Dear Newsgroup ~ In my previous post, I presented evidence that John Norbury, Esq., did not die in 1414, but was living in 1415-16. For a better indication of his death date, I note that John Norbury, Esq., was appointed Constable of Leeds Castle for life on 31 August 1399 [see Cal. of Patent Rolls, 1396–1399 (1909): 595]. He presumably died shortly before 27 October 1420, when Geoffrey Yonge was appointed “Gatekeeper” of Leeds Castle [see Cal. of Patent Rolls, 1416–1422 (1911): 300]. Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah On Saturday, March 4, 2017 at 5:08:56 PM UTC-7, Douglas Richardson wrote: > Dear Newsgroup ~ > > This is a followup to my earlier post. > > Roskell, House of Commons 1386–1421 3 (1992): 843–846 includes a good biography of John Norbury, Esq. This biography can be viewed at the following weblink: > > http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1386-1421/member/norbury-john-1414#footnote12_kxf6w0a > > Regarding his death date, the following information is provided by Roskell: > > "Norbury retired from public life in 1409, and appears to have died in 1414, soon after making an elaborate settlement of his estates." > > The statement that Norbury retired from public life in 1409 is not correct. John Norbury served as Justice of the Peace for Hertfordshire in 1413–14. See Calendar of Patent Rolls, 1413–1416 (1910): 419, available at the following weblink: > > https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=inu.30000008749636;view=1up;seq=431 > > Insofar as John Norbury dying in 1414, that information is also incorrect. The online discovery catalogue has the following record which shows that John Norbury, Esq. was still living as late as 3 Henry V [i.e, 1415-16]: > > Reference: E 212/62 > Description: > Grantor: Gilbert Talbot, lord of Archenfield (Irchenfelde) and Blackmere. Grantee: John Norbury, esquire. Subject: Grant of the manor of Chalton (Chalugton). Hampshire > Note: French > Date: 3 Hen. V > Held by: The National Archives, Kew > > There doesn't appear to have been an inquisition post mortem taken John Norbury's death, so the exact year of his death is unknown. My research indicates that his widow, Elizabeth, married (3rd) John Montgomery, Knt. in or before 1425. > > Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Dear Newsgroup ~ In an earlier post in this thread, I presented evidence that John Norbury, Esq., Lord High Treasurer of England, did not die in 1414, but was living as late as 1415-16, when Gilbert Talbot, lord of Archenfield and Blackmere, granted him the manor of Chalton, Hampshire [see National Archives, E 212/62, available at http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk]. I previously noted that John Norbury, Esq., was appointed Constable of Leeds Castle for life on 31 August 1399 [see Cal. of Patent Rolls, 1396–1399 (1909): 595]. I stated that he presumably died shortly before 27 October 1420, when Geoffrey Yonge was appointed “Gatekeeper” of Leeds Castle [see Cal. of Patent Rolls, 1416–1422 (1911): 300]. John Watson, however, has rightly pointed out that John Norbury, Esq., actually gave up the lordship and castle of Leeds, Kent sometime before 7 December 1412, as indicated by a record found in Calendar of Patent Rolls, 1408-1413 (1909): 453. The implication that John Norbury was living as late as 1420 was an error on my part. We can be certain, however, that John Norbury died sometime before 23 October 1417, when his widow, Elizabeth, Lady Say, is known to have been married to her next husband, Sir John Montgomery. This new information is revealed in a footnote published in Aldrich, Register of the most noble Order of the Garter 1 (1724): 205, footnote s, which reads as follows: “Lib. S. Albani in Bibl. Cotton. Nero D. 7. [Date:] 23 Oct. 1417. suscepit beneficium nostrae fraternitatis Elizabetha Domina Say; cujus interventu concessa fuit fraternitas nostri Capituli Domino Johanni de Montegomerico viro suo, qui pro tunc in ultramarinis militavit Domino nostro Regi Henrico.” END OF QUOTE. The above source may be viewed at the following weblink: https://books.google.com/books?id=CwxdAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA205 In summary, I find that John Norbury was living as late as 1415-16, and he died sometime before 23 October 1417. Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Dear Newsgroup ~ In my earlier post, I gave the following citation: Aldrich, Register of the most noble Order of the Garter 1 (1724): 205, footnote "s." I believe the citation should actually be: Anstis, Register of the most noble Order of the Garter 2 (1724): 205, footnote "s." Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah