John, She may not have kept her private domain name active. You can see some through the internet archive wayback machine: http://web.archive.org/web/20130815000902/http://claires-rosleaancestry.co.uk/index.html Chris John Olson-Kennedy via wrote: > Hello Listers, > > Does anyone know what's happened to Claire McConville's website? > http://www.claires-rosleaancestry.co.uk/ > > The name still resolves, but there's no data to display. > > If this is gone, many records for St. Tierney's in Roslea will be more > difficult to find. Thankfully Sean Rooney's website still has some of > these available, but I don't think he had as much as Claire did. > http://www.rooneys-of-roslea.com/front_page.html >
Hello Listers, Does anyone know what's happened to Claire McConville's website? http://www.claires-rosleaancestry.co.uk/ The name still resolves, but there's no data to display. If this is gone, many records for St. Tierney's in Roslea will be more difficult to find. Thankfully Sean Rooney's website still has some of these available, but I don't think he had as much as Claire did. http://www.rooneys-of-roslea.com/front_page.html Regards, John in NC
Hi Carol In the Scotland's People records there are many alternative spellings of names and the search only finds results which exactly match what you have entered. So I usually use the main consonants of the name with an * in between and at the end. Kathy Lowe -----Original Message----- From: Carol and Joe Marlo via Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2015 9:35 AM To: CARELL ; Fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com ; Frank Gebhart Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Scotlands People. Hi, Carole, I did indeed go into the Scotlands People website, which is offering access to their records right now. I entered the request for my great-grandparents, John James SLOWEY and Ellizabeth DAVIDSON, in the section relating to Valuation Rolls. According to U. S. Census records and to their death certificates, the first two children of John and Elizabeth were born in Glasgow, Scotland in 1864 and on 17 February 1866, respectively. The website offered Valuation Rolls for 1865, which would have been perfect for my purpose. The rolls were supposed to show everyone who owned, lived, rented or otherwise occupied every dwelling. However, when I entered the data for this couple, there were no matches. Either the SP records are incomplete or the death certificates are incorrect. Elizabeth Davidson Slowey gave the data for her son's death record, since he was only 21 years old, so I doubt that she would have made a mistake on his birth place. It's also entirely possible that I missed something in the navigation of the website. I am a reluctant recruit in the technology revolution! The SP website had a number of interesting categories, so if anyone has ancestors who were connected with Scotland, it would probably be worth checking out. Best wishes and good luck, Carol Gebhart Marlo From: CARELL <carell@bigpond.com.au>
Hi Carol The “ and ” are the computer program misreading the opening and closing quotation marks. Kathy Lowe -----Original Message----- From: Carol and Joe Marlo via Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2015 9:07 AM To: Shirley Smith ; fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD More on the DNA study of Great Britain reported in NATURE. How does one deal with the "Idquo" and other similar terms appearing in the article listed below? Thank you. Carol Gebhart Marlo
Jack, would you please write me directly at smith_shirley_ross@juno.com? I would like to write directly to you and not to the list. Thank you. Shirley Smith ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Jack Fallin via <fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com> To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Digest, Vol 10, Issue 133: More on the DNA study of Great Britain reported in NATURE. Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2015 09:23:05 -0700 Dear List, As promised, I have now reviewed the Article in NATURE that was, in turn, condensed in a Newspaper article for which Carole provided a link. The Article is contained in NATURE, 19 March 2014 at pp. 309-314 and is titled “The fine-scale genetic structure of the British population.” In part, the study’s design is easy to describe and makes sense. While only 2000 people were analyzed, they were selected from rural areas and all four of their grandparents had to be born within 80km of one another. The idea was to avoid the sort of movement that has become common in modern society and to capture, through the grandparents, conditions as they existed in the late 1800s. Their DNA was then analyzed and they were grouped with other test subjects who had the most genetic information in common with them. Although the grouping was done purely on the basis of DNA analysis it wound up dividing most of the groups on a logical geographic basis, e.g. the people from Devon fell in one “cluster” while those in Cornwall fell in another. Not surprisingly those from the Orkney Islands [long in the possession of Norwegian Vikings] were the most widely separated from the rest, with the Welsh being the second outlier. There were a large number of specific variations, but Central and Southern England was generally homogeneous — something the researchers speculated might be attributable to a higher level of movement and DNA interchange in the area. A similarity found between the Northern Ireland population and that of Southern and Scotland is found to be assignable to the “Ulster plantation,” which seems reasonable. Viewed as just an exploration of differences within the UK the study is useful and unexceptional, but when it seeks to extend the data into the identification of corresponding European haplotypes it becomes both more interesting and more problematic. For it’s European comparators the study has no similar “cluster analysis,” rather it borrows a data base created to study multiple sclerosis in European populations. Having identified similarities between the British “clusters” and various “groups” extracted from the multiple sclerosis work, it then goes about attempting to show the place of origin for as many clusters as possible. The principal points of origin for Britain and Scotland are identified within modern France, Germany and Belgium. Norwegian, Danish and Swedish markers appear prominently only in the Orkneys. The use of modern country names immediately introduces uncertainty, because it does not reflect the origins question posed. At the times in question, the connections in France/Gaul and Belgium would almost certainly been Celtic [although unstated, the study seemed not to find any separate identifier for a Norman element]. Even the “German” category, although used to find an Anglo-Saxon connection, is not specifically assigned to any of the tribes supposedly involved. Indeed, “Germany" alone is a questionable category because the great Celtic cultures (Hallstadt and La Téne) had their largest centers in western Germany and Switzerland and it is unclear that those populations were later erased. The samples from Germany are also assigned as “Anglo-Saxon” without any of the interior checks used in the UK. In other words the samples are uncontrolled as to past mixing through movement and intermarriage. After WWII the population of Germany was massively reduced and, at least in some areas, subject to a great deal of movement. No corrective is offered for that problem. The region in the UK to which the German/“Anglo-Saxon” connection is made is Central and Southern Britain, he previously defined as genetically mixed and indistinct. Rather than explicitly pointing out the problem with that comparison, the reader is required to ferret it out from the finding that the actual size of this “Anglo-Saxon” connection is represents only a minority in the areas in question, with a huge uncertainty range between 10 and 40 per cent. While it is comforting that, unlike analyses done in the past, the study supplies some support for a significant population contribution from groups that altered the regions’ underlying language to English, the evidence as to just how large the incursion was, remains uncertain. The study does contain the newspaper quoted conclusion that it found “no evidence of a general “Celtic” population in non-Saxon parts of the UK. Instead, there were many distinct genetic clusters in these regions …” This conclusion is based, in turn, on differences in the “fine” genetic differences between, for instance, South and North Wales. Because the populations in these areas seems overwhelmingly to have come from Gallic/Celtic France and Belgium and the Welsh native language is Brythonic Gaelic, a better statement of the finding would be that the presumptively Celtic areas within the UK show considerable fine genetic diversity among them. That is a statement that can be supported by the study's evidence and likely reflects the fact that Celtic culture is more frequently defined by its language, Gaelic, rather than by individual tribal components. The online version is said to contain “supplemental information” not in the published article, I’ll let the List know if anything new appears there. Jack Fallin Walnut Creek, CA Even those who have paid On Mar 25, 2015, at 8:04 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > > > > 2. Re: Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England > Scotland. (Jack Fallin) > > 15. Re: Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England > Scotland. (Dee Byster-Graham) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 19:30:11 +0000 > From: Dave H <hallmarkone@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Straight answer at last..... > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <55130cd5.ad3ec20a.2b3d.ffffa83b@mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed > > It's MORE than that Dee... describing it as a Will first of all is > DISGRACEFUL!!!! > > Trying to rip people off for something that is useless.. > > It is clearly described as a Will and certainly, as far as I'm > concerned, certainly in Breach of the Trades Description Act!!! > > One can't sell something that is clearly not a Will, while describing it > as a Will!!! > > Time to read up on EU Laws now... grrrrr!! > > Dave > > > > > On 25/03/2015 18:25, Dee Byster-Graham wrote: >> That's bureaucracy for you, Dave. >> >> Grrrr indeed! >> >> Dee >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via >> Sent: Thursday, 26 March 2015 1:41 AM >> To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com >> Subject: FERMANAGH-GOLD Straight answer at last..... >> >> >> Dear Mr Hall, >> >> With reference to your enquiry, the abstract will name neither beneficiaries >> nor bequests. >> >> Yours sincerely, >> >> Reader Services Division, >> >> National Archives, >> >> Bishop Street, >> >> Dublin 8. >> >> --------------------------------------------------- >> >> So whatever it is will be useless!! >> >> Certainly for anyone ordering what is called 'Document type: Will' it >> certainly will be disappointing!! >> >> What is actually is I haven't a clue but certainly won't be ordering it! >> >> >> DH > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 12:31:43 -0700 > From: Jack Fallin <jakff@astound.net> > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA > study for England Scotland. > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <55580B99-0645-4C02-AB0C-CF751B010F18@astound.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 > > I?ve read the Daily Mail article and I can almost guarantee it?s garbled the basic study. It talks about large parts of England having ?French? but not ?Norman? DNA ? well, the Celts in England and Ireland quite clearly came from somewhere else, and the great majority would have come from France and, to a lesser extent, Spain ? arriving atop an existing neolithic population that no one seems quite sure of. So the discussion about a ?Celtic Myth? seems wildly overstated. I subscribe to NATURE and will advise as to what is really said when I get a chance to read it. > > Jack Fallin > > > On Mar 24, 2015, at 6:18 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > >> >> >> >> 11. DNA maps/locations/links! (CARELL) >> 12. Re: DNA maps/locations/links! (Dee Byster-Graham) >> ================================== https://www.google.ie/ ================================== http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
So, it would appear that in order to get any reliable data we are reducing the equation to digging up old, identifiable graves and doing Y-DNA tests on the remains... Cliff. On Friday, March 27, 2015 11:25 AM, Jack Fallin via <fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com> wrote: Dear List, As promised, I have now reviewed the Article in NATURE that was, in turn, condensed in a Newspaper article for which Carole provided a link. The Article is contained in NATURE, 19 March 2014 at pp. 309-314 and is titled “The fine-scale genetic structure of the British population.” In part, the study’s design is easy to describe and makes sense. While only 2000 people were analyzed, they were selected from rural areas and all four of their grandparents had to be born within 80km of one another. The idea was to avoid the sort of movement that has become common in modern society and to capture, through the grandparents, conditions as they existed in the late 1800s. Their DNA was then analyzed and they were grouped with other test subjects who had the most genetic information in common with them. Although the grouping was done purely on the basis of DNA analysis it wound up dividing most of the groups on a logical geographic basis, e.g. the people from Devon fell in one “cluster” while those in Cornwall fell in another. Not surprisingly those from the Orkney Islands [long in the possession of Norwegian Vikings] were the most widely separated from the rest, with the Welsh being the second outlier. There were a large number of specific variations, but Central and Southern England was generally homogeneous — something the researchers speculated might be attributable to a higher level of movement and DNA interchange in the area. A similarity found between the Northern Ireland population and that of Southern and Scotland is found to be assignable to the “Ulster plantation,” which seems reasonable. Viewed as just an exploration of differences within the UK the study is useful and unexceptional, but when it seeks to extend the data into the identification of corresponding European haplotypes it becomes both more interesting and more problematic. For it’s European comparators the study has no similar “cluster analysis,” rather it borrows a data base created to study multiple sclerosis in European populations. Having identified similarities between the British “clusters” and various “groups” extracted from the multiple sclerosis work, it then goes about attempting to show the place of origin for as many clusters as possible. The principal points of origin for Britain and Scotland are identified within modern France, Germany and Belgium. Norwegian, Danish and Swedish markers appear prominently only in the Orkneys. The use of modern country names immediately introduces uncertainty, because it does not reflect the origins question posed. At the times in question, the connections in France/Gaul and Belgium would almost certainly been Celtic [although unstated, the study seemed not to find any separate identifier for a Norman element]. Even the “German” category, although used to find an Anglo-Saxon connection, is not specifically assigned to any of the tribes supposedly involved. Indeed, “Germany" alone is a questionable category because the great Celtic cultures (Hallstadt and La Téne) had their largest centers in western Germany and Switzerland and it is unclear that those populations were later erased. The samples from Germany are also assigned as “Anglo-Saxon” without any of the interior checks used in the UK. In other words the samples are uncontrolled as to past mixing through movement and intermarriage. After WWII the population of Germany was massively reduced and, at least in some areas, subject to a great deal of movement. No corrective is offered for that problem. The region in the UK to which the German/“Anglo-Saxon” connection is made is Central and Southern Britain, he previously defined as genetically mixed and indistinct. Rather than explicitly pointing out the problem with that comparison, the reader is required to ferret it out from the finding that the actual size of this “Anglo-Saxon” connection is represents only a minority in the areas in question, with a huge uncertainty range between 10 and 40 per cent. While it is comforting that, unlike analyses done in the past, the study supplies some support for a significant population contribution from groups that altered the regions’ underlying language to English, the evidence as to just how large the incursion was, remains uncertain. The study does contain the newspaper quoted conclusion that it found “no evidence of a general “Celtic” population in non-Saxon parts of the UK. Instead, there were many distinct genetic clusters in these regions …” This conclusion is based, in turn, on differences in the “fine” genetic differences between, for instance, South and North Wales. Because the populations in these areas seems overwhelmingly to have come from Gallic/Celtic France and Belgium and the Welsh native language is Brythonic Gaelic, a better statement of the finding would be that the presumptively Celtic areas within the UK show considerable fine genetic diversity among them. That is a statement that can be supported by the study's evidence and likely reflects the fact that Celtic culture is more frequently defined by its language, Gaelic, rather than by individual tribal components. The online version is said to contain “supplemental information” not in the published article, I’ll let the List know if anything new appears there. Jack Fallin Walnut Creek, CA Even those who have paid On Mar 25, 2015, at 8:04 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > > > > 2. Re: Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England > Scotland. (Jack Fallin) > > 15. Re: Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England > Scotland. (Dee Byster-Graham) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 19:30:11 +0000 > From: Dave H <hallmarkone@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Straight answer at last..... > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <55130cd5.ad3ec20a.2b3d.ffffa83b@mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed > > It's MORE than that Dee... describing it as a Will first of all is > DISGRACEFUL!!!! > > Trying to rip people off for something that is useless.. > > It is clearly described as a Will and certainly, as far as I'm > concerned, certainly in Breach of the Trades Description Act!!! > > One can't sell something that is clearly not a Will, while describing it > as a Will!!! > > Time to read up on EU Laws now... grrrrr!! > > Dave > > > > > On 25/03/2015 18:25, Dee Byster-Graham wrote: >> That's bureaucracy for you, Dave. >> >> Grrrr indeed! >> >> Dee >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via >> Sent: Thursday, 26 March 2015 1:41 AM >> To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com >> Subject: FERMANAGH-GOLD Straight answer at last..... >> >> >> Dear Mr Hall, >> >> With reference to your enquiry, the abstract will name neither beneficiaries >> nor bequests. >> >> Yours sincerely, >> >> Reader Services Division, >> >> National Archives, >> >> Bishop Street, >> >> Dublin 8. >> >> --------------------------------------------------- >> >> So whatever it is will be useless!! >> >> Certainly for anyone ordering what is called 'Document type: Will' it >> certainly will be disappointing!! >> >> What is actually is I haven't a clue but certainly won't be ordering it! >> >> >> DH > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 12:31:43 -0700 > From: Jack Fallin <jakff@astound.net> > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA > study for England Scotland. > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <55580B99-0645-4C02-AB0C-CF751B010F18@astound.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 > > I?ve read the Daily Mail article and I can almost guarantee it?s garbled the basic study. It talks about large parts of England having ?French? but not ?Norman? DNA ? well, the Celts in England and Ireland quite clearly came from somewhere else, and the great majority would have come from France and, to a lesser extent, Spain ? arriving atop an existing neolithic population that no one seems quite sure of. So the discussion about a ?Celtic Myth? seems wildly overstated. I subscribe to NATURE and will advise as to what is really said when I get a chance to read it. > > Jack Fallin > > > On Mar 24, 2015, at 6:18 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > >> >> >> >> 11. DNA maps/locations/links! (CARELL) >> 12. Re: DNA maps/locations/links! (Dee Byster-Graham) >> ================================== https://www.google.ie/ ================================== http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Thank you Dave, Just clarification-LDS film has only 6 numbers not 7-- #597103? -----Original Message----- From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2015 8:50 PM To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD 1703-1838 Convert Rolls Probably still under Copyright Dee... or try LDS Catholic Convert Rolls, 1703-1838 [LDS microfilm 597103] The Convert Rolls Edited by: Eileen O'Byrne and Anne Chamney The publication in 1981 of the Convert Rolls, edited by Eileen O' Byrne, provided historical researchers with easy access to the main documentary record of those who converted to the Established Church (the Church of Ireland) in the eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries. This new edition of the now out of print 1981 work will be of great interest to genealogists and social and religious historians throughout Ireland. ISBN: 978-1-874280-64-9, PP: xviii + 487 , Cover: Hardback http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/30100249?sid=21105779143331&uid=2&uid= 4&uid=3738232 On 25/03/2015 23:51, Dee Byster-Graham via wrote: > Dear Golders, > > Are the 1703-1838 Convert Rolls available to view on line, or only in person > at PRONI or other palce. > > Kindly, > Dee. > > > ================================== https://www.google.ie/ ================================== http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
I know I have a few people to email but am out of Internet allowance for this month.. (looking up too much stuff!!).. Back on line next Tuesday! DH (at Library!)
Dear List, As promised, I have now reviewed the Article in NATURE that was, in turn, condensed in a Newspaper article for which Carole provided a link. The Article is contained in NATURE, 19 March 2014 at pp. 309-314 and is titled “The fine-scale genetic structure of the British population.” In part, the study’s design is easy to describe and makes sense. While only 2000 people were analyzed, they were selected from rural areas and all four of their grandparents had to be born within 80km of one another. The idea was to avoid the sort of movement that has become common in modern society and to capture, through the grandparents, conditions as they existed in the late 1800s. Their DNA was then analyzed and they were grouped with other test subjects who had the most genetic information in common with them. Although the grouping was done purely on the basis of DNA analysis it wound up dividing most of the groups on a logical geographic basis, e.g. the people from Devon fell in one “cluster” while those in Cornwall fell in another. Not surprisingly those from the Orkney Islands [long in the possession of Norwegian Vikings] were the most widely separated from the rest, with the Welsh being the second outlier. There were a large number of specific variations, but! Central and Southern England was generally homogeneous — something the researchers speculated might be attributable to a higher level of movement and DNA interchange in the area. A similarity found between the Northern Ireland population and that of Southern and Scotland is found to be assignable to the “Ulster plantation,” which seems reasonable. Viewed as just an exploration of differences within the UK the study is useful and unexceptional, but when it seeks to extend the data into the identification of corresponding European haplotypes it becomes both more interesting and more problematic. For it’s European comparators the study has no similar “cluster analysis,” rather it borrows a data base created to study multiple sclerosis in European populations. Having identified similarities between the British “clusters” and various “groups” extracted from the multiple sclerosis work, it then goes about attempting to show the place of origin for as many clusters as possible. The principal points of origin for Britain and Scotland are identified within modern France, Germany and Belgium. Norwegian, Danish and Swedish markers appear prominently only in the Orkneys. The use of modern country names immediately introduces uncertainty, because it does not reflect the origins question posed. At the times in question, the connections in France/Gaul and Belgium would almost certainly been Celtic [although unstated, the study seemed not to find any separate identifier for a Norman element]. Even the “German” category, although used to find an Anglo-Saxon connection, is not specifically assigned to any of the tribes supposedly involved. Indeed, “Germany" alone is a questionable category because the great Celtic cultures (Hallstadt and La Téne) had their largest centers in western Germany and Switzerland and it is unclear that those populations were later erased. The samples from Germany are also assigned as “Anglo-Saxon” without any of the interior checks used in the UK. In other words the samples are u! ncontrolled as to past mixing through movement and intermarriage. After WWII the population of Germany was massively reduced and, at least in some areas, subject to a great deal of movement. No corrective is offered for that problem. The region in the UK to which the German/“Anglo-Saxon” connection is made is Central and Southern Britain, he previously defined as genetically mixed and indistinct. Rather than explicitly pointing out the problem with that comparison, the reader is required to ferret it out from the finding that the actual size of this “Anglo-Saxon” connection is represents only a minority in the areas in question, with a huge uncertainty range between 10 and 40 per cent. While it is comforting that, unlike analyses done in the past, the study supplies some support for a significant population contribution from groups that altered the regions’ underlying language to English, the evidence as to just how large the incursion was, remains uncertain. The study does contain the newspaper quoted conclusion that it found “no evidence of a general “Celtic” population in non-Saxon parts of the UK. Instead, there were many distinct genetic clusters in these regions …” This conclusion is based, in turn, on differences in the “fine” genetic differences between, for instance, South and North Wales. Because the populations in these areas seems overwhelmingly to have come from Gallic/Celtic France and Belgium and the Welsh native language is Brythonic Gaelic, a better statement of the finding would be that the presumptively Celtic areas within the UK show considerable fine genetic diversity among them. That is a statement that can be supported by the study's evidence and likely reflects the fact that Celtic culture is more frequently defined by its language, Gaelic, rather than by individual tribal components. The online version is said to contain “supplemental information” not in the published article, I’ll let the List know if anything new appears there. Jack Fallin Walnut Creek, CA Even those who have paid On Mar 25, 2015, at 8:04 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > > > > 2. Re: Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England > Scotland. (Jack Fallin) > > 15. Re: Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England > Scotland. (Dee Byster-Graham) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 19:30:11 +0000 > From: Dave H <hallmarkone@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Straight answer at last..... > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <55130cd5.ad3ec20a.2b3d.ffffa83b@mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed > > It's MORE than that Dee... describing it as a Will first of all is > DISGRACEFUL!!!! > > Trying to rip people off for something that is useless.. > > It is clearly described as a Will and certainly, as far as I'm > concerned, certainly in Breach of the Trades Description Act!!! > > One can't sell something that is clearly not a Will, while describing it > as a Will!!! > > Time to read up on EU Laws now... grrrrr!! > > Dave > > > > > On 25/03/2015 18:25, Dee Byster-Graham wrote: >> That's bureaucracy for you, Dave. >> >> Grrrr indeed! >> >> Dee >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via >> Sent: Thursday, 26 March 2015 1:41 AM >> To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com >> Subject: FERMANAGH-GOLD Straight answer at last..... >> >> >> Dear Mr Hall, >> >> With reference to your enquiry, the abstract will name neither beneficiaries >> nor bequests. >> >> Yours sincerely, >> >> Reader Services Division, >> >> National Archives, >> >> Bishop Street, >> >> Dublin 8. >> >> --------------------------------------------------- >> >> So whatever it is will be useless!! >> >> Certainly for anyone ordering what is called 'Document type: Will' it >> certainly will be disappointing!! >> >> What is actually is I haven't a clue but certainly won't be ordering it! >> >> >> DH > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 12:31:43 -0700 > From: Jack Fallin <jakff@astound.net> > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA > study for England Scotland. > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <55580B99-0645-4C02-AB0C-CF751B010F18@astound.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 > > I?ve read the Daily Mail article and I can almost guarantee it?s garbled the basic study. It talks about large parts of England having ?French? but not ?Norman? DNA ? well, the Celts in England and Ireland quite clearly came from somewhere else, and the great majority would have come from France and, to a lesser extent, Spain ? arriving atop an existing neolithic population that no one seems quite sure of. So the discussion about a ?Celtic Myth? seems wildly overstated. I subscribe to NATURE and will advise as to what is really said when I get a chance to read it. > > Jack Fallin > > > On Mar 24, 2015, at 6:18 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > >> >> >> >> 11. DNA maps/locations/links! (CARELL) >> 12. Re: DNA maps/locations/links! (Dee Byster-Graham) >>
Christina has posted a useful idea. It will help people in the future who want to look up particular names or topics in the FG archive by cutting out everything that is not directly pertinent to the theme in question. For example if faced with 100 results to look up for a particular area of interest it is not helpful to spend time opening each one and finding half of them are one liners with no real input into the subject. Val Mc Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2015 10:40:56 -0400 From: Christina Hunt <chrisnina@gmail.com> Subject: FERMANAGH-GOLD From Admin to Digest users If you hit Reply to the Digest - you must remove extra text. Or reply *only* to the sender. You can do that by hitting Reply All and then remove the list from the "To" field. Consider this option - if your email is just a simple thank you kind of reply. Regards, Christina List admin
Dave, That is my point entirely - perhaps not stated as succinctly as your answer. Neolithic people did not much care where they came from - only that where they got to was user-friendly! And around 12,000bc when that Mag Garren/Mag Uire left his nice warm cave in Spain and looked over at a land bridge ............................................. Dee :) -----Original Message----- From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via Sent: Thursday, 26 March 2015 9:58 AM To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England Scotland. I Know, Dee but there are certain known bodies being tested plus some of the 6th century Spaniards from the Antrim settlement when population of ireland was about 20,000. There were no Irish when it was covered in ice anyway so they had to have come from somewhere.... It is known that over the centuries people from Spain, Morocco etc settled in Ireland plus the Norse, Vikings, Danes.. So who was the first discoverer of Ireland...? probably some Maguire too!!! grrrrrr.... There was the free test offered to anyone worldwide but don't know how many took up the offer.. People get DNA done which shows Viking or Dane or whatever but at least 99% or more are going to get that simply because all the people moved north as ice melted so even in the year 1000 there were many 'nationalities' living, intermarrying or whatever in Ireland.... there were no Irish until people moved into Ireland from wherever. Dave.
Thank you, Dave, The link you kindly sent enabled me to finally set up a JSTOR account, intending to do so for some time - read the book on line, fascinating. Shall try LDS for the Rolls. Kindly, Dee. -----Original Message----- From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via Sent: Thursday, 26 March 2015 10:50 AM To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD 1703-1838 Convert Rolls Probably still under Copyright Dee... or try LDS Catholic Convert Rolls, 1703-1838 [LDS microfilm 597103] The Convert Rolls Edited by: Eileen O'Byrne and Anne Chamney The publication in 1981 of the Convert Rolls, edited by Eileen O' Byrne, provided historical researchers with easy access to the main documentary record of those who converted to the Established Church (the Church of Ireland) in the eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries. This new edition of the now out of print 1981 work will be of great interest to genealogists and social and religious historians throughout Ireland. ISBN: 978-1-874280-64-9, PP: xviii + 487 , Cover: Hardback http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/30100249?sid=21105779143331&uid=2&uid= 4&uid=3738232 On 25/03/2015 23:51, Dee Byster-Graham via wrote: > Dear Golders, > > Are the 1703-1838 Convert Rolls available to view on line, or only in > person at PRONI or other palce. > > Kindly, > Dee. > > > ================================== https://www.google.ie/ ================================== http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
If you hit Reply to the Digest - you must remove extra text. Or reply *only* to the sender. You can do that by hitting Reply All and then remove the list from the "To" field. Consider this option - if your email is just a simple thank you kind of reply. Regards, Christina List admin
Jack I will be interested to hear what you have to say! One item I read seemed to be saying that we had a lot in common w Germans. Anne On Mar 25, 2015 3:32 PM, "Jack Fallin via" <fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com> wrote: > I’ve read the Daily Mail article and I can almost guarantee it’s garbled > the basic study. It talks about large parts of England having “French” but > not “Norman” DNA — well, the Celts in England and Ireland quite clearly > came from somewhere else, and the great majority would have come from > France and, to a lesser extent, Spain — arriving atop an existing neolithic > population that no one seems quite sure of. So the discussion about a > “Celtic Myth” seems wildly overstated. I subscribe to NATURE and will > advise as to what is really said when I get a chance to read it. > > Jack Fallin > > > On Mar 24, 2015, at 6:18 PM, fermanagh-gold-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > 11. DNA maps/locations/links! (CARELL) > > 12. Re: DNA maps/locations/links! (Dee Byster-Graham) > > > > Message: 1 > > Da > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------te: > Tue, 24 Mar 2015 08:46:10 +0000 > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 11 > > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 09:35:42 +1100 > > From: CARELL <carell@bigpond.com.au> > > Subject: FERMANAGH-GOLD DNA maps/locations/links! > > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > > Message-ID: <535881BC-9AEB-4937-91FE-D1BB7E1BD9C8@bigpond.com.au> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > > From the Scotch Irish list, an interesting link if you ignore > > 'the famous people' trivia.... > > > >> > http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3000998/Are-Welsh-truest-Brits-English-genomes-contain-German-French-DNA-Romans-left-no-trace.html#ixzz3U > >> > >> Carole. > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 12 > > Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 09:14:18 +1000 > > From: "Dee Byster-Graham" <deebg@bigpond.net.au> > > Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD DNA maps/locations/links! > > To: "'CARELL'" <carell@bigpond.com.au>, <fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com> > > Message-ID: <001a01d06688$40e354d0$c2a9fe70$@bigpond.net.au> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Thank you for posting the link, Carole, > > > > Very interesting data, shows northern Ireland dna same as western > Scotland > > as we would expect. > > It was believed that Celticity is cultural rather than dna related, te > > study appears to prove this. > > Same would be true of Roman influence - cultural rather than genetic. > > No less impacting, all the same. > > > > Kindly > > Dee. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com > > [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of CARELL via > > Sent: Wednesday, 25 March 2015 8:36 AM > > To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com > > Subject: FERMANAGH-GOLD DNA maps/locations/links! > > > > From the Scotch Irish list, an interesting link if you ignore > > 'the famous people' trivia.... > > > >> > > > http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3000998/Are-Welsh-truest-Brit > > > s-English-genomes-contain-German-French-DNA-Romans-left-no-trace.html#ixzz3U > >> > >> Carole. > > > > > > ================================== > > > > > ================================== > > https://www.google.ie/ > ================================== > http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >
Dear Golders, Are the 1703-1838 Convert Rolls available to view on line, or only in person at PRONI or other palce. Kindly, Dee. ================================== https://www.google.ie/ ================================== http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Hi Jack and Dave, I am surely no expert on dna matters, but am wondering how Norman genes could be clearly differentiated from Viking. We know that Vikings settled all along that part of the coast of Europe, and William of Normandy's family were fourth generation Viking; simply because they spoke French when they conquered England does not change their dna makeup, although intermarriage with the local population would change the equation. Much of their 'French' overlay was a cultural occurrence rather than genetic. Very rarely does one hear praise for the wonderful Neolithic peoples who settled Britain so long ago, who flourished and built a diverse, interesting civilisation with ingenuity and vigour. The fact is, every dna study will give only basic results unless a very large proportion of the population is tested- and without that extensive testing purely cultural issues need to be taken into consideration when we casually examine any civilisation, ancient or modern. Descending from Dolan and Magauran, two tribes of (hopefully) truly ancient Ireland, it will be fascinating to study the results of the 'who were the Irish' study Dave spoke of. Kindly, Dee. -----Original Message----- From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dave H via Sent: Thursday, 26 March 2015 5:41 AM To: fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Digest, Vol 10, Issue 130; Latest DNA study for England Scotland. On 25/03/2015 19:31, Jack Fallin via wrote: > I've read the Daily Mail article and I can almost guarantee it's garbled the basic study. It talks about large parts of England having "French" but not "Norman" DNA - well, the Celts in England and Ireland quite clearly came from somewhere else, and the great majority would have come from France and, to a lesser extent, Spain - arriving atop an existing neolithic population that no one seems quite sure of. So the discussion about a "Celtic Myth" seems wildly overstated. I subscribe to NATURE and will advise as to what is really said when I get a chance to read it. > > Jack Fallin The current "who were the Irish" study results should be interesting with them taking DNA samples from 6th Century onwards.. Not sure how many bodies they are testing. DH ================================== https://www.google.ie/ ================================== http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Good will hunting. (That was a movie.) JC On 3/25/15 7:38 PM, Viola Wiggins wrote: > Good for you Dave. Give them a run for their money. BUT > Don't draw blood. > When is a Will not a Will? would be my first question to them. Good > hunting > Vi > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > http://www.avast.com > >
Oh it might have been a Magorunnin that left ... DH On 26/03/2015 03:03, Dee Byster-Graham wrote: > Dave, > > That is my point entirely - perhaps not stated as succinctly as your answer. > Neolithic people did not much care where they came from - only that where > they got to was user-friendly! > > And around 12,000bc when that Mag Garren/Mag Uire left his nice warm cave > in Spain and looked over at a land bridge > ............................................. > > Dee
Oh I do apologise! Dave. :-)) On 26/03/2015 02:51, Dee Byster-Graham wrote: > Thank you, Dave, > > The link you kindly sent enabled me to finally set up a JSTOR account, > intending to do so for some time - read the book on line, fascinating. > Shall try LDS for the Rolls. > > Kindly, > Dee.
Thank you, Sharon, Very interesting! Excellent research, too, It is said history is written by the victors, true enough, but it's amazing what a bit of legwork and research will turn up. Thank you so much for posting. Kindly Dee. 4am - off to bed :) -----Original Message----- From: Sharon Oddie Brown [mailto:sharonoddiebrown@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, 25 March 2015 1:05 AM To: Eilish; fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com; Dee Byster-Graham Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Richard III And a distant relation of that WOODVILLE has Irish connections - although not quite with Fermanagh (but close). I wrote a blog piece about her some time ago: http://sharonoddiebrown.blogspot.ca/2013/09/email-serendipity.html Enjoy, Sharon Sharon Oddie Brown, Roberts Creek, BC, Canada. History Project: http://www.thesilverbowl.com/ On 23/03/2015 2:33 PM, Eilish via wrote: > Ironically, I am currently reading The White Queen, about Elizabeth > Woodville and her husband King Edward, Richard's older brother. > Richard has just been married off to a Neville. Prior to that I read > The Red Queen, which was about Margaret Beauford and the Lancaster side. > Phillipa Gregory wrote these books -- they are very readable, and > although novelized, she is a historian with an interest in the > Plantagenets and the Tudors so she decided to flesh out the bones so > to speak. I saw a BBC doc when they dug up the bones of Richard in a > carpark ( unbelievable!) and put him together again. How amazing his > descendant was a cabinet maker who could make his coffin. Still, that > guy got his family tree done for free! Guess I am not a descendant of > any Yorkist. > > Eilish > > > On 23/03/2015 6:26 PM, Dee Byster-Graham via wrote: >> Who is Josephine Tey? >> Have not read any books by this person. >> Presuming she is an author - is her work historically accurate and readable? >> If so, shall search her out in the library. >> >> Dee. >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:fermanagh-gold-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of caiside via >> Sent: Monday, 23 March 2015 9:28 AM >> To: Barry Graham; fermanagh-gold@rootsweb.com; Viola Wiggins; Dave H >> Subject: Re: FERMANAGH-GOLD Richard III >> >> Thanks, I'll look for it. I always enjoyed Josephine Tey. >> >> >> On 3/22/15 7:04 PM, Barry Graham wrote: >>>> On 3/22/15 3:27 PM, Viola Wiggins wrote: >>>>> He was not quite the baddie he has been made out to be. But the >>>>> only version we know was written by his enemies. Now research >>>>> shows him in a different light. >>> Read "The Daughter of Time". >>> A detective novel by Josephine Tey. >>> Involves research into Richard III and the history written by the Tudors. >>> >>> >>> >> ================================== >> >> https://www.google.ie/ >> ================================== >> http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> ================================== >> >> https://www.google.ie/ >> ================================== >> http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > ================================== > > https://www.google.ie/ > ================================== > http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/placenames/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > FERMANAGH-GOLD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message