The Quineys wrote: > Hi Firebird > > Presumably, there was some sort of registration involved with the issue > of ration books. Do you know what 'that' process would have been called > and whether the data from it would have been kept? It would be great if > (in time, of course ;-) ) it could be made available to fill in the gap > left by the missing 1931 and 1941 censuses. There was the 1939 registration but I believe that is subject to the 100 year rule as well, as it does still exist - unless someone knows different, of course :) It isn't as comprehensive as a census because it wasn't intended for that purpose. It was used as the basis for either the NHS or NI so they will be extra careful with that even though the numbers used in the original are no longer used today.

Firebird wrote: > It's been released early because of agitation by a minority... The minority who agitated may wish to believe this, but frankly I doubt it. The National Archives was committed to ensuring that the complete census would be available in 2012. By this they meant, not just the ability of individual researchers to view the original documents at Kew, but the ability for researchers worldwide to search through and view the images. This involves a gargantuan task of scanning, transcription and indexing, which was bound to take a number of years and cost hundreds of thousands of pounds. My guess is that no company was prepared to put up the money to do the work with no prospect of a return on their investment for 4-5 years (would you, if you were in business?). So a deal was struck which allowed brightsolid (the company which owns findmypast) to release the fruits of their labours as they went on, bit by bit from 2009 until 2012 (the deadline for completion). It is a solution which makes sense for everyone. We should always remember that the oft quoted "100 year rule" under which the 1921 and subsequent censuses were conducted did not increase the level of privacy of the information provided. On the contrary - earlier censuses were undertaken under a promise of complete confidentiality, a promise which we have all been complicit in breaking for the sake of our own enjoyment of our hobby. Caroline

Hi Firebird Presumably, there was some sort of registration involved with the issue of ration books. Do you know what 'that' process would have been called and whether the data from it would have been kept? It would be great if (in time, of course ;-) ) it could be made available to fill in the gap left by the missing 1931 and 1941 censuses. Heather Firebird wrote: > The 1931 census was destroyed through war activities and the 1941 was never taken (just in case anyone was wondering about them). > >

Spring wrote: > The subject line and reference to the 100 year rule are apposite to the > news contained in the first issue of The Official 1911 Census > Newsletter, just received. There has always been the anomaly that some information is closed for 100 years (eg the census and hospital records), 70 years (eg coroners reports) whilst whilst BMD certificates are available right up until a couple of years ago and newspapers are available right up to today. > The Newsletter examines the background to the project (managed by > findmypast.com), explains why the census is being released three years > early (in batches) and discusses the new ranges of information added to > those taken in previous censuses.* *It will also the first census > scanned in colour. There's nothing in that newsletter that hasn't been made public already and has been available for some time. I was rather hoping that we'd have an up to date progress report of how far they've got. There's also no mention of the fact that the first places to be released will be the cities followed by large towns with the villages and hamlets being the last available. It's been released early because of agitation by a minority but it's the last census that can or will be made available before the 100 years is up. The 1921, 1951 and subsequent censuses will require special legislation and, much as we as genealogists and family historians might dislike it, our hobby is very low on MPs agendas, if it features at all. The 1931 census was destroyed through war activities and the 1941 was never taken (just in case anyone was wondering about them).

Hello Peter, I think that you are in danger of confusing the issue here by mentioning the early release of the 1911 census. Release of information from the 1911 census, and the fact that repositories might be sympathetic to early release of medical information under the 100 year rule, occur as a result of the Freedom of Information Act. However, there will be no early release of future census records under the same Act. The recent emails have been specifically on the subject of hospital records and should continue under the terms of the Act. It is good that there will be early access to the 1911 census for those who have the ability to pay Findmypast for the privilidge. However, we should not get too excited about the future early release of census information. For the 1921 census, and years following, the early release of information is strictly prohibited by a 1920 Act of Parliament. It is anticipated that any requests for early release of information from the 1921 and following census, quoting the Freedom of Information Act, will be met by quoting the relevant clause in the 1920 Act which expressly forbids disclosure of information under 100 years. So, I am afraid that for 1921 and the census years following, the wait is going to be as long as it has always been in the past. Regards, Mick

Dear All The subject line and reference to the 100 year rule are apposite to the news contained in the first issue of The Official 1911 Census Newsletter, just received. It encourages you to register on the 1911census.co.uk <http://email.1911census.co.uk/I?a=A9X7CkBcNXcksID8bOHHe,XhrQ> website, as " at launch and for some considerable time after, the only place to access the 1911 census online" The Newsletter examines the background to the project (managed by findmypast.com), explains why the census is being released three years early (in batches) and discusses the new ranges of information added to those taken in previous censuses.* *It will also the first census scanned in colour Since my last post, I have been delving into recently-discovered/ augmented family ties in Leyton & Leytonstone (CLEMENCE, MOLL, WOODRUFF), Waltham Holy Cross (CHALLIS, MOLL, THURLEY), Wanstead (MOLL) and West Ham (FUTCHER, MOLL) Best wishes Peter Moll Tortola, BVI Csgen50@aol.com wrote 19/10/2008: > Dans un e-mail daté du 19/10/2008 11:48:25 Romance Daylight Time, > sparrer@gmail.com a écrit : > > There's usually a 100 year closure on hospital records

Heather wrote: > I would concentrate on hospital records. The archivist at the ERO may know > if any Warley (sic) Hospital Records still exist and their location. The > Mid-Essex Heath Authority at Witham, and whatever group covers Braintree may > have librarians. The danger is that we are only 58 years after the events > and there may be a releasing date on records of, say 70 years. I am not > sure. There's usually a 100 year closure on hospital records but sometimes a direct descendent can obtain the information if there is no one in closer direct relationship still living. If the Health Authority or local archive is willing to release the information, they may insist on doing the research themselves so that other, still closed, information is not seen by the enquirer.

Dear Mick, I am afraid that your tile might be a little optimistic in respect of my reply. After the War there was often a 10 year destruction policy on Police reports, so they would probably have gone by 1960. I know of nothing in the Police Museum which would help. In theory it is possible to find reports in local newspapers of persons acting in such a manner to be arrested, but, this is wildly hit and miss. The Essex Chronicle for the period is in the Local Studies Section of Chelmsford Town library (not in the ERO) and there may be others such as the Essex Standard there. I would concentrate on hospital records. The archivist at the ERO may know if any Warley (sic) Hospital Records still exist and their location. The Mid-Essex Heath Authority at Witham, and whatever group covers Braintree may have librarians. The danger is that we are only 58 years after the events and there may be a releasing date on records of, say 70 years. I am not sure. I am sorry not to have been more helpful, but I have heard of information coming from hospitals such as Severalls at Colchester in the past. Good luck, Fred, Editor, Essex Family Historian. -----Original Message----- From: Csgen50@aol.com [mailto:Csgen50@aol.com] Sent: 18 October 2008 16:52 To: Essex-UK@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [Ess] All comes to he who waits Good afternoon everyone, In 1963 I discovered that my g.father had just died in Warely Hospital, I was 13 at the time. Since then I have been unable to find out anything at all about as to why or when he was admitted there. The only info. that I came across was from a copy of his death certificate. Until today! He was first admitted, voluntarily, in April 1949 after being detained by the police at Witham. He was then discharged, " relieved" to St. Michael's, Braintree in 1950. I am awaiting for further details as to why he was sent back to Warely and when. At least I now know something. So, in the mean time I have a few questions that I am sure someone ( Fred F? ) in this knowledgeable group can help. Are any of the police records available that I might access to find out more about why he was detained by the police and if there is any info. as to why he was in Witham when he lived in Waltham Abbey? What was the local paper for Witham at this time to see if the are any reports of his detention? Were there lists of missing persons then to see if his wife, or any of his family, had reported him missing from home? Any help would be much appreciated, even after 45 year of waiting. Regards, Mick.

Dans un e-mail daté du 19/10/2008 11:48:25 Romance Daylight Time, sparrer@gmail.com a écrit : There's usually a 100 year closure on hospital records but sometimes a direct descendent can obtain the information if there is no one in closer direct relationship still living. If the Health Authority or local archive is willing to release the information, they may insist on doing the research themselves so that other, still closed, information is not seen by the enquirer. This is quite correct. I contacted the ERO and they have been very helpful and quick with their responses. The form that I had to fill in was asking only the obvious questions, such as sources of my information, and proof of my relationship. Oddly though I have never received Heather's mail to which the above was a response. Thanks also to Sue, who pointed out my spellling mistake of Warley Hospital. Regards, Mick.

Can someone please tell me if a birth in Warley would be registered in Rochford in 1843. Many thanks, Jan. Message has been scanned by Webshield

Many thanks to all who gave me advice on the above. Jan. Message has been scanned by Webshield

Good afternoon everyone, In 1963 I discovered that my g.father had just died in Warely Hospital, I was 13 at the time. Since then I have been unable to find out anything at all about as to why or when he was admitted there. The only info. that I came across was from a copy of his death certificate. Until today! He was first admitted, voluntarily, in April 1949 after being detained by the police at Witham. He was then discharged, " relieved" to St. Michael's, Braintree in 1950. I am awaiting for further details as to why he was sent back to Warely and when. At least I now know something. So, in the mean time I have a few questions that I am sure someone ( Fred F? ) in this knowledgeable group can help. Are any of the police records available that I might access to find out more about why he was detained by the police and if there is any info. as to why he was in Witham when he lived in Waltham Abbey? What was the local paper for Witham at this time to see if the are any reports of his detention? Were there lists of missing persons then to see if his wife, or any of his family, had reported him mising from home? Any help would be much appreciated, even after 45 year of waiting. Regards, Mick.

Daphne http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/%5CLogin.asp?Start=False&ERO=2 Log on as a Guest then select Quick Find Registers from the right hand menu. If you find a suitable PR then you can order a fiche. Andy -----Original Message----- From: John Scott [mailto:jaydeescott@xtra.co.nz] Sent: 17 October 2008 02:02 To: essex-uk@rootsweb.com Subject: [Ess] BILLERICAY Hi List, I have just rejoined as I am trying to help a friend who is looking for a baptism of a WILLIAM CHAMBERLAIN siad to be in Billericay around 1619 are there any parish records for this time frame ? no sign in the LDS Library lists. Thanks for any help. Daphne New Zealand.

Jenny, I have paid them to find a grave for me and it was worthwhile. The Cemetery has about 150,000 burials and it has been sadly neglected. To see the graves you need to take clippers and cut your way in. There are small trees, brambles and weeds growing everywhere. So much so that it is a wonderful nature reserve in the middle of a built up area. To find a grave it is best to use a guide as there are no clear markers The numbers on the website are not grave numbers so they do not tell you the grave location. It is only the staff there who can tell you that unless you visit and personally check their records Do not pay for more than one name at a time. This cemetery allowed up to six burials in the same plot (I think it was 6) and the quantity was decided when the plot was bought. The research will tell you for example that a husband and wife and some of their children are buried there and this is particularly common with spinster daughters (in my family in any case). As you can imagine some of the combinations are surprising. I believe that they will take a photo for you and email it. If you are visiting and like graveyards, this one is special. As I expect you know there are an enormous number of non-conformists buried there If you wish to see a couple of photos I will send them off list Michael Allbrook -----Original Message----- From: essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:essex-uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jenny T Sent: 18 October 2008 04:36 To: Essex-UK@rootsweb.com Subject: [Ess] Abney Park Cemetery KNAPP Hello List I am trying to add some leaves to my branches and as I know that two of my ancesters, maybe more, are buried in Abney Park Cemetery I jumped onto their website and found four out of a possible nine. Has anyone paid and used their service and was it worthwhile? My other thought is that maybe there is someone SKS out there that could take a snap of the headstone and inscription. I don't mind at all if I have to pay a fee. In fact I would like to. KNAPP George, 07 Jan 1865, Section G02, Index 1S12 KNAPP Louisa Morton, 10 Aug 1866, Section G02, Index 1S13 Dunn Arthur, 1886, Section G03, Index 3506 Louisa Jane DUNN, 1866, Section G02, Index 2S01 Yours in hope Jenny Australia ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1731 - Release Date: 17/10/2008 19:01

Hello List I am trying to add some leaves to my branches and as I know that two of my ancesters, maybe more, are buried in Abney Park Cemetery I jumped onto their website and found four out of a possible nine. Has anyone paid and used their service and was it worthwhile? My other thought is that maybe there is someone SKS out there that could take a snap of the headstone and inscription. I don't mind at all if I have to pay a fee. In fact I would like to. KNAPP George, 07 Jan 1865, Section G02, Index 1S12 KNAPP Louisa Morton, 10 Aug 1866, Section G02, Index 1S13 Dunn Arthur, 1886, Section G03, Index 3506 Louisa Jane DUNN, 1866, Section G02, Index 2S01 Yours in hope Jenny Australia

Can anyone confirm whether the E.R.O. is open on Saturdays, and any useful tips please as it will be my first visit. Many thanks, Jan. Message has been scanned by Webshield

Hi List, I have just rejoined as I am trying to help a friend who is looking for a baptism of a WILLIAM CHAMBERLAIN siad to be in Billericay around 1619 are there any parish records for this time frame ? no sign in the LDS Library lists. Thanks for any help. Daphne New Zealand.

I am tring to locate a birth for George Bradbrook who I believe was born around 1814 at Colchester but unfortunately I do not know his parents names. I would be very grateful for any help or advice. Thasnking you Daphne Gardiner

Hi Daphne. In the 1861 he says he was born in Great Horkesley Essex, which might give you a more exact place to look for a baptism. Name: George Bradbrook Age: 47 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1814 Relation: Head Gender: Male Where born: Great Horkesley, Essex, England Civil Parish: St Pancras Ecclesiastical parish: St Matthew County/Island: Middlesex Country: England Registration district: Pancras Sub registration district: Regents Park ED, institution, or vessel: 3 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 119 Household Members: Name Age Albert Bradbrook 12 Charlotte Bradbrook 16 George Bradbrook 47 Jane Edwards 40 Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 94; Folio: 68; Page: 20 In 1851 he is married to a Louisa, with lots of children! 1851 England Census about George Bradbrook Name: George Bradbrook Age: 37 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1814 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Louisa Gender: Male Where born: Colchester, Essex, England Civil Parish: St Pancras County/Island: Middlesex Country: England Registration district: Pancras Sub registration district: Regents Park ED, institution, or vessel: 3 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 229 Household Members: Name Age Alberts Bradbrook 2 Charlotte Bradbrook 6 Emily Bradbrook 6 Mo George Bradbrook 37 Louisa Bradbrook 36 Samuel Bradbrook 12 William Bradbrook 4 Charlotte Bright 36 Marian Bright 41 Isabella Edwards 27 Emma Watson 16 Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 1493; Folio: 85; Looks like he is just married in 1841 1841 England Census about George Bradbrook Name: George Bradbrook Age: 25 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816 Gender: Male Civil Parish: St Pancras Hundred: Ossulstone (Holborn Division) County/Island: Middlesex Country: England Registration district: St Pancras Sub registration district: Regents Park Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age George Bradbrook 25 Louisa Bradbrook 25 Samuel Bradbrook 2 His marriage cert to Louisa, if it is after mid 1837 will give you his fathers name. HTH Anne On 17 Oct 2008, at 04:46, daphne gardiner wrote: > > I am tring to locate a birth for George Bradbrook who I believe was > born around 1814 at Colchester but unfortunately I do not know his > parents names. I would be very grateful for any help or advice. > Thasnking you > > Daphne Gardiner > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: Essex-UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ESSEX-UK-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

Hello All. I have just uploaded the huge 1801 map of Kent, being the first ever published Ordnance Survey map. It is a beautiful and highly detailed map. Take a look at: An Entirely New & Accurate Survey Of The County Of Kent, With Part Of The County Of Essex, by William Mudge, 1801. http://archivemaps.com/mapco/kent1801/kent1801.htm I hope that you find this map of interest and use. Enjoy this beautiful map! In coming weeks I will be displaying 2 maps of London, being: 1775 - Carington Bowles Bowles's Reduced New Pocket Plan Of The Cities Of London And Westminster With The Borough Of Southwark, Exhibiting The New Buildings To The Year 1775. Preview image on the 'News' page: http://archivemaps.com/mapco/news.htm 1814 - William Darton A New and Correct Plan of London and Westminster with the latest Improvements. Preview image here: http://archivemaps.com/mapco/preview/1814darton.htm ** Volunteers Wanted - Request For Assistance with 1801 Map of Kent ** To enable me to continue scanning maps for display I would like to ask for assistance with transcribing the place names on the 1801 Map of Kent, enabling me to display it in a useful way for users. If there are any listers who can spare some time to assist with this final part of the Kent map project it would be greatly appreciated. This will free my time to get on with the job of scanning and preparing the next maps. A transcribed section will look like this (being the Maidstone section first previewed): http://archivemaps.com/mapco/kent1801/kent16_01.htm Ideally I would like assistants to transcribe 3 images as displayed on the site, equating to one section of the actual map. I estimate this will take 30-60 minutes on average. I will give full details to any volunteers in a separate email. Please send all replies to this request off list. Thanks. All offers of assistance will be greatly appreciated!! Thank you in advance. While I appreciate this particular subject isn't genealogy in the first instance, it benefits all of our research in the long run. I am still committed to displaying a high quality map of London for every decade from 1700 to 1930, and to continuing to display as many county maps (Middlesex, Essex, Surrey & Kent) as possible. Future projects include 19th century Ordnance Survey maps and Rocque's 1746 "An Exact Survey of the City's of London, Westminster, Southwark and the Country of 10 miles round Begun in 1741 and Ended in 1745" (Scale 5.5":1 Mile). Thank you all for your continuing support for the MAPCO project. It is, and shall remain, FREE! Kind regards, David Hale, Adelaide, South Australia. MAPCO : Map And Plan Collection Online http://archivemaps.com ****************************************************