I did not notice this message yesterday. Here is what the register says: Jakob Salamonson Sørestad, page 302 and Ingeborg Mikkelsdotter Sørestad p. 302. Regards Knut Hildal Odda

Hei Knut, I don't have to log into DIS to participate. Maybe something on your side of the ocean? Margit in Minnesota > As a comment; can anyone explain why I now sudddenly have to log in to > use ths Rootsweb service (DIS Norway password required, have never > experienced so rigorous way to take part in this newsgroup) > > Best regards > Knut Hildal > Odda > Norway >

I have this register. There are two which meets your criteriea; Jakob Østenson, Rossemyr, on page 660 and Jakob Østenson, Tjøstheim on page 275. There is only one Siri Johannesdtr from Havrevoll, page 539. Seems that Jakob from Rossemyr is the actual one, he has a son Østen (Øystein) Johannesson listed on Rossemyr (660). There is two Ola Jakobson and two Johannes Jakobson listed in the register as well As a comment; can anyone explain why I now sudddenly have to log in to use ths Rootsweb service (DIS Norway password required, have never experienced so rigorous way to take part in this newsgroup) Best regards Knut Hildal Odda Norway

Robert Heiling wrote: > "Ivar S. Ertesvåg" wrote: > > >>Robert Heiling wrote: >>[....] >> >>>>>For those who are familiar with the numerous errors in the US censuses >>>>>of given & surname spelling errors, birthdate errors, placename errors, >>>>>etc; would you say that the Norwegian censuses have far fewer errors? >>>>>about the same number? more? >>> >>>I was wondering about errors because I haven't been successful in >>>locating a Peter Helland who was born 1883 with a father named Ole and >>>who was probably from that general area of Norway. I've searched for the >>>variations of Peter, Peder, Petter, Per, Pehr and numerous spelling >>>variations of the surname, but the household listed above is the only >>>one that comes close. Could the census taker have written down the wrong >>>birthyear for Peter or could he have reversed the names of Peter & Nils >>>there? Have you observed errors like that in the 1900 census and are >>>they common? In the US censuses, the information could have been given >>>to the census taker by any member of the household or even a neighbor >>>and not just the head of household, so errors are frequent. Is that also >>>true of the Norwegian census? >> >>This is hard to answer. Humans make errors... also in the 1900 census. >>The accuracy most likely depends on the census taker (often a teacher or >>other reliable person) - and even over the period of conduct by one >>single census taker (he got tired, bored, impatient, in short of time, >>etc....). > > > This is all true and in my fairly extensive reading of US censuses that all > happens - name errors, date errors, age errors, and so on - and for some of the > reasons you mention. My question might seem naive on the surface, but it is > based upon a lack of knowledge of how Norwegian censuses are conducted. For all > I know, there might be a rule, for instance, that information could be *only* > taken from the head of household. Measures such as that would increase the > accuracy and cause me to accept data from a Norwegian census that I might reject > from a US census. The instructions for the census can be found at http://www.rhd.uit.no/census/ft1900.html It (and the text at the registration forms) clearly states that the forms should be filled out by the head of the houshould or by the census taker assisted by the head of the houshold. The census taker should visit every houshold and make sure that the forms are properly filled out. > > >>The interesting matter here is whether this specific family was >>correctly registered. Normally, this can be verified from other sources, >>in particular, the parish registry. Furthermore, the source for "your" >>Peter's birth year should also be scrutinized. > > > That's right and I will question my source again, but a 6 year error seems > unlikely unless I have mistakenly been given the wrong person's birthdate or my > source has been given such. If that Einen household census record becomes more > credible I'll pursue investigation of the nedre Helland pasish registry. for sake of order: the parish is Vestnes (nedre Helland is the farm name)

Robert Heiling wrote: [....] >> > For those who are familiar with the numerous errors in the US censuses >> > of given & surname spelling errors, birthdate errors, placename errors, >> > etc; would you say that the Norwegian censuses have far fewer errors? >> > about the same number? more? > > I was wondering about errors because I haven't been successful in > locating a Peter Helland who was born 1883 with a father named Ole and > who was probably from that general area of Norway. I've searched for the > variations of Peter, Peder, Petter, Per, Pehr and numerous spelling > variations of the surname, but the household listed above is the only > one that comes close. Could the census taker have written down the wrong > birthyear for Peter or could he have reversed the names of Peter & Nils > there? Have you observed errors like that in the 1900 census and are > they common? In the US censuses, the information could have been given > to the census taker by any member of the household or even a neighbor > and not just the head of household, so errors are frequent. Is that also > true of the Norwegian census? This is hard to answer. Humans make errors... also in the 1900 census. The accuracy most likely depends on the census taker (often a teacher or other reliable person) - and even over the period of conduct by one single census taker (he got tired, bored, impatient, in short of time, etc....). The interesting matter here is whether this specific family was correctly registered. Normally, this can be verified from other sources, in particular, the parish registry. Furthermore, the source for "your" Peter's birth year should also be scrutinized. > > Thanks again! > > Bob >

"Ivar S. Ertesvåg" wrote: > Robert Heiling wrote: > [....] > > My question might seem naive on the surface, but it is > > based upon a lack of knowledge of how Norwegian censuses are conducted. For all > > I know, there might be a rule, for instance, that information could be *only* > > taken from the head of household. Measures such as that would increase the > > accuracy and cause me to accept data from a Norwegian census that I might reject > > from a US census. > > The instructions for the census can be found at > http://www.rhd.uit.no/census/ft1900.html > It (and the text at the registration forms) clearly states that the > forms should be filled out by the head of the houshould or by the census > taker assisted by the head of the houshold. The census taker should > visit every houshold and make sure that the forms are properly filled out. Thanks for that clarification. That process, if always honored, is much more thorough than the way it has been done over here. It makes those census records far more credible. > >>The interesting matter here is whether this specific family was > >>correctly registered. Normally, this can be verified from other sources, > >>in particular, the parish registry. Furthermore, the source for "your" > >>Peter's birth year should also be scrutinized. > > > > > > That's right and I will question my source again, but a 6 year error seems > > unlikely unless I have mistakenly been given the wrong person's birthdate or my > > source has been given such. If that Einen household census record becomes more > > credible I'll pursue investigation of the nedre Helland pasish registry. > > for sake of order: the parish is Vestnes > (nedre Helland is the farm name) Thanks for that clarification also! Within the past few hours, I was able to locate what certainly must have been that particular Peter Helland in the New York Ellis Island ship passenger lists. The age matches an 1877 birthyear and he was from Romsdal. If we can resolve that 6 year discrepancy, my friend will probably want to pursue this further including those Vestnes parish records. Thanks again! Mvh Bob

"Ivar S. Ertesvåg" wrote: > Robert Heiling wrote: > [....] > >> > For those who are familiar with the numerous errors in the US censuses > >> > of given & surname spelling errors, birthdate errors, placename errors, > >> > etc; would you say that the Norwegian censuses have far fewer errors? > >> > about the same number? more? > > > > I was wondering about errors because I haven't been successful in > > locating a Peter Helland who was born 1883 with a father named Ole and > > who was probably from that general area of Norway. I've searched for the > > variations of Peter, Peder, Petter, Per, Pehr and numerous spelling > > variations of the surname, but the household listed above is the only > > one that comes close. Could the census taker have written down the wrong > > birthyear for Peter or could he have reversed the names of Peter & Nils > > there? Have you observed errors like that in the 1900 census and are > > they common? In the US censuses, the information could have been given > > to the census taker by any member of the household or even a neighbor > > and not just the head of household, so errors are frequent. Is that also > > true of the Norwegian census? > > This is hard to answer. Humans make errors... also in the 1900 census. > The accuracy most likely depends on the census taker (often a teacher or > other reliable person) - and even over the period of conduct by one > single census taker (he got tired, bored, impatient, in short of time, > etc....). This is all true and in my fairly extensive reading of US censuses that all happens - name errors, date errors, age errors, and so on - and for some of the reasons you mention. My question might seem naive on the surface, but it is based upon a lack of knowledge of how Norwegian censuses are conducted. For all I know, there might be a rule, for instance, that information could be *only* taken from the head of household. Measures such as that would increase the accuracy and cause me to accept data from a Norwegian census that I might reject from a US census. > The interesting matter here is whether this specific family was > correctly registered. Normally, this can be verified from other sources, > in particular, the parish registry. Furthermore, the source for "your" > Peter's birth year should also be scrutinized. That's right and I will question my source again, but a 6 year error seems unlikely unless I have mistakenly been given the wrong person's birthdate or my source has been given such. If that Einen household census record becomes more credible I'll pursue investigation of the nedre Helland pasish registry. Thanks again for your help! Mvh Bob

"Ivar S. Ertesvåg" wrote: > Robert Heiling wrote: > > Hei > > > > I'd like to double-check my understanding of Norwegian naming practices > > or be corrected. The following household is taken from the 1900 census, > > More Og Romsdal, Vestnes, and the farmname is EINEN. (please forgive my > > formatting) > > > > Name Family status Marital status Occupation Birth year > > > > Ole Einen hf g Husmand, forpakter m J 1844 > > Berte Einen hm g Husmandskone 1845 > > Peter Helland s ug Skomager 1877 > > Olufine Helland d ug Husligt arb., kreaturstel. 1881 > > Nils Helland s ug Arbeider i snedkerfabrik 1883 > > Marie Helland d ug Barn 1888 > > Julie Helland d ug Barn 1890 > > Hans Helland hf g Driver snedker- og dreierfabrik1869 > > Seriana Helland hm g Snedkerkone 1875 > > Olav Helland s ug Barnv 1900 > > Link to "Digitalarkivet": > http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f01535&gardpostnr=100&merk=100#ovre Thanks for pointing that out. I had been using: http://www.rhd.uit.no/folketellinger/folketellinger_avansert_e.aspx for my searches, but that one puts the various households in better perspective. > > Questions: > > Ole & Berte have the surname Einen because that's the farm that they > > currently reside on? They changed their surname to Einen when they moved > > there from wherever they had been before? The children have the name > > Helland because that is the name of the farm that the family lived on > > when they were born? > > This seems to be a special case. The answer to the first question is > apparently "yes". For the remaining, there are some questions to the > source and the regitration of it. > > It appears that the farm name i Helland nedre. This is farm No.45 i > Vestnes, and it is the vicars's recidence. Einen is a 'husmannsplass' > (small, rented farm) under Helland. Geographically, Einen may be in some > distance from the main farm houses of Helland but still within the area > of it. > > Thus, somehow, the person registering the family in the census has > witten Einen as surname for the parents and Helland for the children. > This may be correct or incorrect - there is no general rule that can > help you figuring out this. Thanks! I see what you're saying and they really are living on a portion of Helland, so therefore the surname. > > I note that there is/was a local parish farm by > > the name of Helland and wonder if that is likely the place that they > > previously resided? I see that Helland seems to be more of a place on > > the map now than a farm. Now that you pointed it out, I see that Helland really was where they lived. > > For those who are familiar with the numerous errors in the US censuses > > of given & surname spelling errors, birthdate errors, placename errors, > > etc; would you say that the Norwegian censuses have far fewer errors? > > about the same number? more? I was wondering about errors because I haven't been successful in locating a Peter Helland who was born 1883 with a father named Ole and who was probably from that general area of Norway. I've searched for the variations of Peter, Peder, Petter, Per, Pehr and numerous spelling variations of the surname, but the household listed above is the only one that comes close. Could the census taker have written down the wrong birthyear for Peter or could he have reversed the names of Peter & Nils there? Have you observed errors like that in the 1900 census and are they common? In the US censuses, the information could have been given to the census taker by any member of the household or even a neighbor and not just the head of household, so errors are frequent. Is that also true of the Norwegian census? Thanks again! Bob

Prince Rainier has just been officially declared dead, so now it is time to make my move with the elephants. Sam Sloan

Sam Sloan wrote: > Prince Rainier has just been officially declared dead, so now it is > time to make my move with the elephants. > > Sam Sloan Watch out for them there high hills they got..... js

Marcia Stice: > Could someone help me with a translation? The occupation I'm searching > is "pladsmandsdatter". Daughter of a cottar ("husmann"/"plassmann"). -- Kjell Ove Hattrem I got a half a pack of Lucky Strikes, man, so come along with me

Robert Heiling wrote: > Hei > > I'd like to double-check my understanding of Norwegian naming practices > or be corrected. The following household is taken from the 1900 census, > More Og Romsdal, Vestnes, and the farmname is EINEN. (please forgive my > formatting) > > Name Family status Marital status Occupation Birth year > > Ole Einen hf g Husmand, forpakter m J 1844 > Berte Einen hm g Husmandskone 1845 > Peter Helland s ug Skomager 1877 > Olufine Helland d ug Husligt arb., kreaturstel. 1881 > Nils Helland s ug Arbeider i snedkerfabrik 1883 > Marie Helland d ug Barn 1888 > > Julie Helland d ug Barn > 1890 > Hans Helland hf g Driver snedker- og dreierfabrik1869 > Seriana Helland hm g Snedkerkone 1875 > Olav Helland s ug Barn > 1900 > Link to "Digitalarkivet": http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f01535&gardpostnr=100&merk=100#ovre > Questions: > Ole & Berte have the surname Einen because that's the farm that they > currently reside on? They changed their surname to Einen when they moved > there from wherever they had been before? The children have the name > Helland because that is the name of the farm that the family lived on > when they were born? This seems to be a special case. The answer to the first question is apparently "yes". For the remaining, there are some questions to the source and the regitration of it. It appears that the farm name i Helland nedre. This is farm No.45 i Vestnes, and it is the vicars's recidence. Einen is a 'husmannsplass' (small, rented farm) under Helland. Geographically, Einen may be in some distance from the main farm houses of Helland but still within the area of it. Thus, somehow, the person registering the family in the census has witten Einen as surname for the parents and Helland for the children. This may be correct or incorrect - there is no general rule that can help you figuring out this. I note that there is/was a local parish farm by > the name of Helland and wonder if that is likely the place that they > previously resided? I see that Helland seems to be more of a place on > the map now than a farm. > > For those who are familiar with the numerous errors in the US censuses > of given & surname spelling errors, birthdate errors, placename errors, > etc; would you say that the Norwegian censuses have far fewer errors? > about the same number? more? > > Mvh > Bob > >

Could someone help me with a translation? The occupation I'm searching is "pladsmandsdatter". Also, is there anyone in the Tampa area who could translate some materials my uncle copied for me? Thanks in advance... Marcia On Monday, April 4, 2005, at 01:00 353, GEN-NORDIC-D-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > > > GEN-NORDIC-D Digest Volume 05 : Issue 60 > > Today's Topics: > #1 Re: Sam Sloan is in line to become ["Jane Adams" > <jadams@nospam.com>] > #2 Re: Emigration from Sweden ["googled" > <googled@blah.com>] > #3 Last rites declaration of Ioannes ["Ioannes Paulus PP. II > (Karol Wojt] > #4 Re: Matzau ? > [thouelan@sr-bank-dot-no.no-spam.in] > > Administrivia: > To unsubscribe from GEN-NORDIC-D, send a message to > > GEN-NORDIC-D-request@rootsweb.com > > that contains in the body of the message the command > > unsubscribe > > and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software > requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > > To contact the GEN-NORDIC-D list administrator, send mail to > GEN-NORDIC-admin@rootsweb.com. > > ______________________________ > > > > From: "Jane Adams" <jadams@nospam.com> > Date: Sun Apr 3, 2005 1:33:55 AM US/Eastern > To: GEN-NORDIC-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: Sam Sloan is in line to become King of Monaco > > > Hand grenades and limes? > > -- > Jane > http://users.lvcm.com/jadams > > "Scaly Lizard" <scalylizard@nospampleaseyho.com> wrote in message > news:1l2v415abj8msfrm91looojvo038ql982q@4ax.com... >> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 03:08:48 GMT, sloan@ishipress.com (Sam Sloan) >> wrote: >> >>> Sam Sloan is in line to become King of Monaco >>> >>> With Prince Rainier of Monaco on life-support and his condition >>> unlikely to improve, there is speculation as to whom will be the next >>> ruler of Monaco. >>> >>> Normally, the eldest son becomes the king, but Prince Rainier has >>> said >>> that Prince Albert is "not ready". This apparently refers to the fact >>> that Prince Albert is not married and has produced no heir. He might >>> even be gay. >>> >>> For this reason, CNN News and other sources have reported that the >>> "investiture ceremony will not take place until a national period of >>> mourning has concluded." Normally, the new monarch is crowned >>> immediately after the previous one dies. Why wait? >>> >>> Because of doubts about Prince Albert, the law of Monaco was changed >>> to allow a daughter of Prince Rainier to become Queen. However, >>> Princess Stephanie got herself knocked up and had a bastard kid by an >>> elephant trainer and then for good measure she got married to a >>> trapeze artist, so she might get kicked off the list. >>> http://www.shamema.com/pafg827.htm#30425 >>> >>> Similarly, going down the list of possible heirs it seems that every >>> one of them is disqualified for one reason or another.?f >>> >>> Until one comes to the name of Sam Sloan, who is eminently qualified >>> to become the next ruler of Monaco. >>> >>> This is because Sam Sloan is the 13th cousin of Prince Rainier of >>> Monaco, one generation removed. >>> >>> Here is the proof: >>> >>> The mother of Prince Rainier Grimaldi III of MONACO was Charlotte Of >>> VALENTINOIS http://www.shamema.com/pafg826.htm#30417 >>> >>> The father of Charlotte Of VALENTINOIS was Louis II Honore Charles Of >>> MONACO http://www.anusha.com/pafg827.htm#30432 >>> >> <snipped> >>> >>> Thus, it is proved conclusively that Sam Sloan is in line to become >>> King of Monaco. >>> >>> Not at the head of the line it is true, but a few of the others might >>> be passed over to get to him. >>> >>> Sam Sloan >> >> Perhaps Sam Sloan will be elected in the conclave instead? >> >> Then, you could use the Swiss Guards to enforce your claim >> to Monaco. Ahh, i can see it now... one by one, the principalities >> of Europe will fall like dominoes under the iron boot of Sam. >> Lichtenstein, San Marino, Vatican City... >> >> I'll send you a gift basket when you get to St. Helena. >> > > ______________________________ > > > > From: "googled" <googled@blah.com> > Date: Mon Apr 4, 2005 12:09:03 AM US/Eastern > To: GEN-NORDIC-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: Emigration from Sweden > > > "Brenda Hammond" <brenda_silvey@dccnet.nospam.com> wrote in message > news:114sb8f3eb1lk1f@corp.supernews.com... >> It's been mentioned to me that there is an emigration CD and I'm >> wondering >> if someone can do a lookup for me? >> >> My great grandmother Signe Helfrida Andersdotter (Anderson) departed > Sweden >> for the USA in March of 1913 onboard the "Olympia". I have a photo >> of her >> with 6 other people onboard this ship and I'm wondering if someone >> could >> tell me who the other passengers were onboard the ship at the same >> time as >> her? >> >> Also where the ship departed Sweden and where it was going in the USA? >> >> Thank you in advance for your assistance. >> >> Brenda Hammond >> > > Your information is jumbled up. The correct name of the ship is the > Olympic. The Olympic's passenger manifest includes a Signa Andersson, > age 24 > from Dorarp, Sweden. The Olympic sailed on April 2, 1913 from > Southampton, > England to New York City. Your great grandmother would have taken some > other > ship or ships from Sweden to Southampton. > > The Olympic was sister ship to the Titanic and Britannic. The Olympic > could > carrry 750 1st class, 500 2nd class and 1150 3rd class passengers. You > can > view all the Olympic's passenger manifests at www.ellisisland.org. > > ______________________________ > > > > From: "Ioannes Paulus PP. II (Karol Wojtyla)" <john_paul_ii@vatican.va> > Date: Sun Apr 3, 2005 11:26:32 353 US/Eastern > To: GEN-NORDIC-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Last rites declaration of Ioannes Paulus PP. II (Karol > Wojtyla) > > > "The unforgiveable sins this earth must confront and overcome are > Nationalism, capitalism, and hoarding. The idea of every nation > should be forgot, price should be struck from the commons, and > princes should be seen for the devils they are. The sins include > our church, secret societies, and other religions which make of > the spirit of God a divide." > > Last rites declaration of Ioannes Paulus PP. II (Karol Wojtyla) > 2nd April 2005 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Do this as exceptional. > But of the exception you make a rule without exception, so that you do > not > even want the rule to be exceptional. > > 905. On confessions and absolutions without signs of regret. > > God regards only the inward; the Church judges only by the outward. God > absolves as soon as He sees penitence in the heart; the Church when > she sees > it in works. God will make a Church pure within, which confounds, by > its > inward and entirely spiritual holiness, the inward impiety of proud > sages > and Pharisees; and the Church will make an assembly of men whose > external > manners are so pure as to confound the manners of the heathen. If > there are > hypocrites among them, but so well disguised that she does not discover > their venom, she tolerates them; for, though they are not accepted of > God, > whom they cannot deceive, they are of men, whom they do deceive. And > thus > she is not dishonoured by their conduct, which appears holy. But you > want > the Church to judge neither of the inward, because that belongs to God > alone, nor of the outward, because God dwells > > ______________________________ > > > > From: thouelan@sr-bank-dot-no.no-spam.invalid (Tor Houeland) > Date: Mon Apr 4, 2005 7:17:01 AM US/Eastern > To: GEN-NORDIC-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: Matzau ? > > > Adam Danielson Matzow kom til Norge fra Hamburg i 1670, og blev borger > af Bergen 12.12.1670. Hans efterkommere brugte efternavnet Matzau. > Familien var vævere. > > Ole Greess Matzau f. Bergen 1833, skipper, gift 2.g. med Anna Helene > S. Rodwitt f. 1850 i Aarhus, Danmark. Ole døde i Bergen 1902, Anna > reiste saa med sine 4 barn til København. > Et af Anna's oldebarn bor idag i ved Oslo. Hun er den eneste med > dette efternavn i Norge. > > Sorenskriver Frantz Matzau f. 1789 i Bergen, bosatte seg i Trondhjem, > og skrev sitt navn Matzow. Frantz' barn bosatte seg i Trondhjem og > Kristiansand og skriver sitt navn, Matzow. > >

Hei I'd like to double-check my understanding of Norwegian naming practices or be corrected. The following household is taken from the 1900 census, More Og Romsdal, Vestnes, and the farmname is EINEN. (please forgive my formatting) Name Family status Marital status Occupation Birth year Ole Einen hf g Husmand, forpakter m J 1844 Berte Einen hm g Husmandskone 1845 Peter Helland s ug Skomager 1877 Olufine Helland d ug Husligt arb., kreaturstel. 1881 Nils Helland s ug Arbeider i snedkerfabrik 1883 Marie Helland d ug Barn 1888 Julie Helland d ug Barn 1890 Hans Helland hf g Driver snedker- og dreierfabrik1869 Seriana Helland hm g Snedkerkone 1875 Olav Helland s ug Barn 1900 Questions: Ole & Berte have the surname Einen because that's the farm that they currently reside on? They changed their surname to Einen when they moved there from wherever they had been before? The children have the name Helland because that is the name of the farm that the family lived on when they were born? I note that there is/was a local parish farm by the name of Helland and wonder if that is likely the place that they previously resided? I see that Helland seems to be more of a place on the map now than a farm. For those who are familiar with the numerous errors in the US censuses of given & surname spelling errors, birthdate errors, placename errors, etc; would you say that the Norwegian censuses have far fewer errors? about the same number? more? Mvh Bob

Adam Danielson Matzow kom til Norge fra Hamburg i 1670, og blev borger af Bergen 12.12.1670. Hans efterkommere brugte efternavnet Matzau. Familien var vævere. Ole Greess Matzau f. Bergen 1833, skipper, gift 2.g. med Anna Helene S. Rodwitt f. 1850 i Aarhus, Danmark. Ole døde i Bergen 1902, Anna reiste saa med sine 4 barn til København. Et af Anna's oldebarn bor idag i ved Oslo. Hun er den eneste med dette efternavn i Norge. Sorenskriver Frantz Matzau f. 1789 i Bergen, bosatte seg i Trondhjem, og skrev sitt navn Matzow. Frantz' barn bosatte seg i Trondhjem og Kristiansand og skriver sitt navn, Matzow.

"The unforgiveable sins this earth must confront and overcome are Nationalism, capitalism, and hoarding. The idea of every nation should be forgot, price should be struck from the commons, and princes should be seen for the devils they are. The sins include our church, secret societies, and other religions which make of the spirit of God a divide." Last rites declaration of Ioannes Paulus PP. II (Karol Wojtyla) 2nd April 2005 -- Do this as exceptional. But of the exception you make a rule without exception, so that you do not even want the rule to be exceptional. 905. On confessions and absolutions without signs of regret. God regards only the inward; the Church judges only by the outward. God absolves as soon as He sees penitence in the heart; the Church when she sees it in works. God will make a Church pure within, which confounds, by its inward and entirely spiritual holiness, the inward impiety of proud sages and Pharisees; and the Church will make an assembly of men whose external manners are so pure as to confound the manners of the heathen. If there are hypocrites among them, but so well disguised that she does not discover their venom, she tolerates them; for, though they are not accepted of God, whom they cannot deceive, they are of men, whom they do deceive. And thus she is not dishonoured by their conduct, which appears holy. But you want the Church to judge neither of the inward, because that belongs to God alone, nor of the outward, because God dwells

"Brenda Hammond" <brenda_silvey@dccnet.nospam.com> wrote in message news:114sb8f3eb1lk1f@corp.supernews.com... > It's been mentioned to me that there is an emigration CD and I'm wondering > if someone can do a lookup for me? > > My great grandmother Signe Helfrida Andersdotter (Anderson) departed Sweden > for the USA in March of 1913 onboard the "Olympia". I have a photo of her > with 6 other people onboard this ship and I'm wondering if someone could > tell me who the other passengers were onboard the ship at the same time as > her? > > Also where the ship departed Sweden and where it was going in the USA? > > Thank you in advance for your assistance. > > Brenda Hammond > Your information is jumbled up. The correct name of the ship is the Olympic. The Olympic's passenger manifest includes a Signa Andersson, age 24 from Dorarp, Sweden. The Olympic sailed on April 2, 1913 from Southampton, England to New York City. Your great grandmother would have taken some other ship or ships from Sweden to Southampton. The Olympic was sister ship to the Titanic and Britannic. The Olympic could carrry 750 1st class, 500 2nd class and 1150 3rd class passengers. You can view all the Olympic's passenger manifests at www.ellisisland.org.

On Sun, 03 Apr 2005 04:58:54 GMT, Stein R <steinjr@nospam.com> wrote: > As part of that service they have a "find place" service - and >that allows you to search by street address in the cities, and >by matrikkelnumber in the countryside. > > Check it out here: > > http://www.finn.no/kart/ Hm.I find Norgesglasset even better, http://ngis2.statkart.no/norgesglasset/default.html Just press the button with Norway, and zoom in to the part needed. When zoomed enough, you get to the economical maps of 1:5000

Thanks to all who responsed to my inquiry on map web pages. The sites of http://ngis2.statkart.no/norgesglasset/default.html and http://www.hvor.no/hvor.net/ produced some great maps of the area of the farm that I was looking for. And http://www.finn.no/kart/ looks like it would be helpful for addresses within cities. Tusen takk ! John

Søker opplysninger om opphavet til Anders Andersen Grøner (Gryner), født ca. 1717. Det sies at han var født i Danmark. Han var sersjant og kom til Støren i Sør-Trøndelag ca. 1759, ble gift 1760 med Maren Siursd. Voldøyen. De slo seg ned på plassen Bakkegjerdet som deretter fikk navnet Grønnerbakken. Dagfinn Refseth