>From that it is possible that Gilbert originated in Cheshire, there is a Gilbert Greenall birth registered Runcorn Cheshire in the Dec Quarter 1852 along with Richard Greenall and Elizabeth Greenall, barring the possibility of triplets that seems a bit strange, but it may be worth while getting the birth certificate for that Gilbert. Their marriage certificate which should be available from the GRO or from Cockermouth Records Office should throw some light on her Father, by the look of the name and the details it seems quite possible she was not English. Whilst it seems the Greenall's were Clergy her family seem military so the possibility of them living and meeting overseas can not be overlooked. I can only find one Matile in the censuses who is French and a few Mattie's all of which appear to be of French Origin in the Channel Islands. I am not sure what the connection with Cockermouth would be. John -----Original Message----- From: David Hughlock [mailto:David@hughlock.co.uk] Sent: 26 April 2009 13:48 To: WESTMORLAND mailing LIST Subject: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] Fw: HELP 1881 lookup please > Hello Listers, > > Could anyone shed light on this couple:- > > FreeBMD - Marriage Sept Q 1876 at Cockermouth ref 10b 757 between Gilbert > GREENALL and Eugenia Marie MATTIE. The district Cockermouth spans the > boundaries of the counties of Cumbria and Cumberland > > The Times, Friday, Jul 28, 1876; pg. 1; Issue 28693; col A, Marriages > On Tuesday, the 25th inst, (25 July 1876) at Crosthwaite Church, > Cumberland, by the Rev. Thomas Greenall, Rector of Grappenhall, and the > Rev. Richard Greenall, Vicar of Stockton Heath, Cheshire, brothers of the > bridegroom, assisted by the Rev. Canon Gibbs, Vicar of Crosthwaite, > GILBERT GREENALL, Esq., of Old Rectory, Grappenhall, Cheshire, to EUGENIE, > MARIE, daughter of Col MATILE, Royal Malta Fencible Artillery. > > We cannot find their births, her parents or the 1881 census listing. > > Help please! > > Kind regards > > Bronwen and David > > > > ------------------------------------- > Have a look at the surname list at www.dfnoble.com/CULnames. If you wish > to add you own areas of research, please email the group. > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > CUMBERLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

GREENALL / MATTIE question. http://www.theclergydatabase.org.uk/index.html The Clergy of the Church of England Database covers the years 1540-1835 only, but if you click on Database and search, you will see some Greenalls who were clergy in different places. Perhaps it will give you some more clues. I find that when searching various areas of Ancestry, there are a good number of the MATTIE surname (even found some in Canada !); haven't found Eugenie though. Barb Baker.

> Hello Listers, > > Could anyone shed light on this couple:- > > FreeBMD - Marriage Sept Q 1876 at Cockermouth ref 10b 757 between Gilbert > GREENALL and Eugenia Marie MATTIE. The district Cockermouth spans the > boundaries of the counties of Cumbria and Cumberland > > The Times, Friday, Jul 28, 1876; pg. 1; Issue 28693; col A, Marriages > On Tuesday, the 25th inst, (25 July 1876) at Crosthwaite Church, > Cumberland, by the Rev. Thomas Greenall, Rector of Grappenhall, and the > Rev. Richard Greenall, Vicar of Stockton Heath, Cheshire, brothers of the > bridegroom, assisted by the Rev. Canon Gibbs, Vicar of Crosthwaite, > GILBERT GREENALL, Esq., of Old Rectory, Grappenhall, Cheshire, to EUGENIE, > MARIE, daughter of Col MATILE, Royal Malta Fencible Artillery. > > We cannot find their births, her parents or the 1881 census listing. > > Help please! > > Kind regards > > Bronwen and David > > > > ------------------------------------- > Have a look at the surname list at www.dfnoble.com/CULnames. If you wish > to add you own areas of research, please email the group. > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > CUMBERLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hello Listers, We have been advised by Pat Otterberg of the USA a Lister to place our brick wall on this forum and see if anyone can help. Our brick wall starts with a Sarah Ullock we believe born 16 Dec 1764 at one of the following - Coniston, Whitehaven, Cark, Cartmel Grange or Flookbrugh or possibly further north. We think this is her:- Baptism: 16 Dec 1764 St Andrew, Coniston, Lancashire, England, Sarah Hullock - dau of James Hullock, Register: Baptism 1689 - 1812 from the Bishops Transcripts, Page 66, Entry 10, Source: LDS Film 1040311. Possible her father James Hullock and mother Sarah Warriner but no real proof as yet. Her children were all illegitimate and we believe they are:- Mary b 16/11/1787, baptised 18 Dec 1787 Cartmel Grange James Ullock born 26 Feb 1793 baptised 24 March 1793 illegitimate son of Sarah Ullock of Grange a Pauper. Atkinson Ullock born 19 March 1797 baptised 23 April 1797 illegitimate son of Sarah Ullock of Grange a Pauper. Matthew Ullock born 21 Oct 1801 baptised 16 Nov 1801 illegitimate son of Sarah Ullock of Grange a Pauper. Robert Ullock born 12 Aug 1805, baptised 1 Sept 1805 illegitimate son of Sarah Ullock of Flookburgh Chapelry. So we are stumped. Who is Sarah ULLOCK please. We believe one of you will have the skill to push us pensioners forward. Thank you for any help you can provide. Here are a few surname variants we have to date - Hulluck, Hulland, Hallak, Hulick, Hullacke, Hollock, Hewlock, Hulock, Houlock, Houllock, Hullock, Hullocke, Youlock, Youlet, Eulock, Ewelock, Hulack, Hallack, Ullock, Ullocke and lots of others. Kind regards Bronwen and David Tewkesbury England

Hi all Thanks to those peole who replied to my querry. Found out that there was a Bobbin Mill at Oak Bank, Nr to Skelsmergh around 1911. Thanks Jeff in Tas..........

I think there was someone on this list, interested in the surname COLLINGE. An entry on the "pilot project" of FamilySearch.org shows this entry for Ireland. > > Groom Name: Aaron COLLINGE > Groom Age: 0350000 > Bride Name: Mary KELLY > Bride Age: 0250000 > Residence: Gannow, Lancashire, England > Event Place: Gannow, Lancashire, England > Event Date: 1888 > > Father of Groom Name: Joseph COLLINGE > Father of Bride Name: Dennis KELLY > > Batch Number: M16282-1 > Date Range: 1800 - 1900 > Film Number: 1526145 > > > Barb Baker, Ontario, Canada. > > > > :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: > > Responses to gatewayed posts must be made on the message board, not the > list. Just click on the link provided to go to the message on the board. > Your response will then also flow to the list. > > :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: :-+-: > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LANCSGEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Jeff. My grand,other was born in Skelmergh in 1877. My grandfather was born in Kendal in 1870 and was a bobbin maker (William and Annie Elizabeth Wilson). It was a large industry at that time and was done in small bobbin mills around the Lakes. The mills grew up around copses of trees and when these were finished the workers moved on to other mills. There is a bobbin mill museum at the bottom of Lake Windermere. If you put in Stott Park Bobbin Mill you will get plenty of information on this industry. If you are interested I have an old photo of the work people at Mire House Bobbin Mill near Keswick. I know my grandfather worked there for a few years but do not know if he is on the photo. Good luck with your search. Joan

Hi all Just found my Grandfather and family living in the Parish of Skelsmergh Nr Kendal on the 1911 Census, his occupation is listed as a Bobbin Maker. Where would he be employed in this category?, thanks for your time. Jeff in Tas.

Jeff:: Bobbins are used in sewing machines, but the ones probably used in your grandfathers situation would probably have been the lager ones. Mostly turned from wood or possibly fabricated from metal cylinders to be used in the textile mills and probably worked his way up from an apprentice to a journeyman in that trade..... Keith in Ont. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Dent" <jjdent@tadaust.org.au> To: <eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2009 9:10 PM Subject: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] 1911 Census Occupation > Hi all > Just found my Grandfather and family living in the Parish of > Skelsmergh Nr Kendal on the 1911 Census, his occupation is listed as > a Bobbin Maker. > > Where would he be employed in this category?, thanks for your time. > > Jeff in Tas. > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Jeff: The attached URL might give you some leads. Terry Alderson. Toronto http://haresnape.com/Richard%60s%20Memories.html >> Hi all > Just found my Grandfather and family living in the Parish of > Skelsmergh Nr Kendal on the 1911 Census, his occupation is listed as > a Bobbin Maker. > > Where would he be employed in this category?, thanks for your time. > > Jeff in Tas. > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Reinvent how you stay in touch with the new Windows Live Messenger. http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9650731

Hello Listers, Can anyone help me please with the statement below: it was transcribed to my best ability from an old family Bible. "Information gathered by Daniel LAMB from conversations with his Mother and Aunt May A Ashall and from parties in England while he was residing with his family in England, 1890 & 1891 at Oak Lane/Lawn? Hamlet of Upper Norwood London Eng. Mr & Mrs LAMB with all there Children enjoyed their visit very much taking great interest in all the old historical? places". They were on holiday from Canada. The next transcription is thought to be part of their family in Canada 0 - In 1881 mother-in-law Mary Ann (nee LAMB) ASHALL aged 63 (1818) born England a Widow and Baptist is living with her son William ASHALL aged 29 (1852) born England a Baptist and Watchmaker is married to Mary D ASHALL aged 26 (1855) born England, a Baptist, they have 2 children Edith L ASHALL aged 2 (1879) born Ontario, a Baptist, Laura ASHALL aged 1 (Born: Nov; 5/12) (1880) born Ontario a Baptist, Mary Ann (nee LAMB) ASHALL Widow, aged 63 (1818) born England a Baptist, Elizabeth LANGFORD married aged 33 (1848) born England a Baptist and Dressmaker, Annie LAMB aged 20 (1861) born Ontario a Baptist they lived at - Census Place St John's Ward, Toronto, York, Ontario, Family History Library Film 1375882, NA Film Number C-13246, District 134, Sub-district D, Division 1, Page Number 5, Household Number 23. Two question - 1st who are the London family they stayed with in London and 2nd where is Oak Lane/Lawn? Please Many thanks for any help you may be able to provide. Kind regards David

There is a Daniel LAMB, age 49 born in Canada, living on his own means at 30 Hamlet Rd, Penge, London, England in the 1891 Census (official date 5 April 1891). He and his family (all Canadian born) are living in their own house if this is the right Daniel LAMB. Enumerated with him: wife, Elizabeth (age 43), children: Annie (19); Alice Jane (16) scholar; Charles M. (14) scholar; Ethel M. (12), scholar; Clara M. (10) scholar; Thomas B. (6); Edith F. (4) and 2 servants Maria Dalby (22); Florence Adams (16) (Ancestry.com, UK Census Collection; London; Penge; District 66; Household schedule # 253 Image 44 of 50. ...Also PRO: RG12/598; Folio 26; ED # 66; Page 45, lines 5-15; GSU roll # 6095708.) Searching in Google maps: "Upper Norwood, London, England" is now about 1.2 miles from "Hamlet Road, Penge, London, England". Hope this helps, Pat Otterberg Florida, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Hughlock" <David@hughlock.co.uk> To: "WESTMORLAND mailing LIST" <eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com>; <CUMBERLAND@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2009 3:12 PM Subject: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] Ashall family London and Lamb familyLancashire/Canada > Hello Listers, > > Can anyone help me please with the statement below: it was transcribed to > my best ability from an old family Bible. > > "Information gathered by Daniel LAMB from conversations with his Mother > and Aunt May A Ashall and from parties in England while he was residing > with his family in England, 1890 & 1891 at Oak Lane/Lawn? Hamlet of Upper > Norwood London Eng. Mr & Mrs LAMB with all there Children enjoyed their > visit very much taking great interest in all the old historical? places". > > They were on holiday from Canada. The next transcription is thought to be > part of their family in Canada > > 0 - In 1881 mother-in-law Mary Ann (nee LAMB) ASHALL aged 63 (1818) born > England a Widow and Baptist is living with her son William ASHALL aged 29 > (1852) born England a Baptist and Watchmaker is married to Mary D ASHALL > aged 26 (1855) born England, a Baptist, they have 2 children Edith L > ASHALL aged 2 (1879) born Ontario, a Baptist, Laura ASHALL aged 1 (Born: > Nov; 5/12) (1880) born Ontario a Baptist, Mary Ann (nee LAMB) ASHALL > Widow, aged 63 (1818) born England a Baptist, Elizabeth LANGFORD married > aged 33 (1848) born England a Baptist and Dressmaker, Annie LAMB aged 20 > (1861) born Ontario a Baptist they lived at - Census Place St John's Ward, > Toronto, York, Ontario, Family History Library Film 1375882, NA Film > Number C-13246, District 134, Sub-district D, Division 1, Page Number 5, > Household Number 23. > > Two question - 1st who are the London family they stayed with in London > and 2nd where is Oak Lane/Lawn? Please > > Many thanks for any help you may be able to provide. > > Kind regards > > David > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

For Example, David. I am sending separately the birth of Edith ASHALL in 1878, York, Ontario, Canada. Barb, Ontario, Canada.

Hello David: I could help with the following information: Ontario, Canada (which includes Toronto, for example; but also other places in Ontario), during the years for........ Births..............................1869 to 1909 Marriages.......................1857 to 1924 Deaths............................1869 to 1934 1901 Canadian Census 1911 Canadian Census Canadian Passenger Lists...........................1865 to 1935 Very happy to help, but please include the full name, where born (if known), and a very helpful fact...........the Occupation. Barb, Ontario, Canada.

This is now on line. Very expensive!!!! Judy

Three of us (Sheila H / Jackie L / Barb Baker have recently made a "connection" and are researching the SIMPSON family from Shap, Westmorland and area. By using the Google search, we have found a Family Tree, posted by a Jeremy HODGKINSON in 2005, and it includes (what we think are) some of our SIMPSONs, going back to 1630 with a Martin SIMPSON. By chance is Jeremy HODGKINSON a member of this list ?? We are hoping so !! Barb, Ontario, Canada.

Dear Dot, I think I have had some correspondence with you some years ago, as you appear on my family tree! I shall send a short report giving brief details of Robert Thompson's siblings and parents, to you directly. One of his brothers was Miles Thompson, the architect, and you will find that there is a pub names after him in Kendal! I can send you more details in due course, but here is a bit to be going on with. Robert Thompson was my GG grandfather - and I think he must have been yours also - am I right? Jane Rimmer (née Thompson) On 30 Mar 2009, at 22:09, Dot wrote: > At last after researching other branches of my family for years I > will soon be visiting Kendal to follow up this family. > I am particularly looking for the parents and siblings of Robert > THOMPSON b1810 d 1880. Does anyone have any details on them. Are the > Bishops Transcripts available for searching? > Thanks > Dot > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

CUMBERLAND AND WESTMORLAND WRESTLING. The annual meeting of the Cumberland and Westmorland Wrestling Society was held yesterday, at Lillie Bridge, London. The twelve-stone London prize was won by J. WANNOP, of Carlisle, beating H. GRAHAM, Carlisle. The champion prize for men of all weights fell to George STEADMAN, of Drybeck, beating LOUDEN, of Frizington. The country prize for 11-1/2 stone men was won by FREARS, of Frizington. Foot racing and pole jumping filled up the programme. The meeting was a great success, some 10,000 people being on the ground, and the weather, except for a light shower, beautifully fine.

"THWAITE" AND ITS MEANINGS. Mr. B. KIRKBY, Batley, supplies the following references, in answer to "J.D." in No. 1, 144:- THWAITE is Norse or Scandinavian for a clearing of wood, and exists in THWAITES, MICKLETHWAITE. Domestic Book forms of it are MUCEBTNOIT, MUCELTUIT (MICKLETHWAITE). - "Ancient Bingley", J. Horsfall TURNER.). THWAITE - A piece of land cut off by a fence, or enclosed, a fell or meadow. Icel. pveit or pveiti. The root is found in A.S. thwitan, to chop or cut off (CHAUCER). TWAITE, CUMBERLAND dialect, to white q.v. Thwaites, in Lakeland, were originally fields or meadows fenced or cut off. In this acceptation we have thwiates or meadows on the margin of Coniston Lake. So in Icelandic, of a piece of land or paddock of land, in which language it seems to have been originally used of an outlying cottage with its paddock. The modern sense of pveitit in Icelandic is the brim of dry meadow land that gradually inclines towards bogland. From being a field name, thwaite gradually, in Cumberland and Westmorland, became applied to farms, and then to villages and parishes, as The Thwaite, near Coniston, Seathwaite, Ormthwaite, Crossthwaite, Bassenthwaite. And in this sense, it is of very frequent application in Norway and Denmark. Tvoet, Dan. tvcede; or thwaite, a surname; and the word thwaite is also found as a surname in High Furness. There are several names ending in thwaite almost identical in Norway and Lakeland:- LAKELAND. The Thwaite. Applethwaite. Birthvet. Branthwaite. Braithwaite. Seathwaite. Ruthwaite. NORWAY. Thveit, Thveilor. Eplthvet, Borthvet. Brandsthvet. Sjothvet. Rugthviet. ("Lakeland and Iceland," by REV. T. ELLWOOD.) THWAITE or THWAITES is frequently met with in the West Riding and the North of England as a surname. In West Yorkshire it is commonly pronounced Twaite: farther north it is Waite. In Westmorland to thwite or white a stick is to cut or shave it with a knife. Scholar lads or dilatory messengers are ordered to "white ther stick", i.e. to "cut their stick" or bow off and quickly. Occasionally, with the older generation in Yorkshire, a carving knife is spoken of as "t'whittle". "Whittle-gait" in Cumberland and Westmorland was not many years ago the right of food a schoolmaster or clergyman had at the table of his patrons. A form of banter for the natives of one northern village was, " _____ caris whittle ta t' tree." The explanation of which was, they had only one carving knife for the township, and for convenience, it was kept in communal fashion in the bark of a tree on the village green. Any one requiring it when it was out, was to make known his wants in these words. A form of expletive is Ord-twhite-ta, or Odtwhite-t-rops-o-tha, or Od-twhite-t-leets-o-tha, which seems to be an imprecation of a cruel meaning when we associate twhite with its old sense of hewing down, or cutting to pieces. ===========================================================================================================================

CASUALTY LISTS. ADDITIONS AND CORRECTIONS. The War Office issued the following lists of casualties yesterday: ADDITIONAL CASUALTIES, SPITZ KOP, July 22 Second Essex - Cpl. H. GORDON, killed. First Derby - L.-Cpt. W. MARRIOTT, dangerously wounded. Eighteenth Co. Imperial Yeomanry -Pte. J. BROWN (slightly_ Westmorland & Cumberland Yeomary (attached to 8th Hussars) - Lieut C. C. WILSON, severely wounded, thigh and stomach.