Thanks, Dennis. It always helps to know these little tidbits of information. Dee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hi Dee and Maciej > > There are commonly three relationships described as a "sister-in-law": the > sister of one's spouse, the wife of one's brother, or the wife of one's > brother-in-law. Less common ways of adding sisters-in-law would involve > the > remarriage of persons mentioned above. Given the fact that by July 1944 > almost five years of war had elapsed, a good number of persons had become > widows and/or widowers and some remarried. This results in new surnames > entering our family trees. > > But, strange things can happen to familial relationships when translated > and > penned on documents, especially if it means a war-time pass to visit the > Big > Apple. I suspect that's what happened in this particular case. Maybe, > maybe > not. > > I love a mystery. Please keep us informed. > > Cheers! > > Dennis Benarz > http://spuscizna.org/ > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dee Sager" <dsager@hughes.net> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 7:58 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> >> To be a sister-in-law, she could have been a sister to your father's wife >> as >> well as wife to his brother. >> >> Dee >> >> >> >>> Hello Elaine, >>> >>> My message was one of pure speculation. I have a number of mysteries >>> about >>> my father and this is just one of them. >>> >>> I have no idea on what basis Irena could have claimed to be my father's >>> sister in-law. There may be some other alternative but, had she been a >>> sister in-law, she would have been Irena Slugocka. My father only had >>> one >>> brother and he was executed by the Soviets in 1940 so that relationship >>> is >>> hardly likely - in any case my parents would have mentioned that to me. >>> My speculation is therefore that there was some other relationship >>> between >>> my father and Irene. >>> >>> I don't have the time to chase this story down but perhaps someone, some >>> time in the future will see this exchange of messages and establish some >>> sort of link. If I had the time, and the skill I would try to track >>> this >>> down. >>> >>> In the mean time I am appreciative of your reply and if you come across >>> any information or link I would be most appreciative. >>> >>> Yes, Hobart Australia is where my father ended up having started life in >>> Lwow. >>> >>> Best wishes >>> >>> Maciej Slugocki >>> Hobart, Australia >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >>> On Behalf Of elaine frey >>> Sent: Friday, 12 June 2009 9:15 PM >>> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>> >>> Hello Maciej >>> I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! >>> However, >>> I >>> am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was >>> a >>> Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. >>> Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt >>> Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa >>> arriving >>> and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. >>> I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of >>> an >>> Irene, I will let you know. >>> Regards. >>> Elaine >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> >>> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM >>> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>> >>> >>>> Hi Elaine, >>>> >>>> I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and >>>> photo >>>> I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, >>>> written >>>> in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated >>>> July >>>> 26,1944 is as follows. >>>> >>>> "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: >>>> This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., >>>> Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad >>>> leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. >>>> >>>> This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in >>>> support >>>> of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her >>>> in >>>> New York on important family affairs." >>>> >>>> The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question >>>> however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? >>>> >>>> Maciej Slugocki >>>> Hobart, Australia >>>> >>>> PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer >>>> 1943 >>>> in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com >>>> [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >>>> On Behalf Of elaine frey >>>> Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM >>>> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >>>> Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>>> >>>> Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived >>>> Dec >>>> 18 1913, she was born 1897. >>>> She is # 11 on the manifest. >>>> In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to >>>> her >>>> sister?????? Pogorzelska. >>>> Can you make out her name, >>>> Thanks, >>>> Elaine >>>> The house is still there >>>> ********************************* >>>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> ********************************* >>>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>> >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Dee and Maciej There are commonly three relationships described as a "sister-in-law": the sister of one's spouse, the wife of one's brother, or the wife of one's brother-in-law. Less common ways of adding sisters-in-law would involve the remarriage of persons mentioned above. Given the fact that by July 1944 almost five years of war had elapsed, a good number of persons had become widows and/or widowers and some remarried. This results in new surnames entering our family trees. But, strange things can happen to familial relationships when translated and penned on documents, especially if it means a war-time pass to visit the Big Apple. I suspect that's what happened in this particular case. Maybe, maybe not. I love a mystery. Please keep us informed. Cheers! Dennis Benarz http://spuscizna.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dee Sager" <dsager@hughes.net> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 7:58 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > To be a sister-in-law, she could have been a sister to your father's wife > as > well as wife to his brother. > > Dee > > > >> Hello Elaine, >> >> My message was one of pure speculation. I have a number of mysteries >> about >> my father and this is just one of them. >> >> I have no idea on what basis Irena could have claimed to be my father's >> sister in-law. There may be some other alternative but, had she been a >> sister in-law, she would have been Irena Slugocka. My father only had >> one >> brother and he was executed by the Soviets in 1940 so that relationship >> is >> hardly likely - in any case my parents would have mentioned that to me. >> My speculation is therefore that there was some other relationship >> between >> my father and Irene. >> >> I don't have the time to chase this story down but perhaps someone, some >> time in the future will see this exchange of messages and establish some >> sort of link. If I had the time, and the skill I would try to track this >> down. >> >> In the mean time I am appreciative of your reply and if you come across >> any information or link I would be most appreciative. >> >> Yes, Hobart Australia is where my father ended up having started life in >> Lwow. >> >> Best wishes >> >> Maciej Slugocki >> Hobart, Australia >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> On Behalf Of elaine frey >> Sent: Friday, 12 June 2009 9:15 PM >> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> Hello Maciej >> I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! >> However, >> I >> am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was >> a >> Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. >> Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt >> Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa >> arriving >> and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. >> I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of an >> Irene, I will let you know. >> Regards. >> Elaine >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> >>> Hi Elaine, >>> >>> I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and >>> photo >>> I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, >>> written >>> in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated >>> July >>> 26,1944 is as follows. >>> >>> "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: >>> This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., >>> Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad >>> leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. >>> >>> This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in support >>> of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her >>> in >>> New York on important family affairs." >>> >>> The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question >>> however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? >>> >>> Maciej Slugocki >>> Hobart, Australia >>> >>> PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer 1943 >>> in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >>> On Behalf Of elaine frey >>> Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM >>> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>> >>> Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived >>> Dec >>> 18 1913, she was born 1897. >>> She is # 11 on the manifest. >>> In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to >>> her >>> sister?????? Pogorzelska. >>> Can you make out her name, >>> Thanks, >>> Elaine >>> The house is still there >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hello Elaine, My message was one of pure speculation. I have a number of mysteries about my father and this is just one of them. I have no idea on what basis Irena could have claimed to be my father's sister in-law. There may be some other alternative but, had she been a sister in-law, she would have been Irena Slugocka. My father only had one brother and he was executed by the Soviets in 1940 so that relationship is hardly likely - in any case my parents would have mentioned that to me. My speculation is therefore that there was some other relationship between my father and Irene. I don't have the time to chase this story down but perhaps someone, some time in the future will see this exchange of messages and establish some sort of link. If I had the time, and the skill I would try to track this down. In the mean time I am appreciative of your reply and if you come across any information or link I would be most appreciative. Yes, Hobart Australia is where my father ended up having started life in Lwow. Best wishes Maciej Slugocki Hobart, Australia -----Original Message----- From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of elaine frey Sent: Friday, 12 June 2009 9:15 PM To: galicia@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest Hello Maciej I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! However, I am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was a Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa arriving and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of an Irene, I will let you know. Regards. Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hi Elaine, > > I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and photo > I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, written > in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated July > 26,1944 is as follows. > > "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: > This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., > Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad > leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. > > This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in support > of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her in > New York on important family affairs." > > The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question > however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? > > Maciej Slugocki > Hobart, Australia > > PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer 1943 > in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of elaine frey > Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM > To: galicia@rootsweb.com > Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived Dec > 18 1913, she was born 1897. > She is # 11 on the manifest. > In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to her > sister?????? Pogorzelska. > Can you make out her name, > Thanks, > Elaine > The house is still there > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ********************************* Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

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To be a sister-in-law, she could have been a sister to your father's wife as well as wife to his brother. Dee > Hello Elaine, > > My message was one of pure speculation. I have a number of mysteries about > my father and this is just one of them. > > I have no idea on what basis Irena could have claimed to be my father's > sister in-law. There may be some other alternative but, had she been a > sister in-law, she would have been Irena Slugocka. My father only had one > brother and he was executed by the Soviets in 1940 so that relationship is > hardly likely - in any case my parents would have mentioned that to me. > My speculation is therefore that there was some other relationship between > my father and Irene. > > I don't have the time to chase this story down but perhaps someone, some > time in the future will see this exchange of messages and establish some > sort of link. If I had the time, and the skill I would try to track this > down. > > In the mean time I am appreciative of your reply and if you come across > any information or link I would be most appreciative. > > Yes, Hobart Australia is where my father ended up having started life in > Lwow. > > Best wishes > > Maciej Slugocki > Hobart, Australia > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of elaine frey > Sent: Friday, 12 June 2009 9:15 PM > To: galicia@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > Hello Maciej > I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! However, > I > am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was a > Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. > Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt > Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa arriving > and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. > I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of an > Irene, I will let you know. > Regards. > Elaine > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Hi Elaine, >> >> I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and photo >> I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, >> written >> in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated July >> 26,1944 is as follows. >> >> "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: >> This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., >> Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad >> leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. >> >> This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in support >> of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her >> in >> New York on important family affairs." >> >> The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question >> however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? >> >> Maciej Slugocki >> Hobart, Australia >> >> PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer 1943 >> in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> On Behalf Of elaine frey >> Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM >> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived >> Dec >> 18 1913, she was born 1897. >> She is # 11 on the manifest. >> In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to >> her >> sister?????? Pogorzelska. >> Can you make out her name, >> Thanks, >> Elaine >> The house is still there >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

No Chris, they are from Baranow in what was Galicia and is now Malapolska I think, Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Smolinski" <csmolinski@blackcatsystems.com> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 1:36 PM Subject: [GALICIA] Pogorzelski Re: name on manifest > Elaine, > > Are your Pogorzelskis from the Sokoly/Kobylin parishes in Lomza? > >>Hello Maciej >>I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! However, >>I >>am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was a >>Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. >>Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt >>Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa arriving >>and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. >>I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of an >>Irene, I will let you know. >>Regards. >>Elaine >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> >>To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >>Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM >>Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> >>> Hi Elaine, >>> >>> I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and >>> photo >>> I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, >>> written >>> in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated >>> July >>> 26,1944 is as follows. >>> >>> "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: >>> This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., >>> Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad >>> leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. >>> >>> This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in >>> support >>> of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her >>> in >>> New York on important family affairs." >>> >>> The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question >>> however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? >>> >>> Maciej Slugocki >>> Hobart, Australia >>> >>> PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer >>> 1943 >>> in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com >>> [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >>> On Behalf Of elaine frey >>> Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM >>> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest >>> >>> Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived >>> Dec >>> 18 1913, she was born 1897. >>> She is # 11 on the manifest. >>> In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to >>> her >>> sister?????? Pogorzelska. >>> Can you make out her name, >>> Thanks, >>> Elaine >>> The house is still there >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> ********************************* >>> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >>********************************* >>Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >>GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >>------------------------------- >>To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > > --- > Chris Smolinski > Black Cat Systems > http://www.blackcatsystems.com > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Elaine, Are your Pogorzelskis from the Sokoly/Kobylin parishes in Lomza? >Hello Maciej >I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! However, I >am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was a >Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. >Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt >Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa arriving >and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. >I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of an >Irene, I will let you know. >Regards. >Elaine > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> >To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM >Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > >> Hi Elaine, >> >> I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and photo >> I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, written >> in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated July >> 26,1944 is as follows. >> >> "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: >> This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., >> Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad >> leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. >> >> This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in support >> of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her in >> New York on important family affairs." >> >> The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question >> however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? >> >> Maciej Slugocki >> Hobart, Australia >> >> PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer 1943 >> in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> On Behalf Of elaine frey >> Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM >> To: galicia@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest >> >> Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived Dec >> 18 1913, she was born 1897. >> She is # 11 on the manifest. >> In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to her >> sister?????? Pogorzelska. >> Can you make out her name, >> Thanks, >> Elaine >> The house is still there >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ********************************* >> Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >> GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >********************************* >Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at >GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- --- Chris Smolinski Black Cat Systems http://www.blackcatsystems.com

Hello Maciej I can't believe you are in Australia and we are communicating.!!! However, I am sorry that I do not know of an Irene Pogorzelska. My grandmother was a Pogorzelska in Poland, Antoinette. Three Pogorzelskas came to live in Yonkers Marya who came with my Aunt Karolina. Jadwiga and Josefa. I couldn't find anything on Josefa arriving and found nothing on census reports etc for any of them. I am going to check with a cousin from Connecticut and if she knows of an Irene, I will let you know. Regards. Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maciej Slugocki" <maciej.slugocki@iinet.net.au> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:35 AM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hi Elaine, > > I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and photo > I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, written > in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated July > 26,1944 is as follows. > > "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: > This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., > Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad > leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. > > This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in support > of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her in > New York on important family affairs." > > The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question > however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? > > Maciej Slugocki > Hobart, Australia > > PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer 1943 > in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of elaine frey > Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM > To: galicia@rootsweb.com > Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived Dec > 18 1913, she was born 1897. > She is # 11 on the manifest. > In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to her > sister?????? Pogorzelska. > Can you make out her name, > Thanks, > Elaine > The house is still there > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Elaine, I saved this message earlier because I wanted to check a letter and photo I found in my deceased father's papers. The content of the letter, written in English, from the Consul of Poland, on letterhead paper and dated July 26,1944 is as follows. "TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN: This is to certify that Miss Irena Pogorzelska, 41-33 Forley St., Elmhurst, L.I.N.Y., is a sister in law of Adam SLUGOCKI, a cadet-squad leader, M.P.O., 304 R.C.A.F., Ottawa, Canada. This is being issued at the request of Miss Irena Pogorzelska in support of the above named Adam SLUGOCKI's request to be permitted to visit her in New York on important family affairs." The content of the letter is intriguing to say the least. My question however Elaine is. Do you know of this Irene? Maciej Slugocki Hobart, Australia PS Irene is a very attractive lady. The photo was taken in summer 1943 in New York and Irene looks to be in her 20s. -----Original Message----- From: galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:galicia-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of elaine frey Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2009 3:21 AM To: galicia@rootsweb.com Subject: [GALICIA] name on manifest Hi, I found a second cousin on a manifest: Jadwiga Pogorzelska,arrived Dec 18 1913, she was born 1897. She is # 11 on the manifest. In column 18 she states she is going to 80 Orchard st in Yonkers NY to her sister?????? Pogorzelska. Can you make out her name, Thanks, Elaine The house is still there ********************************* Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

2. In the 1899 entry into the country by Tekla Podraza (Ellis Island records), the documents state that she is coming to visit her brother. One of the items that I am currently researching is: Is Stanislaw (Stanley) Podraza the brother of Tekla. Don't know which Stanley you're looking for, but the ship manifests indicate he was going to his mother Anna Podraza in Chicago when he immigrated in 1913. He also said he had no relation in Poland. He was from Dombrowka. http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100646030319 Look for more people who immigrated with the names you are seeking. http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/EIDB/ellis.html MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > Everyone, > Hi. You have all been tremendously helpful. I am so glad that I joined this > list. I have learned so much. > > 1. In regard to the 1914 reentry into the country of Tekla Wiktor and the 3 > children (Ellis Island records), where did you see that Jan Lis was her > father? I have looked at this several times and I am obviously missing > something. > > 2. In the 1899 entry into the country by Tekla Podraza (Ellis Island > records), the documents state that she is coming to visit her brother. One of the > items that I am currently researching is: > Is Stanislaw (Stanley) Podraza the brother of Tekla. > > 3. Tekla Podraza had a sister named Marianna (Mary) Podraza. Her first > marriage was to Peter Remkar. Her second marriage was to Florian (Frank) Sendor. > Because her sister's maiden name was also Podraza, I'm thinking that > Podraza is the correct maiden name and perhaps, Jan Lis is a stepfather. > > 4. I have been able to get the marriage certificate of Tekla Podraza and > John Wiktor from familysearch.org. I have also discovered that most of my > family is connected to Holy Trinity Church in Chicago. Another item that I need > to follow up on is trying to view the baptism, marriage, etc., records that > they have. > > Thank you all again for all of your help and assistance. > Susan > > > **************Mortgage rates drop to record lows. $200,000 for $1,029/mo > Fixed. LendingTree® > (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222653866x1201461148/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.lendingtree.com%2Fborrower%2Falliance%2Ffrom.as > p%3Fwhereto%3Dpromopagev3%26promo%3D00279%26loan%5Ftype%3D2%26source%3D28895 > 60%26esourceid%3D2889560%26800num%3D1%2D800%2D289%2D3915%26AdType%3D2) > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

1. Keep looking on the page with all the names. Ditto marks precede the name Jan Lis; when you follow the ditto marks it leads to 'father'. Note that children say 'grandf' ditto marks to Jan Lis. 2. Are there any Dziennik Chicagoski obituaries you can check to see who is mentioned? Any Podrazas in census records that make sense? 3. Follow the sister's records. All sorts of scenarios possible. Any other death certificates show the maiden name as Lis? Clues in the hometown records. 4. I noticed the Holy Trinity connection and wondered if that might be a clue you can follow. Go for it. A paper trail is really the only valid trail. (except for the microfilmed records of Poland hometown from the LDS) Mary MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > Everyone, > Hi. You have all been tremendously helpful. I am so glad that I joined this > list. I have learned so much. > > 1. In regard to the 1914 reentry into the country of Tekla Wiktor and the 3 > children (Ellis Island records), where did you see that Jan Lis was her > father? I have looked at this several times and I am obviously missing > something. > > 2. In the 1899 entry into the country by Tekla Podraza (Ellis Island > records), the documents state that she is coming to visit her brother. One of the > items that I am currently researching is: > Is Stanislaw (Stanley) Podraza the brother of Tekla. > > 3. Tekla Podraza had a sister named Marianna (Mary) Podraza. Her first > marriage was to Peter Remkar. Her second marriage was to Florian (Frank) Sendor. > Because her sister's maiden name was also Podraza, I'm thinking that > Podraza is the correct maiden name and perhaps, Jan Lis is a stepfather. > > 4. I have been able to get the marriage certificate of Tekla Podraza and > John Wiktor from familysearch.org. I have also discovered that most of my > family is connected to Holy Trinity Church in Chicago. Another item that I need > to follow up on is trying to view the baptism, marriage, etc., records that > they have. > >

Everyone, Hi. You have all been tremendously helpful. I am so glad that I joined this list. I have learned so much. 1. In regard to the 1914 reentry into the country of Tekla Wiktor and the 3 children (Ellis Island records), where did you see that Jan Lis was her father? I have looked at this several times and I am obviously missing something. 2. In the 1899 entry into the country by Tekla Podraza (Ellis Island records), the documents state that she is coming to visit her brother. One of the items that I am currently researching is: Is Stanislaw (Stanley) Podraza the brother of Tekla. 3. Tekla Podraza had a sister named Marianna (Mary) Podraza. Her first marriage was to Peter Remkar. Her second marriage was to Florian (Frank) Sendor. Because her sister's maiden name was also Podraza, I'm thinking that Podraza is the correct maiden name and perhaps, Jan Lis is a stepfather. 4. I have been able to get the marriage certificate of Tekla Podraza and John Wiktor from familysearch.org. I have also discovered that most of my family is connected to Holy Trinity Church in Chicago. Another item that I need to follow up on is trying to view the baptism, marriage, etc., records that they have. Thank you all again for all of your help and assistance. Susan **************Mortgage rates drop to record lows. $200,000 for $1,029/mo Fixed. LendingTree® (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222653866x1201461148/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.lendingtree.com%2Fborrower%2Falliance%2Ffrom.as p%3Fwhereto%3Dpromopagev3%26promo%3D00279%26loan%5Ftype%3D2%26source%3D28895 60%26esourceid%3D2889560%26800num%3D1%2D800%2D289%2D3915%26AdType%3D2)

Looking for information on the following families from Dabrowica Duza in SE Poland that where Ukraine. Motyl, Kania, Walaszko, Hys. Please email me at _Frankgiamb@aol,com_ (mailto:Frankgiamb@aol,com) if you have any information on these families. **************Mortgage rates dropped. Record lows. $200,000 for $1,029/mo Fixed. LendingTree® (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222627882x1201465404/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.lendingtree.com%2Fborrower%2Falliance%2Ffrom.a sp%3Fwhereto%3Dpromopagev3%26promo%3D00279%26loan%5Ftype%3D2%26source%3D2889 570%26esourceid%3D2889570%26800num%3D1%2D800%2D289%2D3915%26AdType%3D2)

Dennis,...Thank you so much for all this great information..You are just soooo smart. I am going to give that census a try. Good night Elaine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 10:28 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest Hi Elaine The Kohlman data came from the 2002 PESEL (kind of a census in Poland) which Dr. Kazimierz Rymut compiled on a CD. Data from the 1990 PESEL is avilable online in a searchable database at http://www.herby.com.pl/indexslo.html Records for both Debica's Saint Hedwig (Sw. Jadwiga) Parish and Pilzno's Saint John the Baptist (Sw. Jana Chrzciciela) Parish have been microfilmed by the Church of Latter Day Saints and can be viewed at a local Family History Center. You can check the online LDS Family History Library Catalog for the microfilm numbers. I am pretty familiar with the Pilzno/Debica area. My grandmother was born in Grabiny and my grandfather was born in Glowaczowa, both just across the Wisloka River in Straszecin Parish. But, because Pilzno Parish is more than two hundred years older than either Straszecin or Debica parishes, I suspect that I have ancestors who attended Holy Mass every Sunday at Pilzno. The original church at Pilzno was built around 1000 AD by the Benedictine monks whose primary mission was to convert and educate us heathens. Today, Saint Benedict is one of the patron saints of the Diocese of Tarnow. Good luck! Dennis > From: cookie10710@verizon.net > To: galicia@rootsweb.com > Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 17:31:17 -0400 > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > Thanks again; where did you find the number of families living in this > area/ > The Kohlmann came from Austria, Kasimierz and Helena. They lived in Pilzno > and Debica. My maternal g-grandmother, Marie married Jan Pogorzelska and > had my granmother,Antoinette. She married Antoni Lis who was the son of > Marcin Lis from Skopanie. I have no other info on Kohlmanns and Marci Lis, > tho a son that he had, Joe or Julian is the father of a cousin Lottie, in > Connecticut, I will check with her > Thanks again for your help > Elaine > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 2:24 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > > > Hi Elaine > > > > The cemetery is likely not to have any specific or particular name. It's > > just the parish cemetery and is identified simply with the parish. And > > customarily the cemetery is adjacent to or close to the church, so > > that's > > never a problem. But that's the case in rural Poland. Here in North > > America, > > multiple parishes in growing cities often found the need for a cemetery > > and > > pooled their resources to acquire the land for one. In such a case, the > > cemetery was no longer tied to one particular parish and needed its own > > name. > > > > Unlike our custom in North America, most rural roads in Poland have no > > street or road names. Perhaps that's because most villages grew along a > > single road ("this road") or perhaps at/near an intersection of two > > roads. > > In such cases, Poles would likely differentiate the two roads by calling > > one > > "this road" and the other "that road". > > > > I find Poles fascinating when it comes to geographic names. Every place > > that > > you can think of or stumble upon has a place name. My g-grandfather's > > farm > > was clustered with a couple of other farms just beyond a narrow stand of > > trees separating it from the main portion of the village. Yep, it had > > its > > own place name (but was still part of the village). As did the single > > homestead a bit further down the unpaved road that had dwindled to > > barely > > a > > path. Yep, it had its own place name. But did the road/path have a name? > > No, > > but if it did it would be "that other road" because the main village > > already > > had two roads, "this road" and "that road". When Poles eventually got to > > Polish cities, the need for street names finally became obvious because > > "that other, other, other, other road" was just too unwieldy to use > > routinely. > > > > Cheers! > > > > Dennis > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> > > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:08 PM > > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > > > > >> Dennis, > >> Thanks so much for the info. I am the bad speller town is Przewoz and > >> there are no street names only house number. > >> > >> Lila lives in Wroclaw but her brother lives in my mom's house in > >> Przewoz. > >> She sent me pics of the cemetery by St John the Baptist church and > >> school > >> . > >> Do you know the name of that Catholic cemetery? > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> > >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:09 PM > >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > >> > >> > >>> Hi Elaine > >>> > >>> Here's some background on the other two villages that you mentioned. > >>> > >>> In the 19th Century, Suchorzow was part of Baranow Parish and had 138 > >>> homes > >>> and 604 residents. Another reference revealed that around 1575 > >>> Suchorzow > >>> was > >>> part of nearby Miechocin Parish. However, this makes complete sense > >>> because > >>> Miechocin Parish is among the oldest parishes in the area (being > >>> founded > >>> around 1165 AD) and a new, more spacious church at Baranow wasn't > >>> erected > >>> until 1604-1607. Apparently sometime after the new church was built in > >>> Baranow, the parish boundaries were amended. > >>> > >>> In the 19th Century, Przezow is described as a "wolka" (the > >>> contemporary > >>> meaning would be something like an unattached neighborhood or > >>> subdivision) > >>> of Suchorzow and had 28 homes and 126 residents. It too was part of > >>> Baranow > >>> Parish. > >>> > >>> You can count on your cousins for many things, but the correct > >>> spellings > >>> of > >>> place names isn't one of them. Przewoz is Przewoz. (Chuckle.) > >>> > >>> Regarding Kohlmann - > >>> > >>> I'll go way out on a limb here, but I'll bet that Kohlmann is not a > >>> surname > >>> native to Poland. (Nor is Stubenvoll, the surname of the family who > >>> resided > >>> at the noble estate in my ancestral parish and who proved themselves > >>> to > >>> be > >>> loyal patriots during WWII.) Alas you won't find any Kohlmanns living > >>> today > >>> in Malopolska, but you will find Kohlmans. While there are 2 living > >>> around > >>> Jaroslaw and 2 more living around Sanok, curiously there are 6 > >>> Kohlmans > >>> living in the metropolitan Tarnow area and Pilzno is just down the > >>> road > >>> a > >>> piece. (This data is from 2002.) Making contact with them might > >>> provide > >>> you > >>> with many answers. > >>> > >>> I too have some Germanic ancestors contributing to my genetic mix. Two > >>> distinctly separate lines, as a matter of fact. But they settled in > >>> Malopolska long before surnames became commonplace among commoners and > >>> probably at the invitation of King Casimir the Great who invited many > >>> different nationalities to resettle and repopulate his kingdom in the > >>> 1350s. > >>> Thus, their surnames became simply "Niemiec" and in Polish "Niemiec" > >>> means > >>> "German". (We could quibble that "niemiec" also means "mute" and that > >>> most > >>> new immigrants couldn't speak Polish and were thus "mute", but why? My > >>> version is much more fun.) > >>> > >>> Cheers and good luck! > >>> > >>> Dennis > >>> http://spuscizna.org/ > >>> > >>> > > > > > > ********************************* > > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009 ********************************* Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Mary and Susan Dennis is totally befuddled tonight due to the changes at Hotmail affecting Outlook Express users. Among the newly discovered problems: none of Susan's postings to the Galicia list have reached my Hotmail inbox yet. Mary's replies are there, however. Go figure. So, please excuse my lackluster demeanor but my brain hurts. The town where the Wiktor farm was apparently located is Brzostek and in Brzostek Parish. The village where Tekla's "father" lived is apparently Zagorze, just a few miles away in Przeczyca Parish. The two places are close enough to be served by the same post office. The general area is about 5-10 miles south of Debica. On a map, just let your finger wander downward along the Wisloka River and you'll find them. Everything is in Debica County (Powiat Debicki). The mailing addresses: Znalezienia Krzyza Swietego (Holy Cross) ul. Sloneczna 1 39-230 Brzostek POLAND Najswietszej Maryi Panny Wniebowzietej (Assumption of the BVM) Przeczyca 1 39-230 Brzostek POLAND Now to the interesting question of how "father" Jan Lis has a "daughter" Tekla Podraza. There are all sorts of possibilities, starting with his being, in reality, her stepfather. But there are several more, including perhaps she was married previously or perhaps she was illegitimate or perhaps the relationship given on the manifest is incorrect.. I think you'd really need to research the records of Przeczyca Parish to find the answer. And lucky for you, LDS microfilmed the Przeczyca Parish records for the time period 1784-1945 at the Archives of the Diocese of Tarnow in 1994. The microfilms you want are #1900674 and #1900675. Now I need to lie down on the couch in front of the TV and mindlessly view whatever happens to be on. Good luck and good night! Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mary Snow" <marysnow@bellsouth.net> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 6:31 PM Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > Hello, Susan, > > Here is the link to the manifest for a 1914 return to America for Tekla, > Jozef, Jewka, and Stefania - going to husband and father Jan Wiktor. > Closest relative in Poland was Tekla's father, Jan LIS. Dennis will > tell us about the town of Brzostok, Zaborze - my read of the spelling. > This page and previous page. > http://www.ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?pID=100473010228 > > MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: >> >> Hi, >> My name is Susan. >> >> My grandmother, Eva Wiktor, was born in Chicago in 1908. Within a few >> years >> of her birth, my great grandfather, John Wiktor, his wife, Tekla (Tillie) >> Podraza Wiktor, and Eva went back to Poland. Times were tough, jobs were >> scarce and within a few years, John Wiktor came back to Chicago. Tekla >> and Eva >> stayed behind in Poland to sell their house and land. However, as WWI was >> looming, they left the land with relatives to sell and came back to >> Chicago. >> >> The story goes that either a relative (possibly to the Podraza family) or >> a >> very close friend begged them to take their son, Richard Lis, with them >> and >> claim that he was their son so that he wouldn't have to go into the >> Polish >> military. They may have reentered the US as the Lis family. >> >> Eva had a younger sister name Stefania. On Stefania's death certificate, >> their mother's name is listed as: Tillie Lis (not Tillie Wiktor). (Note >> that I >> checked this out and Teckla was never married to a Lis.) >> >> Eva married Walter Filar who died in Chicago in October 1969. A Richard >> Lis >> attended his wake. >> >> In summary, I am unsure if I am related to the Lis family or not. If >> anyone >> has any information, please feel free to contact me. >> > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

With the caveat that the manifest also says Jozef, age 17, 'claims born US.' Sounds like proof was not given for any of the children. Hope you were able to download the marriage certificate. Mary MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > > Mary, > Hi. I'm thinking the same thing. Jozef might very well be the person that > they brought back from Poland. This manifest matches to family story that we > have heard all of these years. > > Thanks, > Susan > > In a message dated 6/4/2009 7:38:58 PM Central Standard Time, > marysnow@bellsouth.net writes: > > Jozef is the one who didn't fit on the 1914 manifest; Jan and Tillie had > three girls, Eva, Stella, and Genevieve in the 1920 census. No Joseph; > perhaps he is the Richard Lis you referenced earlier, travelling as a > son to Tillie. > > There is a downloadable marriage certificate for Jan Wiktor and Tekla > 'Podrasa' in the Cook County marriage collection at the LDS pilot site: > http://search.labs.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#r=0;p=allCollect > ions > > >

The actual marriage records from the church where Tillie and John were married would be a possible source, depending on the record keeping. Couples were required to have baptismal certificates from their home parish, which listed parents. Once you locate the exact town or parishes of your ancestors, you can check to see if records were microfilmed by the LDS. These microfilms can be ordered from your local Family History Center and are kept there for about a month; they are renewable. If you live in Chicago, check the Washington Library to see if the films are already there. Place search for microfilm: http://www.familysearch.org/eng/Library/FHLC/frameset_fhlc.asp FHL near you: http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/FHC/frameset_fhc.asp Mary MichellesBigBash@aol.com wrote: > > Many, many years ago, my sister had documented that Tekla's parents were: > Albert and Catherine Lis. However, her source was a verbal conversation from > a family member who has since passed. I could find no other verification of > this and I have also learned that it is not uncommon for memories be > incorrect. > > With the two manifests listing places in Galicia, I now have places to > continue my search. My atlas is out and on the table! > >

Hi Elaine The Kohlman data came from the 2002 PESEL (kind of a census in Poland) which Dr. Kazimierz Rymut compiled on a CD. Data from the 1990 PESEL is avilable online in a searchable database at http://www.herby.com.pl/indexslo.html Records for both Debica's Saint Hedwig (Sw. Jadwiga) Parish and Pilzno's Saint John the Baptist (Sw. Jana Chrzciciela) Parish have been microfilmed by the Church of Latter Day Saints and can be viewed at a local Family History Center. You can check the online LDS Family History Library Catalog for the microfilm numbers. I am pretty familiar with the Pilzno/Debica area. My grandmother was born in Grabiny and my grandfather was born in Glowaczowa, both just across the Wisloka River in Straszecin Parish. But, because Pilzno Parish is more than two hundred years older than either Straszecin or Debica parishes, I suspect that I have ancestors who attended Holy Mass every Sunday at Pilzno. The original church at Pilzno was built around 1000 AD by the Benedictine monks whose primary mission was to convert and educate us heathens. Today, Saint Benedict is one of the patron saints of the Diocese of Tarnow. Good luck! Dennis > From: cookie10710@verizon.net > To: galicia@rootsweb.com > Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 17:31:17 -0400 > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > Thanks again; where did you find the number of families living in this area/ > The Kohlmann came from Austria, Kasimierz and Helena. They lived in Pilzno > and Debica. My maternal g-grandmother, Marie married Jan Pogorzelska and > had my granmother,Antoinette. She married Antoni Lis who was the son of > Marcin Lis from Skopanie. I have no other info on Kohlmanns and Marci Lis, > tho a son that he had, Joe or Julian is the father of a cousin Lottie, in > Connecticut, I will check with her > Thanks again for your help > Elaine > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 2:24 PM > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > > > Hi Elaine > > > > The cemetery is likely not to have any specific or particular name. It's > > just the parish cemetery and is identified simply with the parish. And > > customarily the cemetery is adjacent to or close to the church, so that's > > never a problem. But that's the case in rural Poland. Here in North > > America, > > multiple parishes in growing cities often found the need for a cemetery > > and > > pooled their resources to acquire the land for one. In such a case, the > > cemetery was no longer tied to one particular parish and needed its own > > name. > > > > Unlike our custom in North America, most rural roads in Poland have no > > street or road names. Perhaps that's because most villages grew along a > > single road ("this road") or perhaps at/near an intersection of two roads. > > In such cases, Poles would likely differentiate the two roads by calling > > one > > "this road" and the other "that road". > > > > I find Poles fascinating when it comes to geographic names. Every place > > that > > you can think of or stumble upon has a place name. My g-grandfather's farm > > was clustered with a couple of other farms just beyond a narrow stand of > > trees separating it from the main portion of the village. Yep, it had its > > own place name (but was still part of the village). As did the single > > homestead a bit further down the unpaved road that had dwindled to barely > > a > > path. Yep, it had its own place name. But did the road/path have a name? > > No, > > but if it did it would be "that other road" because the main village > > already > > had two roads, "this road" and "that road". When Poles eventually got to > > Polish cities, the need for street names finally became obvious because > > "that other, other, other, other road" was just too unwieldy to use > > routinely. > > > > Cheers! > > > > Dennis > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "elaine frey" <cookie10710@verizon.net> > > To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:08 PM > > Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > > > > > >> Dennis, > >> Thanks so much for the info. I am the bad speller town is Przewoz and > >> there are no street names only house number. > >> > >> Lila lives in Wroclaw but her brother lives in my mom's house in Przewoz. > >> She sent me pics of the cemetery by St John the Baptist church and school > >> . > >> Do you know the name of that Catholic cemetery? > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Dennis Benarz" <benarz@hotmail.com> > >> To: <galicia@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 12:09 PM > >> Subject: Re: [GALICIA] name on manifest > >> > >> > >>> Hi Elaine > >>> > >>> Here's some background on the other two villages that you mentioned. > >>> > >>> In the 19th Century, Suchorzow was part of Baranow Parish and had 138 > >>> homes > >>> and 604 residents. Another reference revealed that around 1575 Suchorzow > >>> was > >>> part of nearby Miechocin Parish. However, this makes complete sense > >>> because > >>> Miechocin Parish is among the oldest parishes in the area (being founded > >>> around 1165 AD) and a new, more spacious church at Baranow wasn't > >>> erected > >>> until 1604-1607. Apparently sometime after the new church was built in > >>> Baranow, the parish boundaries were amended. > >>> > >>> In the 19th Century, Przezow is described as a "wolka" (the contemporary > >>> meaning would be something like an unattached neighborhood or > >>> subdivision) > >>> of Suchorzow and had 28 homes and 126 residents. It too was part of > >>> Baranow > >>> Parish. > >>> > >>> You can count on your cousins for many things, but the correct spellings > >>> of > >>> place names isn't one of them. Przewoz is Przewoz. (Chuckle.) > >>> > >>> Regarding Kohlmann - > >>> > >>> I'll go way out on a limb here, but I'll bet that Kohlmann is not a > >>> surname > >>> native to Poland. (Nor is Stubenvoll, the surname of the family who > >>> resided > >>> at the noble estate in my ancestral parish and who proved themselves to > >>> be > >>> loyal patriots during WWII.) Alas you won't find any Kohlmanns living > >>> today > >>> in Malopolska, but you will find Kohlmans. While there are 2 living > >>> around > >>> Jaroslaw and 2 more living around Sanok, curiously there are 6 Kohlmans > >>> living in the metropolitan Tarnow area and Pilzno is just down the road > >>> a > >>> piece. (This data is from 2002.) Making contact with them might provide > >>> you > >>> with many answers. > >>> > >>> I too have some Germanic ancestors contributing to my genetic mix. Two > >>> distinctly separate lines, as a matter of fact. But they settled in > >>> Malopolska long before surnames became commonplace among commoners and > >>> probably at the invitation of King Casimir the Great who invited many > >>> different nationalities to resettle and repopulate his kingdom in the > >>> 1350s. > >>> Thus, their surnames became simply "Niemiec" and in Polish "Niemiec" > >>> means > >>> "German". (We could quibble that "niemiec" also means "mute" and that > >>> most > >>> new immigrants couldn't speak Polish and were thus "mute", but why? My > >>> version is much more fun.) > >>> > >>> Cheers and good luck! > >>> > >>> Dennis > >>> http://spuscizna.org/ > >>> > >>> > > > > > > ********************************* > > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at > > GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ********************************* > Need to contact the list manager? Write to Marie at GALICIA-admin@rootsweb.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GALICIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009

Many, many years ago, my sister had documented that Tekla's parents were: Albert and Catherine Lis. However, her source was a verbal conversation from a family member who has since passed. I could find no other verification of this and I have also learned that it is not uncommon for memories be incorrect. With the two manifests listing places in Galicia, I now have places to continue my search. My atlas is out and on the table! Thank you for all of your help. Susan ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------- In a message dated 6/4/2009 7:26:27 PM Central Standard Time, marysnow@bellsouth.net writes: You'd have to see the microfilmed records to see any relationship. Did Catherine and Albert live in the same town? Mary **************Limited Time Offers: Save big on popular laptops at Dell (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221354145x1201369495/aol?redir=http:%2F %2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215221161%3B37268813%3By)

Mary, Hi. I'm thinking the same thing. Jozef might very well be the person that they brought back from Poland. This manifest matches to family story that we have heard all of these years. Thanks, Susan In a message dated 6/4/2009 7:38:58 PM Central Standard Time, marysnow@bellsouth.net writes: Jozef is the one who didn't fit on the 1914 manifest; Jan and Tillie had three girls, Eva, Stella, and Genevieve in the 1920 census. No Joseph; perhaps he is the Richard Lis you referenced earlier, travelling as a son to Tillie. There is a downloadable marriage certificate for Jan Wiktor and Tekla 'Podrasa' in the Cook County marriage collection at the LDS pilot site: http://search.labs.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#r=0;p=allCollect ions Mary **************Limited Time Offers: Save big on popular laptops at Dell (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221354145x1201369495/aol?redir=http:%2F %2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215221161%3B37268813%3By)