Kia Ora Carol Sorry I don't have access to the census apart from the 1881 online! Your info about the number of Baptisms per day means that I have been very lucky indeed to find the ones I have in Brum.! If you are looking at RC they might be in Latin eg My James was Jacobus! His wife Jane became Johanna. Maths was obviously a problem for some families- I have that too and is often relected in Death Certs where the Informant has no idea, especially at a time of stress. One more possibility is that the Marriages took place ina Registry Office which in my experience occuredwith "mixed" marriages. Good Luck Marlene New Zealand ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol Thomas" <carolthomas2@googlemail.com> To: <eng-warks-birmingham@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, October 02, 2009 4:38 AM Subject: Re: [B'ham] Miller/Standley > Hi Marlene > > Thanks for all this. Yes, I am aware of the limitations of the IGI, in > fact > I rarely use it but sometimes it's worth a shot. I am lucky enough to > live > near Birmingham, so I have looked at the microfilms of the registers I > quoted. The population was becoming huge at that time, with only a few > churches to serve it, and to look through even one year's worth of > baptisms > took hours. There were several baptisms taking place every day in St > Philip's and St Martin's as I remember. > > As far as James and Eliza's ages go, his is consistent throughout the > censuses, giving a birth date of 1805, but on the death certificate dated > 1873 his age is given as 73, giving a birth year of 1800. I have looked > within that date range and a bit to either side. Eliza is more difficult: > 1851, aged ?38 (or 35, enumerator's mark through the number) b. Roscommon > Ireland; 1861, aged 38, b. Birmingham; 1871, aged 54, b. Birmingham; 1881; > aged 75, widow living with son James, b. Sheffield. On her death > certificate (1885) her age is given as 77. I am pretty sure that she is > the > same person throughout as the children were all the same and the residence > was too. > > I had more or less assumed that James was their eldest son as the > tradition > seems to have been to use either James or William for sons' names. Having > said that James senior would have been 44 when James jnr. was born in > 1844, > which seems quite old to me. From the censuses they had only two other > children - William, b 1847 and Caroline b 1852. I have not seen any > evidence of baptisms so far. I suppose it is possible that they had other > children in Birmingham who did not travel to Wales with them, or died. > > I don't know about their religion. I hope to look at the Roman Catholic > registers in Birmingham before too long, and maybe they will provide a > clue. > Certainly by the time they were in Wales, their local church was CofE, and > their children were eventually buried in that graveyard (and it looks as > if > the burial was certified by someone other than the local vicar or curate, > meaning that the family could have been non-conformist by then). > > Best wishes > Carol > > -----Original Message----- > From: eng-warks-birmingham-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:eng-warks-birmingham-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Marlene > Shipman > Sent: 01 October 2009 12:54 > To: eng-warks-birmingham@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [B'ham] Miller/Standley > > > Hi Carol > Several matters to watch here! First the IGI is far from complete. Second > beware of Members Submissions Look for extracted records and you > should then get the film from the Mormon Family centre near to you and > check > > the entry. > Thirdly as Eliza changes her place of birth have you checked that the ages > correspond? It is possible that James married more than once to an Eliza! > I > note that in the 1881 census Eliza Miller widow is living with her son > James and is aged 75 thus born c1806. In 1851 you say she was 35 thus born > 1816 > > Did James Junior have any siblings? Have you tracked all of them to > determine commmon factors such as occupations, locations, forenames being > used for example > It may be necessary to purchase the birth certificates of other children > to > > determine the mother's surname. > You don't mention whether the family was Cof E or RC or non conformist? > Not > all records are available to the Mormon Church. > Good Luck > Marlene > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carol Thomas" <carolthomas2@googlemail.com> > To: <eng-warks-birmingham@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, October 01, 2009 9:46 PM > Subject: [B'ham] Miller/Standley > > >>I have recently discovered that my greatgreatgrandfather, James Miller, >>was born in Birmingham, and am hoping for some advice about how to >>trace his birth/baptism and possibly that of his wife, Eliza Standley. >> >> He appears on the 1851 census for Rhosymedre, which is near Ruabon, >> North Wales, and is a tinman, aged 46, born Birmingham. His wife is >> Eliza, aged 35, born Roscommon, Ireland. >> >> The 1841 census for this area is missing, so I don't know when they >> would have moved to Wales, except that it had to be before April 1844 >> as his son James was born in Rhosymedre then. >> >> In subsequent censuses, up to his death in 1875, he was described as a >> tin >> plate worker, and on his death certificate a master tin man. Eliza >> variously gives her place of birth as Roscommon, Birmingham and >> Sheffield. James is listed in a couple of trade directories as a tin >> plate worker and umbrella maker. >> >>>From his age on the various censuses, and on his death certificate, I >>>think >> he was born between 1800 and 1805. I have looked at the parish >> registers for St Philip's, St Martin's and St Peter and St Paul's >> (Aston), St Paul's in the Jewellery quarter, and St Mary's, Whittall >> Street for likely baptisms, but couldn't find any Millers at all. I >> would be extremely grateful for any suggestions about which other >> churches might have been in existence in the locality at the time - or >> any ideas at all really about how to find out a bit more. I haven't >> looked for their marriage yet, other than >> on the IGI which didn't yield anything obvious. >> >> Best wishes >> Carol >> >> _____________________________________________ >> _____________________________________________ >> >> Research in Birmingham: http://www.bham.de/ >> >> Any problems, please contact the List Admin: >> ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-admin@rootsweb.com >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > _____________________________________________ > _____________________________________________ > > Research in Birmingham: http://www.bham.de/ > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: > ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > _____________________________________________ > _____________________________________________ > > Research in Birmingham: http://www.bham.de/ > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: > ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message