Jozef is the one who didn't fit on the 1914 manifest; Jan and Tillie had three girls, Eva, Stella, and Genevieve in the 1920 census. No Joseph; perhaps he is the Richard Lis you referenced earlier, travelling as a son to Tillie. There is a downloadable marriage certificate for Jan Wiktor and Tekla 'Podrasa' in the Cook County marriage collection at the LDS pilot site: http://search.labs.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#r=0;p=allCollections Mary MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > > Mary, > Hi. Do you know if the Jan Lis below is related to a Catherine and Albert > Lis? > > Susan > > In a message dated 6/4/2009 7:14:01 PM Central Standard Time, > MichellesBigBash@aol.com writes: > > Mary Snow wrote: > >> Hello, Susan, >> >> Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, >> Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. >> Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will >> tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. >> This page and previous page. >> http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 >> > >

You'd have to see the microfilmed records to see any relationship. Did Catherine and Albert live in the same town? Mary MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > > Mary, > Hi. Do you know if the Jan Lis below is related to a Catherine and Albert > Lis? > > > Mary Snow wrote: > >> Hello, Susan, >> >> Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, >> Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. >> Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will >> tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. >> This page and previous page. >> http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228

Throughout my grandmother's life (Eva Wiktor), she only acknowledged two siblings: Stefania and Genowefa. She never acknowledged a brother. Therefore, the relationship of Richard Lis to my grandmother is still a mystery. In a message dated 6/4/2009 7:14:01 PM Central Standard Time, MichellesBigBash@aol.com writes: So if Teckla's maiden name was Podraza, how is Jan Lis her father? Was he a stepfather? **************Limited Time Offers: Save big on popular laptops at Dell (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221354145x1201369495/aol?redir=http:%2F %2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215221161%3B37268813%3By)

Mary, Hi. Do you know if the Jan Lis below is related to a Catherine and Albert Lis? Susan In a message dated 6/4/2009 7:14:01 PM Central Standard Time, MichellesBigBash@aol.com writes: Mary Snow wrote: > Hello, Susan, > > Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, > Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. > Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will > tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. > This page and previous page. > http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 **************Limited Time Offers: Save big on popular laptops at Dell (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221354145x1201369495/aol?redir=http:%2F %2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215221161%3B37268813%3By)

Mary Snow, Hi. You are wonderful! So if Teckla's maiden name was Podraza, how is Jan Lis her father? Was he a stepfather? This is great - I was stuck. I knew that John Wiktor and Teckla Podraza had gotten married at Holy Trinity church on October 23, 1900. I'll check all of those links now. Susan In a message dated 6/4/2009 6:43:02 PM Central Standard Time, marysnow@bellsouth.net writes: Tekla Podraza immigration in 1899; note, she, like Tekla Wiktor, was blind in one eye. http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=603076060370 Mary Mary Snow wrote: > Hello, Susan, > > Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, > Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. > Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will > tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. > This page and previous page. > http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 **************Limited Time Offers: Save big on popular laptops at Dell (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221354145x1201369495/aol?redir=http:%2F %2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215221161%3B37268813%3By)

Tekla Podraza immigration in 1899; note, she, like Tekla Wiktor, was blind in one eye. http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=603076060370 Mary Mary Snow wrote: > Hello, Susan, > > Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, > Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. > Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will > tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. > This page and previous page. > http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 > > MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> My name is Susan. >> >> My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few years >> of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) >> Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were >> scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla and Eva >> stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was >> looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to Chicago. >> >> The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or a >> very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them and >> claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the Polish >> military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. >> >> Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, >> their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note that I >> checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) >> >> Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard Lis >> attended his wake. >> >> In summary, I am unsure if I am related to the Lis family or not. If anyone >> has any information, please feel free to contact me. >> >

The mystery is the marriage listing of Jan Wiktor and Thecla Podraza in 1900 at Holy Trinity Church. http://www.pgsa.org/CzuchMar.php Mary Snow wrote: > Hello, Susan, > > Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, > Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. > Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will > tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. > This page and previous page. > http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 > > MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> My name is Susan. >> >> My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few years >> of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) >> Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were >> scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla and Eva >> stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was >> looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to Chicago. >> >> The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or a >> very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them and >> claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the Polish >> military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. >> >> Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, >> their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note that I >> checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) >> >> Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard Lis >> attended his wake. >> >

Hello, Susan, Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. This page and previous page. http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > > Hi, > My name is Susan. > > My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few years > of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) > Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were > scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla and Eva > stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was > looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to Chicago. > > The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or a > very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them and > claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the Polish > military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. > > Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, > their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note that I > checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) > > Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard Lis > attended his wake. > > In summary, I am unsure if I am related to the Lis family or not. If anyone > has any information, please feel free to contact me. >

Strike that. I see her maiden name was Podraza. Mary Mary Snow wrote: > Could it be that the death certificate was giving Tillie's maiden name? > > Mary > > MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> My name is Susan. >> >> My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few years >> of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) >> Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were >> scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla and Eva >> stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was >> looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to Chicago. >> >> The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or a >> very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them and >> claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the Polish >> military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. >> >> Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, >> their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note that I >> checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) >> >> Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard Lis >> attended his wake. >> >> In summary, I am unsure if I am related to the Lis family or not. If anyone >> has any information, please feel free to contact me. >> >> >> > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Could it be that the death certificate was giving Tillie's maiden name? Mary MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > > Hi, > My name is Susan. > > My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few years > of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) > Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were > scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla and Eva > stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was > looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to Chicago. > > The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or a > very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them and > claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the Polish > military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. > > Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, > their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note that I > checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) > > Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard Lis > attended his wake. > > In summary, I am unsure if I am related to the Lis family or not. If anyone > has any information, please feel free to contact me. > >

Hi, My name is Susan. My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few years of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla and Eva stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to Chicago. The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or a very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them and claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the Polish military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note that I checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard Lis attended his wake. In summary, I am unsure if I am related to the Lis family or not. If anyone has any information, please feel free to contact me. Thank you, Susan ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------- In a message dated 6/4/2009 4:34:22 PM Central Standard Time, cookie10710@verizon.net writes: Thanks again; where did you find the number of families living in this area/ The Kohlmann came from Austria, Kasimierz and Helena. They lived in Pilzno and Debica. My maternal g-grandmother, Marie married Jan Pogorzelska and had my granmother,Antoinette. She married Antoni Lis who was the son of Marcin Lis from Skopanie. I have no other info on Kohlmanns and Marci Lis, tho a son that he had, Joe or Julian is the father of a cousin Lottie, in Connecticut, I will check with her Thanks again for your help Elaine **************Limited Time Offers: Save big on popular laptops at Dell (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221354145x1201369495/aol?redir=http:%2F %2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215221161%3B37268813%3By)

Thanks again; where did you find the number of families living in this area/ The Kohlmann came from Austria, Kasimierz and Helena. They lived in Pilzno and Debica. My maternal g-grandmother, Marie married Jan Pogorzelska and had my granmother,Antoinette. She married Antoni Lis who was the son of Marcin Lis from Skopanie. I have no other info on Kohlmanns and Marci Lis, tho a son that he had, Joe or Julian is the father of a cousin Lottie, in Connecticut, I will check with her Thanks again for your help Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 2:24 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hi Elaine > > The cemetery is likely not to have any specific or particular name. It's > just the parish cemetery and is identified simply with the parish. And > customarily the cemetery is adjacent to or close to the church, so that's > never a problem. But that's the case in rural Poland. Here in North > America, > multiple parishes in growing cities often found the need for a cemetery > and > pooled their resources to acquire the land for one. In such a case, the > cemetery was no longer tied to one particular parish and needed its own > name. > > Unlike our custom in North America, most rural roads in Poland have no > street or road names. Perhaps that's because most villages grew along a > single road ("this road") or perhaps at/near an intersection of two roads. > In such cases, Poles would likely differentiate the two roads by calling > one > "this road" and the other "that road". > > I find Poles fascinating when it comes to geographic names. Every place > that > you can think of or stumble upon has a place name. My g-grandfather's farm > was clustered with a couple of other farms just beyond a narrow stand of > trees separating it from the main portion of the village. Yep, it had its > own place name (but was still part of the village). As did the single > homestead a bit further down the unpaved road that had dwindled to barely > a > path. Yep, it had its own place name. But did the road/path have a name? > No, > but if it did it would be "that other road" because the main village > already > had two roads, "this road" and "that road". When Poles eventually got to > Polish cities, the need for street names finally became obvious because > "that other, other, other, other road" was just too unwieldy to use > routinely. > > Cheers! > > Dennis > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:08 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Dennis, >> Thanks so much for the info. I am the bad speller town is Przewoz and >> there are no street names only house number. >> >> Lila lives in Wroclaw but her brother lives in my mom's house in Przewoz. >> She sent me pics of the cemetery by St John the Baptist church and school >> . >> Do you know the name of that Catholic cemetery? >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:09 PM >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> >>> Hi Elaine >>> >>> Here's some background on the other two villages that you mentioned. >>> >>> In the 19th Century, Suchorzow was part of Baranow Parish and had 138 >>> homes >>> and 604 residents. Another reference revealed that around 1575 Suchorzow >>> was >>> part of nearby Miechocin Parish. However, this makes complete sense >>> because >>> Miechocin Parish is among the oldest parishes in the area (being founded >>> around 1165 AD) and a new, more spacious church at Baranow wasn't >>> erected >>> until 1604-1607. Apparently sometime after the new church was built in >>> Baranow, the parish boundaries were amended. >>> >>> In the 19th Century, Przezow is described as a "wolka" (the contemporary >>> meaning would be something like an unattached neighborhood or >>> subdivision) >>> of Suchorzow and had 28 homes and 126 residents. It too was part of >>> Baranow >>> Parish. >>> >>> You can count on your cousins for many things, but the correct spellings >>> of >>> place names isn't one of them. Przewoz is Przewoz. (Chuckle.) >>> >>> Regarding Kohlmann - >>> >>> I'll go way out on a limb here, but I'll bet that Kohlmann is not a >>> surname >>> native to Poland. (Nor is Stubenvoll, the surname of the family who >>> resided >>> at the noble estate in my ancestral parish and who proved themselves to >>> be >>> loyal patriots during WWII.) Alas you won't find any Kohlmanns living >>> today >>> in Malopolska, but you will find Kohlmans. While there are 2 living >>> around >>> Jaroslaw and 2 more living around Sanok, curiously there are 6 Kohlmans >>> living in the metropolitan Tarnow area and Pilzno is just down the road >>> a >>> piece. (This data is from 2002.) Making contact with them might provide >>> you >>> with many answers. >>> >>> I too have some Germanic ancestors contributing to my genetic mix. Two >>> distinctly separate lines, as a matter of fact. But they settled in >>> Malopolska long before surnames became commonplace among commoners and >>> probably at the invitation of King Casimir the Great who invited many >>> different nationalities to resettle and repopulate his kingdom in the >>> 1350s. >>> Thus, their surnames became simply "Niemiec" and in Polish "Niemiec" >>> means >>> "German". (We could quibble that "niemiec" also means "mute" and that >>> most >>> new immigrants couldn't speak Polish and were thus "mute", but why? My >>> version is much more fun.) >>> >>> Cheers and good luck! >>> >>> Dennis >>> http://spuscizna.org/ >>> >>> > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Elaine The cemetery is likely not to have any specific or particular name. It's just the parish cemetery and is identified simply with the parish. And customarily the cemetery is adjacent to or close to the church, so that's never a problem. But that's the case in rural Poland. Here in North America, multiple parishes in growing cities often found the need for a cemetery and pooled their resources to acquire the land for one. In such a case, the cemetery was no longer tied to one particular parish and needed its own name. Unlike our custom in North America, most rural roads in Poland have no street or road names. Perhaps that's because most villages grew along a single road ("this road") or perhaps at/near an intersection of two roads. In such cases, Poles would likely differentiate the two roads by calling one "this road" and the other "that road". I find Poles fascinating when it comes to geographic names. Every place that you can think of or stumble upon has a place name. My g-grandfather's farm was clustered with a couple of other farms just beyond a narrow stand of trees separating it from the main portion of the village. Yep, it had its own place name (but was still part of the village). As did the single homestead a bit further down the unpaved road that had dwindled to barely a path. Yep, it had its own place name. But did the road/path have a name? No, but if it did it would be "that other road" because the main village already had two roads, "this road" and "that road". When Poles eventually got to Polish cities, the need for street names finally became obvious because "that other, other, other, other road" was just too unwieldy to use routinely. Cheers! Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:08 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Dennis, > Thanks so much for the info. I am the bad speller town is Przewoz and > there are no street names only house number. > > Lila lives in Wroclaw but her brother lives in my mom's house in Przewoz. > She sent me pics of the cemetery by St John the Baptist church and school > . > Do you know the name of that Catholic cemetery? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:09 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Hi Elaine >> >> Here's some background on the other two villages that you mentioned. >> >> In the 19th Century, Suchorzow was part of Baranow Parish and had 138 >> homes >> and 604 residents. Another reference revealed that around 1575 Suchorzow >> was >> part of nearby Miechocin Parish. However, this makes complete sense >> because >> Miechocin Parish is among the oldest parishes in the area (being founded >> around 1165 AD) and a new, more spacious church at Baranow wasn't erected >> until 1604-1607. Apparently sometime after the new church was built in >> Baranow, the parish boundaries were amended. >> >> In the 19th Century, Przezow is described as a "wolka" (the contemporary >> meaning would be something like an unattached neighborhood or >> subdivision) >> of Suchorzow and had 28 homes and 126 residents. It too was part of >> Baranow >> Parish. >> >> You can count on your cousins for many things, but the correct spellings >> of >> place names isn't one of them. Przewoz is Przewoz. (Chuckle.) >> >> Regarding Kohlmann - >> >> I'll go way out on a limb here, but I'll bet that Kohlmann is not a >> surname >> native to Poland. (Nor is Stubenvoll, the surname of the family who >> resided >> at the noble estate in my ancestral parish and who proved themselves to >> be >> loyal patriots during WWII.) Alas you won't find any Kohlmanns living >> today >> in Malopolska, but you will find Kohlmans. While there are 2 living >> around >> Jaroslaw and 2 more living around Sanok, curiously there are 6 Kohlmans >> living in the metropolitan Tarnow area and Pilzno is just down the road a >> piece. (This data is from 2002.) Making contact with them might provide >> you >> with many answers. >> >> I too have some Germanic ancestors contributing to my genetic mix. Two >> distinctly separate lines, as a matter of fact. But they settled in >> Malopolska long before surnames became commonplace among commoners and >> probably at the invitation of King Casimir the Great who invited many >> different nationalities to resettle and repopulate his kingdom in the >> 1350s. >> Thus, their surnames became simply "Niemiec" and in Polish "Niemiec" >> means >> "German". (We could quibble that "niemiec" also means "mute" and that >> most >> new immigrants couldn't speak Polish and were thus "mute", but why? My >> version is much more fun.) >> >> Cheers and good luck! >> >> Dennis >> http://spuscizna.org/ >> >>

Dennis, Thanks so much for the info. I am the bad speller town is Przewoz and there are no street names only house number. Lila lives in Wroclaw but her brother lives in my mom's house in Przewoz. She sent me pics of the cemetery by St John the Baptist church and school . Do you know the name of that Catholic cemetery? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:09 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hi Elaine > > Here's some background on the other two villages that you mentioned. > > In the 19th Century, Suchorzow was part of Baranow Parish and had 138 > homes > and 604 residents. Another reference revealed that around 1575 Suchorzow > was > part of nearby Miechocin Parish. However, this makes complete sense > because > Miechocin Parish is among the oldest parishes in the area (being founded > around 1165 AD) and a new, more spacious church at Baranow wasn't erected > until 1604-1607. Apparently sometime after the new church was built in > Baranow, the parish boundaries were amended. > > In the 19th Century, Przezow is described as a "wolka" (the contemporary > meaning would be something like an unattached neighborhood or subdivision) > of Suchorzow and had 28 homes and 126 residents. It too was part of > Baranow > Parish. > > You can count on your cousins for many things, but the correct spellings > of > place names isn't one of them. Przewoz is Przewoz. (Chuckle.) > > Regarding Kohlmann - > > I'll go way out on a limb here, but I'll bet that Kohlmann not a surname > native to Poland. (Nor is Stubenvoll, the surname of the family who > resided > at the noble estate in my ancestral parish and who proved themselves to be > loyal patriots during WWII.) Alas you won't find any Kohlmanns living > today > in Malopolska, but you will find Kohlmans. While there are 2 living around > Jaroslaw and 2 more living around Sanok, curiously there are 6 Kohlmans > living in the metropolitan Tarnow area and Pilzno is just down the road a > piece. (This data is from 2002.) Making contact with them might provided > you > with many answers. > > I too have some Germanic ancestors contributing to my genetic mix. Two > distinctly separate lines, as a matter of fact. But they settled in > Malopolska long before surnames became commonplace among commoners and > probably at the invitation of King Casimir the Great who invited many > different nationalities to resettle and repopulate his kingdom in the > 1350s. > Thus, their surnames became simply "Niemiec" and in Polish "Niemiec" means > "German". (We could quibble that "niemiec" also means "mute" and that most > new immigrants couldn't speak Polish and were thus "mute", but why? My > version is much more fun.) > > Cheers and good luck! > > Dennis > http://spuscizna.org/ > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 8:50 AM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Hello Dennis, >> I will look over the manifest again. I found only one Josefa on >> Ancestrycom. >> I will have to assume that's her. My mother and her 2 sisters came to >> U<S >> from Baranow. One lists Suchorzow as home; the other Przewoz; they are >> about 3 miles apart, My first cousin who I found when I went to Poland 3 >> years ago says it is now Prezwoz, My mother's house is still there and >> my >> cousin's brother lives there. They are anxious that I come to visit but >> I >> had spinal fusion back surgery and it is not healing well It's n\been a >> year post op. Lila my cousin sent me cemetery photos and photos of >> Baranow >> castle, My great grandmother took care of the royalty's children and her >> husband >> was a doorman? She is a Kohlmann and he Jan Pogorzelski, >> I cannot find anything on Kohlman from Pilzno ;prior Austria. >> My cousins do not speak or write English and I no Polish. >> Regards, Elaine >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:07 PM >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> >>> Hi Elaine >>> >>> I agree with Marie's appraisal - Jozefa it is. >>> >>> By the way, it appears that Jadwiga was travelling in the company of >>> several >>> other young women from the Tarnobrzeg area. This would not be an unusual >>> arrangement for a 16-year old girl. While I do not detect any familial >>> relationship between Jadwiga and them, it is always possible that a >>> cousin >>> might be among them.. >>> >>> Jadwiga gives her hometown as Baranow (today Baranow Sandomierski) and >>> that's such a pretty spot - the site of Saint John the Baptist Church, >>> Baranow Castle, and fields of poppies blowing in the wind. See: >>> http://spuscizna.org/spuscizna/baranow.html . >>> >>> Good luck in your endeavor! >>> >>> Dennis >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> >>> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 12:50 PM >>> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>> >>> >>>> Marie,, Thanks so much On looking again I think Josefa is correct >>>> >>>> Regards >>>> >>>> Elaine >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "MJDallas" <rwlistsboards@comcast.net> >>>> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:33 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>>> >>>> >>>>> elaine frey wrote: >>>>>> Can you make out her name >>>>> >>>>> Elaine, >>>>> >>>>> I read the sister's first name as Jozefa. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Marie >>>>> ********************************* > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Elaine Here's some background on the other two villages that you mentioned. In the 19th Century, Suchorzow was part of Baranow Parish and had 138 homes and 604 residents. Another reference revealed that around 1575 Suchorzow was part of nearby Miechocin Parish. However, this makes complete sense because Miechocin Parish is among the oldest parishes in the area (being founded around 1165 AD) and a new, more spacious church at Baranow wasn't erected until 1604-1607. Apparently sometime after the new church was built in Baranow, the parish boundaries were amended. In the 19th Century, Przezow is described as a "wolka" (the contemporary meaning would be something like an unattached neighborhood or subdivision) of Suchorzow and had 28 homes and 126 residents. It too was part of Baranow Parish. You can count on your cousins for many things, but the correct spellings of place names isn't one of them. Przewoz is Przewoz. (Chuckle.) Regarding Kohlmann - I'll go way out on a limb here, but I'll bet that Kohlmann not a surname native to Poland. (Nor is Stubenvoll, the surname of the family who resided at the noble estate in my ancestral parish and who proved themselves to be loyal patriots during WWII.) Alas you won't find any Kohlmanns living today in Malopolska, but you will find Kohlmans. While there are 2 living around Jaroslaw and 2 more living around Sanok, curiously there are 6 Kohlmans living in the metropolitan Tarnow area and Pilzno is just down the road a piece. (This data is from 2002.) Making contact with them might provided you with many answers. I too have some Germanic ancestors contributing to my genetic mix. Two distinctly separate lines, as a matter of fact. But they settled in Malopolska long before surnames became commonplace among commoners and probably at the invitation of King Casimir the Great who invited many different nationalities to resettle and repopulate his kingdom in the 1350s. Thus, their surnames became simply "Niemiec" and in Polish "Niemiec" means "German". (We could quibble that "niemiec" also means "mute" and that most new immigrants couldn't speak Polish and were thus "mute", but why? My version is much more fun.) Cheers and good luck! Dennis http://spuscizna.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 8:50 AM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hello Dennis, > I will look over the manifest again. I found only one Josefa on > Ancestrycom. > I will have to assume that's her. My mother and her 2 sisters came to U<S > from Baranow. One lists Suchorzow as home; the other Przewoz; they are > about 3 miles apart, My first cousin who I found when I went to Poland 3 > years ago says it is now Prezwoz, My mother's house is still there and my > cousin's brother lives there. They are anxious that I come to visit but I > had spinal fusion back surgery and it is not healing well It's n\been a > year post op. Lila my cousin sent me cemetery photos and photos of > Baranow > castle, My great grandmother took care of the royalty's children and her > husband > was a doorman? She is a Kohlmann and he Jan Pogorzelski, > I cannot find anything on Kohlman from Pilzno ;prior Austria. > My cousins do not speak or write English and I no Polish. > Regards, Elaine > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:07 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Hi Elaine >> >> I agree with Marie's appraisal - Jozefa it is. >> >> By the way, it appears that Jadwiga was travelling in the company of >> several >> other young women from the Tarnobrzeg area. This would not be an unusual >> arrangement for a 16-year old girl. While I do not detect any familial >> relationship between Jadwiga and them, it is always possible that a >> cousin >> might be among them.. >> >> Jadwiga gives her hometown as Baranow (today Baranow Sandomierski) and >> that's such a pretty spot - the site of Saint John the Baptist Church, >> Baranow Castle, and fields of poppies blowing in the wind. See: >> http://spuscizna.org/spuscizna/baranow.html . >> >> Good luck in your endeavor! >> >> Dennis >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 12:50 PM >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> >>> Marie,, Thanks so much On looking again I think Josefa is correct >>> >>> Regards >>> >>> Elaine >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "MJDallas" <rwlistsboards@comcast.net> >>> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:33 PM >>> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>> >>> >>>> elaine frey wrote: >>>>> Can you make out her name >>>> >>>> Elaine, >>>> >>>> I read the sister's first name as Jozefa. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Marie >>>> *********************************

Hello Dennis, I will look over the manifest again. I found only one Josefa on Ancestrycom. I will have to assume that's her. My mother and her 2 sisters came to U<S from Baranow. One lists Suchorzow as home; the other Przewoz; they are about 3 miles apart, My first cousin who I found when I went to Poland 3 years ago says it is now Prezwoz, My mother's house is still there and my cousin's brother lives there. They are anxious that I come to visit but I had spinal fusion back surgery and it is not healing well It's n\been a year post op. Lila my cousin sent me cemetery photos and photos of Baranow castle, My great grandmother took care of the royalty's children and her husband was a doorman? She is a Kohlmann and he Jan Pogorzelski, I cannot find anything on Kohlman from Pilzno ;prior Austria. My cousins do not speak or write English and I no Polish. Regards, Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hi Elaine > > I agree with Marie's appraisal - Jozefa it is. > > By the way, it appears that Jadwiga was travelling in the company of > several > other young women from the Tarnobrzeg area. This would not be an unusual > arrangement for a 16-year old girl. While I do not detect any familial > relationship between Jadwiga and them, it is always possible that a cousin > might be among them.. > > Jadwiga gives her hometown as Baranow (today Baranow Sandomierski) and > that's such a pretty spot - the site of Saint John the Baptist Church, > Baranow Castle, and fields of poppies blowing in the wind. See: > http://spuscizna.org/spuscizna/baranow.html . > > Good luck in your endeavor! > > Dennis > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 12:50 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Marie,, Thanks so much On looking again I think Josefa is correct >> >> Regards >> >> Elaine >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "MJDallas" <rwlistsboards@comcast.net> >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:33 PM >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> >>> elaine frey wrote: >>>> Can you make out her name >>> >>> Elaine, >>> >>> I read the sister's first name as Jozefa. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Marie >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Elaine I agree with Marie's appraisal - Jozefa it is. By the way, it appears that Jadwiga was travelling in the company of several other young women from the Tarnobrzeg area. This would not be an unusual arrangement for a 16-year old girl. While I do not detect any familial relationship between Jadwiga and them, it is always possible that a cousin might be among them.. Jadwiga gives her hometown as Baranow (today Baranow Sandomierski) and that's such a pretty spot - the site of Saint John the Baptist Church, Baranow Castle, and fields of poppies blowing in the wind. See: http://spuscizna.org/spuscizna/baranow.html . Good luck in your endeavor! Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Marie,, Thanks so much On looking again I think Josefa is correct > > Regards > > Elaine > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MJDallas" <rwlistsboards@comcast.net> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:33 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> elaine frey wrote: >>> Can you make out her name >> >> Elaine, >> >> I read the sister's first name as Jozefa. >> >> Regards, >> Marie >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Marie,, Thanks so much On looking again I think Josefa is correct Regards Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "MJDallas" <rwlistsboards@comcast.net> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:33 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > elaine frey wrote: >> Can you make out her name > > Elaine, > > I read the sister's first name as Jozefa. > > Regards, > Marie > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

elaine frey wrote: > Can you make out her name Elaine, I read the sister's first name as Jozefa. Regards, Marie

Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived Dec 18 1913, she was born 1897. She is # 11 on the manifest. In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to her sister?????? Pogorzelska. Can you make out her name, Thanks, Elaine The house is still there