Hi I am new to this list although I have been following threads for a little time. So I hope I have got the method right. According to the census returns of 1881 and 1891, my great-grandmother, Mary SULLIVAN was born in New York, USA in 1849. She "married" my great-grandfather, Walter Baldwin (born 1846 in Horton, Bradford) sometime between 1871 when Walter is shown to be a lodger in Horton and unmarried and, presumably, 1874 when their first child William was born. However, I have never been able to find any record of the marriage between 1865 and 1880. It is possible, of course, that they never married. It also occurs to me that Mary SULLIVAN from New York and with probable Irish ancestry may well have been Catholic at birth. The question, therefore, is would her Catholicism - if that is what she was - have any bearing upon the registration of a marriage at that time. Or, possibly, the fact that she was an immigrant have any bearing. Also, are there any obvious reasons I may have missed as to why a probable Irish/American family would emigrate to Bradford in the 1860's. There are no obvious Mary Sullivans claiming to have been born in the USA in the 1861 or 1871 census returns but, of course, many claiming an Irish birthplace Thanks for any ideas. Geoff Longbottom

From: "Volpone" <volpone@btinternet.com> > According to the census returns of 1881 and 1891, my > great-grandmother, Mary SULLIVAN was born in New York, USA in 1849. > She "married" my great-grandfather, Walter Baldwin (born 1846 in > Horton, Bradford) sometime between 1871 when Walter is shown to be a > lodger in Horton and unmarried and, presumably, 1874 when their first > child William was born. However, I have never been able to find any > record of the marriage between 1865 and 1880. It is possible, of > course, that they never married. It also occurs to me that Mary > SULLIVAN from New York and with probable Irish ancestry may well have > been Catholic at birth. The question, therefore, is would her > Catholicism - if that is what she was - have any bearing upon the > registration of a marriage at that time. Or, possibly, the fact that > she was an immigrant have any bearing. Also, are there any obvious > reasons I may have missed as to why a probable Irish/American family > would emigrate to Bradford in the 1860's. There are no obvious Mary > Sullivans claiming to have been born in the USA in the 1861 or 1871 > census returns but, of course, many claiming an Irish birthplace > Thanks for any ideas. > > Geoff Longbottom> Have you considered the possibility that they married in America, if Walter had gone to a job over there and then brought Mary back to England? I can't see that her religion or being born in America would make any difference. If they were married in Bradford, then there would be a record of it. Walter was obviously from Bradford and a woollen worker in a worsted manufacturer's (1881 census). Bradford was the wool capital of the world in those times and the city's wool merchants would have had strong business links with America. Maybe his employer sent Walter across or he emigrated, met and married Mary and decided to return to Bradford. -- Roy Stockdill Professional genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Newbies' Guide to Genealogy & Family History: www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

Many thanks for the response I had thought of the possibility but up to now have considered it a long-shot. And, of course, the means of checking are rather limited - and expensive. Passenger lists do not appear to be available prior to 1890 and passport applications do not appear to be covered by this period. Also, there was a limited time scale between early 1871 when Walter BALDWIN was in Horton and early 1874 when he was certainly in Bradford - or at least Mary must have been! But you have given me room for more thought on the possibility And, coincidentally, I recently discovered an American cousin from another side of the family who seems to be interested in family history so I will see if she can research anything from her end. Thanks for the help Geoff Longbottom ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roy Stockdill" <roy.stockdill@btinternet.com> To: <ENG-YKS-BRADFORD@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2008 10:38 PM Subject: Re: [YKS-BRADFORD] Baldwin/Sullivan > From: "Volpone" <volpone@btinternet.com> > >> According to the census returns of 1881 and 1891, my >> great-grandmother, Mary SULLIVAN was born in New York, USA in 1849. >> She "married" my great-grandfather, Walter Baldwin (born 1846 in >> Horton, Bradford) sometime between 1871 when Walter is shown to be a >> lodger in Horton and unmarried and, presumably, 1874 when their first >> child William was born. However, I have never been able to find any >> record of the marriage between 1865 and 1880. It is possible, of >> course, that they never married. It also occurs to me that Mary >> SULLIVAN from New York and with probable Irish ancestry may well have >> been Catholic at birth. The question, therefore, is would her >> Catholicism - if that is what she was - have any bearing upon the >> registration of a marriage at that time. Or, possibly, the fact that >> she was an immigrant have any bearing. Also, are there any obvious >> reasons I may have missed as to why a probable Irish/American family >> would emigrate to Bradford in the 1860's. There are no obvious Mary >> Sullivans claiming to have been born in the USA in the 1861 or 1871 >> census returns but, of course, many claiming an Irish birthplace >> Thanks for any ideas. >> >> Geoff Longbottom> > > Have you considered the possibility that they married in America, if > Walter had gone to a job over there and then brought Mary back to > England? I can't see that her religion or being born in America would > make any difference. If they were married in Bradford, then there would > be a record of it. > > Walter was obviously from Bradford and a woollen worker in a worsted > manufacturer's (1881 census). Bradford was the wool capital of the world > in those times and the city's wool merchants would have had strong > business links with America. Maybe his employer sent Walter across or > he emigrated, met and married Mary and decided to return to Bradford. > > -- > Roy Stockdill > Professional genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer > Newbies' Guide to Genealogy & Family History: > www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html > > "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, > and that is not being talked about." > OSCAR WILDE > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-YKS-BRADFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >