Hi Jenny, ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Tutty" <johntutty@unwired.com.au>. >SNIP< > I will reply to you all off List. Sometimes it is better to hit the reply button on your email programme, and snip the inessential parts of the earleir messages, so that listers can follow what's happening. Otherwise, for, as you say, this list is very helpful, several listers may go over the same ground. > > To update, I have all the bones of William Hyde KNAPP > born Hoxton 17 Aug 1816; baptised 2 Oct 1816 > St Leonard's Shoreditch; died 13 Aug 1892 Hackney > Union Infirmary. I have his marriage to Susannah Wilson > 14 Dec 1836 St John Eltham Kent and a list of his nine > children. When the third child Arthur Wilson KNAPP was > born the family was in 17Gloucester Row Gloucester Street > Hoxton. > SNIP<> > Thank you so much List > Jenny (Australia) and, from your other message today: > As far as bones go I am only missing where he > is buried, did the infirmary bury their dead in a > graveyard attached to the institution? Unlikly, I think. Would have used the parish churchyard until closure around 1854 [metropolitan workhouses] then location would vary from workhouse to workhouse. But remember, William was in as a patient, not necessarily an inmate, and family may have arranged funeral themselves. Hackney Union records will probably be at the LMA: Peter Higginbotham's workhouses site: http://www.workhouses.org.uk/ will help you here. > > As I mentioned in my last message to the List, I > have not looked, in detail, at any other generation > for fear of becoming muddled. The census list > for William KNAPP that you sent to me, I > have now ascertained, that we are looking at > William Hyde's first born child William born c 1838. > Not William Hyde the father. On the evidence you have posted, I am not convinced that William Hyde KNAPP dying in 1892 in the Infirmary is the father. Although I am keeping an open mind, I think it may well be the son. These are the William KNAPPs around in Middlesex in 1841, besides "your" Will KNAPP: [posted off-list].> > You have now opened a Jack in the Box as I have > not gone this far with my research. My line comes > from his brother Arthur who you mention in the 1841 > census. So I now know that hard times have fallen on > William Hyde's son William and that he followed in his father's > footsteps. > > William Hyde KNAPP married Susannah WILSON in > Kent and so William born c 1838 stating his birth place > as Kent would seem correct. Another son George > was born c1839 Finsbury and then the next born > Arthur Wilson KNAPP was born 24 Aug 1840 Hoxton. > > I found very puzzling, your following information , > "However, the William KNAPP in the Infirmary appears to be > also there as a patient in 1891, a House Decorator age 53, > giving a birth of 1838, born Hackney." This seems to be a > mixture of William HYDE and William Jr. The Infirmary records, if they have survived, will throw light on the William KNAPP theer during the 1891 census and the one dying there in 1892. > > John I can't imagine how you managed to obtain so much > information I will send separately off list the details of the the Hoxton family through the censuses. But you really need to look at the images. 1881 ttranscription is free at Familysearch; you reaally need to subscribe to one of the online sites to aid your research, especially from Australia. FreeBMD, of course, will get you index details of BMDs, which you can use to order certificates online from the GRO. Tracking the information on the London/Middlesex KNAPPs through the censuses will enable you to built up a picture of how the various KNAPP families do [or don't!] fit together, and hopefully resolve your confusions :-) As Hoxton/Haggerston [areas of Shoreditch on the borders with Hackney] are in the London/Middlesex area, it might be good for you to join the Middlesex and/or the London lists. HTH John