Charles Ellson wrote: > >> Anne Chambers wrote: >>> Brian Lummis wrote: >>>> See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 >>>> Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to >>>> obtain a copy. >>>> Brian >>> >>> Interesting - it must be for other ranks only. There was a copy of his >>> paybook will in the Army Service record I got from TNA for a 2nd >>> Lieutenant who was killed in 1916 but he doesn't come up on a search of >>> the Probate Service site. >>> > Bearing in mind this is being done by HMCTS it possibly only deals > with soldiers domiciled in England and Wales. I've just tried > MacDONALD in 1915 and the matching CWGC details all give English > addresses and/or regiments for the deceased. > He was a Londoner born and bred.... -- Anne Chambers South Australia anne dot chambers at bigpond dot com

Brian Lummis wrote: > See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 > Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to obtain a copy. > Brian Interesting - it must be for other ranks only. There was a copy of his paybook will in the Army Service record I got from TNA for a 2nd Lieutenant who was killed in 1916 but he doesn't come up on a search of the Probate Service site. -- Anne Chambers South Australia anne dot chambers at bigpond dot com

On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 18:32:00 -0400, ecunningham <ecunningham@att.net> wrote: >Anne Chambers wrote: >> Brian Lummis wrote: >>> See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 >>> Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to >>> obtain a copy. >>> Brian >> >> Interesting - it must be for other ranks only. There was a copy of his >> paybook will in the Army Service record I got from TNA for a 2nd >> Lieutenant who was killed in 1916 but he doesn't come up on a search of >> the Probate Service site. >> Bearing in mind this is being done by HMCTS it possibly only deals with soldiers domiciled in England and Wales. I've just tried MacDONALD in 1915 and the matching CWGC details all give English addresses and/or regiments for the deceased. >Also have seen some before. Possibly in Ancestry WWI Service Records. >Can't check since it wasn't one of mine and don't recall name. >ecunningham@att.net

On 2013-08-25 17:48:51 +0000, Chris Dickinson said: > Roy Stockdill wrote: >   > <snip> >> On the odd occasion I have been asked> to provide either a passport or >> driving licence, I am met with bewilderment on> the part of idiots when >> I tell them I possess neither because I don't drive and> I didn't >> bother to spend money renewing my passport when I ceased travelling> >> abroad.<snip> >   >   > I have a similar problem. Currently I don't have any photo identity > (not being a driver and not having got round to renewing my passport - > must do soon, before any fraudster reads this post).  > I used to play a MMPG that is based in Sweden. My security card for > this game stopped working earlier this year, so I had to get it > replaced. Couldn't do it because the company wouldn't accept anything > other than photo ID. At the same time they assured me that they don't > keep a record of the photo. So why need the photo in the first place - > they haven't got anything to compare it to! Anyway, they've now lost a > client. >   >   >> abroad. Unfortunately, though I know I am in the right this can >> sometimes cause> problems, especially with banks. >   >   > This is partly a problem of technology transition. Using online > banking, you simply don't have that sort of ID problem. Friends of mine > who refuse to bank online complain about how long it takes to prove > their identity at their local branch. They spend an afternoon doing > something that would take a few minutes online. Crazy. >   > The problem is going to get worse. Increasingly now, I don't have > utility bills and the like to prove identity - because I do everything > online or paperless - so even if I had the photo ID, I'm running out of > additional proofs of current address. >   >   > Chris > http://rumbutter.info/ A few years ago a friend of mine died. The funeral took place in the North of Scotland where she had lived for many years. Her father and brother were to travel by plane from London. They had a real problem, as even for internal flights the airlines now require photo id before they will check you in and allow you to board. Granpa was in his 90s and almost blind and in a wheelchair. Hadn't had a passport for years and (obviously) no driving licence, not even a bus pass with his photo on. They did eventually allow him to travel (can't honestly remember now how they got around it) but it can't be an uncommon problem. The airline maintained that it was needed for 'security' purposes but I suspect its more to do with the fact that they charge to transfer a flight ticket and if they have no photo ID we could all transfer tickets if we were unexpectedly unable to travel rather than lose the money we paid for the fare :-) -- Tickettyboo

On 2013-08-29 20:17:50 +0000, Charles Ellson said: > On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 04:16:10 -0700 (PDT), melanie chesnel > <mellychesnel@gmail.com> wrote: > >> On Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:17:52 PM UTC+2, Brian Lummis wrote: >>> See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 >>> >>>   >>> >>> Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to obtain a >>> copy. >>> >>>   >>> >>> Brian >> I have just paid for and ordered one for my greatuncle - there is a 10 >> day delay before it is available for download and it will only remain >> downloadable for 31 days. I suspect they are still digitalising the >> stuff as people order it which explains the delay >> >> regards melanie >> > I suspect they're working the usual PRFD way, i.e. they copy the will > from the original when someone requests it; the only "new work" is > possibly the index which in modern times should involve little extra > effort to provide on-line access. I believe that the company who are handling it are Iron Mountain and that they did the pc access search facility which has been available in Probate Offices for some time. Its a step in the right direction, though it has taken a long time for this first section (soldiers wills) to become available, hopefully the rest of the wills will follow suit in the fullness of time. Its not so bad for those of us in the UK to get copies on the current system whereby you can post off an application, but the only option is payment by sterling cheque, which must be a nightmare for those outside the UK. -- Tickettyboo

On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 04:16:10 -0700 (PDT), melanie chesnel <mellychesnel@gmail.com> wrote: >On Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:17:52 PM UTC+2, Brian Lummis wrote: >> See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 >> >>   >> >> Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to obtain a >> copy. >> >>   >> >> Brian >I have just paid for and ordered one for my greatuncle - there is a 10 day delay before it is available for download and it will only remain downloadable for 31 days. I suspect they are still digitalising the stuff as people order it which explains the delay > >regards melanie > I suspect they're working the usual PRFD way, i.e. they copy the will from the original when someone requests it; the only "new work" is possibly the index which in modern times should involve little extra effort to provide on-line access.

On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 18:11:50 +0100, CWatters <colin.watters@NOturnersoakSPAM.plus.com> wrote: >On 22/08/2013 08:11, Kiwi in Aus wrote: >> I have Francis PASCOE born 1819 in Constantine, Cornwall, England >> Married Belinda MINERS born 7 Feb 1819 in Ladock, Cornwall, England >> their first Child Belinda PASCOE was born 1841 in Falmouth, Cornwall, >> England >> >> I can't find a marriage for Francis and Belinda, any ideas, I do have >> the rest of their children, just no marriage >> > >Francis appears to have left a Will. Perhaps there is a clue in there as >to their marital status?.. > >1876 >Pascoe Francis >Effects under £1,000 >14 January. The Will of Francis Pascoe late of Penzance in the county of >Cornwall Statuary who died 28 December 1875 at Penzance was proved at >Bodmin by Belinda Pascoe Widow the Relict and John Pascoe Statuary both >of Penzance the Executors. > >Info on how to get copies.. > >http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/probate/copies-of-grants-wills > The description of Belinda as "the relict" should be enough unless there's a surprise in the will which contradicts that but if there was then she should not be described as the relict. If they actually never married but represented themselves as married, that is unlikely to be mentioned unless there was a deliberate attempt to exclude her or their children from benefiting. They're also both old enough to have married before the introduction of civil registration in 1837.

Anne Chambers wrote: > Brian Lummis wrote: >> See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 >> Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to >> obtain a copy. >> Brian > > Interesting - it must be for other ranks only. There was a copy of his > paybook will in the Army Service record I got from TNA for a 2nd > Lieutenant who was killed in 1916 but he doesn't come up on a search of > the Probate Service site. > Also have seen some before. Possibly in Ancestry WWI Service Records. Can't check since it wasn't one of mine and don't recall name. ecunningham@att.net

On 22/08/2013 08:11, Kiwi in Aus wrote: > I have Francis PASCOE born 1819 in Constantine, Cornwall, England > Married Belinda MINERS born 7 Feb 1819 in Ladock, Cornwall, England > their first Child Belinda PASCOE was born 1841 in Falmouth, Cornwall, > England > > I can't find a marriage for Francis and Belinda, any ideas, I do have > the rest of their children, just no marriage > Francis appears to have left a Will. Perhaps there is a clue in there as to their marital status?.. 1876 Pascoe Francis Effects under £1,000 14 January. The Will of Francis Pascoe late of Penzance in the county of Cornwall Statuary who died 28 December 1875 at Penzance was proved at Bodmin by Belinda Pascoe Widow the Relict and John Pascoe Statuary both of Penzance the Executors. Info on how to get copies.. http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/probate/copies-of-grants-wills

Graeme Wall wrote: > On 29/08/2013 00:28, laney161042@gmail.com wrote: >> Hi Graham, >> I don't know if you still access this, but my ggg grandparents are Borthwick & Elizabeth Rae. My ancestor >> is their son John Hutton - I still live in Falkirk, Scotland and would love to speak to you about your side >> of the family as I have juat recently started researching mine. >> > > Who are you talking to? This is a newsgroup which many people read. > > The original post was 7 September 2001, according to Google The OP's email address was grahamfh@optusnet.com.au - it might still be the same. -- Anne Chambers South Australia anne dot chambers at bigpond dot com

On 22/08/2013 08:11, Kiwi in Aus wrote: > I have Francis PASCOE born 1819 in Constantine, Cornwall, England > Married Belinda MINERS born 7 Feb 1819 in Ladock, Cornwall, England > their first Child Belinda PASCOE was born 1841 in Falmouth, Cornwall, > England > > I can't find a marriage for Francis and Belinda, any ideas, I do have > the rest of their children, just no marriage > No help but perhps of interest.. http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~stonemen/ http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~stonemen/PAS-PAT.htm Quote: PASCOE, Francis, b.1820 Constantine-Con, Statuary & Marble Mason, address 1841-1844: Falmouth-Con, 1861: 9 Queen Street, Penzance-Con, 1864: Near the Cattle Market, Penzance-Con, 1871: Penzance-Con, 1873: Causeway Head, Penzance-Con. (“Monuments, tombs, headstones, etc. Work and engraved from the newest designs and rendered on the most reasonable terms.”)

On 24/08/2013 12:58, brightside S9 wrote: > He has applied for a job which requires considerable security > checking. Needless to say this forname discrepancy on the birth > certificate aginst all the other documents listed above has resulted > in him failing the security check *unless* he can prove that > XXX-YYY-surname is the same person as ZZZ-surname. Is he married? Were his parents or other relatives witnesses at the marriage?

On 18/08/2013 06:45, Anne Chambers wrote: > There are no WW1 medal record cards for James Elias Martin or James E > Martin for the East Kent regiment but two possibilities for James Martin > Name: James Martin > Regiment or Corps: Royal Sussex Regiment, East Kent Regiment, > Hampshire Regiment > Regimental Number: 4502, 12877, 04947 The 2nd Battalion of the Hampshire regiment was in Ireland from 1919 to 1923 according to.. http://1rhamps.com/hampshireR/hamps2ndBn.html > > Name: James Martin > Regiment or Corps: Middlesex Regiment, East Kent Regiment > Regimental Number: 61540, G/14529 Ist Buffs were in Ireland in 1926.. http://www.kentfallen.com/PDF%20reports/BUFFS%20DATES.pdf

See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to obtain a copy. Brian

On Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:17:52 PM UTC+2, Brian Lummis wrote: > See BBC News article http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23861821 > >   > > Unfortunately the payment gateway was not working when I tried to obtain a > copy. > >   > > Brian I have just paid for and ordered one for my greatuncle - there is a 10 day delay before it is available for download and it will only remain downloadable for 31 days. I suspect they are still digitalising the stuff as people order it which explains the delay regards melanie

On 27/08/2013 19:02, Adrian Gray wrote: >> 11. Re: Quarter years (Renia) >> >> >> As I said, different rules for different areas at different times. Late >> 18th century Yorkshire, for example, for a short period, gives the birth >> date, baptism date, parents' names, mother's maiden name, and name of >> grandparents! >> >> >> > That sounds to me like a so-called "Dade Register" - see here: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parish_register > > These genealogists dreams are largely confirmed to the North of England, > though not exclusively - at least one Essex parish had one, though I cannot > remember which parish. Thanks. I couldn't remember what it was called and didn't have time to look it up!

Hi Graham, I don't know if you still access this, but my ggg grandparents are Borthwick & Elizabeth Rae. My ancestor is their son John Hutton - I still live in Falkirk, Scotland and would love to speak to you about your side of the family as I have juat recently started researching mine. Elaine

From: Adrian Gray <grayadrian3@gmail.com> > > 11. Re: Quarter years (Renia) > > > > > > As I said, different rules for different areas at different times. Late > > 18th century Yorkshire, for example, for a short period, gives the birth > > date, baptism date, parents' names, mother's maiden name, and name of > > grandparents! > > > > > > > That sounds to me like a so-called "Dade Register" - see here: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parish_register > > These genealogists dreams are largely confirmed to the North of England, > though not exclusively - at least one Essex parish had one, though I cannot > remember which parish.> It was Moreton, Essex. I've now found an article on Dade Registers by Roger Bellingham at: http://www.localpopulationstudies.org.uk/PDF/LPS73/Article_3_Bellingham_pp51-60. pdf Well worth a read for those who want to truly understand the immense value of Dade Registers. Here's a classic I found myself in the parish of Topcliffe-by-Thirsk in the North Riding of Yorkshire in 1778..... 'John Harker, son of Benjamin Harker, of Asenby, labourer, son of John Harker of Scugdale, farmer, and of Ann, daughter of James Dunning of Boultby, farmer, by Jane, daughter of William Lumley of Cold Kirby, farmer, born on Monday the 7th of September, baptized on Sunday the 11th of October'. Analyse this entry carefully and you will see that William Lumley was the great-grandfather of John Harker, the child being baptised, so what we have here is part of a four-generation family tree. Now, that is something we don't get on a modern birth certificate! The aforementioned John Harker, son of Benjamin, was a brother of the infamous Mary Bateman, nee Harker, known as the Yorkshire Witch who was hanged at York in 1809 for a murder by poisoning in Leeds and whose life of crime I have extensively researched. Dade Registers are mostly for baptisms only, however there is at least one Yorkshire parish which had Dade marriage registers. This was Sherburn-in-Elmet and it contains some wonderful stuff. Consider, for instance, this marriage in 1783..... "22 Jul Robert Jeffreys of Aberford in this parish aged 27 menial servant to Mr. Raper otsp, s/o Robt of Hull flaxdresser by Patience hwdo Wormsley Todd of Beverley mill wright = Elizabeth Goodall of Aberford aforesaid age 21, d/o George otsp clockmaker by Elizabeth hwdo Robert Acaster of Micklefield farmer Lic. Wit. [blank] Rogers, Ann Rogers." Abbreviations: otsp = of the same place s/o = son of hwdo = his wife, daughter of d/o = daughter of Note that this entry gives us the following information: Ages and place of residence of the bridegroom and bride. Name of the bridegroom's employer. Names, occupations and places of residence of both sets of parents. Names, occupations and places of residence of the two grandfathers. We can see how valuable this entry is, especially since both the groom's parents were from parishes some distance from Sherburn in Elmet. -- Roy Stockdill Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Famous family trees blog: http://blog.findmypast.co.uk/tag/roy-stockdill/ "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

From: Adrian Gray <grayadrian3@gmail.com> > > 11. Re: Quarter years (Renia) > > > > > > As I said, different rules for different areas at different times. Late > > 18th century Yorkshire, for example, for a short period, gives the birth > > date, baptism date, parents' names, mother's maiden name, and name of > > grandparents! > > > > > > > That sounds to me like a so-called "Dade Register" - see here: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parish_register > > These genealogists dreams are largely confirmed to the North of England, > though not exclusively - at least one Essex parish had one, though I cannot > remember which parish.> Here is a list of parishes with Dade Registers that I came across some years ago. I must point out that it was not compiled by myself but by a Yorkshire genealogist called Roger Bellingham who is the acknowledged expert on them. It may still be on the internet somewhere but I couldn't find it today. However, I found it in one of my own posts to a Rootsweb list in 2002. It's 10 years old, so maybe other examples have been found since then. Dade Registers existed for rather longer than a "short period", beginning in the mid-1770s and going up to 1812, when new arrangements for recording baptisms, marriages and burials came into being under George Rose's Act. Ironically, these gave somewhat less information than the Dade Registers! Dade-type registers also existed, but for a much shorter period, in Durham and Northumberland, which were called Barrington Registers, introduced by Bishop Shute Barrington. > LIST of DADE REGISTERS > YPRS = Published by the Yorks. Parish Register Society > Thoresby = Published by the Thoresby Society > HFHS = Huddersfield FHS > * Registers at the Borthwick Institute of Historical Research, York. > > YORKSHIRE AINSTY (14) > *Acaster Malbis, *Acomb (YPRS), *Askham Bryan (YPRS), *Bilbrough, > *Bishopthorpe (YPRS), *Bolton Percy, *Healaugh, Long Marston, *Moor > Monkton, *Nether Poppleton, *Rufforth, *Thorp Arch, *Walton in Ainsty > (YPRS), *Wighill > > YORK (23) > *All Saints North Street, *All Saints Pavement, *Holy Trinity > Goodramgate (YPRS), *Holy Trinity King`s Court (YPRS), *Holy Trinity > Micklegate, *St Crux (YPRS), *St Cuthbert, *St Denys with St George, > *St Helen Stonegate, *St John Ousebridge, *St Lawrence (YPRS), *St > Margaret Walmgate, *St Martin Coney Street (YPRS), *St Martin > Micklegate, *St Mary Bishophill junior (YPRS), *St Mary Bishophill > senior, *St Mary Castlegate (YPRS), *St Maurice, *St Michael le > Belfrey, *St Michael Spurriergate, *St Olave (YPRS), *St Sampson, *St > Saviour > > YORKSHIRE EAST RIDING (46) > *Acklam & Leavening, *Allerthorpe, *Aughton (YPRS), *Barlby, *Barmby > Moor, Barmston, *Bishop Wilton *Bubwith (YPRS), *Catton, > *Copmanthorpe, *Ellerton, *Elvington, *Escrick, *Everingham, > *Fangfoss, *Fulford, Garton on the Wolds, *Great Givendale, *Hayton, > *Hemingbrough, *Heslington (YPRS), *Holme on Spalding Moor, *Huggate, > *Kirby Grindalythe, *Kirby Underdale, *Market Weighton, *Millington, > *Naburn, North Cave, North Ferriby, *Pocklington, *Riccall (YPRS), > Sancton, *Scrayingham, *Seaton Ross, *Sherburn in Hartford Lythe, > *Stillingfleet, *Thorganby, *Thornton on Spalding Moor, Ulrome, > *Weaverthorpe West Heslerton, *Westow, Wetwang, *Wheldrake, *Yapham > > YORKSHIRE NORTH RIDING (33) > *Alne, *Bossall, Bowes (YPRS), *Brafferton, *Brandsby, Castle Bolton, > *Coxwold (YPRS), *Crayke, *Easingwold (YPRS), *Farlington, *Gate > Helmsley, *Haxby, *Hovingham, *Huntington, *Husthwaite, *Huttons Ambo, > Kirkbymoorside, *Marton cum Moxby, *New Malton, *Old Malton, > *Osbaldwick, *Overton, *Raskelf (YPRS), Scruton (YPRS), *Skelton, > Stainton, *Stillington, *Stockton on Forest, *Strensall, *Thormanby, > Topcliffe, *Warthill, *Wigginton > > YORKSHIRE WEST RIDING 42) > *Aberford (Thoresby), Ackworth, Addingham (YPRS), Adel (Thoresby), > Airmyn, Armthorpe, Badsworth, Bardsey, Barnby Dunn, Barwick in Elmet, > Batley (HFHS), Bolton Abbey, Braithwell (YPRS), *Bramham, *Brayton, > *Carlton juxta Snaith (YPRS), *Cawood, *Church Fenton, *Drax, Farnley, > Fishlake, Giggleswick, Hatfield, Headingley, Kirk Broweth, Kirkburton, > *Monk Fryston, *Newton Kyme, Owston (YPRS), Pannal, Pudsey, *Ryther, > *Saxton in Elmet (YPRS), *Selby, *Sherburn in Elmet, Skipton, > Spofforth, Swillington (YPRS), *Tadcaster, Wath on Dearne, Wentworth, > *Wistow > > Other counties: > CHESHIRE (3): Alsager, Macclesfield, Witton; DEVON (1): Uplyme; ESSEX > (1): Moreton; LANCASHIRE (8) Aldingham, Ashton in Makerfield, Blawith, > Hawkshead, Hindley, Lowick, Rufford, Satterthwaite; NOTTINGHAMSHIRE > (8): Beeston, Coddington, East Stoke, Finningley, Mansfield, Sutton > Bonington, Syerston, Teversal; SURREY (1) Chertsey > > TOTAL = 180 -- Roy Stockdill Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Famous family trees blog: http://blog.findmypast.co.uk/tag/roy-stockdill/ "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

On 27/08/2013 19:02, Adrian Gray wrote: > That sounds to me like a so-called "Dade Register" - see here: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parish_register > > These genealogists dreams are largely confirmed to the North of England, > though not exclusively - at least one Essex parish had one, though I cannot > remember which parish. I have the good fortune to have many ancestors and relatives who were baptized/married/buried at St Helen's, Witton (near Northwich) in Cheshire where Dade Registers were kept for some years. It is my misfortune (and doubtless that of others) that whoever was responsible for scanning these for FindMyPast has cocked up in many instances and instead of providing an image of the full double-page spread of the Register has given us either just the left-hand page and a column or 2 of the right, or an image which comprises 2 copies of the left-hand page. -- Jenny M Benson