Patricia: Your friend should look further into this. You absolutely do NOT have to be a citizen to collect Social Security...that is according to my local Social Security office in California. LOTS of foreigners pay into the system and then collect their benefits, yet they are not citizens. I know this for a FACT. My husband is Canadian born (and he has no birth certificate). He also is an Engineer who worked for over 40 years in aerospace (after serving in the Navy during the Korean war), working on secret projects. All without a birth certificate, and being foreign born. He paid into the system, and he collects from the system. When I asked if you have to be a citizen to get a Social Security card when I was in the office a couple of weeks ago, the Manager of that Social Security office said you did not have to be a citizen to get a Social Security card or to pay into the system or to collect benefits. You may THINK this is not the case, but you should look further into it because we have just recently gone through all these issues with the Social Security administration ourselves. Sometimes how you THINK things should be isn't how they actually are! Do you have any idea of how many emigrants there are in this country currently who are not citizens who work, and have Social Security cards, and pay into the system and then later collect benefits? It is a huge number. Social Security will even send their benefits to another country if they leave here upon retirement. Check it out...apparently you will be surprised...but this IS the Social Security Administration's policy. Anne > Wow-- You have to be a citizen to get a SS card today. > > I have a friend who paid into SS but can't collect. He is not a US citizen. > > Right or wrong group? > Lady Patricia > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Anne" <odyssey@heirmail.to> > To: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 6:52 PM > Subject: Birth Certificates > > > > Hmmm...well, lots of people didn't have to get delayed birth > > certificates. My husband was in the Navy during the Korean war, > > and wasn't required to have a birth certificate in order to enlist or to > > serve. He receives Veterans benefits (and his Social Security > > benefits), all without having a real or delayed birth certificate. He > > also didn't need a birth certificate to receive the military honors > > bestowed on him for his service. > > > > I have found many of my ancestors also never had a birth > > certificate. My grandmother didn't have one, none of her siblings > > had one, and apparently my mother and one of her siblings also > > didn't have birth certificates or delayed birth certificates. They all > > (except my grandmother and her siblings) had Social Security > > cards, and collected Social Security benefits...yet there are no > > records of their births. Go figure. Lots of people fell through the > > cracks, unfortunately. > > > > Our local Social Security office told us that we didn't have to have a > > birth certificate to get a Social Security card even today. They don't > > care if you are a citizen or not, so it doesn't matter where you were > > born, and you don't have to be any specific age to apply. People get > > Social Security cards, Drivers Licenses, and other forms of ID all > > the time, all without the benefit of birth certificates. > > > > In fact, I didn't have to show my birth certificate in order to get my > > Social Security card...I just sent away for it. I didn't have to show > > birth certificates to get any of my kids their Social Security cards > > either. Come to think of it, the ONLY time I remember having to > > produce my birth certificate for anything was for my Driver's license > > learners permit...in order to prove I was 15 1/2 at the time (and > > being that young, a birth certificate was the only form of ID that I > > had). Since then, I have never needed to show my birth certificate > > for any reason. If I did, I would be in trouble! Mine is all crumpled > > and has big chunks missing from it, it is so old! > > > > You don't have to show a birth certificate to get married or divorced > > or to have children. > > > > You would probably have to produce a birth certificate in order to > > get a passport, although I have never had to get one, so don't know > > that first hand...but I would think one would have to prove citizenship > > for a passport. > > > > Don't know about now, but I didn't have to have a birth certificate in > > order to attend school, and I didn't have to show my children's birth > > certificates in order for them to attend school (California, Oregon, > > and Washington). Times change, and maybe you have to now, but > > you didn't when I was in school, or when my kids were in school > > (the 80's). > > > > Four of my grandchildren were all born at home, and while I am > > sure their births were recorded, their parents don't have any of their > > birth certificates. Two of them are in school in California. > > > > You don't have to have a birth certificate in order to function in this > > society, but it sure makes life easier for those future descendants > > who decide to go looking for you! :) > > > > Anne > > > > > > > You might check the County Clerk's 1940 Birth Index. Many people born as > > > early as 1889 had to get a delayed birth record registered in 1940 in > order > > > to obtain a SS Card. Also, many men who went into service during WW II > had > > > to obtain a delayed birth certificate. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Raymond Heyer <BuckyHeyer@webtv.net> > > > To: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 4:01 PM > > > Subject: Re: Getting records - Lee Reese > > > > > > > > > > > > --WebTV-Mail-27640-161 > > > Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII > > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit > > > > > > I have my father's SSapplication, but have been unable to find a birth > > > certificate. Am I understanding you correctly, that he had to have a > > > birth certificate when he applied for his SS#? > > > > > > Thank you , > > > Susan > > > > > > > > > --WebTV-Mail-27640-161 > > > Content-Disposition: Inline > > > Content-Type: Message/RFC822 > > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit > > > > > > Received: from mailsorter-101-9.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.43) by > > > storefull-118.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Sat, 24 Jun 2000 > > > 17:41:57 -0700 (PDT) > > > Return-Path: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L-request@rootsweb.com> > > > Received: from lists6.rootsweb.com (lists6.rootsweb.com [63.92.80.125]) > by > > > mailsorter-101-9.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/ms.dwm.v7+dul2) > > > with ESMTP id RAA10595; Sat, 24 Jun 2000 17:41:56 -0700 (PDT) > > > Received: (from slist@localhost) by lists6.rootsweb.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) > id > > > e5P0WP309524; Sat, 24 Jun 2000 17:32:25 -0700 > > > Resent-Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 17:32:25 -0700 > > > X-Original-Sender: diamond6468@mindspring.com Sat Jun 24 17:32:25 2000 > > > From: diamond6468@mindspring.com > > > Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000624193638.00825e20@pop.mindspring.com> > > > X-Sender: diamond6468@pop.mindspring.com > > > X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) > > > Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 19:36:38 -0400 > > > Old-To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com > > > Subject: Re: Getting records - Lee Reese > > > In-Reply-To: <01BFDDF5.06085A80@cx978976-c.chnd1.az.home.com> > > > Mime-Version: 1.0 > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > Resent-Message-ID: <YXT5AD.A.nUC.ZMVV5@lists6.rootsweb.com> > > > To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com > > > Resent-From: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com > > > Reply-To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com > > > X-Mailing-List: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com> > archive/latest/2030 > > > X-Loop: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com > > > Precedence: list > > > Resent-Sender: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L-request@rootsweb.com > > > > > > If you got this off SSDI, there is a place to check "send for records" > or > > > something to that effect, it is a letter to SS to obtain his original > > > application for a SS#, on it will tell his parents, his residence, his > age, > > > lots of stuff - think it cost $7.00 - once you got his parents names and > > > you have where he died, send to the State of his birth for a copy of his > > > death cert, it will say where he was born, you can then send for his > birth > > > cert (although they may not of had them back then) but there will be an > > > amended one he had to have to get his SS# - if you don't know where to > send > > > for his DC, let me know, also if you have the county/city in Ohio, I can > > > give you the name of the funeral home, although it will be on the death > > > cert and you can write them and they will have copies of his obits and > > > probably some other stuff. after the word residense, that number is the > zip > > > code of the residence. > > > delilah > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At 15:58 6/24/00 -0700, you wrote: > > > >Hi, > > > >I recently received the following information and was wondering how to > go > > > about getting birth record, death record, obit, etc for this person. > Does > > > anyone have any suggestions to help me move along in my search? > > > >Lee REESE > > > >SSN 275-20-9296 > > > >Residence: 15243 Carnegie, Allegheny, PA > > > >Born 4 Feb 1894 > > > >Died 15 Jun 1969 Issued: OH (Before 1951) > > > > > > > >Thanks for your help, > > > >Julie > > > > > > > >-- > > > >Julie Reese Bookser > > > >jrbookse@home.com > > > >http://members.home.com/jrbookse > > > > > > > > > > > >==== GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES Mailing List ==== > > > >Please consider becoming a Rootsweb contributor. > > > > > > > >============================== > > > >Get a MASTERCARD with NO Credit Check or Up Front > > > >Cash Security Deposit and GUARANTEED* Approval! > > > >NO Interest Rate! http://www.dollarsonthenet.com/cgi-bin/track/1631/19 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES Mailing List ==== > > > Please consider becoming a Rootsweb contributor. > > > > > > ============================== > > > Get a MASTERCARD with NO Credit Check or Up Front > > > Cash Security Deposit and GUARANTEED* Approval! > > > NO Interest Rate! http://www.dollarsonthenet.com/cgi-bin/track/1631/19 > > > > > > > > > --WebTV-Mail-27640-161-- > > > > > > > > > ==== GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES Mailing List ==== > > > Please consider becoming a Rootsweb contributor. > > > > > > ============================== > > > Search ALL of RootsWeb's mailing lists in real time. > > > RootsWeb's Personalized Mailing Lists: > > > http://pml.rootsweb.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES Mailing List ==== > > > Please consider becoming a Rootsweb contributor. > > > > > > ============================== > > > Join the RootsWeb WorldConnect Project: > > > Linking the world, one GEDCOM at a time. > > > http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/ > > > > > > > > ==== GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES Mailing List ==== > > Please consider becoming a Rootsweb contributor. > > > > ============================== > > Search ALL of RootsWeb's mailing lists in real time. > > RootsWeb's Personalized Mailing Lists: > > http://pml.rootsweb.com/ > > > > > ==== GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES Mailing List ==== > Please consider becoming a Rootsweb contributor. > > ============================== > Join the RootsWeb WorldConnect Project: > Linking the world, one GEDCOM at a time. > http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/