in 1878 leaving £60,000, quite a fortune in those days. He was then of Brighton, Sussex, but died in San Remo, Italy, and his executor was Edmund Beckett Faber of Leeds. In 1861, the Faber brothers were living at Northaw House in Hertfordshire with their family, including their sister, Elizabeth Faber, then aged 20 and born in North Deighton, Yorkshire and their brother, John D B Faber, aged 7. She was unmarried aged 30 and living with her parents in Northaw House in 1871. John David Beverly Faber was also there, a scholar aged 17. She was baptised at Kirk Deighton, Yorkshire on 27th April 1841, born 27 Dec 1840. She married Mortimer Sackville-West (Baron Sackville) in 1873 at Northaw and they both died in 1888, which eliminates her as the mother of John DB Fulton. I can find no evidence for the existence of a Frederick George Fulton, a George Frederick Fulton, a George Fulton or a Frederick Fulton. No one suitable appears on censuses in Scotland, England, the USA or Canada. Neither does anyone suitable appear on UK birth, marriage or death registers. Only two Lady Fultons were of social note in 1929 (Whittaker's Peerage), both of whom were widows and have been mentioned by others: Lady Fulton (Sophia Browne, daughter of John B. Nicholson) married 1875 Sir Forrest Fulton, Kt. Bach., K.C., Recorder of London etc, died 1925 Lady Fulton (Margaret Edith, daughter of Brigade-Surgeon R. G. Mathew, I.M.S.) married 1887 Sir Robert Fulton Fulton, Kt. Bach., I.C.S. ret., sometime a Pulsne Judge, Bengal High Cout (died 1927). Residence: 7 Sloane Gardens, London SW1