Many thanks to John, Mike & Jane For their help with Wm Thomas Fuller, this list has come up with the goods once again. You are a wonderful bunch of detectives. Regards Sheila

I found this extract about Uplands on Wikipedia which would appear to cover the 1890's. "One of the earliest presidents of the Loughton Cricket Club was Julius Rohrweger, a local German extraction who owned Uplands, a large house adjacent to the cricket ground. As he was politically a Liberal, the local Conservative party created and supported for some time a rival team, the Loughton Park Cricket Club, though this no longer exists." -----Original Message----- From: Bev Harsh Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 6:32 PM To: ESSEX-UK-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Ess] "Uplands" Loughton Hello List! Would anyone have any information on this as a convalescent home c1891-1900? I know that Miss Lobb was its head, and have found various ads in connection with it in British Newspaper Archive. There may have been a connection with Dr Barnardo, as in 1895 there was a sale of work "the fifth annual" in the Public Hall, opened "in the absence of Dr Barnardo". Any idea if any Dr Barnardo records for the period exist? All info gratefully received!! Thanks Bev ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello List! Would anyone have any information on this as a convalescent home c1891-1900? I know that Miss Lobb was its head, and have found various ads in connection with it in British Newspaper Archive. There may have been a connection with Dr Barnardo, as in 1895 there was a sale of work "the fifth annual" in the Public Hall, opened "in the absence of Dr Barnardo". Any idea if any Dr Barnardo records for the period exist? All info gratefully received!! Thanks Bev

Hello List! Would anyone have any information on this house c1891? Miss Lobb had a convalescent home there briefly, which then moved to "Uplands" Loughton.."Hillside" address appeared in two small ads in newspaper so I am confident that this is correct, else replies would not have reached her! In 1891 census there is a "Hillside" which is uninhabited, this fits datewise. Thanks Bev

Stisted, D/P 49/1/5 12 May 1774 baptised John BINGHAM aged 74. Hope this may help someone. Glyn

Hi Sheila There is nothing in the Loughton records for him - I have looked 1807-1814. However, I searched on Free-reg and it gave me an idea because it showed James Fuller 15/5/1808 Helena Fuller 9/8/1812 Rosetta Fuller 11/1/1807 Rebekah Fuller 10/10/1802 William Fuller 29/1/1804 Eliza Fuller 7/7/1805 All are children of William and Anne Fuller of Latton, which is in Harlow. I then went onto the SEAX website and looked at the original records, and found another baptism for Thomas Fuller 30/7/1809 There are no burials for any of these, so I am still not sure whether William or Thomas are the ones you are looking for, but I hope this helps. Kind regards Jane

I am looking for the Bapt. of William Thomas Fuller born Abt. 1811 In 1871 he said, Born Loughton Essex and aged 60. RG10 1329 living Civil Parish of Willesden, Town of Kilburn, 27 Denmark Rd. sorry I have no more detail readable on my photo copy. In 1861 he said he was born Harlow, I have looked at a film at LDS but it didn't cover 1811, I understand that records for about this time are missing. Is there anywhere on Line I can look at Loughton records? or can anyone possible do a look up for me please? Regards Sheila NSW

Thanks Penny will do so after our move! Bits are put away at the moment so I don't digress. Ingrid -----Original Message----- From: essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Penny Courtney Sent: 13 January 2013 10:26 PM To: essex-uk@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [Ess] ESSEX-UK Digest, Vol 8, Issue 10 - Royal Mint The Royal Mint records are at Kew. Search the web site http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ Penny, Hampshire UK ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The Royal Mint records are at Kew. Search the web site http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ Penny, Hampshire UK

Bank notes are printed at the Bank of England printing works in Debden - I don't think that coins were ever minted in Debden - they were at Tower Hill before they moved to Llantrisant. -----Original Message----- From: Jackie Tatam Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2013 2:35 PM To: srmenglish1@gmail.com ; Essex List Subject: Re: [Ess] Royal Mint I think the Royal Mint was in Debden near Loughton, Essex before it moved to Wales. About 30-40 years ago. Essex Record Office might be able to help.Jackie Tatam > Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2013 08:15:45 -0500 > From: srmenglish1@gmail.com > To: essex-uk@rootsweb.com > Subject: [Ess] Royal Mint > > I have recently discovered an engraver in my Essex research to my family > circa 1755. Any suggestions where to look for indentured service for > engravers? Google does not show me much. I think there might be a > worshipful company of engravers but I might be looking for the wrong > "title". I thought there was a Royal Mint archive but no luck so far. > > All help and direction appreciated. > > Many thanks > > Shirley O'Donnell > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I think the Royal Mint was in Debden near Loughton, Essex before it moved to Wales. About 30-40 years ago. Essex Record Office might be able to help.Jackie Tatam > Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2013 08:15:45 -0500 > From: srmenglish1@gmail.com > To: essex-uk@rootsweb.com > Subject: [Ess] Royal Mint > > I have recently discovered an engraver in my Essex research to my family > circa 1755. Any suggestions where to look for indentured service for > engravers? Google does not show me much. I think there might be a > worshipful company of engravers but I might be looking for the wrong > "title". I thought there was a Royal Mint archive but no luck so far. > > All help and direction appreciated. > > Many thanks > > Shirley O'Donnell > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Shirley, My husband's family (BUSHER) worked at the Royal Mint and as you say there is no archive there. Was told that there is now being made in Wales or something there but not holding out much hope. There is no harm in contacting the Worshipful Company of Engravers they may be able to give you a further link. Sorry to be no more help though. Happy hunting. Ingrid Billings -----Original Message----- From: essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Shirley O'Donnell Sent: 12 January 2013 1:16 PM To: essex-uk@rootsweb.com Subject: [Ess] Royal Mint I have recently discovered an engraver in my Essex research to my family circa 1755. Any suggestions where to look for indentured service for engravers? Google does not show me much. I think there might be a worshipful company of engravers but I might be looking for the wrong "title". I thought there was a Royal Mint archive but no luck so far. All help and direction appreciated. Many thanks Shirley O'Donnell ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Many thanks to the people who sent me useful suggestions about the Sayers brothers sentence, what a helpful and knowledgeable lot Essex listers are! I will keep chasing this one, and let you know if I find out more.

I have recently discovered an engraver in my Essex research to my family circa 1755. Any suggestions where to look for indentured service for engravers? Google does not show me much. I think there might be a worshipful company of engravers but I might be looking for the wrong "title". I thought there was a Royal Mint archive but no luck so far. All help and direction appreciated. Many thanks Shirley O'Donnell

Hi Patsy, A little while ago, the Essex Society for Family History published a list of Essex men who were punished by transportation, and it could be within your time-frame. If anyone has a copy, perhaps they could look it up for you. Sadly, although I've searched everywhere, I can't locate my own copy (which I kept), and fear I may yet again be the victim of my own filing system! Failing that, the ESFH have a research centre within the Essex Record Office, Wharf Road, Chelmsford (used to be open Wed. 1-4 pm and Thurs 10am to 1pm, but check with them) or e-mail at:* **office@esfh.org.uk*<office@esfh.org.uk> *,* they may be able to send you a copy, or do a look-up for you. I don't know where you are, but there is a direct phone line (or was): 01245 244670 Hope this may help you. Regards, Chris Colchester

Hello I had a similar situation some years ago with an ancestor from Worcestershire sentenced to transportation in 1838 who was clearly back in England by 1845 as a marriage record for him proves. It transpired that he was not sent to Australia but to Bermuda where labourers were needed to build a naval dockyard. See http://www.bermuda-online.org/rnd.htm If this turns out to be where they went I have other links that may be of interest. Dick Mathews On 11/01/2013 11:33, patsypilgrim wrote: > A very Happy New Year to all. I hope someone out there with more > experience than I have can give me some advice here. > > In 1842 my 4 x gt-grandfather William Sayers (born c1794)and his brother > John (born c 1802)were sentenced to 10 and 7 years transportation > respectively for stealing fleeces from Willliam's employer in > Chelmsford.I have found them on the hulk Leviathan in Portsmouth, > presumably awaiting transportation. However after that I can't find any > trace of them until the 1851 census, when they are back in Chelmsford. > They have apparently resumed their lives as normal, except that > unsurprisingly William is now described as a labourer, not a > fellmonger's labourer as in 1841. > > I have found a lot of online resources for convicts in Australia, but > even allowing for the variations in the possible spellings of Sayers I > can't see them. I've considered the possibility that I'm chasing the > wrong William Sayers, but I can't find another who fits the bill. Can > sks suggest where to go next? > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Shirley, Many of us in the UK have free online access 24/7 to the British Library's 19th Century Newspapers database (provided by Gale Cengage), through membership of our county or borough library. You simply use the barcode number on your library membership card to log on from home. In addition, there is the British Newspaper Archive -- a much more comprehensive online resource (from brightsolid), which will eventually hold the entire Newspaper Collection at the British Library. Searches and thumbnail results are free, images require a subscription (several different packages available). http://www.britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk/ HTH Judy London, UK -----Original Message----- From: Shirley O'Donnell [mailto:srmenglish1@gmail.com] Can we access these Criminal newspaper articles online? On Jan 11, 2013, at 8:25 AM, Judy Lester <jlester@btinternet.com> wrote: > I'm also sending you offlist a report of the committal proceedings from > the Essex Standard (14 Oct 1842). This refers to the men's occupations, > and it may help you determine whether they are yours.

Patsy, I'm also sending you offlist a report of the committal proceedings from the Essex Standard (14 Oct 1842). This refers to the men's occupations, and it may help you determine whether they are yours. HTH Judy London, UK -----Original Message----- From: essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of patsypilgrim I've considered the possibility that I'm chasing the wrong William Sayers, but I can't find another who fits the bill. Can sks suggest where to go next?

Patsy, To help determine whether these two convict SAYERS are yours, it might be helpful to find out what happened to them. If you can't find them in Australian databases (and, after only a brief look, I couldn't either), it may be because they were pardoned, or their sentences commuted. Transportation was seriously winding down by the early 1840s. A licensing system was introduced in the 1850s, but in the interim convicts could be kept hanging around in the hulks for years until the politicians reached agreement about what was going to happen to them. Eventually some were transferred to other prisons, and others were released. The relevant hulk register for Leviathan at Portsmouth (HO 9/14, available via Ancestry) shows that these men were transferred from there to the prison hulk Stirling Castle on 31 Oct 1844 (HO 9/14). Stirling Castle was previously at Devonport, but by late 1844 I believe it had been moved to Portsmouth. To pursue this in more detail you would need to visit the National Archives, Kew, or have someone go on your behalf. You would need to look at the registers of prisoners for Stirling Castle at the appropriate date (PCOM 2/134), which should show if/when these men were discharged. To find out whether they were pardoned or their sentences commuted, the Correspondence and Warrants in HO 13 could also be checked from October 1844 (piece HO 13/85 onwards), as well as the Criminal Petitions in HO 18 (indexed in HO 19). If you don't have access to Kew, or don't want to commission paid research, there may be LDS films of PCOM 2 (though I think not of HO 18). So you may be able to hire some films and look through them yourself at a local Family History Centre. HTH Judy London, UK -----Original Message----- From: essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of patsypilgrim In 1842 my 4 x gt-grandfather William Sayers (born c1794)and his brother John (born c 1802)were sentenced to 10 and 7 years transportation respectively for stealing fleeces from Willliam's employer in Chelmsford.I have found them on the hulk Leviathan in Portsmouth, presumably awaiting transportation. However after that I can't find any trace of them until the 1851 census, when they are back in Chelmsford. They have apparently resumed their lives as normal, except that unsurprisingly William is now described as a labourer, not a fellmonger's labourer as in 1841. I have found a lot of online resources for convicts in Australia, but even allowing for the variations in the possible spellings of Sayers I can't see them. I've considered the possibility that I'm chasing the wrong William Sayers, but I can't find another who fits the bill. Can sks suggest where to go next?

A very Happy New Year to all. I hope someone out there with more experience than I have can give me some advice here. In 1842 my 4 x gt-grandfather William Sayers (born c1794)and his brother John (born c 1802)were sentenced to 10 and 7 years transportation respectively for stealing fleeces from Willliam's employer in Chelmsford.I have found them on the hulk Leviathan in Portsmouth, presumably awaiting transportation. However after that I can't find any trace of them until the 1851 census, when they are back in Chelmsford. They have apparently resumed their lives as normal, except that unsurprisingly William is now described as a labourer, not a fellmonger's labourer as in 1841. I have found a lot of online resources for convicts in Australia, but even allowing for the variations in the possible spellings of Sayers I can't see them. I've considered the possibility that I'm chasing the wrong William Sayers, but I can't find another who fits the bill. Can sks suggest where to go next?