I am trying to research a family that split in half, the wife Emma ROBERTS nee WOOD sells the contents of the house in a well organised house contents sale on 12 July 1906 and apparently moves to Rio de Janeiro with some of the grown up children, Emma was married to Thomas George ROBERTS 4 Nov 1866 St Simon Zelotes, Bethnel Green, he was a Cheesemonger in 1841. He was the son of John ROBERTS and Eliza nee MANNING. I have been searchings ships passenger lists and cannot find Emma, but have turned up  two possible sons, John H Roberts, 40, b abt 1866, departed 17 July 1906 from Liverpool to New York on the Carmania. The other son is George J ROBERTS b abt 1871, 35 from Liverpool to New York on Etruria departed 1 Dec 1907. Would they get the same ship to Rio, are they stopping of at New York?  Goodness knows why Emma decided to go to Rio? I have used the shipping lists before, but any pointers about how to try and trace this families massive journey to Rio would be appreciated. Thomas and Emma had 10 children, the parents and 8 children appear on 1891 census at 13 Raymond Road, St Stephen, West Ham, London RG12/1329. Previous census returns they have been at Leytonstone and West Home, both Essex I believe. Several children were born in Plaistow, Essex. I have a catalogue for the house sale, they had 7 bedrooms, and the items for sale run to 9 pages. Presume the money they raised would pay fares, but so far I cannot find the family travelling together. Thomas is found in1911 at 26 Roman Road East Ham, lodging with the SNEATH family, George is 70 at this time. Pat in Lincolnshire

I can't offer much help, but since you've had no other replies on the list, from my own research, it does seem that NY was a stopping-off point for those on longer journeys, possibly involving a change of vessel as well. Many of my German maternal granny's family, by the name of Rosswaag, emigrated to the US and Canada in the 1920s and 30s, but one settled at Caracas, Venezuela, around the 1890s. He and one or two near relatives appear more than once in the Ellis Island records; it seems possible that a brother or two who lived in NYC or NY state paid occasional business trips to their Caracas relative, sailing via Ellis Island. They printed and published books and he published postcards of Caracas. Back in Germany, they had all been jewellers. It's not much, but I hope it gives you some encouragement. There must be a reason why your Emma chose Brazil. Try books on English social history and emigration c.1906, books looking at which countries Brits emigrated to and why, and also possibly Brazilian books looking at their country's immigrants. Maybe the Brazilian equivalent of the TNA website might have some basic info online to start you off. Perhaps your Emma saw an advert in a UK newspaper offering new starts in Brazil, maybe a one-way ticket there was on special offer at the time, or maybe she already had relatives or contacts out there who arranged accommodation etc. for her in advance. Her two adult sons following her later seems curious - one would think that at least one of them would have gone first to make sure all was okay out there. Maybe they went to try and bring her back instead? Have you checked their UK backgrounds, marriages, offspring, census entries etc.? Lawrence On 20/04/2013 22:09, Pat Cook wrote: > I am trying to research a family that split in half, the wife Emma ROBERTS nee WOOD sells the contents of the house in a well organised house contents sale on 12 July 1906 and apparently moves to Rio de Janeiro with some of the grown up children, > > Emma was married to Thomas George ROBERTS 4 Nov 1866 St Simon Zelotes, Bethnel Green, he was a Cheesemonger in 1841. He was the son of John ROBERTS and Eliza nee MANNING. > > I have been searchings ships passenger lists and cannot find Emma, but have turned up two possible sons, John H Roberts, 40, b abt 1866, departed 17 July 1906 from Liverpool to New York on the Carmania. > > The other son is George J ROBERTS b abt 1871, 35 from Liverpool to New York on Etruria departed 1 Dec 1907. > > Would they get the same ship to Rio, are they stopping of at New York? Goodness knows why Emma decided to go to Rio? > > I have used the shipping lists before, but any pointers about how to try and trace this families massive journey to Rio would be appreciated. > > Thomas and Emma had 10 children, the parents and 8 children appear on 1891 census at 13 Raymond Road, St Stephen, West Ham, London RG12/1329. Previous census returns they have been at Leytonstone and West Home, both Essex I believe. Several children were born in Plaistow, Essex. > > I have a catalogue for the house sale, they had 7 bedrooms, and the items for sale run to 9 pages. Presume the money they raised would pay fares, but so far I cannot find the family travelling together. > > Thomas is found in1911 at 26 Roman Road East Ham, lodging with the SNEATH family, George is 70 at this time. > > Pat in Lincolnshire > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Are there any Welsh connections? I believe that Rio was the destination of many Welsh miners from England and Wales. -----Original Message----- From: La Greenall I can't offer much help, but since you've had no other replies on the list, from my own research, it does seem that NY was a stopping-off point for those on longer journeys, possibly involving a change of vessel as well. Many of my German maternal granny's family, by the name of Rosswaag, emigrated to the US and Canada in the 1920s and 30s, but one settled at Caracas, Venezuela, around the 1890s. He and one or two near relatives appear more than once in the Ellis Island records; it seems possible that a brother or two who lived in NYC or NY state paid occasional business trips to their Caracas relative, sailing via Ellis Island. They printed and published books and he published postcards of Caracas. Back in Germany, they had all been jewellers. It's not much, but I hope it gives you some encouragement. There must be a reason why your Emma chose Brazil. Try books on English social history and emigration c.1906, books looking at which countries Brits emigrated to and why, and also possibly Brazilian books looking at their country's immigrants. Maybe the Brazilian equivalent of the TNA website might have some basic info online to start you off. Perhaps your Emma saw an advert in a UK newspaper offering new starts in Brazil, maybe a one-way ticket there was on special offer at the time, or maybe she already had relatives or contacts out there who arranged accommodation etc. for her in advance. Her two adult sons following her later seems curious - one would think that at least one of them would have gone first to make sure all was okay out there. Maybe they went to try and bring her back instead? Have you checked their UK backgrounds, marriages, offspring, census entries etc.? Lawrence On 20/04/2013 22:09, Pat Cook wrote: > I am trying to research a family that split in half, the wife Emma ROBERTS > nee WOOD sells the contents of the house in a well organised house > contents sale on 12 July 1906 and apparently moves to Rio de Janeiro with > some of the grown up children, > > Emma was married to Thomas George ROBERTS 4 Nov 1866 St Simon Zelotes, > Bethnel Green, he was a Cheesemonger in 1841. He was the son of John > ROBERTS and Eliza nee MANNING. > > I have been searchings ships passenger lists and cannot find Emma, but > have turned up two possible sons, John H Roberts, 40, b abt 1866, > departed 17 July 1906 from Liverpool to New York on the Carmania. > > The other son is George J ROBERTS b abt 1871, 35 from Liverpool to New > York on Etruria departed 1 Dec 1907. > > Would they get the same ship to Rio, are they stopping of at New York? > Goodness knows why Emma decided to go to Rio? > > I have used the shipping lists before, but any pointers about how to try > and trace this families massive journey to Rio would be appreciated. > > Thomas and Emma had 10 children, the parents and 8 children appear on 1891 > census at 13 Raymond Road, St Stephen, West Ham, London RG12/1329. > Previous census returns they have been at Leytonstone and West Home, both > Essex I believe. Several children were born in Plaistow, Essex. > > I have a catalogue for the house sale, they had 7 bedrooms, and the items > for sale run to 9 pages. Presume the money they raised would pay fares, > but so far I cannot find the family travelling together. > > Thomas is found in1911 at 26 Roman Road East Ham, lodging with the SNEATH > family, George is 70 at this time. > > Pat in Lincolnshire