Perhaps this article from The Guardian <http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/shortcuts/2013/feb/22/glad-my-surname-dying-out> will interest or amuse some of you: "Why I'm glad my surname is dying out" "At school I longed to be called something that people could pronounce easily and that didn't make boys laugh. "It seems that the surname BUTTERWORTH is in danger of melting away, but as someone who has been saddled with this lumpen badge of origin for nearly half a century, you won't find me mourning its demise. "According to a study by Ancestry.co.uk, based on a comparison of the 1901 census and more recent data, the list of doomed monikers also includes KERSHAW, SUTCLIFFE, CLEGG, HATMAN and WOODBEAD. The Yorkshire Ripper gave SUTCLIFFE a bad name, but I'm not sure what the others have done to deserve being struck off. BUTTERWORTH, however, seems to me an obvious candidate for the scrapheap. "It didn't help that my parents partnered my clumsy surname with a first name that was apparently unpronounceable by most people living in the north-east of England in the 70s – as if teenagers don't have enough to cope with. When I later discovered that this had been misspelled – it's always nice when people point out that there should be no second I in Siobhain – I began to seriously wonder about my parents' lack of attention to the whole business of doling out names. "My Lancastrian father and Irish mother were outsiders and no one at school had either of my names. How I longed to be called something I could just throw out casually for people to pick up and use instantly like Jackie Wheatley, or Clare Henderson, or Karen Hislop. Names that would not make boys laugh, and that did not carry the stigma of being unusual. Instead I had to put up with being called things like Shoveoff Margarineworth. In my early years this may have led me to resort to violence in the playground. "On the plus side, tell a stranger your name is Butterworth and it will often produce a smile. It's a funny name. But I'm often not in the mood to be laughed at when I'm just telling someone who I am. The trouble is that its three cluttered syllables are such a mouthful to get out, it's easy to make yourself sound ridiculous. Can you blame me for wanting something more elegant? "I've never liked my surname. It's just not me. You would think I'd have ditched it at the first opportunity, but feminist principles got in the way and what's more, paradoxically, I may have done my bit to preserve this monstrous label for posterity. I married a man with a perfectly ordinary, two-syllable, English surname, which I much preferred and then stubbornly refused to take his and kept my own. To make matters worse, when we had children we gave them my clunky surname, not my husband's more refined alternative. My only defence for these two terrible errors of judgment is that it was the 80s and this sort of thing seemed terribly important then. I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise to all concerned."

Hello Trevor: Have you considered that somewhere along the line someone mis-transcribed Mopley for Mossley? This is very easy when an archaic form of double 'S' is written or even printed. There is a Mossley Hall in Congleton. There may be others as it could be quite a common name. Best wishes, Irene

I am extremely grateful to both sites. However, Ancestry always trumps FMP with its search engine. The flexibility in allowing for wildcard searching across the board is essential as far as I'm concerned, especially with the spelling of surnames. FMP allows for address searches in all the census they have uploaded and they have a wide range of parish records to search (although Ancestry does MUCH better in the Lancashire stakes). While I can afford to have access to both sites, I'll continue to do so. I can't bear to even think about the day when I'd have to choose between them, but I guess I'd go for Ancestry. Regards, Sally ---------------------------------------- > From: birdboot@btinternet.com > To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com > Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:08:14 +0000 > Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] Opinions re FH sites > > A good strategy is to do a general search on Ancestry using your > subscription, then if necessary looking at it in more detail using credits > on FMP. >

Hello Trevor, I've also had my wrist slapped (nicely, I hasten to add) by Lynne, when I've sent replies without snipping out all the extra bits of text that don't need to be forwarded - like the pleasantries added on at the bottom of each email as they are automatically added to each one sent :o) Chester technically falls under Cheshire for a county. It might be worth posting to that rootsweb list to make sure that you're catching everyone that would have knowledge of the local area. Google produced nothing of any use that I could see, although it is mentioned in the General Armoury Book as Mopley Hull. Possibly a spelling mistake, which doesn't bode well for the spelling of Mopley if that is the case. Regards, Sally ---------------------------------------- > From: trevorarmstrong@iinet.net.au > Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 21:42:16 +1100 > To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com > Subject: [ENG-MAN] Mopley Hall, County of Chester? > > Sally, > > I too may have been guilty of not "snipping" my recent posting, so I am sending it again. I hope I can be forgiven. > > Some little while ago I sought the assistance of the group with regard to the baptismal details of Sir Oswald Brierly (1817-1894), who was Marine Artist to Queen Victoria. I received some very helpful advice. > > Brierly says, in his writings, that he was entitled to armorial bearings and this was confirmed in Burkes' "General Amory of England ….", which refers to "Brierly of Mopley Hall Co of Chester". The description of the crest in Burke is exactly that used by Brierly in all his correspondence. > > My problem is that I cannot find any reference to either "Mopley Hall" or indeed a place called Mopley in the County of Chester. > > There was an ancient church of All Saints in Chester, which was rebuilt in the 19th century and is now the secular Guildhall in Watergate Street, Chester. It has some tenuous connection with the name "Mopley" > > I was hoping someone with "local knowledge" might be able to give me a pointer in the right direction. > > Regards

A good strategy is to do a general search on Ancestry using your subscription, then if necessary looking at it in more detail using credits on FMP. Jim ---Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Humphrey Sent: 27 February 2013 22:45 To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] Opinions re FH sites Hi Jim Thanks for that feedback. I have used FMP occasionally using credits and I do tend to find they have fewer transcription errors. I think I will go on with using it at the library for now and when my Ancestry subscription expires, maybe I'll switch for a year. I do find it handy how Ancestry links with my Your Family Tree software though. Joanne

Hi Andy, "Snipping" is when you remove text from the email before sending it round the group. For example, under my reply to this, you'll see that only your question from the group of emails is showing. I do this by - after having hit the reply button - highlighting all the text I want to remove and then just pressing the delete button. This removes all the unwanted bits of previous correspondence and keeps the emails shorter, more clear and therefore easier to read. Hope that helps :o) Regards, Sally > From: muzandmuz@gmail.com > Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 09:59:06 +0000 > To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] Digest mode - an ASK to posters > > As someone who is not very computer literate, I am not really sure if I am replying correctly or not! > Or how to snip! If some one can let me know if I am responding correctly pease > Andy > >

Thank you for that Joanne. I will consider this in my research, as sticking to the 'born in Manchester' search has got me nowhere. Perhaps there is an Irish source to this line, Murray obviously being common in both Ireland and Scotland. Let's start again! Andy Sent from my iPad On 26 Feb 2013, at 23:41, "Joanne Humphrey" <joanne1humphrey@gmail.com> wrote: > Well I'm certainly not an expert in these things but I have two family > members who have Ireland listed as their place of birth on one census and > Liverpool on another. I don't know whether this is down to enumerator's > error, or assumptions, or those people simply 'adopting' their new home as > their place of birth, but there are certainly cases where places of birth on > censuses are unreliable. > > I did try to find a James Murray, born Ireland c1838 and living in > Manchester in 1841 and 1851 but didn't found one. Thinking about the timing > of the potato famine, it is highly likely he came to England in the 1850s, > as my Murrays did and therefore wouldn't feature on any earlier censuses. > > There is a James Murray, b 1838 in Ireland, father John in Ormskirk in the > 1851 census. John's profession is reedmaker and stricker. I haven't been > able to track down what these professions involved, but someone has > overwritten it with silk maker, which could certainly be connected with > weaving. The mother of the family is Elizabeth and there is a 16-year-old > Mary Ann, born in Scotland, and a nine-year-old John who was born in France! > I had a quick look for John junior in later censuses but haven't found him > yet. It would be worth your while following James forward to find out > whether you can eliminate him as your James. > > Good luck! > Joanne > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Andrew And Jenny > Murray > Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 6:56 AM > To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] MURRAY > > Hi Joanne, > Accidentally deleted your last message concerning my James and John Murray > and Ireland! But: > Due to my lack of progress it has crossed my mind- all I can go off is the > 1861 and 1871 Census' I have, both of which give James Murray's place of > birth as Manchester. Could he in 1841 and 1851 be listed as being of Irish > birth, and later adapted it to his place of residence maybe? > > Andy > > Sent from my iPad > > On 26 Feb 2013, at 06:59, "Joanne Humphrey" <joanne1humphrey@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Hi Andy >> >> It's a good job you did send the reply to the list as well because I >> never received the one you sent just to me. Thanks for the details of >> your Murrays. The only name which matches with one of mine is James >> and my James was born much later than that so I don't think we've >> found a connection just yet. >> >> You never know what will turn up though! >> >> Joanne >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Andy and >> Jenny Murray >> Sent: Saturday, 23 February 2013 8:15 AM >> To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] MURRAY >> >> Hi Gilly, >> I have just given this infomation to Joanne's question-being new to >> this list I am not sure if I have to reply to each person individually >> or can do it all in one go and everybody on the thread will view it? >> >> Basically my Murray ancestors are: >> (Father) Fred Murray 1940-2003 >> Fred Murray 1915-1992 >> John Murray 1862-1926 >> James Murray c1838-1878 >> John Murray ?-? >> >> Andy >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 5:03 AM, gillykh <gillykh@cox.net> wrote: >> >>> HI Andy, >>> Perhaps you could tell us what info you have ,and what info you would >> like. >>> Gilly >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com >>> [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Andrew And >>> Jenny Murray >>> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 3:00 PM >>> To: ENG-MANCHESTER-L@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: [ENG-MAN] MURRAY >>> >>> >>> Hi everyone, I have just returned to this list after an extended >>> break. I am researching many ancestors in the Manchester area, but at >>> this moment concentrating on my MURRAY and HEWITT surnames. >>> Andy Murray >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> >>> >>> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >>> >>> Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. >>> Other people can learn from them! >>> >>> Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. >>> >>> Please SNIP when replying. >>> >>> Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. >>> No fees! >>> >>> >>> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >>> >>> Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. >>> Other people can learn from them! >>> >>> Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. >>> >>> Please SNIP when replying. >>> >>> Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. >>> No fees! >>> >>> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. >> Other people can learn from them! >> >> Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. >> >> Please SNIP when replying. >> >> Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No > fees! >> >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. >> Other people can learn from them! >> >> Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. >> >> Please SNIP when replying. >> >> Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No > fees! >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. > Other people can learn from them! > > Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. > > Please SNIP when replying. > > Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. > Other people can learn from them! > > Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. > > Please SNIP when replying. > > Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

As someone who is not very computer literate, I am not really sure if I am replying correctly or not! Or how to snip! If some one can let me know if I am responding correctly pease Andy Sent from my iPad On 28 Feb 2013, at 09:45, "Joanne Humphrey" <joanne1humphrey@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Ruth > > Don't worry; I wasn't offended. I just thought I'd inadvertently done the > wrong thing because I'm quite new to the list and wasn't aware of that > particular requirement. I'm very happy to be pointed in the right direction > by more experienced users. Good luck with trying to get Rootsweb to update > its processes! > > Best wishes > Joanne > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. > Other people can learn from them! > > Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. > > Please SNIP when replying. > > Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. > Other people can learn from them! > > Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. > > Please SNIP when replying. > > Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Listers Can I just remind everyone that administrative matters are not for discussion on the list? If anyone has a problem posting, or has a problem with how others post, please contact me privately off list and I'll endeavour to help. Please don't chide fellow subscribers on the list. That may lead to hard feelings and we want to keep this list very friendly. New list members, please read the list's Welcome Message. Yes, it's very long, but It contains all of the list's guidelines plus the links to some helpful sites. As far as snipping goes, the list's guidelines state: "SNIP when replying to messages. The most frequent complaint received from subscribers, especially those getting digests, is that folks leave huge amounts of the previous message when replying to list. Please quote only what is necessary for understanding or continuity. To prune the text, drag your cursor over the words to be removed to select them, and overtype with 'snipped' to show you have removed a section." If those instructions aren't clear, by all means write to me privately with your suggestions on how the instructions can be improved. Those that consistently fail to snip may be switched to Digest mode so they can fully understand why snipping is so important. There are two options for the display of Digest mode. If you are a Digest subscriber and don't like the way the Digest appears, write to me privately and I'll switch modes for you. While I have your attention, a few other things: If you have eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com in your address book, please remove it. At least once a week someone tries to post to that address, but it doesn't work and the message bounces to me. That is an unmanned address which is only used by RootsWeb's mail servers to send out error messages. If your email program automatically adds email addresses to your address book, you may want to turn off that function. Remember to post in plain text. If you post in HTML, your messages will fly into cyberspace, never to be seen again. If you post in MIME, RootsWeb computers will try to separate the plain text portion and send that on to the list, but if the message is larger than the list's maximum length, the post will just bounce to me. If you have any questions or comments about this email, list guidelines or etiquette, please remember to contact me privately. Thanks everyone. Happy researching! Kind regards, Lynne list administrator

Hi Ruth I think this is largely my fault. I must admit I had never noticed the snip note before you drew my attention to it and I prefer to have the whole thread in one email and just keep the most recent one, so I hadn't realised I was doing the wrong thing by keeping the whole trail in there. I'll make sure I 'snip' in future (although I didn't previously know what that meant!) Sorry Joanne :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. Other people can learn from them! Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. Please SNIP when replying. Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Jim Thanks for that feedback. I have used FMP occasionally using credits and I do tend to find they have fewer transcription errors. I think I will go on with using it at the library for now and when my Ancestry subscription expires, maybe I'll switch for a year. I do find it handy how Ancestry links with my Your Family Tree software though. Joanne :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. Other people can learn from them! Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. Please SNIP when replying. Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

No, Joanne, it's not just you. Please don't think that. I'm a poster on several of the Northern Lists and it's a common problem. On the mornings when you get a number of l-o-o-n-g lists to read it becomes a TASK and not a JOY. I guess I was feeling particularly grumpy yesterday. I sent the message to the List and to the Administrator because, at bottom, I feel it's a Rootsweb problem. I'm not a computer buff but there must be a better way of organising topics as it doesn't happen on other Forums at all. Topics can be threaded. A reply button appears on the thread, so avoiding the use of the reply button on an individual's computer. That way it all stacks up neatly. I'm hoping that Administrators have easier access to the Generals at Rootsweb and have a stronger voice than us mere Listers and will pass the message on. It's a very big hope, I know, but I do think Rootsweb needs to review it's system and overhaul it. Ruth

Hi Bev Thanks for the feedback and the ideas. I have discovered that my local library has access to FMP (I didn't think they would because it's not a very big library) so I think I'll spend a couple of days in there using it and then I can decide whether it's worth paying to use it at home. Many thanks Joanne -----Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Bev Bonning Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 12:56 PM To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] Opinions re FH sites Joanne Why don't you visit FMP and try some searches. Searching is free, and the results list will give you an idea of the records that FMP has. >From the Home Page look through their News releases and their News Archive. It might also be helpful if you go to the bottom of the Home Page and click on Our Partners. That will also give you an idea of what is available. You might be especially interested in their Manchester Collection. Personally I use both, because it suits me to do so. But I would not presume to advise you one way or another. I really think you should look for yourself. Good luck and Happy Researching. Bev -----Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Humphrey Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 9:45 AM To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-MAN] Opinions re FH sites I was just wondering whether other listers have found it useful to have membership of both Ancestry and FMP. I am already a member of Ancestry, but FMP is offering a 20% discount if I sign up by tomorrow and I'm wondering whether there is enough additional material on there to make it worth having both. What sorts of records can be found on FMP which make it worthwhile? Thanks in advance Joanne :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. Other people can learn from them! Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. Please SNIP when replying. Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Joanne Why don't you visit FMP and try some searches. Searching is free, and the results list will give you an idea of the records that FMP has. >From the Home Page look through their News releases and their News Archive. It might also be helpful if you go to the bottom of the Home Page and click on Our Partners. That will also give you an idea of what is available. You might be especially interested in their Manchester Collection. Personally I use both, because it suits me to do so. But I would not presume to advise you one way or another. I really think you should look for yourself. Good luck and Happy Researching. Bev -----Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Humphrey Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 9:45 AM To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-MAN] Opinions re FH sites I was just wondering whether other listers have found it useful to have membership of both Ancestry and FMP. I am already a member of Ancestry, but FMP is offering a 20% discount if I sign up by tomorrow and I'm wondering whether there is enough additional material on there to make it worth having both. What sorts of records can be found on FMP which make it worthwhile? Thanks in advance Joanne

I was just wondering whether other listers have found it useful to have membership of both Ancestry and FMP. I am already a member of Ancestry, but FMP is offering a 20% discount if I sign up by tomorrow and I'm wondering whether there is enough additional material on there to make it worth having both. What sorts of records can be found on FMP which make it worthwhile? Thanks in advance Joanne

Well I'm certainly not an expert in these things but I have two family members who have Ireland listed as their place of birth on one census and Liverpool on another. I don't know whether this is down to enumerator's error, or assumptions, or those people simply 'adopting' their new home as their place of birth, but there are certainly cases where places of birth on censuses are unreliable. I did try to find a James Murray, born Ireland c1838 and living in Manchester in 1841 and 1851 but didn't found one. Thinking about the timing of the potato famine, it is highly likely he came to England in the 1850s, as my Murrays did and therefore wouldn't feature on any earlier censuses. There is a James Murray, b 1838 in Ireland, father John in Ormskirk in the 1851 census. John's profession is reedmaker and stricker. I haven't been able to track down what these professions involved, but someone has overwritten it with silk maker, which could certainly be connected with weaving. The mother of the family is Elizabeth and there is a 16-year-old Mary Ann, born in Scotland, and a nine-year-old John who was born in France! I had a quick look for John junior in later censuses but haven't found him yet. It would be worth your while following James forward to find out whether you can eliminate him as your James. Good luck! Joanne -----Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Andrew And Jenny Murray Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 6:56 AM To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] MURRAY Hi Joanne, Accidentally deleted your last message concerning my James and John Murray and Ireland! But: Due to my lack of progress it has crossed my mind- all I can go off is the 1861 and 1871 Census' I have, both of which give James Murray's place of birth as Manchester. Could he in 1841 and 1851 be listed as being of Irish birth, and later adapted it to his place of residence maybe? Andy Sent from my iPad On 26 Feb 2013, at 06:59, "Joanne Humphrey" <joanne1humphrey@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Andy > > It's a good job you did send the reply to the list as well because I > never received the one you sent just to me. Thanks for the details of > your Murrays. The only name which matches with one of mine is James > and my James was born much later than that so I don't think we've > found a connection just yet. > > You never know what will turn up though! > > Joanne > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Andy and > Jenny Murray > Sent: Saturday, 23 February 2013 8:15 AM > To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [ENG-MAN] MURRAY > > Hi Gilly, > I have just given this infomation to Joanne's question-being new to > this list I am not sure if I have to reply to each person individually > or can do it all in one go and everybody on the thread will view it? > > Basically my Murray ancestors are: > (Father) Fred Murray 1940-2003 > Fred Murray 1915-1992 > John Murray 1862-1926 > James Murray c1838-1878 > John Murray ?-? > > Andy > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 5:03 AM, gillykh <gillykh@cox.net> wrote: > >> HI Andy, >> Perhaps you could tell us what info you have ,and what info you would > like. >> Gilly >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Andrew And >> Jenny Murray >> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 3:00 PM >> To: ENG-MANCHESTER-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [ENG-MAN] MURRAY >> >> >> Hi everyone, I have just returned to this list after an extended >> break. I am researching many ancestors in the Manchester area, but at >> this moment concentrating on my MURRAY and HEWITT surnames. >> Andy Murray >> Sent from my iPad >> >> >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. >> Other people can learn from them! >> >> Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. >> >> Please SNIP when replying. >> >> Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. >> No fees! >> >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. >> Other people can learn from them! >> >> Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. >> >> Please SNIP when replying. >> >> Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. >> No fees! >> >> :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. > Other people can learn from them! > > Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. > > Please SNIP when replying. > > Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. > Other people can learn from them! > > Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. > > Please SNIP when replying. > > Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! > > :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. Other people can learn from them! Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. Please SNIP when replying. Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am forwarding this on behalf of David because his emails don't seem to be getting through. Thank you for the information about Nathan's Court, all of which is supported by a set of maps which Mike sent to me via the list. Best regards Joanne -----Original Message----- From: David Wightmore [mailto:] Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 4:17 AM To: Joanne Humphrey Subject: Nathan's Court Hi Joanne, Eng-man doesn't seem to be accepting my messages... Could you transfer this to the list, please? Nathan's Court is located in Salford in the centre of Back Fredrick Street. Frederick Street starts about the centre of Bury Street and commences in a south-south west direction. Rigby Street starts at Rosamond Street and runs east-west across St Stephens Street and abuts Frederick Street. Back Frederick is to the east of Frederick Street. Frederick Street shows up on the 1858 map, but not Back Frederick. It does, however, show up on the Godfrey Edition Old Ordnance Survey Map Series - #22 - Salford (Adelphi) section b4. hth David

Hi David No, I haven't come across William Humphrey Murray before and I don't believe the first of my Murrays came to Manchester from Ireland until the 1850s so I doubt he is one of mine if he was born in Salford. I think you're right to be considering a military connection as you're right - the population of Aldershot outside the military is definitely in the minority! Joanne -----Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of DAVID STIRLING Sent: Tuesday, 26 February 2013 10:05 PM To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-MAN] Another Manchester MURRAY Hello Joanne, Because of the match of names, I wonder if you know anything about a William Humphrey Murray in my tree. I have it that he was born 2Feb1833, probably in Salford. In 1856 he married Elizabeth Burslem in Chorlton, and in 1863 their son George was born in Aldershot, Hampshire. But in the 1971 census George (age 8) is in the Chorlton workhouse, possibly with his mother, and Wm.Humphrey is nowhere to be found. Aldershot was (and is) a military training centre, so I'm wondering if Wm.Humphrey Murray perished in a war somewhere. David. :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. Other people can learn from them! Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. Please SNIP when replying. Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I receive mailings in Digest mode. This morning the mailing was VERY lengthy and confusing. Please, please, please, Posters, SNIP your postings. We are asked to do this at the head of every mailing. In this morning's Digest I got that message 7 times plus all the tails plus the messages plus the replies. It was yards long! It's very tempting when replying to simply click on the reply button on the computer - but that just messes things up for readers. It would be really helpful if, when replying, posters created a 'clean' new posting to eng-manchester@rootsweb.com with a snip (a cut and paste) showing what it is that's being replied to. Apologies for moaning so early in the morning - but I'm feeling very frustrated. Ruth

As a member of both, I find that they are both useful. Their search facilities are different and often I find that, if I can't find a record on one, I can find it on the other. The facility on FMP to search by address is sometimes very useful. I also find burial records easier to search on FMP. Of course, it is a bit expensive to subscribe to both and others may have different views. Jim -----Original Message----- From: eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-manchester-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Humphrey Sent: 26 February 2013 23:45 To: eng-manchester@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-MAN] Opinions re FH sites I was just wondering whether other listers have found it useful to have membership of both Ancestry and FMP. I am already a member of Ancestry, but FMP is offering a 20% discount if I sign up by tomorrow and I'm wondering whether there is enough additional material on there to make it worth having both. What sorts of records can be found on FMP which make it worthwhile? Thanks in advance Joanne :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: Except for personal messages, please post replies to the list. Other people can learn from them! Be sure list mail is in PLAIN TEXT. Please SNIP when replying. Buy or sell family research items on the GEN-MAT-UKI mailing list. No fees! :-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~:-~: ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-MANCHESTER-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message