hi, can you find a Charlotte of the correct age & place in earlier censuses? Where was mother Charlotte born? She may have changed her name. I think it's quite likely William made up a father's name. My great grandfather was illegitemate but named a father on his marriage cert. Jane     --- On Fri, 12/6/09, Stephen <familytree@tinfoil.cotse.net> wrote: From: Stephen <familytree@tinfoil.cotse.net> Subject: [B'ham] Brickwall: William Gumbley, son of Charlotte, born c1840? To: eng-warks-birmingham@rootsweb.com Cc: matt@gumbley.me.uk Date: Friday, 12 June, 2009, 11:15 AM Hello, I have been banging my head against a brick wall for a year; can anyone help me? William Gumbley married Charlotte Morris in 1860. According to the marriage records, William's father was Edwin Gumbley, a shoemaker, and his mother was Charlotte Gumbley. This gets confusing because there are now two Charlotte Gumbleys: William's mother and William's wife. I have not been able to find any trace of Edwin Gumbley in the censuses or BMD records. I wonder if he ever existed? It would appear that Charlotte Gumbley (William's mother) married Charles Styles in 1852. In the 1861 census, William and Charlotte (William's wife) are listed as living with William's half-brother Richard Styles. So far, so good. I assumed that Charlotte Gumbley married Edwin Gumbley and had a son, William, born circa 1840; that Edwin died and that Charlotte later remarried Charles Styles. The problem is that the marriage records state that Charlotte (William's mother) was a spinster at the time of her marriage to Charles Styles. So either way one of the marriage records must be wrong: Is Charlotte's (the mother's) marriage to Charles Styles incorrect that she was a spinster: did she lie to avoid bigamy or was this an innocent mistake by whoever recorded it? Or is William's marriage to Charlotte (his wife) wrong to record Edwin Gumbley as his father? Was William the illegitimate son of Charlotte? Was the name Edwin Gumbley invented by William at the time of his marriage? Or was it invented by Charlotte; was William bought up believing his lost father was Edwin? William should have been born c1840. There is no birth certificate for him that I can find. Freebmd lists two William Gumbleys born 1840 but Birmingham register office say this is a mistake and there is only one. The birth that was registered was to different parents and that William and his family can be found in the censuses, so I know they are different people. Is there any way I can find William's birth? Is there any way I can find William's father? Perhaps the earlier censuses would help but I can't even find Charlotte Gumbley (the mother) in these. Help! Thanks, Stephen. _____________________________________________ _____________________________________________ Research in Birmingham: http://www.bham.de/ Any problems, please contact the List Admin: ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-WARKS-BIRMINGHAM-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message