Nivard, When it comes to Cer*ies, I saw Mary, as indicated. Also several were listed as Ceries. It made me think it was actually a name with several persons bearing it. But now that I look at it, the * does indicate a gap, and so it apparently is unique. So I've just added it as a possibility. ince

Good Day, Nivard... You asked, "You say you checked the other reference? do you mean you looked at the GRO index page for the death in 1857? and you don't think its yours?" After I saw how you used the asterisk, I played some more with the site and think this is the most likely: Deaths Jun 1859 Surname Given Name District Volume Page CERVEN Mary Greenwich 1d 357 The other (1857) had too many other entries with similar spellings, making me think it was an actual name. Now I don't have confidence this one is correct, but I am noting it just in case. Vince

Hi Nivard. I think there used to be a smattering on Family history online which was taken over by another genealogy group....which escapes me. But like you said they are hens teeth and very little use in general. If you can remember who took over FHOL he may gets some joy. Cheers Pam from Adelaide Australia > Hi again > > I forgot to answer your 1831 question > > Generally the first useful census for research that listed names Country > wide was the 1841 census > > There was an 1831 census but it was generally a head count and did not > record people in each household, so in the main not of much use to the > genealogist, there are a few surviving 1831 returns which do have names > listed but they are few and far between and none are available online as > far > as I am aware > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > >

Hi again Vince As I said previously I have checked the census from 1841 on and don't see a CERONIO or similar in any past 1851 , including the 1861 Having said that there may be more, mistranscribed or enumerated as in 1851 There are parts/people missing from all census years, some worse than others, like today some people did not want to be found, others were missed off for one reason or another The census being the massive task it has always been there will be administrative mistakes made along the way with some parts being lost, pages in some cases, sections in others In the greater scale of things its a miniscule amount when compared to the whole but who knows who was on the missing parts You say you checked the other reference? do you mean you looked at the GRO index page for the death in 1857? and you don't think its yours Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Well, that's life, I guess. I assume there is an 1861, and am hoping > someone may be able to check that out. > > I checked the other reference, too. > > Thanks, > Vince

Hi Pam *Some* of the content of familyhistoryonline ended up on findmypast but at a hugely inflated cost but its hard to tell whats on that site There is a listing of pre 1841 census available here by County http://www.essex.ac.uk/history/working-papers/MW-RW-BM.pdf I prefer "Pre-1841 Censuses and Population Listings in the British Isles" by Colin Chapman which also lists other sources with names Those that do survive with names can be immensely useful but luck plays a large part in it for most people Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > > Hi Nivard. > I think there used to be a smattering on Family history online which was > taken over by another genealogy group....which escapes me. But like you > said > they are hens teeth and very little use in general. > If you can remember who took over FHOL he may gets some joy. > Cheers Pam from Adelaide Australia

David, Congratulations - another stunning London map - nobody does it better, in my opinion. The improved 'click to enlarge' feature is a real bonus. Best wishes for the New Year. Rod. In frozen Notting Hill, west London. Cross's London Guide 1851 displayed on the MAPCO website has been revised: Cross's London Guide 1851 http://london1851.com The thumbnail map and map images have been reworked to take full advantage of the wider format MAPCO website design. The 'click to enlarge' feature has been improved to give better access to very high quality enlarged images of each map section. This beautiful hand coloured map of London is printed on silk, and shows the site of the Great Exhibition of 1851 in Hyde Park. Of course 1851 was a significant census year, making this a map of particular interest to historians and genealogists.

Kingswood is now one of the halls of residence of Royal Holloway, University of London. See http://www.rhul.ac.uk/Registry/SAC/sh/halls.html#Kingswood Season's Greetings, Chris Townsend ----- Original Message ----- From: <MICHAELCOOMBER@aol.com> To: <ENG-SOMERSET@rootsweb.com> Cc: <eng-surrey@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 8:07 PM Subject: [SRY] Marriage of Major C. STEWART & Mrs. J. REID ( 1828 ) > >From Jackson's Oxford Journal, Saturday, June 7,1828; Issue 3919. > > MARRIED > At All Soul's church, Marylebone, Charles STEWART, Esq., of Bath, Major > in > the Hon.East India Company's Service, to Mrs. J. REID, of Kingswood > Lodge, > Engleford-green. > ( Presumably meant to be Englefield-green )

Bill - Hithefield maybe the go with an I not a Y What do you think? Pam from Adelaide >".......... now turn to the list for help figuring out a place name. >There is this passage in the will: "I have lately (surrender) .. all my >share or part of my Coppyhold Lands and premises situate? (Lying and) >being (in Withfield? Lithfield?) .field in the parish of Egham aforesaid" >Does anyone know of a manor or place with the name Withfield, Lithfield >or ?ithfield? Some possibilities :- Englefield, Reversfield, Hythefield? Egham history at: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=42999#s2 Ann

Hi again I forgot to answer your 1831 question Generally the first useful census for research that listed names Country wide was the 1841 census There was an 1831 census but it was generally a head count and did not record people in each household, so in the main not of much use to the genealogist, there are a few surviving 1831 returns which do have names listed but they are few and far between and none are available online as far as I am aware Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Hi, > > I think I'm on to something, but time only will tell. My Edward > CERONIO, indigo manufacturer (a shameful occupation) is found in 1829 > in India, but the next Bengal Directory I have access to is 1838. He > is *not* there. On the other hand, I see a Mary CERONIO in England in > the 1841 and 1851 census. She is listed as not native, but from an > English Colony. This seems a probable connection, as she is the only > CERONIO I am aware of in all of England in those times. > > Does anyone have access to a census *after* 1851? If so, is she > there? Also: was there an 1831? If so would there be any way of > finding out if she was there? If she is there in 1831, I am wondering > if she was already a widow or has a husband. In the 1841 and 1851 she > has a servant, Mary RAFFERTY (in case spelling is a problem). > > Thanks, > Vince Summers >

Hi again I presume you were replying to mine? Hard to tell as you have not included any part of the mail that you are replying to I really needed the census page reference, it will start HO107 then a series of numbers, the census I have access to does not have a search facility for addresses However armed with the parish I found her, she is transcribed on Ancestry as May CEROMO (which frankly is exactly what it looks like on the page, Mary RAFFERTY is also transcribed as May (again as it looks) Name: May Ceromo Age: 56 Estimated birth year: abt 1795 Relation: Head Gender: Female Where born: British Colony Civil parish: Herne Town: Herne Bay County/Island: Kent Country: England Registration district: Blean Sub-registration district: Sturry ED, institution, or vessel: 3d Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 87 Household Members: Name Age May Ceromo 56 May Rafferty 53 John Rafferty 13 HO107; Piece: 1625; Folio: 365; Page: 30 The third individual has been transcribed as John RAFFERTY which I believe is wrong (its a female for a start) and looks like just initials for first and last name only, the transcriber has assumed they were ditto's by the looks of it There is an entry on freebmd which you may want to investigate as follows Deaths Sep 1857 Cer*ies Mary Pancras 1b 8 The page is hard to read but may be your Mary (the page on Ancestry is much clearer than the freebmd page) Unfortunately ages are not in the index at that time Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) PS just a small point but the 87 in 1851 is the schedule number not the house number, in this case the house numbers are not recorded > Can you give the 1851 census reference? > > I hope this tells you what you need to know to find her in 1861 if she > exists then... > > Parish of Herne, Town of Herne Bay, 87 Clarence Road. > Where born? British Colony. > > Thanks! > > Vince

Have answered Bill off list - he sent me a copy of the will. The doubtful word is definitely "Hithfield", I think, by comparing the upper-case letter with an upper-case H elsewhere. So it is Hythe Fields, the area close to Staines Bridge; "hythe" means landing place, and the testator of this will was a waterman. Frederic Turner in his history of Egham points out that it was a favoured place for watermen to live. Geoff Geoffrey Chew g.chew@rhul.ac.uk ________________________________ From: eng-surrey-bounces@rootsweb.com on behalf of Pam Hillier Sent: Sat 19.12.09 20:54 To: eng-surrey@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [SRY] Place names in Surrey Bill - Hithefield maybe the go with an I not a Y What do you think? Pam from Adelaide >".......... now turn to the list for help figuring out a place name. >There is this passage in the will: "I have lately (surrender) .. all my >share or part of my Coppyhold Lands and premises situate? (Lying and) >being (in Withfield? Lithfield?) .field in the parish of Egham aforesaid" >Does anyone know of a manor or place with the name Withfield, Lithfield >or ?ithfield? Some possibilities :- Englefield, Reversfield, Hythefield? Egham history at: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=42999#s2 Ann *************************************** Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** superfluous old messages in replies. List Admin can be contacted at: Eng-Surrey-admin@rootsweb.com. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-SURREY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Vince In 1841 your Mary CERONIO is enumerated as N (not born in County where enumerated, *not* foreign parts) which implies she was born somewhere in England but not Middlesex where she is enumerated Mary RAFFERTY is enumerated as born S = Scotland (could be an I = Ireland) I don't see either in 1851 or later I don't find any CERONIO events in freebmd either Can you give the 1851 census reference, I see she is transcribed on findmypast which is where I presume you found her? There is one reference to CERONIO on the National Archives which may be worth following up ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Folder icon [no title] IOR/F/4/1536/60987 Feb 1834-Mar 1835 These documents are held at British Library, Asia, Pacific and Africa Collections Related information: India Sep Rev 1 Jun 1836, draft 227/1836, E/4/747 pp 1116-17 [See also 1481] Contents: Proposal of Messrs Ceronio and Gayraud to establish a rum distillery at Agra. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I could only find one CERONIO on the IGI as follows JEYKELL EVELINE CATHERINE CERONIO Birth: 24 NOV 1824 Christening: 27 OCT 1831 Agra, , West Bengal, India Father: JAMES MONTAGUE DELARE CERONIO Family Mother: CATHERINE AMANDA C750033 1831 0498964 Film NONE All points seem to lean towards India, perhaps worth trying an India list A look here may help also http://www.fibis.org/ Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Hi, > > I think I'm on to something, but time only will tell. My Edward > CERONIO, indigo manufacturer (a shameful occupation) is found in 1829 > in India, but the next Bengal Directory I have access to is 1838. He > is *not* there. On the other hand, I see a Mary CERONIO in England in > the 1841 and 1851 census. She is listed as not native, but from an > English Colony. This seems a probable connection, as she is the only > CERONIO I am aware of in all of England in those times. > > Does anyone have access to a census *after* 1851? If so, is she > there? Also: was there an 1831? If so would there be any way of > finding out if she was there? If she is there in 1831, I am wondering > if she was already a widow or has a husband. In the 1841 and 1851 she > has a servant, Mary RAFFERTY (in case spelling is a problem). > > Thanks, > Vince Summers

Nivard said: "There was an 1831 census but it was generally a head count and did not record people in each household, so in the main not of much use..." Well, that's life, I guess. I assume there is an 1861, and am hoping someone may be able to check that out. I checked the other reference, too. Thanks, Vince

Thanks, Nivard, for the additional reference. Wish I had '61. But that will come... I presume you were replying to mine? Yes, another list refuses to take much by way of quotes, so I err on the side of deprivation. May CEROMO (which frankly is exactly what it looks like on the page, Mary RAFFERTY is also transcribed as May (again as it looks) I have a clear image, and it is clearly CERONIO, and clearly MARY on all counts. The ditto marks are doubtless Mary "Jr," aged 13. Going to take a look-see on the piece of new info you gave me! Vince

Can you give the 1851 census reference? I hope this tells you what you need to know to find her in 1861 if she exists then... Parish of Herne, Town of Herne Bay, 87 Clarence Road. Where born? British Colony. Thanks! Vince

Hi, I think I'm on to something, but time only will tell. My Edward CERONIO, indigo manufacturer (a shameful occupation) is found in 1829 in India, but the next Bengal Directory I have access to is 1838. He is *not* there. On the other hand, I see a Mary CERONIO in England in the 1841 and 1851 census. She is listed as not native, but from an English Colony. This seems a probable connection, as she is the only CERONIO I am aware of in all of England in those times. Does anyone have access to a census *after* 1851? If so, is she there? Also: was there an 1831? If so would there be any way of finding out if she was there? If she is there in 1831, I am wondering if she was already a widow or has a husband. In the 1841 and 1851 she has a servant, Mary RAFFERTY (in case spelling is a problem). Thanks, Vince Summers

>From Jackson's Oxford Journal, Saturday, June 7,1828; Issue 3919. MARRIED At All Soul's church, Marylebone, Charles STEWART, Esq., of Bath, Major in the Hon.East India Company's Service, to Mrs. J. REID, of Kingswood Lodge, Engleford-green. ( Presumably meant to be Englefield-green )

I would love to find the baptism of my gr gr grandfather, Benjamin GUEST. According to all other info he was born about 1822 in Lambeth, Surrey. Father's name James and I have no mother. I found him in one census as William Benjamin and have searched under both names with no success. Benjamin GUEST married Margaret GRIFFITHS of Bangor Is y Coed, Flintshire, Wales on 28 Jan 1844 in Lambeth. I would be so happy if someone could find Benjamin's baptism. Thank you ........and Merry Christmas to all. Marg >From the Beautiful British Columbia Cariboo Region, Canada

I had a search around and googled several options but cannot find anything - I would be v. interested to know the answer. Bill perhaps you can scan the relevant part of the will - perhaps I can see something different. Paul ________________________________ From: Bill Dalton <rnbill@centurytel.net> To: eng-surrey@rootsweb.com Sent: Fri, December 18, 2009 3:56:13 PM Subject: [SRY] Place names in Surrey Hi Pam has been giving me invaluable help in wading through the script in a will and we now turn to the list for help figuring out a place name. There is this passage in the will: "I have lately (surrender) …… all my share or part of my Coppyhold Lands and premises situate? (Lying and) being (in Withfield? Lithfield?) …field in the parish of Egham aforesaid" Does anyone know of a manor or place with the name Withfield, Lithfield or ?ithfield? Bill *************************************** Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** superfluous old messages in replies. List Admin can be contacted at:  Eng-Surrey-admin@rootsweb.com.   ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-SURREY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

>From: "Bill Dalton" <rnbill@centurytel.net> >".......... now turn to the list for help figuring out a place name. >There is this passage in the will: "I have lately (surrender) …… all my >share or part of my Coppyhold Lands and premises situate? (Lying and) >being (in Withfield? Lithfield?) …field in the parish of Egham aforesaid" >Does anyone know of a manor or place with the name Withfield, Lithfield >or ?ithfield? Some possibilities :- Englefield, Reversfield, Hythefield? Egham history at: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=42999#s2 Ann