Hi all, I’ve just received the will of Robert SILCOCK of Barnston, late Farmer, dated 21 May 1817. Robert SILLCOCK married Hannah NEWPORT on 31 January 1761 at Bidston, and I’m now quite sure they are my 5 x great grandparents. He mentions £10 to his son Robert Silcock, his son Henry Silcock, his daughter Ann Richardson; one shilling to his daughter Elizabeth; all the rest of money and goods to his daughter Hannah for ever, and his son in law John Davies to be the whole and sole executor. Witnesses were Joseph Peers, John Evans and John Cookson. Kind regards, Yvonne

Now that Syl has raised the subject of Old Maps, I should take this opportunity to mention my "Bible" of Old Liverpool - the three volumes of the "Edwardian A-Z of Liverpool and Bootle", by Paul Bolger. I don't think I have ever failed to find the street I am looking for in these books of hand-drawn maps. Part 1 covers North Liverpool and Bootle. Part 2 covers Central Liverpool. Part 3 covers South Liverpool. The period they cover is C.1909/1911. There are lots of very interesting pictures. I can't extol the virtues of these books too much - when I bought mine they were £10 each, but I did see Part 2 for sale for £4 in that book shop in St John's Market - I should have bought them all to pass on to people. Please do ask me if you want any further information. Marged No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3374 - Release Date: 01/11/11 19:34:00

Thanks Marian, I havent heard of this site so will certainly give it a go. Thanks Regards Syl - UK >

Hi Syl, Have you tried the Vision of Britain website? They have lots of old maps. All the best, Marian ----- Original Message ----- From: "sams_nan" <sh001k2186@blueyonder.co.uk> To: <ENG-MERSEYSIDE@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 10:04 PM Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Old maps > Can anyone point me in the right direction to view old maps of Kirkdale, > Liverpool, c1910. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Syl - UK > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ______________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by Netintelligence > http://www.netintelligence.com/email > > ______________________________________________ This email has been scanned by Netintelligence http://www.netintelligence.com/email

Hi Syl, I have a map of liverpool 1in to the mile, from 1923. I can send it by attachment if you e-mail me off topic. Best Regards, Peter in Liverpool. > From: sh001k2186@blueyonder.co.uk > To: ENG-MERSEYSIDE@rootsweb.com > Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 22:04:03 +0000 > Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Old maps > > Can anyone point me in the right direction to view old maps of Kirkdale, > Liverpool, c1910. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Syl - UK > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you Joe, I will certainly have a go. Syl - UK

TUC 1868 6.5 million (2008) United Kingdom ITUC Brendan Barber, (General Secretary) Dougie Rooney, President Congress House, London www.tuc.org.uk Hi Marged Here is your best source of info for trades unions in the early 1900s as many smaller unions were merged and their details lost in a maze of archives. For instnce my dsad was a member of the National Boilermakers Union which merged with the AEU. I have looked at their website and there are lots of links to the info you need. Dorothy

Try Godfrey Maps www.alangodfreymaps.co.uk They have a fine selection of what you seek. Joe Platt Liverpool -----Original Message----- From: eng-merseyside-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-merseyside-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of sams_nan Sent: 11 January 2011 22:04 To: ENG-MERSEYSIDE@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Old maps Can anyone point me in the right direction to view old maps of Kirkdale, Liverpool, c1910. Any help would be appreciated. Syl - UK ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3373 - Release Date: 01/11/11

Can anyone point me in the right direction to view old maps of Kirkdale, Liverpool, c1910. Any help would be appreciated. Syl - UK

Thank you for that very full description Gordon - I knew I could rely on you. It's a pity there is no information regarding employment, but because of documents like the one I sent to you, I have been able to enter him on the "Sugar Workers Data Base" as a sugar worker - they won't let you put anyone on there without definite proof. Marged Attachment received and opened ok. A description of the [1911] references is given here :- 'Census references When you view a transcript, you will see that a long sequence of letters and numbers appears underneath the name. This is the Census Reference and is, in effect, a very complicated page number that identifies the location of the paper record at The National Archives. An example Census Reference: Before the records were digitised, this number was the only way of finding the original paper document within the millions that are stored in the repositories at The National Archives. For the purposes of searching on the internet, this reference is no longer necessary. But it should still be cited when you compile your family tree, and in case you want to compare records with someone else, and be sure that you have the same person and household. Key to references RG78 RG refers to the series of records that were the responsibility of the Registrar General (which also covers Births, Marriages and Deaths), and 78 is the code given to the enumerators' summary books. RG14 14 is the number that identifies the records as household schedules PN Stands for Piece Number, which is an individual volume of records RD Is the Registration District SD Is the Registration Sub District ED Is the Enumeration District SN Is the Schedule Number within the Household Schedules (RG14)' As you'll see, none of them, unfortunately, relate to employment. :-( Best regards Gordon >From: "Marged" <marged36@btopenworld.com> >To: "ENG-MERSEYSIDE" <ENG-MERSEYSIDE-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 12:36 PM >Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Reference numbers > >I notice when I am looking something up on the Census sheets in Genes >Reunited that there are >a lot of reference numbers referring to >householders (this is in the typed version). >Can anyone please tell me what these reference numbers mean, and if there >is somewhere >where I can check them out? Would like to find some >referring to employment if possible. >Marged ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3372 - Release Date: 01/10/11 19:34:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3373 - Release Date: 01/11/11 07:34:00

One of the papers we are treasuring for future generations is my father in law's "Indentures" when he became an apprentice joiner. I suppose we might be able to apply to his Union for some information. If your chap was in Liverpool, Syl, why not try somewhere like a plumbers union - I don't know of one, but it would be worth a try. We have references for both my father and Don's from their training days - maybe one day they will open doors for future generations, who knows? Marged At age 20 my grandfather was recorded as being a Plumber in 1901. The 1911 census shows him as being a Plumber and Gas fitter and working for an employer in Liverpool. Later in his life he became self-employed. Does anyone know where I can find information on apprenticeships assuming that he became an apprentice prior to qualifying in his chosen trade. Can anyone give me an idea as where to look for this info. Any help would be very much appreciated. Regards Syl - UK ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3373 - Release Date: 01/11/11 07:34:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3373 - Release Date: 01/11/11 07:34:00

At age 20 my grandfather was recorded as being a Plumber in 1901. The 1911 census shows him as being a Plumber and Gas fitter and working for an employer in Liverpool. Later in his life he became self-employed. Does anyone know where I can find information on apprenticeships assuming that he became an apprentice prior to qualifying in his chosen trade. Can anyone give me an idea as where to look for this info. Any help would be very much appreciated. Regards Syl - UK

Hi Marged Attachment received and opened ok. A description of the [1911] references is given here :- 'Census references When you view a transcript, you will see that a long sequence of letters and numbers appears underneath the name. This is the Census Reference and is, in effect, a very complicated page number that identifies the location of the paper record at The National Archives. An example Census Reference: Before the records were digitised, this number was the only way of finding the original paper document within the millions that are stored in the repositories at The National Archives. For the purposes of searching on the internet, this reference is no longer necessary. But it should still be cited when you compile your family tree, and in case you want to compare records with someone else, and be sure that you have the same person and household. Key to references RG78 RG refers to the series of records that were the responsibility of the Registrar General (which also covers Births, Marriages and Deaths), and 78 is the code given to the enumerators' summary books. RG14 14 is the number that identifies the records as household schedules PN Stands for Piece Number, which is an individual volume of records RD Is the Registration District SD Is the Registration Sub District ED Is the Enumeration District SN Is the Schedule Number within the Household Schedules (RG14)' As you'll see, none of them, unfortunately, relate to employment. :-( Best regards Gordon >From: "Marged" <marged36@btopenworld.com> >To: "ENG-MERSEYSIDE" <ENG-MERSEYSIDE-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 12:36 PM >Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Reference numbers > >I notice when I am looking something up on the Census sheets in Genes >Reunited that there are >a lot of reference numbers referring to >householders (this is in the typed version). >Can anyone please tell me what these reference numbers mean, and if there >is somewhere >where I can check them out? Would like to find some >referring to employment if possible. >Marged

Will try and send it to you off list Gordon Hi Marged Can you give an example, maybe? Gordon From: "Marged" <marged36@btopenworld.com> To: "ENG-MERSEYSIDE" <ENG-MERSEYSIDE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 12:36 PM Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Reference numbers >I notice when I am looking something up on the Census sheets in Genes >Reunited that there are a lot of reference numbers referring to >householders >(this is in the typed version). >Can anyone please tell me what these reference numbers mean, and if there >is >somewhere where I can check them out? Would like to find some referring to >employment if possible. >Marged ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3372 - Release Date: 01/10/11 19:34:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3372 - Release Date: 01/10/11 19:34:00

Hi Marged Can you give an example, maybe? Gordon From: "Marged" <marged36@btopenworld.com> To: "ENG-MERSEYSIDE" <ENG-MERSEYSIDE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 12:36 PM Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] Reference numbers >I notice when I am looking something up on the Census sheets in Genes >Reunited that there are a lot of reference numbers referring to >householders >(this is in the typed version). >Can anyone please tell me what these reference numbers mean, and if there >is >somewhere where I can check them out? Would like to find some referring to >employment if possible. >Marged

I notice when I am looking something up on the Census sheets in Genes Reunited that there are a lot of reference numbers referring to householders (this is in the typed version). Can anyone please tell me what these reference numbers mean, and if there is somewhere where I can check them out? Would like to find some referring to employment if possible. Marged No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3372 - Release Date: 01/10/11 19:34:00

Your library is correct. Ancestry currently has some very limited 1911 census information - the summary sheets which contain the names of the householders and the number of persons living with them. You need to go to Findmypast (or the other site with 1911 information) in order to get anything else. Angelika On 10/01/2011 11:25, sams_nan wrote: > Thanks for that Anne, I did go to a library and they told me access for 1911 > wqas not yet available through ancestry. I will have another go. > > Cheers > > Syl - UK > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MERSEYSIDE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thanks for that Anne, I did go to a library and they told me access for 1911 wqas not yet available through ancestry. I will have another go. Cheers Syl - UK

Anne wrote :- >In 2010 I visited a local LDS centre (50 miles away!) >You are able to access 1911 there for free. The minimum cost of a findmypast subscription is £6-95, affording you 60 credits over a 90-day period. How much does it cost to travel 100 miles (50 miles return) in the UK? So how free is ' for free'? :-) Gordon From: "ANNE BAMFORD" <annet.bamford@btopenworld.com> To: <eng-merseyside@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, January 08, 2011 8:34 PM Subject: [ENG-MERSEYSIDE] 1911 CENSUS Hi Syl, Briefly looked at the post you sent re 1911 census. In 2010 I visited a local LDS centre (50 miles away!) You are able to access 1911 there for free. It can only be accessed via one of their computers. The volunteer working there was not aware it could be accessed until one of their church ministers came into the centre, (they have a church attached to the one I went to) so dig deep and don't just accept the first word of advice if they say no they don't. Things may have changed since but well worth a try. I didn't access it myself so the content they offer for 1911 may be no more than you already know but its worth a phone call or email Hope this helps Anne

Hi Syl, Briefly looked at the post you sent re 1911 census.   In 2010 I visited a local LDS centre (50 miles away!) You are able to access 1911 there for free. It can only be accessed via one of their computers.   The volunteer working there was not aware it could be accessed until one of their church ministers came into the centre, (they have a church attached to the one I went to) so dig deep and don't just accept the first word of advice if they say no they don't.   Things may have changed since but well worth a try. I didn't access it myself so the content they offer for 1911 may be no more than you already know but its worth a phone call or email   Hope this helps Anne