Mal Platt-Grigg wrote: > They are actually testing male Y-DNA, which remains virtually unchanged > through the male line. That rules out my participation then. I've no brothers and my father's been dead 30 years. Not that I intended participating anyway. > I, for one, think this is fascinating technology albeit in it's infancy. As > the database grows, it will become a valuable tool in genealogy. I don't think it will be "a valuable tool in genealogy". It can't prove anything. At best it can suggest that a link *might* be possible and that it *might* be around a certain (vague) point in the past. It can't tell me the name of an ancestor or where s/he was born or when. It might be able to rule in, or out, another family of the same name but without a paper trail, without hard proof, DNA testing is worthless. Tracking back on the female line is an exercise in futility since it can't name names or places or give dates and the mother's name invariably changes generation on generation. As far as I'm concerned it's just an expensive gimmick, a new toy, a wishful thinking short cut to a family tree without all the hard work - and that's all. Good luck to those with money to waste. Personally, I'd rather spend the hundreds of pounds these tests cost on the volumes of the VCH I would like, or a fistful of certificates that would provide links, or the fares and overnight accommodation to a record office some distance from my home. DNA testing is not all it's cracked up to be. However, Rootsweb do have a DNA mailing list where this tedious subject can be discussed with like minded people.

I would not be quite so dismissive - and while I agree that the DNA list is the place to go into details, it is not much use as an introduction to the subject. So may I just say I was also (very) sceptical about DNA testing in genealogy but that I've changed my mind about Y-DNA since reading Chris Pomery's book "DNA and Family History". This is the best read I have found on the subject, from a genealogist and/or one-namer point of view - it clarifies the science, and explains the uses. Disclaimer: I have no affiliation etc. etc. After following up further, I'm convinced Y-DNA is a genuine genealogical tool to use in conjunction with documentary evidence, though obviously of limited application as it's only good for the pure male line. While it's true that the results are statistical, they're still useful - a multi-point mismatch pretty much disproves a close connection, while a medium-to-high resolution full match is an extremely strong indication of a common male ancestor within the last few centuries (remember that many courts accept this as proof of paternity). It's illuminating to look at actual Y-DNA results alongside associated documentary research, which can be found on the web. And remember that documentary evidence is not proof either - just part of a weight of evidence. Yes Y-DNA is no magic wand, but it is a genuine tool, so why dismiss altogether? I plan to join my name study and be tested, as I come from an Australian branch of a particular English family (that I have researched in usual way), with the connection absolutely undocumented in England yet thoroughly documented in Australia (a tale of a remittance man*, abandonment of wife and children, bigamy, suicide, a chancery case, ...). Y-DNA testing is a tool for such a situation; and though this name database is still fairly small, I am in touch with an English branch of my family (female 5th cousin) and plan to sponsor a test if there is a willing male there. Regards Steve * remittance man = son of a "good" British family who disgraced them and was banished to the Colonies, where he was remitted funds as long as he stayed there. Firebird wrote: > Mal Platt-Grigg wrote: > >> They are actually testing male Y-DNA, which remains virtually unchanged >> through the male line. >> > > That rules out my participation then. I've no brothers and my > father's been dead 30 years. Not that I intended participating anyway. > > >> I, for one, think this is fascinating technology albeit in it's infancy. As >> the database grows, it will become a valuable tool in genealogy. >> > > I don't think it will be "a valuable tool in genealogy". It can't > prove anything. At best it can suggest that a link *might* be > possible and that it *might* be around a certain (vague) point in the > past. It can't tell me the name of an ancestor or where s/he was born > or when. It might be able to rule in, or out, another family of the > same name but without a paper trail, without hard proof, DNA testing > is worthless. Tracking back on the female line is an exercise in > futility since it can't name names or places or give dates and the > mother's name invariably changes generation on generation. > > As far as I'm concerned it's just an expensive gimmick, a new toy, a > wishful thinking short cut to a family tree without all the hard work > - and that's all. Good luck to those with money to waste. Personally, > I'd rather spend the hundreds of pounds these tests cost on the > volumes of the VCH I would like, or a fistful of certificates that > would provide links, or the fares and overnight accommodation to a > record office some distance from my home. > > DNA testing is not all it's cracked up to be. > > However, Rootsweb do have a DNA mailing list where this tedious > subject can be discussed with like minded people. > >

Hi All I am not happy with Mr Happy. I do not consider this a suitable subject for County specific lists - there are many Rootsweb Mail Lists for DNA discussion. Mike Fisher Wythall,WOR One-Place Genealogical Study http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~wythallindex/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Sims" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 11:46 AM Subject: Re: [WOR] Worcs Gene Pool >I would not be quite so dismissive - and while I agree that the DNA list > is the place to go into details, it is not much use as an introduction > to the subject. > > So may I just say I was also (very) sceptical about DNA testing in > genealogy but that I've changed my mind about Y-DNA since reading Chris > Pomery's book "DNA and Family History". This is the best read I have > found on the subject, from a genealogist and/or one-namer point of view > - it clarifies the science, and explains the uses. Disclaimer: I have no > affiliation etc. etc. > > After following up further, I'm convinced Y-DNA is a genuine > genealogical tool to use in conjunction with documentary evidence, > though obviously of limited application as it's only good for the pure > male line. While it's true that the results are statistical, they're > still useful - a multi-point mismatch pretty much disproves a close > connection, while a medium-to-high resolution full match is an extremely > strong indication of a common male ancestor within the last few > centuries (remember that many courts accept this as proof of paternity). > It's illuminating to look at actual Y-DNA results alongside associated > documentary research, which can be found on the web. And remember that > documentary evidence is not proof either - just part of a weight of > evidence. Yes Y-DNA is no magic wand, but it is a genuine tool, so why > dismiss altogether? > > I plan to join my name study and be tested, as I come from an Australian > branch of a particular English family (that I have researched in usual > way), with the connection absolutely undocumented in England yet > thoroughly documented in Australia (a tale of a remittance man*, > abandonment of wife and children, bigamy, suicide, a chancery case, > ...). Y-DNA testing is a tool for such a situation; and though this name > database is still fairly small, I am in touch with an English branch of > my family (female 5th cousin) and plan to sponsor a test if there is a > willing male there. > > Regards > Steve > > * remittance man = son of a "good" British family who disgraced them and > was banished to the Colonies, where he was remitted funds as long as he > stayed there. > > Firebird wrote: >> Mal Platt-Grigg wrote: >> >>> They are actually testing male Y-DNA, which remains virtually unchanged >>> through the male line. >>> >> >> That rules out my participation then. I've no brothers and my >> father's been dead 30 years. Not that I intended participating anyway. >> >> >>> I, for one, think this is fascinating technology albeit in it's infancy. >>> As >>> the database grows, it will become a valuable tool in genealogy. >>> >> >> I don't think it will be "a valuable tool in genealogy". It can't >> prove anything. At best it can suggest that a link *might* be >> possible and that it *might* be around a certain (vague) point in the >> past. It can't tell me the name of an ancestor or where s/he was born >> or when. It might be able to rule in, or out, another family of the >> same name but without a paper trail, without hard proof, DNA testing >> is worthless. Tracking back on the female line is an exercise in >> futility since it can't name names or places or give dates and the >> mother's name invariably changes generation on generation. >> >> As far as I'm concerned it's just an expensive gimmick, a new toy, a >> wishful thinking short cut to a family tree without all the hard work >> - and that's all. Good luck to those with money to waste. Personally, >> I'd rather spend the hundreds of pounds these tests cost on the >> volumes of the VCH I would like, or a fistful of certificates that >> would provide links, or the fares and overnight accommodation to a >> record office some distance from my home. >> >> DNA testing is not all it's cracked up to be. >> >> However, Rootsweb do have a DNA mailing list where this tedious >> subject can be discussed with like minded people. >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >