Oscar Ray Bolin was a suspect in the Montgomery County murder but was executed - he wouldn't talk about anything at the point he was questioned. He was in the area around that time. However, I don't think it was him due to the MO was wrong - my husband didn't think he did it either but a former chief thought so. Neither one was decomposed. Plenty of post-mortems at the scene and on the slab. Also drawings of both girls were widely circulated. They were definitely transients. I just can't believe somebody out there doesn't miss these girls. Both had excellent dentals - Montgomery County had even had an operation to fix a gap between her teeth - so somebody took care of these girls at one time. Most truck-stop prostitutes aren't getting orthodontic work done between tricks : ) so I think they were runaways who became prostitutes. Miami County had thick, reddish-brown braids and wore a handmade fringed buckskin jacket with a purple lining - it is a beautiful piece and I even have a picture of it - I need to scan it in. Montgomery County had fresh IV tracks in her arms. Her hair was curly but could have been permed - I found out the coroner's don't necessarily do a chemical analysis on the hair for such things - at least here they didn't. For a look at what the artist thinks she looked like alive click on http://web.qx.net/aubriana/OHJaneDoe1.htm Tanya - if you are interested in these things, have you (or anybody else) ever heard of James Parker Long? I guess I should post something about him - the most notorious unknown serial killer! He was from around Shreveport and spent a lot of time in Texas - I believe his mother still lives there. I will try to put something together on him today. His case is important because so many pictures of women - some sexually assaulted and beaten - were found in his van when he died. The women have never been identified. I guess I should put together my own website on all this stuff! Martha At 01:20 AM 1/24/00 -0500, you wrote: >Dear Martha, > >I'm wondering if Henry Lee Lucas was suspected in either of these two, or >both of, these murders. I'm wondering if the police departments that >investigated these two murders would have taken any post-mortem photographs? >If so, how badly were the bodies, especially the second one, decomposed or >mutilated? If the answer is pretty badly, maybe they would have made a >drawing or drawings? It sounds like the first one, and possibly the second >also, were transients. If that is the case, I think it may be especially >difficult to identify them or find out where they were originally from. At >any rate, I think your, or your husband's best bet would be to try to locate >any photographs or drawings that were taken or drawn of the victims and post >them around the state and/or the country. I mean, when you get right down to >it, the written description of those two girls could fit a number of people. >It sound like there was nothing spectacular about the way they were dressed - >I mean considering they both were murdered in the '80's, the way they were >dressed was pretty standard for the times. >Did the police in either, or both, departments check with any of the shelters >in the area? Let me know and I will see if I can't come up with some other >suggestions! Good Luck! Let me know if anything pans out! > >Best of Luck, >Tanya in Austin, TX Martha HARDCASTLE GUTHRIE L'homme paresseux travaille le plus dur You can see my pathetic wobbly first web page at: http://hometown.aol.com/lofiwoman/myhomepage/index.html Coming soon! Martha's "I Used to be a Babe" page!

Hello Martha Hardcastle Guthrie, Just a thought. Have you considered posting these two names to a site called, <A HREF="http://www.hypervigilance.com/genlog/firstname.html">First Name Basis</A> ?? http://www.hypervigilance.com/genlog/firstname.html I recently noted the following names to be added to the site: Sixto Sams Bugay, Arcenieth H. Greer. And I found 3 unusual names Oceanus Hopkins, Peregrine White and Thankful Barlett that I had been looking for on the same site. It might help if anyone is looking for a contact for your Miami and Montgomery. Hope this helps, Sincerely, Sun2Moon11@aol.com Beck Miami County had thick, reddish-brown braids and wore a handmade fringed buckskin jacket with a purple lining - it is a beautiful piece and I even have a picture of it - I need to scan it in. Montgomery County had fresh IV tracks in her arms. Her hair was curly but could have been permed - I found out the coroner's don't necessarily do a chemical analysis on the hair for such things - at least here they didn't. For a look at what the artist thinks she looked like alive click on http://web.qx.net/aubriana/OHJaneDoe1.htm

Whats the birthdate of the adopted person? Vern

In a message dated 1/24/00 7:02:21 AM Central Standard Time, larc@buckeye-express.com writes: << Shaylaya3@cs.com >> I'm not sure I can help but I'm willing to try. I will be in Jacksonville, Florida on Friday, 1-28-2000 and would like to speak with you if I can. I have a business trip to Toronto next month and an extended one for the month of April. I can try to find information for the Ontario ancestors while there. Let me know. Deb Purcell Glendale, Arizona

Do you think your adopted father may very well have been your birth father and that is why your adopted mother was so mean. I was wondering if he may have had a short affair with this single female then ended up raising the baby with his wife. Just a thought. Good luck with your search !!!! P.H ----- Original Message ----- From: jmeyer <jmeyer@jvil.com> To: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 9:55 PM Subject: [GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES] Adoption Help Please > I posted regarding the photos i had which were unidentified and wish to > thank those of you who replied back. It was suggested, i give my > information as there may be someone here who could help me. > I was born in IL somewhere in 1953 and I cant get the local court to > look or the state wont look. It involves someone with power and money > and influence as I have had many stumblingblocks put in my way. Where I > live is a very corrupt system and has always been, a small place where > everyone knows everyone and those who know will not talk they say they > are scared. The only information I know it was a young single girl and > an older man and my adopted father would not tell me anything before he > died anfd my adopted mother was a very hateful and mean woman and thank > God she left when I was 13. She disappeared and now there is a woman > using her name and identtiy who i feel is an imposter also.If anyone has > ideas or can help email me privately as I do not wish to tell much more > details on here. > Joseph > >

I posted regarding the photos i had which were unidentified and wish to thank those of you who replied back. It was suggested, i give my information as there may be someone here who could help me. I was born in IL somewhere in 1953 and I cant get the local court to look or the state wont look. It involves someone with power and money and influence as I have had many stumblingblocks put in my way. Where I live is a very corrupt system and has always been, a small place where everyone knows everyone and those who know will not talk they say they are scared. The only information I know it was a young single girl and an older man and my adopted father would not tell me anything before he died anfd my adopted mother was a very hateful and mean woman and thank God she left when I was 13. She disappeared and now there is a woman using her name and identtiy who i feel is an imposter also.If anyone has ideas or can help email me privately as I do not wish to tell much more details on here. Joseph

I kind of had the same thought, Joseph. If there are other biological children of your father, it's possible to have a DNA test done to determine if you are closely related or not. Jo-Ann - ---------------------------------- At 01:35 AM 1/24/00 -0600, you wrote: >Do you think your adopted father may very well have been your birth father >and that is why your adopted mother was so mean. I was wondering if he may >have had a short affair with this single female then ended up raising the >baby with his wife. Just a thought. >Good luck with your search !!!! >P.H

Hello: Bill Hamilton, of Victoria, BC, Canada, missing since 1959. Please have a look on my family treemaker page, I have his photo posted there. It's the third photo, you can't miss it ,Bill Hamilton Missing. Thank-you, any information welcome! Deborah Reid http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/r/e/i/Deborah-Reid ----- Original Message ----- From: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-D-request@rootsweb.com> To: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-D@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 9:17 PM Subject: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-D Digest V00 #26

Dear Martha, I'm wondering if Henry Lee Lucas was suspected in either of these two, or both of, these murders. I'm wondering if the police departments that investigated these two murders would have taken any post-mortem photographs? If so, how badly were the bodies, especially the second one, decomposed or mutilated? If the answer is pretty badly, maybe they would have made a drawing or drawings? It sounds like the first one, and possibly the second also, were transients. If that is the case, I think it may be especially difficult to identify them or find out where they were originally from. At any rate, I think your, or your husband's best bet would be to try to locate any photographs or drawings that were taken or drawn of the victims and post them around the state and/or the country. I mean, when you get right down to it, the written description of those two girls could fit a number of people. It sound like there was nothing spectacular about the way they were dressed - I mean considering they both were murdered in the '80's, the way they were dressed was pretty standard for the times. Did the police in either, or both, departments check with any of the shelters in the area? Let me know and I will see if I can't come up with some other suggestions! Good Luck! Let me know if anything pans out! Best of Luck, Tanya in Austin, TX

This came to be and I feel it shouldn't be ignored. This wonderful bunch out there that is so willing to help must be able to find SOMETHING for her to go on. PLEEEEEASE email her back if you have any info that can shed light on her roots? I will be doing the same. Attached is my reply after her plea so that you are all aware of the whole thing and that I had told her that I would love to send this to all of these lists (12 in total) and try to help. :o) p.s. I am not sure what list she sent this to me from (it was sent directly to me from my obit offer posting), but if your email is returned, please post it to as many lists as you can or that you belong to so that one of them may reach her? Thanks, Happy Hunting and Bless the ones who care :o) Lori-Ann ----- Original Message ----- From: <Shaylaya3@cs.com> To: <larc@buckeye-express.com> Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 7:55 PM Subject: Re: R.A.G. RYAN, E. James & RYAN, Ethel (nee COOK) obituaries > I'm Looking for my family name,ROBINSON,my grandfather and grandmother both > were Born in Canada. I can not find the names of my grand fathers parents.He > even had some brothers living in Canada. His brother Cecil,was murdered in > Canada. He also had two brothers in the WW1; Also he had two children that > died in Transcona,Manitoba, what cemetery, unknown. I know that Transcona,was > taken over by Winnipeg. The name of the children are Deniece Lenora > Robinson, died as a small child or baby, the other's name is Alford (Alfie) > Robinson . > My Grandparents had seven children in Canada,and then after they moved here > to Jacksonville, Florida. They had more children (7 boys & 7 girls). > I can not find any of this kind of info on them and I have spent money after > money on cd's and etc. My husband is not liking it much. > I don't know where to go for more information. I tried to find this info > before my Dad died and couldn't get any help from anyone, even from a lady that > lived not far from Transcona. She said she would check out some of the > cemeteries and her husband remembered something about a Robinson family. She > never got back to me and 2 months later my Dad died, which was in October > 1999. I even offered to pay her for her troble and for her gasbut she refused. > I got my hopes up for nothing. > I'm not a well person myself and I'm almost 57 years old. > I was wondering if you have come across the name Robinson or have seen the name on > some grave headstones. > This is not an easy task and I can't get my family to help out with some > money. I feel lost and tired trying to do this alone. > I would appreciate any advice that you can give me that might help me get a > little smarter on searching for my dead ones in Canada from Ontario to Manitoba. > Thanks for taking time out to read this. > > Yours Friendly,Jo. > E-Mail: Shaylaya3@cs.com > HERE IS MY REPLY TO HER: Hi, I have been so buried that I don't even know if I responded. I do know how you feel though and I would like to forward this email you sent me to the lists that I belong to. No matter where you live, who you are, someone may have a connection. I belong to 13 lists and the information & cd's etc that people have out there are amazing. >From my own experience, I tried myself without posting too much and then sent an email ending with "pleeeeeeease help?????" and got my own first break at Christmas time. I would love to help you and will search my Kindred Konnections momentarily. I will also be given a free month with Evertons.com and they have a wealth of info which I will search in there too as soon as my account is activated. Hope this helps and that your replies provide fruitful. Lori-Ann :o) p.s. please update me when you find something? Better yet, post it to the lists so others may feel as happy for you as you will be for yourself! :o)

(I have posted this to 13 lists so if you see it more than once, there is NO error in my system..smiles) Kindred Konnections is a site I have found to be of great use to me. If you transcribe one of their sheets, they will give you an hour free. Submit your GEDCOM file to them and they will give you one month of free searching. (their are two entries per sheet) I have been able to find alot of information and at the cost of nothing. Do check it out....you won't regret it. Lori-Ann go to www.kindredkonnections.com Happy Hunting :o) Searching: Welcome,Morgan,Ryan(s),Carse Newfoundland, Ontario, Illinois, Iowa Random Acts of Genealogy Kindness http://raogk.rootsweb.com/index.html

I have not had any problem this morning. I am subscribed to mail mode not digest though. Verdena Veelle wrote: > Did I miss something this morning. My mail was clogged up, had to go to > server page to get any messages, there was one about a person was going to > wait for the book? Was there a large message that might have gotten me > clogged up? > Verdena Veelle > -----Original Message----- > From: Nancy Custer +ADw-ncuster+AEA-mindspring.com+AD4- > To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L+AEA-rootsweb.com > +ADw-GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L+AEA-rootsweb.com+AD4- > Date: Sunday, January 23, 2000 9:40 AM > Subject: RE: +AFs-GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES+AF0- Hour of birth on birth certificate > > I believe the person posting was from England. Happily here in the US we get > a few more tidbits of information on our documents. > > Nancy > > -----Original Message----- > From: gayle +AFs-mailto:gayle1+AEA-wheatstate.com+AF0- > Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 6:19 AM > To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L+AEA-rootsweb.com > Subject: +AFs-GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES+AF0- Hour of birth on birth certificate > > I am afraid I need to dispel the comment in a previous posting that the time > of birth is only listed on birth certificates of multiple births. I just > went in and checked my birth certificate, and that of my three siblings in > Kansas. All give the hour of birth, and none of us were multiple births. > > Gayle

Did I miss something this morning. My mail was clogged up, had to go to server page to get any messages, there was one about a person was going to wait for the book? Was there a large message that might have gotten me clogged up? Verdena Veelle -----Original Message----- From: Nancy Custer +ADw-ncuster+AEA-mindspring.com+AD4- To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L+AEA-rootsweb.com +ADw-GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L+AEA-rootsweb.com+AD4- Date: Sunday, January 23, 2000 9:40 AM Subject: RE: +AFs-GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES+AF0- Hour of birth on birth certificate I believe the person posting was from England. Happily here in the US we get a few more tidbits of information on our documents. Nancy -----Original Message----- From: gayle +AFs-mailto:gayle1+AEA-wheatstate.com+AF0- Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 6:19 AM To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L+AEA-rootsweb.com Subject: +AFs-GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES+AF0- Hour of birth on birth certificate I am afraid I need to dispel the comment in a previous posting that the time of birth is only listed on birth certificates of multiple births. I just went in and checked my birth certificate, and that of my three siblings in Kansas. All give the hour of birth, and none of us were multiple births. Gayle

Many people in the early part of research will run into problems around the turn of the last century, for 2 reasons- The destruction of the 1890 census leaves a major gap between 1880 and 1900. However, you do have 1900, 1910, and 1920 that can be searched, and it includes such information as month and year of birth. If you have not used the census, you have missed probably the one most basic source for American research. And if you rely on an index that only shows the head of house, you will often miss children of a different surname, living with relatives. If you don't search the county for people of the same surname, you miss the opportunity to compare their information that can lead you further. No, I would not want to try searching a major city, but if it isn't, then this is a basic step to take. Secondly, this time frame is when most states were in the process of establishing laws for vital records as we know them. Too frequently, I see people hoping to find a death certificate, as an example, for 1900, without having taken the first step of determining that the state involved did not mandate death certificates until 1905. SOME local agencies (such as the county) MIGHT have kept records before the State required them, some didn't. I used to joke that this was the "1900 hump"... getting past it means getting past the types of records that we take for granted, and evaluating what else might provide information. Last, I am a bit skeptical that any book could possibly cover "all the graveyards". Most counties in any state would require a book of that size. Your best bets regarding what may have already been published is contacting the genweb site for a particular county; checking with the library in the county for any possible genealogical or history groups (who are OFTEN NOT ONLINE); or, use the LDS website to do a search of their catalog for resources for the county in question. Searching other library catalogs is also worth your time, but the LDS catalog will list the court/public records that are available on microfilm, early church records that may not be in book form, so forth. Wendy -- RESEARCH is what you start doing when no one alive remembers, no one has written a book, and no one has posted a gedcom.

I believe the person posting was from England. Happily here in the US we get a few more tidbits of information on our documents. Nancy -----Original Message----- From: gayle [mailto:gayle1@wheatstate.com] Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2000 6:19 AM To: GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES] Hour of birth on birth certificate I am afraid I need to dispel the comment in a previous posting that the time of birth is only listed on birth certificates of multiple births. I just went in and checked my birth certificate, and that of my three siblings in Kansas. All give the hour of birth, and none of us were multiple births. Gayle

Sorry everyone, I posted the wrong URL for my mystery: It is: <http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Farm/1989> Faye Edwards

I'm in UK Gayle - it is the usual practice here. Regards, K>, Robin Hood Country. ----- Original Message ----- From: gayle <gayle1@wheatstate.com> To: <GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: 23 January 2000 14:18 Subject: [GEN-UNSOLVED-MYSTERIES] Hour of birth on birth certificate > I am afraid I need to dispel the comment in a previous posting that the time > of birth is only listed on birth certificates of multiple births. I just

Horace: Every mail program is diffent, your tip does not work on all of them. Every email list is set up by the list owner, that showing the title of the list itself is an option for them, it can be changed by the owner. Another option is the "reply to"- on some lists, reply to will send the message to the person writing, on other lists (this one for instance), "reply to" sends the answer back to the entire list. And, if the topic title were changed, trust me. You would wind up with people subscribing, and sending queries that have nothing to do with Genealogical "mysteries". Wendy -- RESEARCH is what you start doing when no one alive remembers, no one has written a book, and no one has posted a gedcom.

At 07:58 AM 1/23/00 -0600, you wrote: >Michael & Shannon <buzclan@megsinet.net> Shannon, And others That is a problem, but you can widen the column on your mail program to see more of the title by just clicking on the column divider and slide it to the right. Just click down, then slide right, and then let up. It will stay where you move it. Maybe the title should be shortened to simply "Unsolved". That would provide more space, too. Thank you, Horace. (Over 32,800 Descendents) ___________________________________________________ ...The First Peelle Family In America [Peelle, Peele, Peel, Peal]... The Directory to all my sites at - http://www.horace.peele.com Sons of The American Revolution # 151084 Horace Peele, 12806 Chateau Forest, San Antonio, TX 78230 ....ô¿ô For More Peeles.......Animated.&.Musical.Web.Sites.....

I am afraid I need to dispel the comment in a previous posting that the time of birth is only listed on birth certificates of multiple births. I just went in and checked my birth certificate, and that of my three siblings in Kansas. All give the hour of birth, and none of us were multiple births. Gayle