Hello List. A big thank you to Ruth for the speedy response to my Query.I just could not make the letters out properly.Evidently it was a school at that time,I found my ancestor,there as a pupil. Kind Regards. Sheila,in Suffolk.

Hi, I have found the relevant 1861 census image of my ancestor, William WEAVER, born in Herefordshire abt. 1850. He's a Scholar at a School and the entry is found on RG 9 Piece 2089 Folio 4 Page 1. (The School Mistress is Sarah E NEWTON) If someone could clarify the name of the residence I'd appreciate it. Kind regards. Sheila in Suffolk.

Angela The only Mary Ann PETFORDs ( or PITFORD ) I can locate on 1851 and 1861 Census - do not have a Father Edward !! 1. 1851 at Stock & Bradley father Thomas Mary Ann PETFORD Dau 7 Scholar Born Hanbury/WOR 2. 1851 at White Ladies Aston Father john Mary Ann PETFORD dau 5mths Born White Ladies Aston 3. 1851 White Ladies Aston Niece in household of Joseph PETFORD Mary Ann PETFORD Nce 8 Scholar Born Birmingham No 2 is to me ruled out as would only be 11 in 1862. 1861 1. Does not appear 2.at Grafton Flyford father John Mary Ann PETFORD 10yrs Scholar Born White Ladies Aston 3. Niece to Walter Ruskin BURROWS Eastnor House Leigh Mary Ann PETFORD Nce 19 Born Birmingham/WAR. All the Best Helen New Zealand -----Original Message----- From: Dai Bevan [mailto:daibevan@clara.co.uk] Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2005 9:40 p.m. To: ENG-WORCESTER-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [WOR] Petford/Pitford Hi, I hope someone can help me find anything about my missing ancestor Mary Ann Petford or Pitford. Especially on the 1861 census and back. On her marriage certificate, 1st Sep 1862, she was a minor, father Edward, a labourer, living in Norton. On later censuses she was born Worc. St. Peters or Norton. Born between 1846 and 1851. I have tried St. Peters registry office but they have no trace of a birth in the time slot. Any help will be greatly appreciated. thanks in advance Regards Angela. ==== ENG-WORCESTER Mailing List ==== FreeREG Project: parish register database http://freereg.rootsweb.com UK Census on-line http://freecen.rootsweb.com/ http://www.worcestershiresurnames.co.uk/

Hi Angela, A lot depends on *which* Norton she lived in as to which Registrar's Office you need to enquire of. Norton (juxta Kempsey) [just outside Worcester, and with a corner touching Worcester St Peter] was in Pershore Registration District - and sounds on the face of it to be the most likely Norton (and Lenchwick) [just outside Evesham] was in Evesham District Norton (by Bredon) was in Tewkesbury [GLS] District, although the village was in WOR Worcester St Peter was - hardly surprisingly - in Worcester District, although Whittington (which was a part of St Peter until 1866) was in pershore District. If you're looking for Certificates, you'd probably do rather better by going via the GRO at Southport rather than the local Offices, for Pershore and Tewkesbury (at least) are only part-time Offices... Gus ----- Original Message ----- From: Dai Bevan <daibevan@clara.co.uk> To: <ENG-WORCESTER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:40 AM Subject: [WOR] Petford/Pitford > Hi, > > I hope someone can help me find anything about my missing ancestor Mary Ann > Petford or Pitford. Especially on the 1861 census and back. > > On her marriage certificate, 1st Sep 1862, she was a minor, father Edward, a > labourer, living in Norton. > On later censuses she was born Worc. St. Peters or Norton. Born between 1846 > and 1851. > > I have tried St. Peters registry office but they have no trace of a birth in > the time slot. > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > thanks in advance > > Regards > Angela. > >

Hi, I hope someone can help me find anything about my missing ancestor Mary Ann Petford or Pitford. Especially on the 1861 census and back. On her marriage certificate, 1st Sep 1862, she was a minor, father Edward, a labourer, living in Norton. On later censuses she was born Worc. St. Peters or Norton. Born between 1846 and 1851. I have tried St. Peters registry office but they have no trace of a birth in the time slot. Any help will be greatly appreciated. thanks in advance Regards Angela.

July 14th Reposting my (only) interest in Worcestershire. My relatives, John/Jack and Nellie Barnard appear on the 1946 electoral roll as living at Red House Villa, Sedgeberrow. Does anyone know if this house is still there? Was it perhaps a lodge of a larger house - The Red House? Has anyone heard of a property called May Court in the area? Thanks Rosemary Rees

Hello, This is probably of no help whatsoever - other than to say there were many Beales way back round the Bromsgrove area and linked to the big "Quaker contingent" of Bowaters who headed off to Pennsylvania....... Look on Rootsweb for Beales there are lots, or through the Bowater link on rootsweb. I am a Bowater descendant from Worcestershire, not linked to the Quaker group unless they all hook up prior to 1650 Bye, Jilly

It's a long time since I last posted, but my Beales are still resisting all attempts to find them! Robert Beale married Betty Young at Birtsmorton on 31.12.1818. I have never managed to find his birth, though his entry for Castlemorton in one of the censuses suggests that he was born around 1793. His great grandchildren are also giving me a bad time, the children of James Beale and Elizabeth (nee Pearson) they were all born in Gloucester. The first three I have traced successfully: Louise Florence, died 1907 Henry James, died 1957 Andrew, died 1932. The other three, however, have defied me constantly: William born 1883 Fred born 1885 Ethel born 1889. I know that in the early 1890's, James went to America to "make his fortune" and that the family followed him out in 1892. However, by 1900, the widow Elizabeth had remarried back in Gloucester and as far as I know all the children returned to England with her. Ethel was last heard of around 1920 working at a delicatessen in Cheltenham, but the other two, William and Fred, appear to have vanished off the face of the planet. Has anyone any connections to this family or have any ideas please? regards Dennis

Hello All Just to let you all know that I have now uploaded the photos of the memorials for Bredon and added slideshows of the interior and exterior of the church. Hope you enjoy them Sally www.parishmouse.co.uk

Re: discrepancy between Birth date and Baptism. My Hale family had 5 children baptised in March 1852, the eldest was born in 1845. Re: discrepancy between Birth date on the Certificate and actual date. My mother knew her Dad's birth date was 14 May (my first born was due on this date) however on his certificate it is given as 20 May. The date of registration was 29 June which was more than 6 weeks after the 14th May but changing the birth date made it all legal! Vivien

Hi all Listers I now have my Ann Allchurch's birth certifcate and her parents marriage certifcate. Are there any other researchers out there for this family Thomas Allchurch married Sarah Townsend 1841 Stourbridge. Children are - Luke 1842, Joseph 1846, Margaret 1848, Ann 1850, David 1853, Thomas 1855 Thomas's parents are Joseph Allchurch & Ann ? Children - Thomas 1812 Sarah Townsends parents are Henry Townsend & Ann Whitehouse, the reasearch on this family also leads to Kingswinford Stafforshire. Children Thomas 1816 Tipton, Sarah 1819 Tipton Maybe I need to join the Staffordshire List as well. Elaine Smith QLD, Australia ..· ´¨¨)) -:¦:- ¸.·´ .·´¨¨)) ((¸¸.·´ ..·´ -:¦:- -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*.``..

Colin Adult baptisms were quite common, some were performed in very much later years. Regards David Pearsall - Solihull UK ----- Original Message ----- From: "colin jarvis" <colcon2@bigpond.com> To: <ENG-WORCESTER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 2:52 AM Subject: [WOR] AGES SHOWN IN CENSUS RECORDS. > Hrllo everyone, > Have found an entry for an ancestor as a child in a 1851 census giving an > age which would give a birth year of > about1846. > An 1881 census shows him married with an age given which would make the > birth year about 1850. > Am I correct in assuming that the information shown would be given by the > head of the house and that the age shown would be based on the birth year. > This latter point is of interest as in some cases I have found > considerable gaps between baptism and birth dates. > > Thanks, > > Colin Jarvis. > > > > > ==== ENG-WORCESTER Mailing List ==== > FreeREG Project: parish register database > http://freereg.rootsweb.com > > UK Census on-line > http://freecen.rootsweb.com/ > http://www.worcestershiresurnames.co.uk/ > > >

Hrllo everyone, Have found an entry for an ancestor as a child in a 1851 census giving an age which would give a birth year of about1846. An 1881 census shows him married with an age given which would make the birth year about 1850. Am I correct in assuming that the information shown would be given by the head of the house and that the age shown would be based on the birth year. This latter point is of interest as in some cases I have found considerable gaps between baptism and birth dates. Thanks, Colin Jarvis.

Hello Colin, There's a lot of Theory that doesn't necessarily match up to Practice here, especially for the earlier Censuses and first 25 years of Births Registration... Census-taking Theory - The Head of the Household was responsible for recording all the appropriate details of those who spent Census Night there - and that the information he would give would all be true. Practice a) - Enough of them didn't bother / couldn't understand [maybe also unable to read or write] / was absent when the Enumerator called to collect his form / flatly refused to co-operate. b) - Although it was an Offence to refuse etc, this would mean Bother (and much extra unpaid work) for the Enumerator who not-infrequently would obtain the details from wife, neighbours etc (which latter would involve a certain amount of guesswork) and fill in the Householder's Return himself. c) - Remember that the "Census Returns" we now see are COPIES made by the Enumerators from possibly-inaccurate originals - *before* allowing for the Enumerators' own and inevitable copying errors. Birth Dates Theory - all births after 1 July 1837 had to be Registered within 6 weeks. Practice a) - Although it was an Offence to fail to Register (either within the time limit or at all) there was no Penalty if the parent was caught. [This state of affairs continued until around 1875!] b) - 'Late' Registration could be covered by stating the child was born 6 weeks before the date of Registering... c) - it is entirely possible for a child to be baptised before it was (officially) born ! Ages 1) Our preoccupation with Exact Age wasn't shared by most of the population at that time - most didn't have a Vote, and there were no Pensions that started at a set age - so why bother to be accurate? 2) In general, though, children's ages [birthplaces, too, and possibly even more so] are more likely to be given accurately by parents (especially if supplied by the mother...) than by adults who wouldn't remember the event... 3) Adults - for any number of reasons - might Lie about their Ages. (I've come across a woman who consistently understated her age by 6 years in 4 successive censuses, and a man who overstated his by 4 in 3...) Conclusion Don't take *anything* appearing on Birth Certificates or Censuses as being Absolute Truth... Treat each item as a 'Data Point' - and gather as many as you can. The net result should (hopefully) then be Accurate Enough. Gus ----- Original Message ----- From: colin jarvis <colcon2@bigpond.com> To: <ENG-WORCESTER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 2:52 AM Subject: [WOR] AGES SHOWN IN CENSUS RECORDS. > Hrllo everyone, > Have found an entry for an ancestor as a child in a 1851 census giving an age which would give a birth year of > about1846. > An 1881 census shows him married with an age given which would make the birth year about 1850. > Am I correct in assuming that the information shown would be given by the head of the house and that the age shown would be based on the birth year. > This latter point is of interest as in some cases I have found considerable gaps between baptism and birth dates. > > Thanks, > > Colin Jarvis. > > > > > ==== ENG-WORCESTER Mailing List ==== > FreeREG Project: parish register database > http://freereg.rootsweb.com > > UK Census on-line > http://freecen.rootsweb.com/ > http://www.worcestershiresurnames.co.uk/ > >

Hello everyone, I have found the basic details of a marriage in I G I and wonder if anyone having access to the 1841 census could lookup to see if they appear in the records for Broadway. Jarvis Joseph " Sarah wife " Elizabeth daughter. Shipston on Stour Jarvis Emanuel " Ann wife. Thanks, Colin Jarvis.

Hi all, Tracing the above family for a friend, got as far as William MUNN married Sarah KINGS in St. Swithens, Worcester. She may have been born in Cotheridge. (Not sure if there is a church in Cotheridge). However, can't find the baptism of William ca 1768 or earlier. William MUNN's children included Samuel, 1817. Any information on these would be very welcome. Also, I am looking for someone who could obtain copies of baptisms/Marriages for SPECIFIC dates, 5 in all from St. Clements and St. John in Bedwardine. Willing to pay expenses and costs. Please reply offlist. Terry

Hi Listers, I have just joined this mailing list, my interest are Charlotte Dudley born 1823 married William Weston 1844 at Grimley. regards Joan from Adelaide --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Rosalie Have checked for Marriage of Henry and Ann in Phillimore's ( doesn't include Worcester, in fact mostly South WOR Parishes ) and British Vital Records Index with no success. Happy Hunting Helen New Zealand -----Original Message----- From: Andy &Rose [mailto:arstrim@bigpond.com] Sent: Friday, 8 July 2005 10:56 a.m. To: ENG-WORCESTER-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [WOR] Howell marriage - Help needed I have found the christening of one of my Howell ancestors (Deborah) and what would appear to be her siblings from the IGI Deborah HOWELL born 8 Aug 1817, chr 5 Oct 1817 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, Worcester, England Elizabeth HOWELL born 21 Jul 1815, chr 20 Aug 1815 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, Worcester, England Richard HOWELL chr 25 Mar 1814 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, Worcester, England I was wondering if there is anyone who could help me find the marriage of the parents. All I know is that the father is Henry HOWELL and the mother is ANN. On the IGI there is no marriage of Henry and Ann in Worcester. There is one in London but am not sure if this would be correct. Is there such a thing as Phillmore marriage index? Rosalie Trim Australia ==== ENG-WORCESTER Mailing List ==== Transcribers wanted for Worcestershire FreeREG for more information see http://freereg.rootsweb.com UK Census on-line http://freecen.rootsweb.com/ http://www.worcestershiresurnames.co.uk/

Hello Rosalie, Pallot's Marriage Index has this entry. Not as far away as London, but still 50 miles from Worcester... Henry Howell Ann Dobson 5 Apr 1812 Henbury Gloucestershire The card actually reads... "Henry Howell, mason, & Ann Dobson" Best regards, John Kane, Sapcote, Leics. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy &Rose" <arstrim@bigpond.com> To: <ENG-WORCESTER-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 11:55 PM Subject: [WOR] Howell marriage - Help needed >I have found the christening of one of my Howell ancestors (Deborah) and > what would appear to be her siblings from the IGI > Deborah HOWELL born 8 Aug 1817, chr 5 Oct 1817 Saint Helen Pump > Street-Methodist, Worcester, England > > Elizabeth HOWELL born 21 Jul 1815, chr 20 Aug 1815 Saint Helen Pump > Street-Methodist, Worcester, England > > Richard HOWELL chr 25 Mar 1814 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, > Worcester, England > > I was wondering if there is anyone who could help me find the marriage of > the parents. All I know is that the father is Henry HOWELL and the mother > is ANN. On the IGI there is no marriage of Henry and Ann in Worcester. > There is one in London but am not sure if this would be correct. Is there > such a thing as Phillmore marriage index? > Rosalie Trim > Australia

I have found the christening of one of my Howell ancestors (Deborah) and what would appear to be her siblings from the IGI Deborah HOWELL born 8 Aug 1817, chr 5 Oct 1817 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, Worcester, England Elizabeth HOWELL born 21 Jul 1815, chr 20 Aug 1815 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, Worcester, England Richard HOWELL chr 25 Mar 1814 Saint Helen Pump Street-Methodist, Worcester, England I was wondering if there is anyone who could help me find the marriage of the parents. All I know is that the father is Henry HOWELL and the mother is ANN. On the IGI there is no marriage of Henry and Ann in Worcester. There is one in London but am not sure if this would be correct. Is there such a thing as Phillmore marriage index? Rosalie Trim Australia