Hi Lyn ,   Thanks for your suggestions .   Yes I was told that about the 7 year rule re-marriage and that Victoria was a popular destination because of the prospecting . I was also told that many men changed their names in order to hide their convict past  which would make it even more difficult !   I also wonder if Sarah remarried in England and thats why I can't find her after 1838 . I don't have Ancestry but tried various combinations of first names with birth places on the limited resources I have , to no avail .     It could be mother Sarah and her son just led a gypsy type life and missed all the official records  , as on her marriage when she married Francis Hand he was described as "a hawker" and  her father was also a hawker . They lived in one of the poorest streets in Liverpool , Ben Jonson Street in 1838 . On his marriage in 1868 son Michael , keeping up the tradition of hawker, lived in the poorest street in Nottingham !   Francis Hand' mother Anne and siblings Michael and Bridget also seem elusive .    I have had a look in the Australian records that I could search and so did the researcher that found him for me whilst transcribing his transportation record but will "plod on" . Thanks again ,   David --- On Sat, 7/28/12, Lyn <[email protected]> wrote: From: Lyn <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [ENG-LIV] Help with HAND or SPENCER families of Liverpool c 1820 To: [email protected] Date: Saturday, July 28, 2012, 10:01 PM Hi David? Francis may have remarried in Australia - many convicts did as once a spouse was missing for 7 years you could marry and/or he may have gone to the mainland (probably Victoria) once he got his Certificate of Freedom so he could be in the records there. Most states have online indexes. http://www.coraweb.com.au/bdmaut.htm He might also have worked his passage back to England as crew. Just some thoughts Regards Lyn In Oz. snip >   > > > After his release in 1853 he seems to have dissappeared off > the face of the earth no further records in Oz ,nothing here > . Though with his poor record in Tasmania for drunkeness and > gambling somehow doubt he had the money to buy his passage back . > > There are still a few niggles with me with regard to claiming > it's "our" Francis Hand . > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Admin Message - List guidelines: http://freespace.virgin.net/genealogical.collections/AdminMessage.htm The list admin can be contacted at [email protected]  ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message