Bev Can't see anyone of the correct age/origin in my version of the 1851 or 1861. There are a couple of the right age but born Lancs or Westmorland not Cumberland. There is John a Pauper in Kendal in 1851 but he was aged 40 therefore born about 1811 in Hawkeshead. Nothing comes up under prisoner for any county. John -----Original Message----- From: Bev Kirby [mailto:bev@inkmatehillcrest.co.za] Sent: 05 October 2009 12:20 To: eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] 1851UK CENSUS- JOHN KNIPE Regretfully, I no longer have access to Anc.com and have tried on GenesReunited but have had no luck. Please can some kind person look up John KNIPE b 1818 Cumberland in the 1851 census- especially prisoners. He went missing- and I have just found out that he was declared insolvent in 1844 so he probably spent the 1851 census separated from his family and in jail!!!!!!! Thank you- Bev Kirby- Durban South Africa ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Regretfully, I no longer have access to Anc.com and have tried on GenesReunited but have had no luck. Please can some kind person look up John KNIPE b 1818 Cumberland in the 1851 census- especially prisoners. He went missing- and I have just found out that he was declared insolvent in 1844 so he probably spent the 1851 census separated from his family and in jail!!!!!!! Thank you- Bev Kirby- Durban South Africa

In a message dated 04/10/2009 22:32:21 GMT Daylight Time, bbaker48@sympatico.ca writes: Another New York Passenger and Immigration List shows: Hello Again, Sheila: Do you think that your HERMAN family might have gone to the U.S.A. ? I've found this Robert HERMAN travelling in 1832 to New York from Liverpool; he is age 4 which would tie in with his birth date of abt. 1828. Just a thought ! Barb, Ontario, Canada. ________________________________________________________ Robert HERMAN Arrival Date 27 Mar 1832 Age: 4 Port of Arrival: New York Port of Departure: Liverpool Destination: New York Ship: "Citizen" No other details than this. Barb. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Hello Barb Many thanks for your help with my HERMAN family. I think we have communicated in the past relating to my BECK's. Sophia Herman married Joseph Beck in 1863 Milnthorpe. Sophia being the daughter of John HERMAN. I have been trying without any real success to sort these HERMAN's. There were a number of HERMAN's in the Liverpool area and I'm sure that a Professor of Music at a school there, had links to my Thomas HERMAN born in 1801. So far I have not set that relationship. Robert HERMAN appears on the 1841 census at home with his parents, so its doubtful that he is the 4yr old passenger. The other list I have not been able to identify his marriage and have not progressed on this one. If you come up with anything else, I will be very interested. Many thanks, Sheila

I don't know if they are related to me, but thanks for the article. My ancestor Robert Wells married Elizabeth Powley in Morland in 1609. Robert was born at Shap so I don't know whether her family was from Morland or Shap. Obviously, I know very little about the Powley family. John B. Wells III John B. Wells III District Manager Colonial Insurance 770-683-6830(O) 678-378-6294(Cell) 770-683-8002(Fax) wellsga@bellsouth.net --- On Sun, 10/4/09, AClemmett@aol.com <AClemmett@aol.com> wrote: From: AClemmett@aol.com <AClemmett@aol.com> Subject: Re: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] New Subscriber To: eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Date: Sunday, October 4, 2009, 5:58 PM Hi John, I dont know if you are aware but there are Powley`s in Asby from 1671 to  1779. The family were clock makers during this period and a good article on  them is on line by Brian Loomes @ _http://www.brianloomes.com/collecting/powleys_ (http://www.brianloomes.com/collecting/powleys) well worth a read.Hope it helps.                                                Arthur Clemmett ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

John, Do you have an interest in the Powleys of Levens? Stephen --- On Sun, 4/10/09, John Wells <wellsga@bellsouth.net> wrote: From: John Wells <wellsga@bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] New Subscriber To: eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Date: Sunday, 4 October, 2009, 4:13 PM Hello! I'm continuing to research the Wells, Powley and Rigg families of Shap and Morland in Westmorland from 1650 and earlier. I will be happy to share any information I have found. Cheers! John B. Wells Newnan, Georgia "Way Down South In Dixie" wellsga@bellsouth.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I don't know. My ancestor Robert Wells married Elizabeth Powley in Morland in 1609. Robert was born at Shap so I don't know whether her family was from Morland or Shap. Obviously, I know very little about the Powley family. John B. Wells III District Manager Colonial Insurance 770-683-6830(O) 678-378-6294(Cell) 770-683-8002(Fax) wellsga@bellsouth.net --- On Sun, 10/4/09, STEPHEN READ <castleblack@btinternet.com> wrote: From: STEPHEN READ <castleblack@btinternet.com> Subject: Re: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] New Subscriber and POWLEY To: eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Date: Sunday, October 4, 2009, 2:29 PM John, Do you have an interest in the Powleys of Levens? Stephen --- On Sun, 4/10/09, John Wells <wellsga@bellsouth.net> wrote: From: John Wells <wellsga@bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] New Subscriber To: eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Date: Sunday, 4 October, 2009, 4:13 PM Hello! I'm continuing to research the Wells, Powley and Rigg families of Shap and Morland in Westmorland from 1650 and earlier. I will be happy to share any information I have found. Cheers! John B. Wells Newnan, Georgia "Way Down South In Dixie" wellsga@bellsouth.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi John, I dont know if you are aware but there are Powley`s in Asby from 1671 to 1779. The family were clock makers during this period and a good article on them is on line by Brian Loomes @ _http://www.brianloomes.com/collecting/powleys_ (http://www.brianloomes.com/collecting/powleys) well worth a read.Hope it helps. Arthur Clemmett

Another New York Passenger and Immigration List shows: Hello Again, Sheila: Do you think that your HERMAN family might have gone to the U.S.A. ? I've found this Robert HERMAN travelling in 1832 to New York from Liverpool; he is age 4 which would tie in with his birth date of abt. 1828. Just a thought ! Barb, Ontario, Canada. ________________________________________________________ Robert HERMAN Arrival Date 27 Mar 1832 Age: 4 Port of Arrival: New York Port of Departure: Liverpool Destination: New York Ship: "Citizen" No other details than this. Barb.

Hi everyone I'm a new subscriber to this list, and would be keen to hear from anyone who has connections to the Redmans of Levens and Harewood. Ruth in Hambledon, Hampshire "The Cradle of Cricket"

Hello Sheila: There is a New York Passenger List dated May 10, which shows: (the writing is difficult to read ! and, there are no headings above each column) Robert HERMAN, age 41, Mechanic, Germany Susanna(?) HERMAN, age 43, Female, Wife Axel HERMAN, age 8, ditto marks under "Female", Child ?albey(? HERMAN, age 7, ditto marks under "Female" Child Harold HERMAN, age 6, Male Child The ship is the "City of London" Port of Departure: Liverpool, England Destination: United States of America Place of Origin: Germany Ethnicity/Race/Nationality: German Port of Arrival: New York Hope this helps a bit; I'll see what else I can dig up. Barb.

Hello I continue to search for the background of John HERMAN of Milnthorpe - born 1821 in Germany. His parents appear on the Appleby 1841 census - Isabella & Thomas HERMAN both born in 1801 and as the place of birth is blank, I have assumed they also were born in Germany.… After that, I cannot find anything on them. On the 1841 census they also record Isabella born in 1833, Robert 1828 and William 1831. all being born in Westmorland. The HERMAN spelling sometimes appears as HERRMANN or HEMAUER I would love to be able to move on this family. Maybe someone will be able to help me Best Wishes, Sheila

Hi Ruth, I have an interest in the Redman / Redeman / Redmayne / Redmond family, as originally mentioned in the person of Matthew de Redeman, Seneschal of Kendal, co. Westmorland, circa 1260 (seneschal was a steward and recorder) [Ref.: "The History of Westmorland & Cumberland", by Nicholson & Burns (1777), page 130, which describes how two men in particular were the leading witnesses to a grant made by William de Lancastre:- Gilbert(2) de Kirketon, Under-sheriff of Westmorland to the hereditary High Sheriff, Robert de Veteri Ponte (Vipont), and the said Matthew de Redeman, Seneschal. Matthew likely at that time bore a blazon bearing three cushions as charges, probably in various combinations of tinctures and metals. I have a certain amount of data about particularly the Redmaynes of Brathay Hall, Ambleside, if they are connected and are of interest, and would be very willing to compare notes. Jonathan Kirton, Canada

Good afternoon, I am interested in corresponding with anyone who has access to Morland records. I am researching my ancestor Richard Wells who was christened at Morland in 1618. The family disappeared from Morland parish records in 1625 and Richard left Gravesend for America in 1635. I am most curious to determine why he left and why the family left Morland. John B. Wells III Newnan, Georgia "Way Down South In Dixie" wellsga@bellsouth.net --- On Sun, 10/4/09, John Wells <wellsga@bellsouth.net> wrote: From: John Wells <wellsga@bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] New Subscriber To: eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Date: Sunday, October 4, 2009, 11:13 AM Hello! I'm continuing to research the Wells, Powley and Rigg families of Shap and Morland in Westmorland from 1650 and earlier. I will be happy to share any information I have found. Cheers! John B. Wells Newnan, Georgia "Way Down South In Dixie" wellsga@bellsouth.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello! I'm continuing to research the Wells, Powley and Rigg families of Shap and Morland in Westmorland from 1650 and earlier. I will be happy to share any information I have found. Cheers! John B. Wells Newnan, Georgia "Way Down South In Dixie" wellsga@bellsouth.net

PENRITH HERALD and EAST CUMBERLAND and WESTMORLAND NEWS. NO. 438-Sixth Week in Quarter Registered for Transmission Abroad. SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 7, 1874. PRICE 1D. THE elections, at the time we write, are not far enough over to enable us to know how many workman representatives have been returned to the new Parliament. One paper calculated that at least six candidates of this class would be able this week to write M.P. to their names. Great efforts have been put forth by the trades unionists to secure direct labour representatives in Parliament, and there need be no surprise if these efforts, in some cases, have proved successful. MR. MACDONALD, the workman candidate for Stafford, had substantial pecuniary assistance from the Fifeshire miners. They voted a considerable sum towards his election expenses,and a capitation contribution towards his costs of living when in Parliament. MR. GLADSTONE, in a letter addressed to an old friend of the Liberal cause, has made known, plainly enough, what his views are on this subject of working-men candidates. The letter was apparently intended to assist the candidature of MR. HOWELL, whose name is pretty familiar in connection with working-class movements, and he begins by saying, "I have always been very anxious that some representatives of the working men should find their way into the House of Commons." One result at least of labour representation will be the removal of a cause of discontent which has always been made much of by professional agitators.

PENRITH HERALD and EAST CUMBERLAND and WESTMORLAND NEWS. NO. 438-Sixth Week in Quarter Registered for Transmission Abroad. SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 7, 1874. PRICE 1D. ILLINGWORTH, INGHAM & CO., of Leeds, makers of School Furniture, have bought "WARD'S PATENT", and are sole proprietors of the LEEDS REVERSIBLE SCHOOL DESK, which makes Desk, Table, or Seat. Write for photos and prices. _________________________________________________________________ RHEUMATISM AND NEURALGIA. - Sufferers from these complaints should use Gardiner's Rheumatic Compound, in bottles each 1s. 1-1/2d., 2s. 9d., & 4s. 6d. Gardiner's Rheumatic Compound. Order from your own Chemist. Wholesale of Barclay & Co., & other Wholesale Chemists London. _________________________________________________________________ WHELPTON'S VEGETABLE PURIFYING PILLS have for more than 35 years proved their value in Diseases of the Head, Chest, Liver, Kidneys, and Digestive Organs. They are a direct Purifier of the Blood, and in all Skin Complaints one of the best Medicines known. Sold by G. WHELPTON & SON, 3, Crane-court, Fleet-street, and may be had of Chemists and Medicine Vendors. Sent free to any part of the kingdom on receipt of 8, 14, or 33 stamps. __________________________________________________________________ RHEUMATISM. - Elliman's Universal Embrocation is the most efficacious remedy extant. Of all chemists 1s.1-1/2d. 4 oz., and 2s. 9d. a 10-oz. bottle. __________________________________________________________________ A handsome and useful Almanack for 1874 can be had gratis, ON APPLYING TO EITHER OF THE 3248 agents for Horniman's celebrated Pure Teas in Packets. __________________________________________________________________ 750 STONE BREAKERS AND ORE CRUSHERS in use. Catalogues of Patentee, and only maker of the well-known BLAKE machine, with NEW PATENT CUBING JAW, H.R. MARSDEN, Soho Foundry, Leeds. ___________________________________________________________________ THOSE about to buy a Soda-water Machine should write to N. G. WILCOCKS, Back-street, Bath, Somerset, who will send, post-free, full particulars of his celebrated machine for making every aerated drink. *********************************************************************************************

PENRITH HERALD and EAST CUMBERLAND and WESTMORLAND NEWS. NO. 438-Sixth Week in Quarter Registered for Transmission Abroad. SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 7, 1874. PRICE 1D. THE LATE FATAL FIGHT AT BIRMINGHAM. At the Public Office, Birmingham, the men FRANKLIN, YARDLEY, and BRADLEY, were brought up on the charge of causing the death of ALFRED FOSTER, in a boxing match between FRANKLIN and FOSTER, at the Army and Navy Inn, Barford-street. After hearing the evidence, MR. KYNNERSLEY said he thought it extremely doubtful, after the verdict of the coroner's jury, if the grand jury would find a true bill against the prisoners, who were accordingly discharged. ____________________________________________________________________ FROM BERLIN we learn that the Ultramontane priest MGR. BOEDDINGHAUS, of Munster, who has gone through a period of imprisonment for political press offences committed in his capacity of manager of an Ultramontane print, has received a letter expressing sympathy and approbation in warm terms from ARCHBISHOP MANNING. ____________________________________________________________________ THE PEACE SOCIETY AND THE ELECTION. - The Peace Society have issued an election manifesto, in which, while disclaiming political propagandism, they point out that it is the duty of each one to avail himself of every opportunity for exerting a personal influence in securing, as far as possible, the election of a body of national representatives who, while avoiding any errors of the past, may steadfastly follow, in the future, those examples which wise and able statesmen have given in the promotion of that "Peace on earth and Good Will to men" which all right-minded persons must earnestly desire. ____________________________________________________________________ A PROFESSOR of legerdemain entertained a village audience which was principally composed of colliers. After "astonishing the natives" with various tricks - metamorphosing wine into water, &c., - he asked the loan of a half-penny from one of the audience. A collier, after a little hesitation, handed out the coin, which the juggler speedily exhibited, as he said, transformed into a guinea. "An' is that my bawbee?" exclaimed the collier. "Undoubtedly", answered the juggler. "Let's see't," said the collier, and, turning it round and round in examination, with an ecstacy of delight, he thanked the juggler for his kindness, and putting it into his pocket, said, "I'se warn't ye'll no turn't into a bawbee again." ___________________________________________________________________ A "NATIONAL PARTY" IN FRANCE. - A Paris correspondent says: From another source in Paris I learn that PRINCE NAPOLEON now seeks to found "a national party," having at its head young men, deputies, councillors-general, &c. "Sans engagements dans le pass", and having for its motto "Liberty, democracy, and national sovereignty". PRINCE NAPOLEON's propaganda, I am also told, is more active and successful in the provinces than in the capital. __________________________________________________________________ GERMANY AND ENGLAND. - From an article in the Spener Gazette, it appears that the Protestant meetings in London have given great satisfaction in Germany, it being evident that Ultramontane France can now no longer look to England for support in any plans of revenge. Belgium, it is hoped, will see by the London meetings on what a steep and dangerous decline the country is being led by hostility towards Germany, and by the unchecked action of the Jesuits.

John Brisco of Crofton, in the Parish of Thursby, co Cumberland D.D. rector of ORTON, and Vicar of Aspatria (Musgraves territory) married Catherine, b. 1706 Their son, Sir John Brisco of Crofton, Bart, so created 4 June 1762 married  Catherine-Alice, daughter of Gilbert Fane Fleming Esq. by Lady Camilla Bennet, daughter of Charles, Earl of Tankerville Their son, Sir Wastell Brisco, of Crofton, Bart, born 1779 co-heir with Hylton Joliffe of the blood of Hilton (The Hiltons of Hylton Castle, Monkwearmouth, now City of Sunderland) Source; Pedigree of Hilton of Hilton from The Hiltons of Hylton Castle by Eric William Lamberton, sourced from Surtees' History and Antiquities of the County Palatine of Durham Thanks for your help AncestryUK, Family Heritage International, Box No.90, The "Original" Washington, England NE37 OYP

Shawn That is the other Orton near Carlisle. There is of course a Hilton near Appleby, but no Castle just a Hall unless the name got changed. Something in the back of my mind puts a Hilton Castle near to Winton, but for the life of me I can not find it. John -----Original Message----- From: shawn [mailto:shawn-shaw@talktalk.net] Sent: 28 September 2009 22:36 To: Webmaster@AncestryUK.com; eng-westmorland@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] HILTON CASTLE near Kirkby Stephen Try http://www.stevebulman.f9.co.uk/cumbria/orton_f.html "Hylton Castle, about 2½ miles S.E. of Orton," that is towards Kelleth and would make it some 20 miles or so SW of Kirkby Stephen. http://www.stevebulman.f9.co.uk/cumbria/1901/orton.html informs us that “BALDWIN HOLME township comprises about 2,415 acres, of which the gross estimated rental is £2,934, the ratable value of the land £2,039, and of the buildings £598. The principal landowners are Nicholas Thompson, Esq., John Twentyman, Herbert Hayes, John Harrison, and J.B. Watson. The township contains a small village of its own name, and also Orton Rigg, Little Orton, and Woodhouses. Orton Park, formerly called Hylton Castle, is a beautiful mansion, erected in 1839 by Sir Wastel Brisco. It is now the residence of Mr. N. Thompson, who purchased the estate in 1880. Tempest Tower is the name of a farmhouse in Little Orton, erected by James and Ruth Sibson in 1875. The stone tower, with its battlemented parapet, is a conspicuous object for miles around. Bulmer's History & Directory Of Cumberland, 1901” Hope this gives the lead you are looking for. -----Original Message----- From: eng-westmorland-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-westmorland-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Family Heritage International Sent: 28 September 2009 13:43 To: ENG-WESTMORLAND@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] HILTON CASTLE near Kirkby Stephen We are trying to find the exact location of Hilton Castle, near Kirkby Stephen which is shown in this photograph from the Bowes Collection at Bowes Museum. http://www.thebowesmuseum.org.uk/collections/objects/category/10/11908/ The Post office in Kirkby Stephen had never heard of it. We have reason to believe it might have been in Borrowdale, Westmoreland (not Borrowdale, Cumberland) Can anyone help? Eric AncestryUK, Family Heritage International, Box No.90, The "Original" Washington, England NE37 OYP ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Might the Hilton in question be Hilton, near Appleby-in-Westmorland. Interestingly, Hilton, in spite of being a very small village has a street called 'Castle Street'... might be worth checking out. Good luck Julian -----Original Message----- From: eng-westmorland-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-westmorland-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Family Heritage International Sent: 28 September 2009 13:43 To: ENG-WESTMORLAND@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-WESTMORLAND] HILTON CASTLE near Kirkby Stephen We are trying to find the exact location of Hilton Castle, near Kirkby Stephen which is shown in this photograph from the Bowes Collection at Bowes Museum. http://www.thebowesmuseum.org.uk/collections/objects/category/10/11908/ The Post office in Kirkby Stephen had never heard of it. We have reason to believe it might have been in Borrowdale, Westmoreland (not Borrowdale, Cumberland) Can anyone help? Eric AncestryUK, Family Heritage International, Box No.90, The "Original" Washington, England NE37 OYP ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WESTMORLAND-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message