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Well, with a liitle help from patient Janhart, I finally learned to use the LDS search site. I've used the IGI at my FHC, of course, and thought I knew certain things about it, but suddenly seeing things on my computer screen made me realize how INACCURATE it can be! Before we all assume genealogy heaven has arrived and rush off to write down everything we see on the IGI as Gospel and Fact, keep in mind it is full of errors and suppositions. Now, I'm not saying it all is, but if you see a death date listed as "about" that is a big clue that you are NOT looking at an actual record but of someone's supposition. Another clue is when a wife's name is entered as Mrs. John Smith instead of Mary Jones. For instance, there is a record listed for a Patt Cassidy of Drumgormly, Devenish Parish, Co Fermanagh, which is based on a pension claim, which itself was based on a transcript of the 1851 census. The head of the house was Patt Cassidy, and he was listed as a widower, his marriage date given as 1809. (I know because I have looked at the actual transcript at PRONI.) This same info appears in the IGI, and it MAY be true, but what you are looking at in the IGI is not the primary record!! And certainly to list a female in the IGI as Mrs. Patt Cassidy, based on this record, is not telling us a whole lot! So please keep this in mind as you use the IGI and other search engines on the LDS site. The info is NOT itself primary source material. In many cases it is not even a copy of primary source material but a copy of a copy, or even someone's leap of imagination. SO you may find something interesting, but then you must go find the original source before believing it. Just a word of caution.... Janet C-S

Does anyone have detailed maps of townland lisnaskea, Co. Armagh, in any detail ? Ron Betty

Thanks for all the great information on LDS. I have just started to use their resources and the film numbers will be a huge help! I am looking for a detailed map of Fermanagh. Does anyone have any suggestions where I couild get one. I live in Canada. Also has anyone read books on the early history of Fermanagh which they would recommend? Betty Jean Moyle Counsellor Sir Sandford Fleming College (705) 324-9144, ext. 3275

Dear listers Do records exist anywhere to show when Estates were set up, who owned the estates & more importantly who lived on or rented out the farms/land from the estates. I know my ancestors have been on the same farms of land (various townlands in parish of Magheraculmoney) during the Griffiths Valuations and the Tithe Applotments but I don't know any info before that time. I am particularily interested in the John G Irvine estate which covered parts of Fermanagh & Tyrone. I have looked at some Irvine 'boxes' when at PRONI. There was some correspondence from the early part of this century, but very little from before that. Are any of the Irvines still alive & would they hold family records not deposited with PRONI? Can anyone help. Richard

Greetings, I need some suggestions on where to look next for information on Patrick... The following is what I know and don't know about Patrick Timoney, my grandfather: *DOB: 03/14/1884 *father's name is James Timoney and mother is Bridget McGrath *"Certified Copy of Entry in the Register of Cases of Successful Vaccination" on Patrick is from the Union of Ballyshannon, District of Churchill. This certificate came from the office of Bunahone Churchill. The certificate also states Patrick's birth as being registered in Belleek District. Also listed is James Timoney as Father and residing in Glenashover. *Patrick married Ellen Ward -- in Boston, Massachusetts, but I have no idea as of the date and the Registry of Vital Records requires some sort of date in order to find entry. *Patrick and Ellen produced 2 children: Anne Patricia b.01/08/1920 d. 12/??/1983 and James Daniel (my dad) b. 07/09/1921 d.09/21/1985 -- both born in Boston, Mass. *An application for an SS# for Patrick states his place of birth as Co. Fermanagh, Ireland -- this w/ the Belleek on the vaccination record prompted me to write to the General Register Office for a copy of Patrick's birth certificate. I have also written to Registry of Vital Records Massachusetts for copy of Patrick's death certificate. Where else can I look for info? Thanks very much in advance for any tips offered... Best Wishes, Ellen M. Timoney ellen.timoney@portergaud.edu

Thank you to everybody who is putting on all these beaut references for the LDS. I am one of the very fortunately people who have a local library even though I live in the country in NSW so I will be off there pronto! Can I take the time to post my research: My BARRETT family, as far as I can trace, were in Fermanagh in the late 1700s. They were at Gushedy Beg, Parish Drumkeeran. I have been there and seen the farm and met a few relatives - VERY exciting. I also found whilst I was there that Michael (Mickey) Barrett who lived in the adjoining townland was the Fenian, Michael Barrett who was the last man to be publicly hanged in London for the blowing up of wall at Clerkenwell prison. He was supposedly in Glasgow at the time but his alibi was not accepted. However, another person did confess later to the crime - alas for Mickey Barrett. There has been a very good book written on the subject if anyone is interested. There appears to be only one BARRETT family in Fermanagh, all related - names are Owen, Patrick, William, Edward, John. There was an Edward Barrett, a soldier listed in the military records in 1600's - perhaps he was the first! The Barrett name is certainly NOT a Fermanagh name, more Mayo and Limerick but my lot seem to have been there for quite a while. Any clues??? My ancester who came to Australia in 1841 was Patrick Barrett, wife Ellen McHugh and their son Owen Barrett and wife Mary Ann McNally. Patrick Barrett's parents were Owen Barrett and Ann Logan. If anyone might know anything I would be grateful. and THANK YOU again!!! Chrissy Fletcher, Bowral, NSW

In a message dated 5/19/99 9:02:18 AM, BMOYLE@flemingc.on.ca wrote: <<I am looking for a detailed map of Fermanagh. Does anyone have any suggestions where I couild get one. I live in Canada. Also has anyone read books on the early history of Fermanagh which they would recommend? >> I recommend the Ordnance Survey maps. The most detailed are the "Discovery Series". Numbers 12, 17, 18, 26, 27 cover most of Fermanagh. You can get them through many books stores. Try Fred Hanna's. http://www.hannas.ie/hannas/ For history, try The Fermanagh Story, by Peadar Livingstone--a rather rambling, but detailed, account of Fermanagh from early times on. Try Hanna's for that, too, or Hall's in Enniskillen. The PRONI website has been putting up parish maps, though I don't think they have done all of Fermanagh yet. But it is a good site to watch. Go to http://proni.nics.gov.uk/index.htm and click on Geographical Index. Good luck, Janet C-S

I have had several inquiries re the codes I sent They are BATCH numbers and need to be proceeded by C or M or (in the case of Liverpool P - figure that one out ?) The D and B bits do not yet appear to be working Sorry if this confused people. Karin At 17:07 18-05-99 -0400, you wrote: >Karen, >Are the code numbers Batch Numbers or Film Numbers? >If Batch Numbers ,should they be preceded by the letter B,C,M,or D? >Thanks, >Jim Swindell > > > > >

Hi Chrissy I caused quite a lot of interest posting this film number. Firstly, it is an IGI search using the Custom tab which gives you additional boxes in which to enter the criteria for searching. What is obvious is that Film no. 538447 doesn't contain ALL Drumkeeran information. I struck lucky with the Bartons it appears. There are a few very early Irvines on this film too but from Donegal! I came across it when I was trawling through results from just entering the name Barton. One name of Drumkeeran came up which gave me the film number. As I wasn't searching any other names I didn't try any others on the film. Several listers have tried their names on the film no. without success. Some results came back with English parishes. So a film number is not exclusive to one area. This is where I agree with Karin that the records seem in a mess. It would be nice to be given a variety of search methods to narrow the results. So it's down to finding just one from the region you want to yield the batch or film number. Several people have shared numbers on the list already - so it's worth giving them a try. Remember that a maximum of 200 results is returned and by looking at the initial of the first name at the END of the list you get an idea of how many more names there are. So try entering a first name with a different letter to get a different set of 200 results and so on. I've used the Feedback form to ask if we can have a facility to search on a batch number alone. Wonder if our comments are taken up? Jan Hart ----- Original Message ----- From: Chrissy Fletcher <amberley@hinet.net.au> To: <FERMANAGH-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: 19 May 1999 08:16 Subject: LDS SITE - HELP PLEASE????? > I was excited to read about Drumkeeran film 538447 as ALL my BARRETT > ancestors come from that Parish way back to late 1700s. I have tried and > tried but I don't know what you did to get that film. I have tried all > custom searches. > > Please step me through it. > Is it IGI or Ancestral Search? > > Thought I would post this for all to see in case there are other dummies > out there who are not game to ask!! But I HAVE to!!! > > Thanks Chrissy Fletcher >

I was excited to read about Drumkeeran film 538447 as ALL my BARRETT ancestors come from that Parish way back to late 1700s. I have tried and tried but I don't know what you did to get that film. I have tried all custom searches. Please step me through it. Is it IGI or Ancestral Search? Thought I would post this for all to see in case there are other dummies out there who are not game to ask!! But I HAVE to!!! Thanks Chrissy Fletcher

Hullo list, Can this kiwi enquire what this all means. I have belonged to the list for a while now and am using it to try and learn how on earth one uncovers their family from Fermangh. At first I thought Fermangh was a town, I now understand that to know ones ancestors were from Fermanagh is not enough. I see you all posting Library information and I must have lost a thread as I do not know what it is. I have tried a researcher to track my family down but I am not even sure I understand what I bought. At least no family was found. I understand what a microfish is and assume some of you own the readers, or are the numbers what you take to the L.D.S to request the films. Many thanks in anticipation. Oh, and before s.k.s, offers to look for the family and on hearing the name puts their head in their hands and wishes they had not offered the name is Brown >grin ( Not easy eh) Kind regards Pauline Live in the Light t 08:16 AM 18/05/1999 +0100, buddyf@ieway.com wrote: > I wish to add my list to thew Fermanagh Group. > > >>>As a volunteer at the local LDS Library, I have gathered the folowing >>>information which I wish to share with all Fermanagh County subscribers: >>> >>>Microfish # Subject >>> >>>100173 Religious census, 1766, by T Grooves >>>100181 Freeholder index, 1760 to 1788 >>>100266 Surname index, land and property >>>100912 Index, Wills/Deeds, 1661 to 1885 >>>100959 Index, Administrative Bonds >>>127935 Fermanagh, Military lists >>>256588 Applotment Books, 1824-1840 >>>258443 Tith Applotment Books, 1833 >>>258520 Inishmacsaint, Parish records >>>258520 Devenish, parish records >>>258753 Derrybrusk, Griffiths Valuation, maps 27, 1862 >>>259148 Fermanagh, Enniskillen, Poor Law Union, 1845-1913 & Work >>>House register of 1848 >>>476999 Surnames, Matheson Survey of 1894 >>>824865 Inishmacsaint, Census, 1901, part 1 >>>824866 Inishmacsaint, Census, 1901, part 2 >>>1279238 Clogher, records >>>1279325 Fermanagh, land & Property records >>>1279356 Fermanagh, Poll of Electors >>>1565474 N. Ireland, Tithe Applotment Boks, 1822-1837 >>>1696604 Clogher, Clergy & Parishes & Church directories >>>6020359 Ports of Departure in 1841 from Ireland >>>6026286 Ulster, History >>>6036090 Ireland, County Bibliogrophys >>>6036263 Ulster, The Plantation Index of 1601 >>>6342443 Fermanagh, Parish maps with Townland shown, by each parish >>>and location, some indexed. >>>6342445 Monaghan, townlands ( might have relatives there ) >>>597733 Fermanagh, Census, 1821 >> >>The films listed below are not in the LDS computer, library disk #10, but >are availiable. They are inventories of all materials on certain >Geographical locations about Ireland ,England, Scotland & Wales.. >> >>6110526 England, 89 m/f >> >>6110527 Ireland, 19 m/f >> >>6110528 Scotalnd, 18 m/f >> >>6110529 Wales, 17 m/f >> >> Enjoy and keep checking this site for more information. >> >William J Flanagan >Fermanagh County Host >Spokane, Wa.,USA >

I regret that I must leave the list for a while. But first I want to very sincerely thank the Listowner, all Listers and in particular, those Listers who have been so kind, so friendly and so helpful. My time with you all has been extremely enjoyable and educational. I will be back as soon as I can. I wish you all much happiness and success in your research. I would be very happy to hear from anyone privately in the meantime at ronjones@bigpond.com In particular I would love to share information regarding:- Fermanagh: Francis BROWN, Elizabeth BROWN nee GRAHAM and their large family. Emigrated to Australia early 1850's. Nearby Sligo: James Nicholson LARNER, his father Edward LARNER; his mother, or grandparent NICHOLSON. Also MOTHERWELL. Best wishes to all from Australia, Ron Jones.

Responding to Jan Hart & Karin Endemann It is a great idea if we can all get together and come up with a list of batch numbers, film numbers, etc., for Co Fermanagh. As I haven't had much luck myself trawling through Custom Search, I tried out some of your suggestions:- "For example, when you try a Custom Search the Film number 538447 covers Drumkeeran in Fermanagh." I didn't get any return on my own name so i thought I would try a very common name like SMITH, I returned the following info:- You searched for: smith [refine search] Results: International Genealogical Index/British Isles (5 matches) 1. Ann SMITH - International Genealogical Index Gender: F Marriage: 11 Oct 1724 Helions Bumpstead, Essex, England 2. Charles Littler SMITH - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Birth: 14 May 1893 Tottenham, London, England 3. Elizabeth Mary SMITH - International Genealogical Index Gender: F Birth: 28 Dec 1897 Tottenham, London, England 4. Richard SMITH - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Marriage: 1892 Tottemham, London, England 5. Richard John SMITH - International Genealogical Index Gender: M Birth: 23 Oct 1894 Tottenham, London, England You will notice that all 5 returns come from England - and none from Drumkeeran ! Jan must have been lucky, I typed in BARTON and came up with 29 returns, 28 of which came from Drumkeeran !! It would be great if we only had to insert a batch or film number and didn't have to insert a surname. Has anyone else had any luck working it all out ? Richard

If you haven't seen it yet, there is now a site open with over 3000 records of NYC's Emigrant Savings Bank, searchable online. Go to http://www.genexchange.com/ny/Emigrant.CFM There are 4 Cassidys listed. One, Hugh CASSIDY was from Drumbulkin, near Lowtherstown (Irivinetown) in Fermanagh, son of Connor and Sarah McGuire. Other info is given. There is another Hugh CASSIDY, and a Michael CASSIDY as well. There are other surnames too, of course, and not all account holders were Irish ;-), and not all lived in NYC. Janet C-S

Having started off this idea, I have remarkably little to offer for Fermanagh in return! What I have got so far is as follows. Anyone searching for Bartons will find a lot here: Fermanagh in General: Batch: 6010744 47 Batch: F610744 47 Film: 1761071 Drumkeeran: Film: 538447 Clonelly: Film no: 184319 Page no: 160 Ref: 3488 I have collected quite a lot for Antrim, Down and Armagh as well as some English counties. I will publish it on my website but I am still experimenting with the best way to present the information. Jan Hart

I wish to add my list to thew Fermanagh Group. >>As a volunteer at the local LDS Library, I have gathered the folowing >>information which I wish to share with all Fermanagh County subscribers: >> >>Microfish # Subject >> >>100173 Religious census, 1766, by T Grooves >>100181 Freeholder index, 1760 to 1788 >>100266 Surname index, land and property >>100912 Index, Wills/Deeds, 1661 to 1885 >>100959 Index, Administrative Bonds >>127935 Fermanagh, Military lists >>256588 Applotment Books, 1824-1840 >>258443 Tith Applotment Books, 1833 >>258520 Inishmacsaint, Parish records >>258520 Devenish, parish records >>258753 Derrybrusk, Griffiths Valuation, maps 27, 1862 >>259148 Fermanagh, Enniskillen, Poor Law Union, 1845-1913 & Work >>House register of 1848 >>476999 Surnames, Matheson Survey of 1894 >>824865 Inishmacsaint, Census, 1901, part 1 >>824866 Inishmacsaint, Census, 1901, part 2 >>1279238 Clogher, records >>1279325 Fermanagh, land & Property records >>1279356 Fermanagh, Poll of Electors >>1565474 N. Ireland, Tithe Applotment Boks, 1822-1837 >>1696604 Clogher, Clergy & Parishes & Church directories >>6020359 Ports of Departure in 1841 from Ireland >>6026286 Ulster, History >>6036090 Ireland, County Bibliogrophys >>6036263 Ulster, The Plantation Index of 1601 >>6342443 Fermanagh, Parish maps with Townland shown, by each parish >>and location, some indexed. >>6342445 Monaghan, townlands ( might have relatives there ) >>597733 Fermanagh, Census, 1821 > >The films listed below are not in the LDS computer, library disk #10, but are availiable. They are inventories of all materials on certain Geographical locations about Ireland ,England, Scotland & Wales.. > >6110526 England, 89 m/f > >6110527 Ireland, 19 m/f > >6110528 Scotalnd, 18 m/f > >6110529 Wales, 17 m/f > > Enjoy and keep checking this site for more information. > William J Flanagan Fermanagh County Host Spokane, Wa.,USA

I forgot to tell you all - even though all the numbers end in 1 (one) the codes got from 1-9 in each case - so you will have to try them all. Karin

Hi Fermanagh hunters (and especially Jan who had the brilliant idea!) In the spirit of sharing and to get us all going - here is my current listing of the files on the LDS IGI site. As we are all trying to solve the biggest and most complicated puzzles around, I thought that we should share what few clues we do have and try to reduce the insanity a bit. Hope this information helps someone. I would, of course, love to have your coding to help me. In here I have included Ireland, Scotland and a bit on Liverpool as my group moved around and I bet yours did too. Ciao all :) Karin in Ottawa, Canada LATTER DAY SAINTS IGI CODING IRELAND ARMAGH 701281 701226 Markethill 701237 701292 701221 FERMANAGH 701269 701293 (Enniskillen) 701241 (1864) 701321 (1864) 701221 (1864) 701231 (1864) 701821 (also Roscommon) 701263 702303 701612 701622 701312 CAVAN 700461 LONDONDERRY F505627 CLONES MONEHAN 700681 701253 DOWN 701266 701297 700101 700111 LAOIGHIS 701223 701253 ROSCOMMON 701851 701303 701223 TIPPERARY 701235 KILKENNY 701264 LIMERICK 700561 700571 701332 700451 701292 701261 OFFALY 701253 701288 KERRY 701366 700901 ANTRIM 701051 DUBLIN 700251 701121 701282 TYRONE 700701 701221 DONEGAL 701222 701227 DOWN 700031 700051 CORK F186423 701254 WESTMEATH 701364 SCOTLAND DUNDEE 112821 112731 FORFAR 112881 MONTIFIETH 113104 GLASGOW 119461 119741 119751 119671 119661 119681 Milton 119261 119271 116441 Central MONTROSE 113123 ARBROATH 112721 KIRRIEMUIR 112992 ANGUS F186070 PANBRIDE 113162 BARRY 112741 DOUGLAS 116416 CLOSEBURN 118164 BO�NESS 116631 WIGTOWN 118874 118954 119001 ABERDEEN: NEW DEER 112251 OLD DEER 112281 TYRIE 112481 MONQUITTER 112232 ST NICHOLAS 111684 ABERDOUR 111694 FRAZERBURG 111964 TARVES 112435 ABERDEEN T000155 TURIFF 112471 AUCHTERLESS 111731 ENGLAND LIVERPOOL P020951 P020278 P020951

There isn't a site list for Monaghan. Jerrian