Subject: "Family Crest" > news:soc.genealogy.italian "Deborah Vivona" wrote in message news: Date: 2002-05-20 06:00:14 PST : > Hi Paula, Sorry, I tried to write you off LIST, but my letter to you came back.... > Dear Deborah, Please don't feel embarrassed its okay. It was a learning experience, which will help others. This Heraldry topic comes up once in awhile as marketers sell people family crests and certificates. However, it really can get out of hand in a big way, which is why Frank and Mike posted those little comedy routines on the subject. (Aka "dry wit" or sarcasm) Frank has a point about making up your own coat-of-arms, etc as many of the marketers do just that ... so why not a personal creation? In fact, in the historical archives one can sometimes uncover more than one crest/coat of arms for a surname when different individuals, with the same surname, received a Title. I have seen sites that help you "build your own" and once lived near a family who did just that...and worked on it like a huge flag quilt and dropped it over their 2nd story balcony. It was very beautiful. Have a great time in Italy and in researching your Family Tree. Best Wishes Always, Paula Marie Nigro "Italian Genealogy Online and all things Italian" http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/pearlsofwisdom/index.html --------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Deborah Vivona Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 7:54 AM To: Tea Cup Subject: Re: "Family Crest" yesme Good Morning Tea Cup, "Thank you," for your kind words and the information. Somehow what and how you explained it, didn't hurt....I was hurt and embarrassed that I had shared something that I was going to be cross stitching on with all of the LIST that I thought others were be interested in to. But, if through my ignorance of crests ,my choice of ignorance has saved others of throwing away their money, then something good did come out of it. Yes, what the English woman, (?) [Carleen Basham Carnivale] said was kind too and appreciated...I do have a room such as her "genie" room! As usual, your wise words, are greatly received and warmly taken. "Thank you" for teaching me so politely. I will think of you in a week as I cross stitch in Italy, fondly, and I will keep my ears and eyes open for other Nigros as I continue to search for Vivonas. You have been a friend as Mary Nigro was to our Grandmother Sadie Vivona was in Kansas City.... Thank you, Sincerely, Deborah Vivona > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tea Cup > Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 2:13 AM > To: GEN-ITALIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: "Family Crest" yesme@Iamhere >> >> "Deborah Vivona" wrote in message > > news:OE157sKd6QR7j1HaKtK0003620f@hotmail.com > > Dear NOT ME @ NOT There, > > Yes, you did burst my bubble... > Hello, > Well actually it sounded more like he was trying to protect you and anyone > else who might fall for these schemes since this is a global newsgroup with > many readers. Guys can sometimes be overly blunt but if Frank F would have > tipsy-toed around the situation many people might not have understood as > quickly. That old saying you quoted did not apply to accurate research, it > was about "bad hair" days, a cake that didn't rise and things of that order. > In research it is not about "if you can't say something nice don't say it" > In research it is all about *Truth otherwise it is Fraud* > > Although his delivery tends to be rough It Truly seems like he just wants > protect you and others from throwing away huge sums of money on this sort of > thing and to help you understand the importance of accuracy. There are > those poor souls out there who pay BIG bucks to have some phony bunch of > heraldic papers given to them. The Italian Government has closed down 3 of > them within the past 2 years, one in Roma and two in Firenze, for fraud in > the millions$$. > > Purchasing a cute little pillow or piece of paper won't hurt anyone, if it > stops there, but it is important to be truthful to oneself and to keep > truthful records for future generations. Genealogy research is a little > like bookkeeping. One may wish to believe they have thus and such but it is > important to truly "count the beans" (so to speak). An honest Inventory is > not wishful thinking...just the facts. > > Simply put: Many people share the same surname as some person way, way, way > back in time who was raised to the ranks of nobility because of something he > did for the King or the Pope or the Holy Roman Emperor. When he died or > retired even his eldest son would need *approval* from the monarch (or > someone in charge) in order to have the Title and Family Crest passed on > down to him. The younger boys did not get it (unless the eldest son died) > and the girls did not in most cases. Some sovereigns and titled people were > women only because there were no male heirs and a special dispensation was > granted. > > Most people who share those surnames worked at the castle...they didn't own > it. Plus many "so called" Family Crests, like the ones Frank F found on > > "thisisfake" and "ripoff". They had crests for all four names. > > Never existed and are Totally Fake. > > Maybe you will feel better if you do as the English (?) woman who posts here > does (the one with the Italian husbands surname) as she said... > do it for "fun" . in your "genie room" > > Best wishes, > Paula