Thanks to help recieved on this list I think I can finally trace references on the 1841. I've traced those MALTBY names entered and feel satisfied ,although they are not what I expected. I can now use these names to see if they are Grandmother, uncle etc. There are not too many MALTBY names about so it could be better than my SUTCLIFFE trail. Having said that I'm back on the census now to find My John SUTCLIFFE b Mountain and his father William. Just hoping might lead me to the 'Famed ' Bill at Mountain' who played 'Knurr and Spell' so well as reported by Derek Barraclough. Thanks Derek, that has spurred me on to do a bit more work before I go away for a week. I'll still be reading your messages but will have no resorces with me. THANKS to all who helped. Valerie