Mobile friendly was not an issue I brought up as needing fixed. It already is fixed, for me. Barry gave the view tag to me long ago. It's already part of the template he created, nice and pretty at the top of every page. One thing I don't need to fix. smile

Valerie, I'm using an html table. It should work as is. But I'll try the px just in case. From what I've learned about external css, things above in a page can affect things below. Since "table" is now not in the CSS, could this be true about my non-CSS "table"? Used as is on W3 schools Try It, the table's height and borders look fine. OTOH, since "table" wants to be big in cell height, how can I control that aspect if I put "table" into the CSS? judy

At 10:27 PM 8/19/2018, you wrote: >Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2018 20:10:46 -0400 >From: JFlorian <cageycat@gmail.com> >Subject: [FreeHelp]Re: Ext CSS tables >To: Freepages Web Sites <freepages-help@rootsweb.com> >Message-ID: > <CAE5hz-DW1C3vaZvsEM5wZnYCRbRS_6qdCxXDKB=0EsFyocT8Vw@mail.gmail.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > >Okay, I just removed other tables in CSS. So this ><....table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> > <..tr> > <...td width="50%"></td> > <...td width="50%"></td> > </tr> > <tr> > <td width="50%"></td> > <td width="50%"></td> > </tr> ></table> > >Should be just a plain, thin row, table, like the ones I showed. But it >isn't. Instead, it looks like I could fit 3 lines in each cell, as if it >has padding or margins or whatever it's called. > >I don't understand why it's behaving like this. > >The triple borders I named table1 and table2. So a Frontpage "table" >cannot be picking up their settings, right? I'm lost. Tempted to make all >table pages stay as html only.... and only convert the rest of the site to >css. > >Again, any ideas why table is producing a thing 3x as big as it should? > >------------------------------ ************************** In your table definition you have included "cellpadding = '3'". This is going to add extra spacing on all margins within each cell. Try changing that to "cellpadding='0'" and see what happens. Bill

Here's a page that gives a very clear explanation of the tag that makes sites "mobile friendly". https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Mobile/Viewport_meta_tag While not an "official" tag it solves the problem of screen size. It seems that "mobile friendly" relies on the high resolution of most small devices. The pixels on our regular devices are not the same as the smaller ones we use every day. It seems that modern smart phones have resolutions approaching the very best high definition television screens. Way better than our average computer monitor. That's the old issue. Anyway, it seems that if we put |<meta name="viewport" content="width=device-width, initial-scale=0.86, maximum-scale=3.0, minimum-scale=0.86"> in the head of the page we are now mobile friendly. | Here's Googles own view of the viewport tag https://developers.google.com/web/tools/lighthouse/audits/has-viewport-meta-tag https://developers.google.com/web/fundamentals/design-and-ux/responsive/ It appears to me that extraordinary measures to be "mobile friendly" are not needed. A simple meta tag takes care of it to even Google's satisfaction. Judy. Chill out. Go ahead and use your tables. Your working to hard. On 08/20/2018 05:26 AM, JFlorian wrote: > Nobody said you have to. Google will penalize sites that aren't... which > is the only reason for me to do anything on it. > > Of course, then our sites went away.... lost Google ranking.... so.... > shrug. LOLOL > > Back to site overhaul -- later guys! > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe and Archives https://mailinglists.rootsweb.com/listindexes/search/freepages-help > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community > -- "The dog is a gentleman. I hope to go to his heaven, not man's." Mark Twain

Judy, you say your cell padding is "3". Should this not be 3px? On 20 August 2018 at 01:10, JFlorian <cageycat@gmail.com> wrote: > Okay, I just removed other tables in CSS. So this > <....table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> > <..tr> > <...td width="50%"></td> > <...td width="50%"></td> > </tr> > <tr> > <td width="50%"></td> > <td width="50%"></td> > </tr> > </table> > > Should be just a plain, thin row, table, like the ones I showed. But it > isn't. Instead, it looks like I could fit 3 lines in each cell, as if it > has padding or margins or whatever it's called. > > I don't understand why it's behaving like this. > > The triple borders I named table1 and table2. So a Frontpage "table" > cannot be picking up their settings, right? I'm lost. Tempted to make all > table pages stay as html only.... and only convert the rest of the site to > css. > > Again, any ideas why table is producing a thing 3x as big as it should? > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe and Archives https://mailinglists.rootsweb. > com/listindexes/search/freepages-help > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community >

Well Neil, it did it again. I'm going to try typing it in again from scratch and see if that will fix it. http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks or https://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks <http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/boyer_easton/lewboyer.html> and in case that is garbled, copied from the address bar where I actually looked at your site: http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks Hopefully at least one of those three will come through non-garbled this time. Great site, BTW! Best regards, -- Charlie Carothers http://www.freebiblecommentary.org <http://freebiblecommentary.org>

if you wish to convert a sheet into a table, this site will do it for you, http://tableizer.journalistopia.com/. It works well.  I deleted the style section and placed it in my style sheet. Bruce

To Pat Geary: YES YES YES! That's exactly how I want it to look. My aim is to connect it with Kompozer to make the changes that will bring it up to date. Now I will spend the rest of the day trying to follow the instructions in your Geary Family Site The instructions make it sound simple. I hope I can make it work. Many thanks. Neil -----Original Message----- From: freepages-help-request@rootsweb.com [mailto:freepages-help-request@rootsweb.com] Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2018 10:27 PM To: freepages-help@rootsweb.com Subject: FREEPAGES-HELP Digest, Vol 13, Issue 200 Send FREEPAGES-HELP mailing list submissions to freepages-help@rootsweb.com To subscribe via email send a message with subject subscribe and body subscribe to freepages-help-request@rootsweb.com To unsubscribe via email send a message with subject unsubscribe and body unsubscribe to freepages-help-request@rootsweb.com You can reach the person managing the list at freepages-help-owner@rootsweb.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of FREEPAGES-HELP digest..." When replying to a digest message, quote only the specific message to which you are replying, removing the rest of the digest from your reply. Remember to change the subject of your reply so that it coincides with the message subject to which you are replying. ***FREEPAGES HELP & FAQ*** <http://helpdesk.rootsweb.com/FAQ/fpindex.html> Today's Topics: 1. Re: Still Fighting Filezilla (Patricia Geary) 2. Re: Still Fighting Filezilla (Ron Lankshear) 3. Re: Still Fighting Filezilla (Pat Asher) 4. Re: Ext CSS tables (JFlorian) 5. Re: Ext CSS tables (JFlorian) 6. Still fighting filezilla (Charles Carothers) 7. Re: Spread sheet (Barry Carlson) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2018 17:22:08 -0400 From: "Patricia Geary" <patgeary@comcast.net> Subject: [FreeHelp]Re: Still Fighting Filezilla To: "'Freepages Web Sites'" <freepages-help@rootsweb.com> Cc: 'Johanna Misey Boyer ' <johannaboyer@hotmail.com> Message-ID: <00ab01d43802$b0086fe0$10194fa0$@comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Neil, this is your remote site http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/ Does it look like what you expect it to?? If you have set up your site as you have been directed here http://sites.rootsweb.com/~gearyfamily/publishing-your-sites.html What you should see in the left pane is your site on your computer. I cannot tell you what it should look like as I have no idea how it is set up. What you should see in the right pane is the actual list of files and folders that are currently on the server. Top right pane for remote site should show /boyerlinks/genealogy_html Under that would be the list of files and folders that make up your site. If you right click on the file name on the left hand pane and select upload, it will be uploaded to the server and replace the file that is already there if it has the same name. If it is a new page, then you should see it listed. Pat G -----Original Message----- From: Neil Boyer [mailto:naboyer@comcast.net] Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2018 4:31 PM To: freepages-help@rootsweb.com Cc: 'Neil A. Boyer ' <naboyer@comcast.net>; 'Johanna Misey Boyer ' <johannaboyer@hotmail.com> Subject: [FreeHelp]Still Fighting Filezilla Can you imagine? I am still trying to make this go. In my left pane on Filezilla, I have genealogy_html as one of many entries in the Local Site. If I right click that line on the Local Site and upload, I get the same list of folders on the right side as on the left. So far, so good, right? As I understand it, I should now go to one of my folders on the left side, edit it with Kompozer or some other editor and save it. Then, I think, I should right-click and upload it from the left side. Then, in Charles's guidance, as I read it, I think, I should go to my browser and open my web site and check it for accuracy. Here is where I am stalled. I don't have a URL for my site. How do I open it? Did I skip something? Did I skip many things? The remote site is boyerlinks. Thanks again. Neil _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe and Archives https://mailinglists.rootsweb.com/listindexes/search/freepages-help Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community ********************************

Nobody said you have to. Google will penalize sites that aren't... which is the only reason for me to do anything on it. Of course, then our sites went away.... lost Google ranking.... so.... shrug. LOLOL Back to site overhaul -- later guys!

I'm sorry, but I'm not going out of my way to make my Freepages site mobile friendly. It is what it is and it's staying that way! CAWTHORN, SCOTT,  & DeSILVA PALMER Family History Pages: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cawthorn/ temporarily at http://www.annmcclean.co.nf/ On 20/08/2018 04:27, Billie Walsh wrote: > I think we have just about beat this subject to death. But, I still > have a hard time wrapping my head around the issue. > > First off I think people use their smart phone for things that are > best left to other devices. IMHO it is stupid what some people do with > them. Surfing the web is at the top of my stupid list. [ I mean no > offense to anyone, just my opinion ] > > From my research making them "mobile friendly" just requires something > in the head of the page to tell small device browsers how to scale the > page. > > I've looked at many of my pages on everything from an iPhone 4 to my > netbooks. All of them scale very well. Even for my old eyes. > > I don't plan on doing anything. >

My method is to create/open the spreadsheet in Libre Office [ or microsoft office or open office - whatever you have ] then export to an HTML file. I then have to "fix" the html but using the "Replace" function of whatever editor you choose you can delete masses of bad code in a short time. On 08/19/2018 09:26 PM, Barry Carlson wrote: > Bruce, > > As Billie has stated, spreadsheets contain data that can be presented > exactly as it would be in tables. > > I have in the past described in detail how to convert a spreadsheet > into a HTML table, and I'll post a link to it when I find it. > > In simple terms; make a copy of your spreadsheet, then insert columns > containing the HTML table code per:- > > 1.. To left of first column in first row <tr><td> > > 2.. To the left of each remaining column in first row </tr><td> > > 3.. After last column in first row </td></tr> > > 4.. In each of the new columns, Fill Down the HTML content. > > 5.. Finally, add <table> to <tr><td> in first row / first column, and > </table> after </td></tr> in the last row / last column. You should > now save this file with .xls or equivalent extension. > > Once saved, Copy and Paste the contents into a new page of your Text > Editor, then save as 'yourname.txt'. > > You now have a table that can be inserted into an existing HTML page - > by the Copy & Paste method, then styled preferably using CSS until it > displays the way you'd like it to. > > Barry > > > > On 19/08/2018 23:18, Bruce Coyne wrote: >> Is it possible to show one in Freepages? >> >> Bruce >> > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe and Archives > https://mailinglists.rootsweb.com/listindexes/search/freepages-help > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY  Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal > RootsWeb community > -- "The dog is a gentleman. I hope to go to his heaven, not man's." Mark Twain

Barry's fix makes it scale but also tells folks to dump their phones in the toilet cos this site is not built for phones. ... well, in so many words, nicely. LOL smile

Neil, I don't know how it got garbled, but the URL for your site is: *https://www.rootsweb.com/~b <https://www.rootsweb.com/~sitename>oyerlinks* and not that gibberish that showed up in my last post. Regards, -- Charlie Carothers http://www.freebiblecommentary.org <http://freebiblecommentary.org>

I think we have just about beat this subject to death. But, I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the issue. First off I think people use their smart phone for things that are best left to other devices. IMHO it is stupid what some people do with them. Surfing the web is at the top of my stupid list. [ I mean no offense to anyone, just my opinion ] From my research making them "mobile friendly" just requires something in the head of the page to tell small device browsers how to scale the page. I've looked at many of my pages on everything from an iPhone 4 to my netbooks. All of them scale very well. Even for my old eyes. I don't plan on doing anything. -- "The dog is a gentleman. I hope to go to his heaven, not man's." Mark Twain

I've been happy with the results and ease of implementation of tables using https://css-tricks.com/responsive-data-tables/ By Chris Coyier, April 27, 2011. It dynamically adjusts column widths to fit the size of the screen. For editing HTML I often use simple text editors, like WordPad, but I'm also happy with the free version of the WYSIWYG editor, BlueGriffen. But those who want to work a lot with HTML tables may find its add-on for working with tables a worthwhile investment.

Bruce, As Billie has stated, spreadsheets contain data that can be presented exactly as it would be in tables. I have in the past described in detail how to convert a spreadsheet into a HTML table, and I'll post a link to it when I find it. In simple terms; make a copy of your spreadsheet, then insert columns containing the HTML table code per:- 1.. To left of first column in first row <tr><td> 2.. To the left of each remaining column in first row </tr><td> 3.. After last column in first row </td></tr> 4.. In each of the new columns, Fill Down the HTML content. 5.. Finally, add <table> to <tr><td> in first row / first column, and </table> after </td></tr> in the last row / last column. You should now save this file with .xls or equivalent extension. Once saved, Copy and Paste the contents into a new page of your Text Editor, then save as 'yourname.txt'. You now have a table that can be inserted into an existing HTML page - by the Copy & Paste method, then styled preferably using CSS until it displays the way you'd like it to. Barry On 19/08/2018 23:18, Bruce Coyne wrote: > Is it possible to show one in Freepages? > > Bruce >

> > > Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2018 16:31:08 -0400 > From: "Neil Boyer" <naboyer@comcast.net> > Subject: [FreeHelp]Still Fighting Filezilla > To: <freepages-help@rootsweb.com> > Cc: "'Neil A. Boyer '" <naboyer@comcast.net>, 'Johanna Misey Boyer ' > <johannaboyer@hotmail.com> > Message-ID: <007a01d437fb$90221a20$b0664e60$@comcast.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Can you imagine? I am still trying to make this go. In my left pane on > Filezilla, I have genealogy_html as one of many entries in the Local Site. > If I right click that line on the Local Site and upload, I get the same list > of folders on the right side as on the left. So far, so good, right? > > As I understand it, I should now go to one of my folders on the left side, > edit it with Kompozer or some other editor and save it. Then, I think, I > should right-click and upload it from the left side. Then, in Charles's > guidance, as I read it, I think, I should go to my browser and open my web > site and check it for accuracy. > > Here is where I am stalled. I don't have a URL for my site. How do I open > it? Did I skip something? > > Did I skip many things? The remote site is boyerlinks. Thanks again. Neil > > > Neil, I think you are almost there. With the caveat that I have not yet actually started working on my old site again, I have read Anne's excellent instructions. Based on that and your statement that your website is boyerlinks, I believe that the new URL for your site is: *https://www.rootsweb.com/~b <https://www.rootsweb.com/~sitename>oyerlinks* OK, as a test I copied and pasted that into my browsers address field at the top. Sure enough, a web site came up. At the top it says "Welcome to the Family History Page of Neil A. Boyer". I'm putting my bets on that being your site!!! You should probably bookmark that URL. :-) And BTW, some of the photos at http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/boyer_easton/lewboyer.html are marvelous! I read a little bit of your story about the life Lewis Boyer, and he was indeed an interesting guy. Best regards, -- Charlie Carothers http://www.freebiblecommentary.org <http://freebiblecommentary.org>

Okay, I just removed other tables in CSS. So this <....table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <..tr> <...td width="50%"></td> <...td width="50%"></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="50%"></td> <td width="50%"></td> </tr> </table> Should be just a plain, thin row, table, like the ones I showed. But it isn't. Instead, it looks like I could fit 3 lines in each cell, as if it has padding or margins or whatever it's called. I don't understand why it's behaving like this. The triple borders I named table1 and table2. So a Frontpage "table" cannot be picking up their settings, right? I'm lost. Tempted to make all table pages stay as html only.... and only convert the rest of the site to css. Again, any ideas why table is producing a thing 3x as big as it should?

Pat wrote: Judy, to me this is exactly the kind of information that belongs in a table. If you are having a hard time know which set of styles to apply to a table, name them something that means or describes what the style is for .3-column-table .2-col-table .4-column-table ==================== It isn't that. It's that in Ext. CSS, I don't know how to adjust the CSS tables Barry made to produce what I prefer, like on those pages I showed.. So.... I could just copy all the tables Barry made and pull them out of the CSS file, and let table be my regular old Frontpage tables? (Sorry Barry, I've really tried.) (I already made the page border table into a different name, so I can use Fp "table" without conflicts.) If I can forego converting tables, OMG I would go kiss a camel! I got enough other stuff on the site to fix and folders deep with sub-folders. Plus, I have to clean up tables already. And no, I'm not smart enough to do an even teeny-partial mobile friendly site. I'm using Barry's code he gave a year or two ago to satisfy Google. Judy

At 04:31 PM 8/19/2018, Neil Boyer wrote: >Here is where I am stalled. I don't have a URL for my site. How do I open >it? Did I skip something? > >Did I skip many things? The remote site is boyerlinks. Thanks again. Neil Neil, you obviously are making progress, but I need to emphasize that Kompozer and Filezilla are two entirely different programs that do entirely different things. Kompozer is for editing the copies of your web pages that reside on your computer. It does NOT upload your edited files to the server so your changes show at your URL <sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/> Filezilla is for uploading your updated files to the server, as you have edited them in Kompozer, so your updates show at your URL <sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/> You access your URL using a browser (a third program). We have no way of knowing what browser you use, but it will be the program YOU use to browse/surf sites across the web, for example Internet Explorer, Firefox, Chrome, etc. Now, once you connect to your web site using your browser <sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/> will display the home page for your site as long as it is named index.htm or index.html. If you want to check a different page such as the one for the ancestors and descendants of Lewis E.Boyer, then you will have to visit that complete URL <http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/boyer_easton/boyer_chronology.html> And that gets back to uploading changed/updated pages using Filezilla. If you upload boyer_chronology.html to your parker_long subdirectory, <http://sites.rootsweb.com/~boyerlinks/boyer_easton/boyer_chronology.html> won't display the updated file because you haven't uploaded it to the same location on the server so the updated file overwrites the existing file. And If you upload it to the parker_long subdirectory, neither you nor the visitors to your site will be able to find it. Pat A.