Well done for alerting us all to this, Dick I couldn't agree more with your conclusions, and as you say, the way forward is probably a mass-extraction exercise. It occurred to me that if James jnr was born c.1801, it would have been before his parents married (1803). If this is the case, 1. the vicar probably refused to christen a bastard; 2. he seems to have been loved by his parents regardless, and brought up as if born during their marriage. Still a bit curious that they christened later offspring but never, apparently, him. My grandad always believed he had been born the eldest of 13 children during his parents' marriage, in 1906. During WW2 he had to apply for the first ever time for his birth certificate, and was profoundly shocked and upset to the core to find out that they married in 1907 - after he was born. He never got over that to his dying day, to the extent of disowning his father. Though to be fair, the fact that his father had two families on the go at the same time, and ran off to the other lot (at Moreton) when he got found out, also probably had an influence on these matters! Lawrence. On 13/04/2013 15:53, Dick Mathews wrote: > On 13/04/2013 David Moss wrote > > > Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same > > problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 > > registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave > > marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date > would be > > 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). After > > looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth > > certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So > > frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of > > information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must > have his > > birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any > > advice?" > > And on 13/04/2013 Caroline Bradford, Mike Fry, Lawrence Greenall, > Suffolk Sue and Dave Dobbin wrote variously in reply. > > From time to time requests for assistance on this list engage my > attention, and often require considerable time and effort to respond. > I'm sure the same is true for some other longstanding listers. > It is therefore more than somewhat irritating to see the original > enquirer posting substantially similar queries, especially when the > earlier work is not quoted, causing people to duplicate effort. > > David Moss and I were in extensive correspondence in 2008, and in May > last year I posted the information below in response to a query from > David when he wrote > " James Moss b1801 in "Hatfield" (he says on the 1851 Rochford census) > d1859 Great Stambridge. Have had ERO check all three Hatfields for his > birth/christening with no success. They also checked surrounding > parishes with no success. Does anybody have any information on his > birth/christening or can suggest alternate sources of this information?" > > Quote > About three years ago I was involved in protracted research for and > correspondence with David Moss about the origins of his ancestor James. > > I thought we had established the following facts about James, who died > on 20 Oct. 1859 and was buried at Gt. Stambridge (where his tombstone > shows his > age as 58, as does the burial register). > > James was the son of James Moss, a farmer, according to his second > marriage on 30 Nov 1838 at Rochford to Maria Peters, who was born about > 1820. His > first wife was Lucy, the widow of a Mr. Wright. She was buried 6 Jun > 1837 at Rochford aged 46. James and Lucy were married at Runwell on 11 > Nov 1823. So > James first married a woman some ten years his senior, and then one > about half his age! > > James’ second marriage was witnessed by Benjamin and Sarah Moss, who > were farming at Barstable Hall in 1841; Benjamin was baptized at Gt > Totham on 18 > Nov 1804. His parents were James Moss and Martha Nunn, who were married > 6 Oct 1803 at Gt Totham; both had been married before. The father James had > (probably) previously married Sarah Chad on 7 May 1799 at Hatfield > Peverel, and it seemed reasonable to assume that the James who died in > 1859 was their > son, although he wasn’t baptized there. > > There are quite a number of entries in the years before and just after > 1800 for what appear to be several Moss families in Little Braxted, > despite it > being described in White’s 1848 directory as “a small parish, on the > east side of the river Blackwater, one mile east of Witham, containing > only 126 > inhabitants, 563 acres of land, a few scattered houses and cottages, and > a water mill”. The Braxteds adjoin Gt Totham parish, and all three are > near to > Hatfield Peverel (where there are quite a number of entries). But the > Familysearch entry can’t be ‘our’ James if the father’s name on the 1828 > marriage is correct. By 1841 no one named Moss lived in either Little or > Great Braxted. > > James’ marriage to Lucy Wright at Runwell was witnessed by Susan Sains, > and it seems likely she is the person who married Thomas Moss there in > 1830. And > it seems likely that it was this Thomas who witnessed the marriage of > Benjamin Moss and Sarah Stock at Fobbing in 1829 (who are presumably the > witnesses to James’ second marriage in 1838). > > My gut feeling is that the Moss line is centered around the parishes to > the south of Witham (the Tothams, Braxteds, Hatfield Peverel etc.) at > around the > turn of the 18th century, and there was a drift to the southwest over > the years. Certainly by the mid 19th century several of them were doing > quite > well. I suspect the widow Lucy Wright was either already related in some > way to James’ family, or she was the legatee of her late husband's > property. And I think it's also clear that James, Benjamin, and Thomas > are all related, and may well be brothers - although James almost > certainly is > Benjamin's half brother. > > What needs to be done next in my view is to extract all of the Moss and > related entries for the parishes where relevant records have already been > found so as to piece a much larger tree together to prove where James > fits in to it. I’d also look at wills and leases and farm accounts at > the Essex > Record Office – although this won’t be easy for David as he is in Canada. > End Quote > > If anyone wishes to assist David further, they might find the above > synopsis useful, and if they would like further details they can contact > me via the list. > > Dick Mathews > in Southend on Sea > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

A Big Thankyou to all those listers who responded to my request, gave me lots of food for thought and persuaded me that there is a lot of research needed by me to get over this block! I live in Canada (so cannot vist ERO) and don't have a lot of time to devote to genealogy. I can assure Dick Mathews that I did not wish to be "more than somewhat irritating" and also assure him that his comprehensive information in the past has been most helpful. Thankyou all for your time and assistance. Dave Moss.

On 13/04/2013 David Moss wrote > Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same > problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 > registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave > marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would be > 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). After > looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth > certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So > frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of > information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have his > birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any > advice?" And on 13/04/2013 Caroline Bradford, Mike Fry, Lawrence Greenall, Suffolk Sue and Dave Dobbin wrote variously in reply. From time to time requests for assistance on this list engage my attention, and often require considerable time and effort to respond. I'm sure the same is true for some other longstanding listers. It is therefore more than somewhat irritating to see the original enquirer posting substantially similar queries, especially when the earlier work is not quoted, causing people to duplicate effort. David Moss and I were in extensive correspondence in 2008, and in May last year I posted the information below in response to a query from David when he wrote " James Moss b1801 in "Hatfield" (he says on the 1851 Rochford census) d1859 Great Stambridge. Have had ERO check all three Hatfields for his birth/christening with no success. They also checked surrounding parishes with no success. Does anybody have any information on his birth/christening or can suggest alternate sources of this information?" Quote About three years ago I was involved in protracted research for and correspondence with David Moss about the origins of his ancestor James. I thought we had established the following facts about James, who died on 20 Oct. 1859 and was buried at Gt. Stambridge (where his tombstone shows his age as 58, as does the burial register). James was the son of James Moss, a farmer, according to his second marriage on 30 Nov 1838 at Rochford to Maria Peters, who was born about 1820. His first wife was Lucy, the widow of a Mr. Wright. She was buried 6 Jun 1837 at Rochford aged 46. James and Lucy were married at Runwell on 11 Nov 1823. So James first married a woman some ten years his senior, and then one about half his age! James’ second marriage was witnessed by Benjamin and Sarah Moss, who were farming at Barstable Hall in 1841; Benjamin was baptized at Gt Totham on 18 Nov 1804. His parents were James Moss and Martha Nunn, who were married 6 Oct 1803 at Gt Totham; both had been married before. The father James had (probably) previously married Sarah Chad on 7 May 1799 at Hatfield Peverel, and it seemed reasonable to assume that the James who died in 1859 was their son, although he wasn’t baptized there. There are quite a number of entries in the years before and just after 1800 for what appear to be several Moss families in Little Braxted, despite it being described in White’s 1848 directory as “a small parish, on the east side of the river Blackwater, one mile east of Witham, containing only 126 inhabitants, 563 acres of land, a few scattered houses and cottages, and a water mill”. The Braxteds adjoin Gt Totham parish, and all three are near to Hatfield Peverel (where there are quite a number of entries). But the Familysearch entry can’t be ‘our’ James if the father’s name on the 1828 marriage is correct. By 1841 no one named Moss lived in either Little or Great Braxted. James’ marriage to Lucy Wright at Runwell was witnessed by Susan Sains, and it seems likely she is the person who married Thomas Moss there in 1830. And it seems likely that it was this Thomas who witnessed the marriage of Benjamin Moss and Sarah Stock at Fobbing in 1829 (who are presumably the witnesses to James’ second marriage in 1838). My gut feeling is that the Moss line is centered around the parishes to the south of Witham (the Tothams, Braxteds, Hatfield Peverel etc.) at around the turn of the 18th century, and there was a drift to the southwest over the years. Certainly by the mid 19th century several of them were doing quite well. I suspect the widow Lucy Wright was either already related in some way to James’ family, or she was the legatee of her late husband's property. And I think it's also clear that James, Benjamin, and Thomas are all related, and may well be brothers - although James almost certainly is Benjamin's half brother. What needs to be done next in my view is to extract all of the Moss and related entries for the parishes where relevant records have already been found so as to piece a much larger tree together to prove where James fits in to it. I’d also look at wills and leases and farm accounts at the Essex Record Office – although this won’t be easy for David as he is in Canada. End Quote If anyone wishes to assist David further, they might find the above synopsis useful, and if they would like further details they can contact me via the list. Dick Mathews in Southend on Sea

To anyone interested.   James Moss married  Maria Peters in Rochford on November 20th, 1838. He was a widower. The witnesses were a Benjamin and Sarah Moss. In 1851 there is a Benjamin born c1806 in Gt. Totham who could be him. The baptism of Benjamin in Gt Totham was 18th November,1804 to a James and Martha. Maybe this Benjamin is James' brother. James Moss,widower married Martha Nunn,widow in Gt. Totham 6th October, 1803.         --- On Sat, 13/4/13, david moss <mossdavid1@gmail.com> wrote: From: david moss <mossdavid1@gmail.com> Subject: [Ess] Moss of Hatfield Peverel To: "Essex mailing list" <essex-uk@rootsweb.com> Date: Saturday, 13 April, 2013, 2:05 Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same problem.  James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would be 1801.  Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel).  After looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress.  So frustrating!  Please, can anyone help?  I have received a lot of information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have his birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork.  Anyone with any advice? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

On 2013/04/13 09:22, Caroline Bradford wrote: > Birth certificates did not exist until 1 July 1837. For ancestors born before > that date you will have to rely on an entry in a baptismal register which may > or may not show his actual date of birth. Did James marry? If so, you can > get his father's name from his marriage certificate. Then you need to head > off to SEAX, the online arm of the ERO, where for a small fee you can browse > the relevant registers. All good advice. However. Just a note of caution. Given the time period concerned, it is more than likely that any marriage took place before July 1837. In which case, the OP has the same problem as he has with the birth certificate. Also, and I think this is right, fathers names and occupations don't appear in parish registers until the advent of Civil Registration in 1837. -- Regards, Mike Fry Johannesburg

And don't assume that 1801 is correct. One relative could have provided his age both for the death certificate and for the memorial, and they could have been suffering from 'human error' - a disease that was rife in those days, and even with modern medicine, still is today. Once you've followed Caroline's advice and visited SEAX, do a thorough study of all entries for people of the same surname over say 20 years either side of 1800, and build up a picture of all their relationships, enabling you to see if there was only one family of that name there at that time, or if there was more than one family. In which case you'll need to research all of them to be sure of which one your man belonged to. Don't forget that not everyone was christened where they were born. Hatfield Pev is in a charming part of Essex (once you get away from the A12). I often have to drive my truck through thereabouts to collect Shaken Udder yoghurts from Wicks Manor Farm in Tolleshunt Major. Some drive! All the piggy-wiggys start chattering when I arrive, and snuffle up to me. I then have to change my clothes. No, the yoghurt is not made from pigs' milk. Neither are the famous Wicks Manor sausages. Lawrence On 13/04/2013 02:05, david moss wrote: > Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same > problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 > registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave > marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would be > 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). After > looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth > certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So > frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of > information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have his > birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any > advice? > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > . >

Good point about the marriage, Mike. I had meant to write "Did James marry after 1July 1837". Caroline Sent from my iPad On 13 Apr 2013, at 09:14, Mike Fry <fredbonzo@iafrica.com> wrote: > On 2013/04/13 09:22, Caroline Bradford wrote: > >> Birth certificates did not exist until 1 July 1837. For ancestors born before >> that date you will have to rely on an entry in a baptismal register which may >> or may not show his actual date of birth. Did James marry? If so, you can >> get his father's name from his marriage certificate. Then you need to head >> off to SEAX, the online arm of the ERO, where for a small fee you can browse >> the relevant registers. > > All good advice. However. Just a note of caution. Given the time period > concerned, it is more than likely that any marriage took place before July 1837. > In which case, the OP has the same problem as he has with the birth certificate. > Also, and I think this is right, fathers names and occupations don't appear in > parish registers until the advent of Civil Registration in 1837. > > -- > Regards, > Mike Fry > Johannesburg > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks Lawrence, for your sage advice and personal interjections. I treasure childhood memories of my father and I accompanying a lorry driver friend of his, early in the morning. We went from farm to farm in south-eastern Essex, collecting churns of milk, . I did not hear of yoghurt, let alone taste it, until many years later, although I understand that it was first commercially produced in Europe in 1919 - but ,I digress..... Peter Moll Tortola, BVI On 13 April 2013 04:43, La Greenall <eldeworth@googlemail.com> wrote: > And don't assume that 1801 is correct. One relative could have provided > his age both for the death certificate and for the memorial, and they > could have been suffering from 'human error' - a disease that was rife > in those days, and even with modern medicine, still is today. > > Once you've followed Caroline's advice and visited SEAX, do a thorough > study of all entries for people of the same surname over say 20 years > either side of 1800, and build up a picture of all their relationships, > enabling you to see if there was only one family of that name there at > that time, or if there was more than one family. In which case you'll > need to research all of them to be sure of which one your man belonged to. > > Don't forget that not everyone was christened where they were born. > > Hatfield Pev is in a charming part of Essex (once you get away from the > A12). I often have to drive my truck through thereabouts to collect > Shaken Udder yoghurts from Wicks Manor Farm in Tolleshunt Major. Some > drive! All the piggy-wiggys start chattering when I arrive, and snuffle > up to me. I then have to change my clothes. No, the yoghurt is not made > from pigs' milk. Neither are the famous Wicks Manor sausages. > > Lawrence > > > > On 13/04/2013 02:05, david moss wrote: > > Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same > > problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 > > registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave > > marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would > be > > 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). > After > > looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth > > certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So > > frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of > > information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have > his > > birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any > > advice? > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > . > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

The obvious statement is that you will not find his 'birth certificate' as these were not introduced until 1837 - your best hope is a record of his baptism. The problem here is that there has never been a 'legal' requirement to have a child baptised and many families didn't bother.especially if they were Baptists or Quakers who do not practice infant baptism. On top of this, if they had the child baptised at a parish church this doesn't necessarily happen at the parish church where they lived, or within a short time of the birth. I have looked up to 1806 at the Hatfield Peverel registers and couldn't see any Moss baptised there. Many families would wait until several children were going to be baptised, then save up their money to take the whole brood to, say, the parish church of one of the grandparents or other relative and have all the baptisms at the same time. You might even find other family members baptising their children at the same time - any excuse for a party! Or they might not get on with the vicar at their local church and prefer another priest to perform the ceremony at a nearby parish. Sorry I can't be more positive, you will have to think laterally. Wher do grandparents live, where do aunts and uncles live, what parishes are round there, where did they get married, etc. You can also sign up for Essex Ancestors at http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/EssexAncestors.aspx and look at online digitised copies of the registers.There are a range of chargeable options from 1 day to 1 year (GBP5.00 to GBP 75.00) any of which may be cheaper than travelling to Chelmsford -----Original Message----- From: david.moss To: essex-uk <essex-uk@rootsweb.com> From: David Moss Sent: Fri, 12 Apr 2013 18:05:33 -0700 Subject: [Ess] Moss of Hatfield Peverel Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would be 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). After looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have his birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any advice?

Hi David Birth certificates did not exist until 1 July 1837. For ancestors born before that date you will have to rely on an entry in a baptismal register which may or may not show his actual date of birth. Did James marry? If so, you can get his father's name from his marriage certificate. Then you need to head off to SEAX, the online arm of the ERO, where for a small fee you can browse the relevant registers. Hope this helps Caroline Sent from my iPad On 13 Apr 2013, at 02:05, david moss <mossdavid1@gmail.com> wrote: > Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same > problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 > registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave > marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would be > 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). After > looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth > certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So > frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of > information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have his > birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any > advice? > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Here I am, back again after a long time and still with much the same problem. James Moss death certificate says he died 20th October 1859 registration district Rochford, aged 58 years (confirmed on his grave marker in Great Stambridge Parish churchyard) therefore birth date would be 1801. Census 1851 says he was born in Hatfield (probably Peverel). After looking everywhere I can think of, I still cannot find his birth certificate so I can get his parents and make some progress. So frustrating! Please, can anyone help? I have received a lot of information from mailing listers in the past, but I believe I must have his birth certificate in order to not continue on guesswork. Anyone with any advice?

Bert Lockwood's More of Mr Frogley's Barking on pp. 137 reads as follows; [This is the beginning of the 20C] There are two sections of this body in Barking - one is known as the Exclusive Brethren who admit only those who are in Fellowship with them to take the sacrament, and the Open Brethren whose 'table' is open to all members of any sect. Bothe sections have been in Barking many years, and the principle supporters was the Glenny Family. The Exclusive Brethren meet for worship in the upper part - now Messrs Page Calnans showroom, at the corner of Fisher Street. Under this large room was at that time a large store or coal shed, and Mr Benjamin Glenny was the owner, a builders merchant and contractor. They were an earnest body, but disputes among them continuously arose, and eventually the majority left the above building and met at the house of Mr Glenny in East Street until he left the town and the house was pulled down. In 1901 they converted a large stable or store into a meeting place and are there now [1898]. This is situated in Linton Road, and was the property of W W Glenny Esq, who was also one of their members. The Open Brethren met in a small chapel in Axe Street, and another section of the Glenny family was chief here viz Mr Edward Glenny of Byfrons. In the rear of this chapel is a small burial ground, and where several members of both sections were buried. ....The members of this body increased more so that the other (sic) section and in 1884 they built a new hall in Axe Street. It is called Park Hall and seats some 600 people. ...... ISBN 0900325968 Tony Clifford & Herbert Hope Lockwood. 2003. Published by the London Borough of Barking and Dagenham. Glynis Morris essexresearch@btopenworld.com -----Original Message----- I recently had input to our Essex OPC site with regards to Christian Brethren. Does anyone know where/if there was a gathering room for this group in Barking? We had lots of "splinter" religious groups in Barking (lots in Queens Road") but I do not recall a CB group. Thanks, Shirley in Florida

I recently had input to our Essex OPC site with regards to Christian Brethren. Does anyone know where/if there was a gathering room for this group in Barking? We had lots of "splinter" religious groups in Barking (lots in Queens Road") but I do not recall a CB group. Thanks, Shirley in Florida Sent from my iPad

Hi Pat SEAX (the online records arm of the Essex records office) has images (unindexed) of Paglesham registers. It's very reasonable at 5GBP for 24 hours. Hope this helps Caroline Sent from my iPad On 8 Apr 2013, at 21:04, Pat Cook <paver207@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > Does anybody know if the Paglesham PR's are online.? > > I am trying to research SMITH, > > The earliest I have at present is > John SMITH (X) > He marries 2 July 1783 at Paglesham Essex by Licence, he is a bachelor otp he marries Anne MIALL, I have only found one child so far > Jonathan SMITH > Bapt 27 November 1796 Paglesham, he marries Mary A .... who's surname could be SHELLEY or FULLER. Their son Jonathan SMITH b abt 1860 Dec qtr Rochford, marries Clara Caroline Keable abt 1894 > All the males for at least three generations are Oyster Dredgers. > > Paglesham is just north of Southend on Sea, lying between the Rivers Roach and Crouch. > > I am struggling to find many Paglesham entries, and cannot seem to find any on IGI or Ancestry for earlier than the 1783 marriage. > > Any suggestions where to look appreciated. > Pat in Lincolnshire > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Does anybody know if the Paglesham PR's are online.? I am trying to research SMITH, The earliest I have at present is John SMITH (X) He marries 2 July 1783 at Paglesham Essex by Licence, he is a bachelor otp he marries Anne MIALL, I have only found one child so far Jonathan SMITH Bapt 27 November 1796 Paglesham, he marries Mary A .... who's surname could be SHELLEY or FULLER. Their son Jonathan SMITH b abt 1860 Dec qtr Rochford, marries Clara Caroline Keable abt 1894 All the males for at least three generations are Oyster Dredgers. Paglesham is just north of Southend on Sea, lying between the Rivers Roach and Crouch. I am struggling to find many Paglesham entries, and cannot seem to find any on IGI or Ancestry for earlier than the 1783 marriage. Any suggestions where to look appreciated. Pat in Lincolnshire

Hello, has the "The Telegraph Pole Appreciation Society" been mentioned www.telegraphpole.org eddy in bavaria

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On 06/04/2013 11:28 PM, Adrian Gray wrote: > As they've sparked so much debate (and some very useful sounding sources to > investigate), I thought that I would post a link to the image concerned. I > will post a link to its reverse in a separate post as there are names > mentioned that someone might find in their tree - though as there's no > surnames it will take some detective work. > http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/MoorEndfromGlad001_zpse29e8b5b.jpg > Adrian > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Hi Adrian, Enlarging the image as much as I can: The two footrests on the nearest pole appear to be catching the light --new?? The second nearest pole appears to have something on the top - but it might just be a bird. There appears to be no trace of any wires. I can't help wondering if the photographer caught the view when the new poles had been put in, but before the crosspieces, insulators and wires had been added. Have you checked the on-line 'phone directories (ancestry, I think), to see when the first telephones arrived in Great Sampford - vicarage, doctor's house, and perhaps garage would be amongst the first. If there were 'phones long before the putative date of 1927, then perhaps the poles were being renewed. Kind regards, John Henley

This is the message on the postcard, written in a style James Joyce would have approved of. They might just tell someone a tale. Wed July 20th. Dear Mum I received your letter so glad to hear Daisy is home and feeling well I shall be glad to have a few lines from her. Poor old Frank I wish he could get something dont think they would pass him for the army on account of his ears. I wish he had stopped longer down here. How did he like the walk to Thaxted Station and did he have long to wait for the train. Isnt this a nice photograph that is Ernie’s fathers cottage with a cross. I got frightened with the storm Sunday night. Love to all Glad XXXXXXXXXXX Here's the original: http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww269/gray1721/MoorEndfromGladreverse_zpsd9b22e89.jpg Adrian