Hi Nancy, Yes, Treacle is dark molasses. The lighter coloured variety is called Golden Syrup. Light gingerbread would be made with the golden syrup, but parkin definitely calls for Black Treacle! Janice

Hello Jo, As far as I am aware, I do not have a direct link to this family but may have some data on them. Give me a day or two and I'll get back to you off list. Best wishes, Sandra > Sandra, my husband's great-grandmother was Eliza Hargreaves, daughter of > Benjamin Hargreaves, greengrocer of Holbeck Lane, Holbeck. In Jan 1862 > Eliza married Alfred Birdsell of Crooland Street, Holbeck. I believe > Eliza's mother was Catherine Jackson. Does this connect with your > Hargreaves? > > Jo Stritch > Warm sunny Texas USA > > > > > ________________________________ > From: sandra hargreaves <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Fri, November 13, 2009 5:20:05 PM > Subject: Re: [YORKSHIRE] Parkin > > Very much looking forward to seeing the parkin recipe. > > My Gran used to make the most beautiful parkin and I can still remember > how > we children loved it! I still have her parkin tin (which doubled as a > Yorkshire Pudding tin and was handed on to me by my mother), but have > never > yet made parkin in it! I will have to put that right. > > Best wishes for the fair. > > Sandra Hargreaves in Melbourne > > > > > Some useful websites - > FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ > FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > Some useful websites - > FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ > FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I can remember my Gran talking about treacle, but I honestly don't know what that is. Is it like molasses? Nancy

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: kerryfarmery Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.england.yks.general/15416.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Hi Judy thanks for getting in touch with that info I'll e-mail you shortly. Kerry xx Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: peterlockwood11 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.england.yks.general/185.1214.3374.2.2.1.3.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Frances Lockwood (1804 - 1886)was born in Skelton, Yorkshire, England. She married Joseph Kipling on 6th September 1836 in Skelton, Yorkshire. They had six children one of whom was John Lockwood Kipling (1837 - abt 1911)born Pickering, Yorkshire who was the father of Joseph Rudyard Kipling (born Bombay, India in 1865) I think that what may happen is that some people may select the first Skelton that appears on a list of place names... Regards Peter Lockwood - Lockwood One Name Study Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: colty_1 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.england.yks.general/185.1214.3374.2.2.1.3/mb.ashx Message Board Post: could anyone kindly explain the Kipling/Lockwood connection.... It seems some people have Frances Lockwood (1804-1886) as being born in Skelton Raliegh West Virginia USA, but others have her born in Skelton, Yorkshire.... can anyone kindly clarify for me which is correct. many thanks. Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

Hi, I am not Roy but we are a similar age and from the same location. Parkin was a traditional food on Bonfire night. My memories of this event were just after WW2 when we didn't have TV, listened to the radio and children roamed safely round the neighbourhood in community groups made up of all age groups hawking a "guy" they had made seeking donations towards buying fireworks. We also collected anything anyone wanted burned and made a community "bonfire", which had to be guarded against neighbouring community children. November 5th was Bonfire night - an event which dates back to the attempt by a group of people to blow up the houses of parliament. I believe Guy Fawkes was one of those and probably put to death by burning so traditionally the guy was thrown on the bonfire. (pretty gruesome). As an adult I would have to study history more carefully. Whilst our laws seem fair on paper, they were not always as fair in practice. So it runs in my memory that there was more to this story than I can remember. In November in Britain, it was dark quite early. the days were closing in ready for the shortest day in December. It was also fairly cold. So Bonfire night and its preparations was a significant fun event which turned our dismal winter into something interesting. Shortly after Bonfire night we kids got ready for Christmas and our carol singing round the neighbourhood. Often in January we had Snow so these interesting things helped us to get through winter. November is much warmer now in UK than I remember. My brother was born in 1948 and we had snow in November that year, I can remember because we had to try to get to the Maternity home through deep snow. (I was allowed to stay outside and look through the window, no kids allowed in by the way.) I have a "Be-Ro" cook book which dates back to the 1930s. Be-Ro was a brand of flour and I brought this book with me to Australia. I have a "Sponge Parkin" recipe from this one and the next version from the 1960s has Gingerbread. I have a third version and it is interesting to see how tastes changed with time and nutritional values. The Sponge Parkin is:- 1lb Be-Ro Flour (I assume this was SR) pinch salt 2tsp ground ginger 8oz caster sugar 2oz Margarine 8oz treacle (not golden syrup) You mix together flour salt ginger and sugar, Warm the marg and treacle and beat together then add the dry ingredients and the beaten egg and milk alternately a little at a time and mix thoroughly. Pour into a greased, shallow tin and bake in a moderate oven about 1.5 hrs. Just found the Parkins recipe: This has 4oz flour, 4oz Oatmeal, 1 tsp ground ginger. 4oz caster sugar, 2 oz Margarine, 1 Egg, 1 tablespoon dark syrup, 1 tbls milk. This one mixes all dry ingredients and you rub in the margarine, add Syrup mixed with beaten egg and work it into a paste with the milk. Place single teaspoons in rounds on a greased baking sheet with a split almond on top of each bake in moderate oven about 15 minutes. I am sure our Parkin had Oatmeal in it and It wasn't cooked in rounds but baked like the sponge parkin. I doubt too many people have the original recipes these days. This gives you an idea and if you want to know more maybe try google. With our low carb diets it is a bit high in sugars but tastes lovely. The oatmeal version is a little drier but the sponge one is gooey and sweet. It could fit in with "trick and treat" occasions I guess. They gave up on Bonfire nights 5th November in S. Australia back in 1967 the year after we landed here as the fire risk is too high in our hot weather. Currently we are in the 6th day over 104F with no end in sight (although it is unusual for the heat to persist so long so early in our summer. Jean in S. Australia. ----- Original Message ----- From: "carol ritchey" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009 7:46 AM Subject: Re: [YORKSHIRE] London Group meeting > If you decide to share your recipe, I would like a copy of it. Would like > to know what my ancestors ate. > Carol > Texas USA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nancy Keith" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 1:36 PM > Subject: Re: [YORKSHIRE] London Group meeting > > >> >> Of course, you WILL share your recipe, won't you? Learning how to make >> something that was an important part of family life for our ancestors >> would >> definitely enhance our Yorkshire Family Stories, I should think. I don't >> think that our families went out to bakeries way back then, so surely >> there >> are family-held recipes for this goody that we have only heard about... >> often wondered what a "Parkin" was! >> >> Nancy >> in Michigan, U S of A, where there just aren't many Parkins... >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Janice Wood" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 1:05 PM >> Subject: [YORKSHIRE] London Group meeting >> >> >>> Hello all, >>> >>> As Roy has mentioned it - I am going to the meeting on the 28th, to hear >>> a >>> talk about "Yorkshire Food" by Christine Willott - if you've been to any >>> of >>> our Yorksgen gatherings, you probably know Chris. >>> My contribution to the meeting - I am bringing some authentic Yorkshire >>> Parkin, which all those who attend will be able to sample. >>> >>> Now many of you will be wondering what Parkin is - it's made at our >>> local >>> bakery and is an oaty gingerbread. >>> >>> :-)) >>> >>> Janice Wood >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Some useful websites - >>> FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ >>> FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ >>> Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki >>> http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> >> >> >> Some useful websites - >> FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ >> FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ >> Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki >> http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > Some useful websites - > FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ > FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Very much looking forward to seeing the parkin recipe. My Gran used to make the most beautiful parkin and I can still remember how we children loved it! I still have her parkin tin (which doubled as a Yorkshire Pudding tin and was handed on to me by my mother), but have never yet made parkin in it! I will have to put that right. Best wishes for the fair. Sandra Hargreaves in Melbourne

For everyone salivating at the thought of parkin and gingerbread, be aware that the Be-Ro book is still available. There is a web site. www.Be-ro.com where all the recipes are displayed, but you can still send for the book. It was sort of a coming of age rite for the women in our family. My grandma used it, my mother used it, I used it and sent for a new edition for my daughters as they left home. Everything in the book is well tried and tested and virtually infallible. I live in France now and constantly produce cakes that make ex-pats weep with remembrance of times gone by or amaze French friends that the English can, contrary to popular belief, cook well! In the discussion of Guy Fawkes Night, nobody mentioned the 4th November. Mischief Night in Leeds where the young went around the streets doing bad things and getting away with it. I wonder if the 'trick or treat' idea actually started with that

Thank you for sharing this recipe! This sounds so yummy!! I can hardly wait to make - or, better yet, to EAT - this treat. I think that our Yorkin ancestors had some good eating. Nancy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Janice Wood" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009 1:58 AM Subject: [YORKSHIRE] Yorkshire Parkin > Get those ovens warmed up! > Here is the traditional (as far as we know it) recipe for Parkin: > > Sorry, you will have to convert quantities from pounds and ounces to > grams. > > ½lb butter or margarine > 1½lb black treacle > ½lb brown sugar > 2lb Oatmeal > 1lb flour > 1oz ground ginger > Dissolve butter in tracle over a gentle heat (or by standing by the side > of > the fire). Stir in the sugar and the ginger and mix the flour and oatmeal > together. Stir in flour and oatmeal and mix with a wooden spoon. Add 1 or > 2 > beaten eggs and a little milk if necessary to mix to a soft but fairly > stiff > consistency. Put in a greased pudding tin. It should be about 1 inch > thickness. Bake in moderate oven for 40-50 minutes. Let it cool in the > tin, > then cut into squares. Store in an airtight tin. > >>From a more modern cookbook: > (Note - this recipe does not include eggs, which I believe Parkin should > not!) > > 8 oz Oatmeal > 4 oz Plain Flour & 1 level teaspoon baking powder > or 4 oz Self-Raising Flour > 4 oz Moist Brown Sugar > 1½ level teaspoons ground ginger > 3 oz Margarine or butter > 8 oz Golden Syrup > 1 tablespoon black treacle > 1/3 pint milk > > Melt butter and treacle, add dry ingredients, add milk. Pour into lined 8 > inch square baking tin. Bake for two hours at 170C > (This takes a lot longer to bake than the one above) > > Our village bakery is going to make our Parkin for the meeting on the > 28th, > to a similar traditional recipe. I know it is good and I think Colin > Withers > can vouch for it - I am sure I kept seeing him going back for another > piece, > when we had Parkin at York last year! > > Enjoy! > > Regards > Janice Wood > >

Get those ovens warmed up! Here is the traditional (as far as we know it) recipe for Parkin: Sorry, you will have to convert quantities from pounds and ounces to grams. ½lb butter or margarine 1½lb black treacle ½lb brown sugar 2lb Oatmeal 1lb flour 1oz ground ginger Dissolve butter in tracle over a gentle heat (or by standing by the side of the fire). Stir in the sugar and the ginger and mix the flour and oatmeal together. Stir in flour and oatmeal and mix with a wooden spoon. Add 1 or 2 beaten eggs and a little milk if necessary to mix to a soft but fairly stiff consistency. Put in a greased pudding tin. It should be about 1 inch thickness. Bake in moderate oven for 40-50 minutes. Let it cool in the tin, then cut into squares. Store in an airtight tin. >From a more modern cookbook: (Note - this recipe does not include eggs, which I believe Parkin should not!) 8 oz Oatmeal 4 oz Plain Flour & 1 level teaspoon baking powder or 4 oz Self-Raising Flour 4 oz Moist Brown Sugar 1½ level teaspoons ground ginger 3 oz Margarine or butter 8 oz Golden Syrup 1 tablespoon black treacle 1/3 pint milk Melt butter and treacle, add dry ingredients, add milk. Pour into lined 8 inch square baking tin. Bake for two hours at 170C (This takes a lot longer to bake than the one above) Our village bakery is going to make our Parkin for the meeting on the 28th, to a similar traditional recipe. I know it is good and I think Colin Withers can vouch for it - I am sure I kept seeing him going back for another piece, when we had Parkin at York last year! Enjoy! Regards Janice Wood

Sandra, my husband's great-grandmother was Eliza Hargreaves, daughter of Benjamin Hargreaves, greengrocer of Holbeck Lane, Holbeck. In Jan 1862 Eliza married Alfred Birdsell of Crooland Street, Holbeck. I believe Eliza's mother was Catherine Jackson. Does this connect with your Hargreaves? Jo Stritch Warm sunny Texas USA ________________________________ From: sandra hargreaves <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, November 13, 2009 5:20:05 PM Subject: Re: [YORKSHIRE] Parkin Very much looking forward to seeing the parkin recipe. My Gran used to make the most beautiful parkin and I can still remember how we children loved it! I still have her parkin tin (which doubled as a Yorkshire Pudding tin and was handed on to me by my mother), but have never yet made parkin in it! I will have to put that right. Best wishes for the fair. Sandra Hargreaves in Melbourne Some useful websites - FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

On 13 Nov 2009 at 18:05, Janice Wood wrote: > Hello all, > > As Roy has mentioned it - I am going to the meeting on the 28th, to > hear a talk about "Yorkshire Food" by Christine Willott - if you've > been to any of our Yorksgen gatherings, you probably know Chris. My > contribution to the meeting - I am bringing some authentic Yorkshire > Parkin, which all those who attend will be able to sample. > > Now many of you will be wondering what Parkin is - it's made at our > local bakery and is an oaty gingerbread. > :-)) I can hardly wait, Janice! My mouth is watering already at the mere thought! Living so long in the south of England, I haven't sampled real Yorkshire parkin for years. My mother used to make the most wonderful parkin for Guy Fawkes Night, also delicious home-made toffee. -- Roy Stockdill Professional genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Newbies' Guide to Genealogy & Family History: www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

Hello all, As Roy has mentioned it - I am going to the meeting on the 28th, to hear a talk about "Yorkshire Food" by Christine Willott - if you've been to any of our Yorksgen gatherings, you probably know Chris. My contribution to the meeting - I am bringing some authentic Yorkshire Parkin, which all those who attend will be able to sample. Now many of you will be wondering what Parkin is - it's made at our local bakery and is an oaty gingerbread. :-)) Janice Wood

Oops! My apologies for sending a message about the above to the list. It was intended as a private e-mail to Janice only but obviously I must have clicked on "all recipients" by mistake. However, since I did so, I may as well mention that the "London Group" I referred to is the London Group of Yorkshire Family History Societies of which I am chairman. We are a small group that meets four times a year at the Society of Genealogists, comprising people with Yorkshire research interests who live mainly in the London and south-east area. We welcome newcomers who are members of one of the Yorkshire societies. See our website for details: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/Misc/FHS/index.html We try to have a varied and entertaining programme, including at least one speaker a year from Yorkshire. -- Roy Stockdill Professional genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Newbies' Guide to Genealogy & Family History: www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

Hi Jan Just wondered if you had made any arrangements to collect any material for the London Group at the fair? I'm afraid with losing Michael, no-one seems to know quite what is happening re our stand and material for WDYTYA? We do appreciate the help you are giving us and I look forward to seeing you at our meeting on Nov 28. Perhaps we can have a discussion then? I intend holding an emergency committee meeting after our usual meeting in the morning and you will be very welcome to join us. Hope you have a good fair tomorrow. I have a feeling one of our committee members, Vivien Tomlinson will be there. Best wishes Roy

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: JudyElkington70 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.england.yks.general/15416.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: The only family in 1911 with this name was living in Devon and Cornwall. I wondered if it is p;ossible, if he was in the army, that they moved there. If you write to me off-line at [email protected] and send me your e-mail address I could send you the copy. Please hed the letter Thomas Tonkin. Judy Stubbs Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: Echa65 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.england.yks.general/6615.3/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Do you have a Minnie Crackles anywhere in your tree? I have fond memories going back 60 years of carrying the shopping bags of this old lady who fetched bags of fish heads from Barnsley Market for all the stray cats near her home in Kingstone, Barnsley. I reckon she must have been born around 1885 Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

If you decide to share your recipe, I would like a copy of it. Would like to know what my ancestors ate. Carol Texas USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nancy Keith" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 1:36 PM Subject: Re: [YORKSHIRE] London Group meeting > > Of course, you WILL share your recipe, won't you? Learning how to make > something that was an important part of family life for our ancestors > would > definitely enhance our Yorkshire Family Stories, I should think. I don't > think that our families went out to bakeries way back then, so surely > there > are family-held recipes for this goody that we have only heard about... > often wondered what a "Parkin" was! > > Nancy > in Michigan, U S of A, where there just aren't many Parkins... > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Janice Wood" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 1:05 PM > Subject: [YORKSHIRE] London Group meeting > > >> Hello all, >> >> As Roy has mentioned it - I am going to the meeting on the 28th, to hear >> a >> talk about "Yorkshire Food" by Christine Willott - if you've been to any >> of >> our Yorksgen gatherings, you probably know Chris. >> My contribution to the meeting - I am bringing some authentic Yorkshire >> Parkin, which all those who attend will be able to sample. >> >> Now many of you will be wondering what Parkin is - it's made at our local >> bakery and is an oaty gingerbread. >> >> :-)) >> >> Janice Wood >> >> >> >> >> Some useful websites - >> FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ >> FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ >> Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki >> http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > > Some useful websites - > FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ > FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Wish I could be there to sample it; sounds great! Cheers, Carol Ritchey Texas USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Janice Wood" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 12:05 PM Subject: [YORKSHIRE] London Group meeting > Hello all, > > As Roy has mentioned it - I am going to the meeting on the 28th, to hear a > talk about "Yorkshire Food" by Christine Willott - if you've been to any > of > our Yorksgen gatherings, you probably know Chris. > My contribution to the meeting - I am bringing some authentic Yorkshire > Parkin, which all those who attend will be able to sample. > > Now many of you will be wondering what Parkin is - it's made at our local > bakery and is an oaty gingerbread. > > :-)) > > Janice Wood > > > > > Some useful websites - > FREECEN - http://www.freecen.org.uk/ > FREEBMD - http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ > Want to know where a place in Yorkshire is - Try Genuki > http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message