Hi Esther, I have just had a quick read of your message. One thought about Hilda Tonkiss - is she related to the famous Todmorden Sculpter called Henry Tonkiss? If there is a link you may be interested in a book available at Todmorden Library about him. I will check my records for any info I might have on the other names and let you know at a later stage. Good hunting. Andrea ---------- From: Esther Bramley[SMTP:bramleytree@hotmail.com] Sent: 30 May 2002 11:22 To: ENG-TODMORDEN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-TOD] jacob edgar firth Hi As i sit here listening to my music, I wonder whether any body has any links to my family, as all the lead i have posted pon verias pages seem to fail. So i decided to start another on one that i am sure that lived. I have come to a conclusion that it is me.. not looking in the right places, as i seem not to be very good at this sort of thing. But having the father of my girlfriedn a Rodger Fentiman... whos family tree goes back numerus centeries, i have him to nudge me right. And i am no way going to stop. I decided to try and get some information about a Jacob Edgar Firth,(my gg grandfather, mother was marry ann/mallt, father james firth) married to Annie crossley. I have found from the 1881 Census that Jacob was born on the 14th august 1865, in Todmorden.He lived at 17 Broad Street, todmoeden (this information i got from the Comenwealth war graves commision while looking up his son) He worked in a cotten warehouse. i Have no other information on his wife Annie, but have a lot of information on their children. John Willie Firth, B.14 October 1889 he was killed in action in France on Monday 11 december 1916 aged 27. he is buried in the Combles communial cemetery extension in somme, france. Grave/pannel number II. F. 12. Jim firth married a hilda tonkiss, giing birth to my granney Dorothy, and her two two brothers Eric and John. Norah Firth, Married a arthur bedford and a bill wright. Norah wasa nurse who whent out to india... she has a page in the book.. todmorden chameo's Mary hannah firth... Emily Ada Gracie (these four i havbe not got much info on) any infor mation that you have wilkl be greatly recieved esther _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ==== ENG-TODMORDEN Mailing List ==== C J Genealogy http://www.dreamwater.net/genealogy/Lists.htm http://freespace.virgin.net/genealogical.collections ============================== To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

Hi As i sit here listening to my music, I wonder whether any body has any links to my family, as all the lead i have posted pon verias pages seem to fail. So i decided to start another on one that i am sure that lived. I have come to a conclusion that it is me.. not looking in the right places, as i seem not to be very good at this sort of thing. But having the father of my girlfriedn a Rodger Fentiman... whos family tree goes back numerus centeries, i have him to nudge me right. And i am no way going to stop. I decided to try and get some information about a Jacob Edgar Firth,(my gg grandfather, mother was marry ann/mallt, father james firth) married to Annie crossley. I have found from the 1881 Census that Jacob was born on the 14th august 1865, in Todmorden.He lived at 17 Broad Street, todmoeden (this information i got from the Comenwealth war graves commision while looking up his son) He worked in a cotten warehouse. i Have no other information on his wife Annie, but have a lot of information on their children. John Willie Firth, B.14 October 1889 he was killed in action in France on Monday 11 december 1916 aged 27. he is buried in the Combles communial cemetery extension in somme, france. Grave/pannel number II. F. 12. Jim firth married a hilda tonkiss, giing birth to my granney Dorothy, and her two two brothers Eric and John. Norah Firth, Married a arthur bedford and a bill wright. Norah wasa nurse who whent out to india... she has a page in the book.. todmorden chameo's Mary hannah firth... Emily Ada Gracie (these four i havbe not got much info on) any infor mation that you have wilkl be greatly recieved esther _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com

Linda, I have been rather diverted since borrowing Linda Croft's and Richard Law's books through Inter-Library Loans. I am still trying to get through those in between living! but they have helped me to appreciate the scale of the FIELDEN and BARKER names in Tod. I have done a rough draft of the names in Ramshaw's "Concerning Todmorden Parish". It is not a big book A5 size (143 pp.) but the binding is in a poor condition and it is only on loan so I do not want to make it worse. I will send, off-list, my draft of the above names and if there are any parts or pics that you think are relevant then I will scan those and send them to you off-list. You will be rather "hors de combat" when you get your 1841 Lancs. Census. I hope you will be able to check on a couple of my missing folk in due course when you have mastered it. Best wishes, Ernest ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda" <Linda.Briggs1@btinternet.com> To: <ENG-TODMORDEN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 10:31 PM

Ernest, Thank you for those strays. I shall file them away for future reference. I will let you know when I get my 1841 of Lancashire so I can return the favour. How goes the indexing of your book? Is it a big book, or could you scan or photocopy it? Linda

Dear Listers, While searching the Lancs 1891 CDs I came across the following CROSSLEYs with possible connections to Tod. &c. : 48 Peel Street, Littleborough 12/3341 Page 5 Samuel CROSSLEY H.M. 56 Moulder in Iron - Employed - Bo. Yorks.Todmorden Mary A. CROSSLEY W.M. -ditto- Ada CROSSLEY D. S. 22 Cotton Operative - Employed - -ditto- Susan CROSSLEY D. S. 20 - ditto - - -ditto- William CROSSLEY S. S. 19 (Occupation unreadable) -ditto- Common Lodging House, James Hill Street, Littleborough Thomas CROSSLEY Ldger, Widower, Cotton Spinner - Employed - Lancs., Littleborough Fred CROSSLEY Ldger, S. Packer -ditto- - Ditto - Maybe they click with someone on the List. Regards to all, Ernest (Southport)

Jack, Perhaps we should buy it between us and have it 6 months each! Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack DAVIES" <jack@walsden.fsworld.co.uk> To: <ENG-TODMORDEN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 6:02 PM Subject: [ENG-TOD] Leeming & Travis Linda, There are a few Sutcliffes in the Millwood area in 1841 but no way of telling if they lived at Leeming Hall. I know Leeming Hall well, have lived in Tod. all my life and my wife used to live in that area when young(er). It was her that said, "You are not paying £90 for it." when I showed her the catalogue with the Travis book in. I don't know the seller at all. Jack ==== ENG-TODMORDEN Mailing List ==== Anglers Rest Indexes http://freespace.virgin.net/ar.indexes ============================== To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

Linda, There are a few Sutcliffes in the Millwood area in 1841 but no way of telling if they lived at Leeming Hall. I know Leeming Hall well, have lived in Tod. all my life and my wife used to live in that area when young(er). It was her that said, "You are not paying £90 for it." when I showed her the catalogue with the Travis book in. I don't know the seller at all. Jack

Jack, This is the first message I have received from you about Leeming Hall. The gremlins must have been at work. Leeming Hall was built in the early 1700's, and in 1824 was occupied by Mr. Samuel Sutcliffe, Gentleman. It was sold in 1910 by a William Henry Sutcliffe and Mr. James Crabtree, and in 1881 and 1891 was occupied by a Barker family. I would imagine it was occupied by Sutcliffes in 1841. It has a cottage attached which in 1881 and 1891 was enumerated as a separate household, although it was probably just one house originally. It faces Halifax Road and is on the corner of Millwood Lane. Thank you for trying, Linda

Jack, This book is sitting on my desk, looking at me, as I write. Unfortunately, it is on loan from the library. I have had it twelve months now, renewing it every three weeks as required. (when I remember) As no-one else wants to borrow it, the library is pleased to let me keep renewing it. It is my pride and joy. It contains many stories of my direct ancestors, including 3 x gt. grandfather and his drinking habits. It is clear the author knew these people personally from the way he describes their appearance, personalities etc. I have tried unsuccessfully to buy it from the library and other places. However, £90 seems a lot of money. Is this a normal amount for such a book? Do you know Bob Dobson? Is it worth contacting him to see if he would consider lending it to Archive CD Books for them to scan onto CD? I mentioned it to my husband who was horrified that I would even consider spending £90!! Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack DAVIES" I have just seen a catalogue issue to Calderdale FHS by Bob Dobson 'Acorns' 3 Staining Rise Staining Blackpool FY3 0BO 01253 8956678 Bob must among other things deal in old books. In it was Travis - Notes Historical & Biographical of Todmorden & District 1896 386pp new eps light cover wear £90 Anyone interested Jack Davies

Linda, This is the 4th time I have sent this message, if you have already received I apologise, but for some reason they have not been arriving back with me as normal so I am not sure if they have actually gone. Sorry but no success with Leeming Hall. I have searched through the Millwood area (where the hall is situated) a couple of times. The only addresses given are Millwood, Lower Laith and Hallroyd. Nothing is narrowed down further than that. If you have no names I cannot go further. Are you sure it was built in 1841? Jack Davies

Esther Sorry Esther, I have checked the 1841 census. There is no Ridge Street on it. James Firth would only be 15 in 1841 (according to your dates) so he would not yet be married and therefore no children. I do not know of a Ridge St. in Todmorden. There is a Ridgefoot and much later a Ridge Bank. The few Firths I have in the heads of household index I will check through later. Jack

I have just seen a catalogue issue to Calderdale FHS by Bob Dobson 'Acorns' 3 Staining Rise Staining Blackpool FY3 0BO 01253 8956678 Bob must among other things deal in old books. In it was Travis - Notes Historical & Biographical of Todmorden & District 1896 386pp new eps light cover wear £90 Anyone interested Jack Davies

Jack, please could you look up a James Firth in the 1841 census. He was born he was born on september 20th 1826, as this is the only on his birth that i have it may not be the exact date on wich he was born. In the other information that i have on him, he lived at 10 Ridge Street, Todmorden. In my notes his occupation is a wood sawer. He married a Mary Ann, her second name i have not yet found out. She was born in 1827. They had a number of childrenn, none of which were born before the 1841 census. I will give you some names incase it helps you. Feby, Mayjor Edward, Alice, Jacob Edgar. I hope that this information will help. I will be very greatfull for any information that you can give, conferm with the census or any other information that you have. if you could confirm the dater that i have already it will be very usesfull. Esther. _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com

Dear David, I have been through my own data and cannot help you I'm afraid. I could be more use to you if you find their parents names. There are some people on this list with data on the Barkers. I'm not sure about Cleggs, although a quick look in the St. Mary's register index tells me there are quite a few of them in Todmorden. You need the 1841 census of Stansfield, which comes under the Yorkshire section. Best wishes, Linda Message forwarded by List Owner - please do not reply to me. Regards, Carol, (Tree Tops) FAMILY TREE & WE'LL MEET AGAIN - Free Query Service: SKY NEWS British TV Text Pages 267 & 268, http://freespace.virgin.net/tree.tops/ http://www.dreamwater.net/genealogy/Index.htm ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -----Original Message----- From: robin45 <robin45@ntlworld.com> To: eng-todmorden-l-request@rootsweb.com <eng-todmorden-l-request@rootsweb.com> Date: 18 May, 2002 10:35 Subject: family ancester I,m trying to find info on Andrew Clegg b.1833 poss Stansfield Todmorden Lancs. married Sarah Ann Barker 1859 in Halifax Yorkshire. Thanks David Clegg

Message forwarded by List Owner - please do not reply to me. Regards, Carol, (Tree Tops) FAMILY TREE & WE’LL MEET AGAIN - Free Query Service: SKY NEWS British TV Text Pages 267 & 268, http://freespace.virgin.net/tree.tops/ http://www.dreamwater.net/genealogy/Index.htm ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -----Original Message----- From: robin45 <robin45@ntlworld.com> To: eng-todmorden-l-request@rootsweb.com <eng-todmorden-l-request@rootsweb.com> Date: 18 May, 2002 10:35 Subject: family ancester I,m trying to find info on Andrew Clegg b.1833 poss Stansfield Todmorden Lancs. married Sarah Ann Barker 1859 in Halifax Yorkshire. Thanks David Clegg

Kent, I also purchased the Baines Directory of Lancashire 1824/5 and agree entirely with your comments. The quality is excellent but the content is geared more to the larger towns and the "better off" folk. However, I find that Mr.White covers the topography and general descriptions of the areas better than Mr. Baines. His descriptive language is a joy to behold. I am enjoying reading his WRY Gazetteer. Linda

A brief CD review: I purchased the 1828/9 Pigot & Co. CD Lancashire Directory and the 1824/25 Lancashire Baines Directory from Archive CD. The scan quality is excellent and the CDs are formatted for both Macs and Windows. Excellent technical quality. Both contain interesting historical data about the larger cities, towns and villages of Lancashire. Witton and Lower Darwen for example are not mentioned, so far as I can find. Unless you know your family was gentry or merchant class, it will probably not be mentioned on these CDs. I found no listings for farmers, apprentices, factory workers etc. Summary: Great technical quality, interesting historical facts on cities and larger villages and towns, little or no information on ³common² persons. Kent Kirkham kkirkham2021@insightbb.com

Jack, Let's hope! As you have the 1841 for WRY, could you do me a favour and look up the inhabitants of Leeming Hall and Leeming Cottage, Millwood? I would appreciate it very much. Any favours I can return please ask. Linda

-----Original Message----- From: Jack DAVIES <jack@walsden.fsworld.co.uk> To: ENG-TODMORDEN-L@rootsweb.com <ENG-TODMORDEN-L@rootsweb.com> Date: 17 May, 2002 18:45 Subject: {not a subscriber} 1841 census Linda Stepping Stones Lancs 1841 Census will have Todmorden cum Walsden on it, but of course the West Riding version, already out has the other 2/3rds ie Stansfield and Langfield. I have a copy and most of it is readable though some is a little feint. It's pot luck whether your particular entry is readable but I would say there is a fair chance it would be. Jack

Hello everyone, I have just splashed out and bought the above History and Gazetteer of the West Riding. (It covers Todmorden). I bought it from Greenwood@yorkshireancestors.com . It is in 2 volumes at £20 for the two CD's. I am very pleased with the quality and also the content. I have also ordered the 1841 census of Lancashire, which includes Todmorden, from Stepping Stones. Delivery expected end of June. I have been watching the response to the Yorkshire version on the WRY mailing list and a few people have been disappointed with the illegibility of some of it. Fingers crossed that the Todmorden enumerators had better hand writing!! Linda