Thanks Doreen. Sarah

Good morning Doreen, Thank you for your email and time. I have searched the freeBDM and this is how I found the marriage record of George Taylor and Mary E Bowker, although my grandmother's name was Edna, maybe it was really Mary Edna ?? but this couple are my father's parents and if this is their marriage, it means they did not marry until Dad was 15. Maybe George had not divorced his first wife. I have nothing to go on, as do not know George's parents or siblings, I know Edna Bowker had siblings, as he brothers indentured Dad in the carpentry business when he was 16. I will write to Blackpool Registery Office and if they have details purchase a certificate. Thank you again. Regards Colleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "doreen EL-AHWANY" <doreen@elahwany.freeserve.co.uk> To: <ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 6:14 PM Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 > Hi Colleen, > > I think you really need to start off by buying the full birth certificate > for your father. This will confirm his parents names. > Alan has found a marriage for you in Oldham that could very well be the > second marriage of your grandfather in 1940 in Oldham, and you will also > need the first marriage record as your father was born in 1925. > The marriage certs will then give you the name of Georges father, and with > a bit of luck, you can then find Georges fathers family on the 1901 > census, to take you further back. > Taylor is quite a popular name in this area. > Have you checked the BMD sites online? There is freeBMD and 1837online, > and the LancsBMD that Alan mentioned. > > Best of luck, > Doreen. > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: 16/07/2005 > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== >>==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > To search the archives of this list go to: > http://searches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?surname=ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L-request@rootsweb.com >

I've just read Doreen's reply about Oldham Local Studies having the indexes for 1841. If, as she says, you contact them for the piece and folio numbers for your name(s), I would be happy to look them up on my CDs. Good luck Janet >From: Ghgel@aol.com >Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 08:18:13 EDT > >Thank you very much, Janet- I will have a look at that site (may have seen >it at some point, my mind is overwhelmed with new facts and places, etc.). >I >certainly understand about the time pressure, so do not worry. An index >would >be better at first, I suppose. > _________________________________________________________________ Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now! http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/

Doreen Thanks very much for your very quick response; it was much appreciated and ties in with my records to date Alan KL Malaysia Quoting doreen EL-AHWANY <doreen@elahwany.freeserve.co.uk>: > Hello Alan, > > Have checked the marriage today. > > St Leonards. Middleton. 26 Dec 1836. Page 277. Number 830. > Joseph Howarth. Labourer of this parish > and > Ann Whitworth. Spinster of this parish. (Neither signed). > Wits - Joseph Latham and Wm. Hy. Kenyon (both signed). > By banns. Curate - Robt. Charles Willm. Wilkinson. > > Doreen. > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: > 16/07/2005 > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > >==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > To search the archives of this list go to: > http://searches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?surname=ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L-request@rootsweb.com > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- This e-mail has been sent via JARING webmail at http://www.jaring.my

Doreen, Thank you for the information and for your suggestion. I have just written Oldham LS. Helen

Hi Janet- I just this minute finished writing and sending my request to Oldham LS. Thank you very much for your offer. I will let you know as soon as I hear from them. Have a good day, Helen

Hi Doreen, Have you any information from these records or others on the ages of the parents of either of these Betty Haworths? My grandmother x 4 is a Jane Haworth of Middleton who was born in early 1800s and I am trying, unsuccessfully thus far, to get a lead on her parents and siblings. As James Haworth is a family name your email got me wondering if there is a family link. Sarah Hamilton - US/Massachusetts

Helen, Oldham LS have an index for the 41 Oldham census. If there are not too many Kays listed - they could send you the film/folio numbers, then someone could perhaps look at the CDs for you. Try sending them an email and see what they think. Doreen. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: 16/07/2005

Hello Alan, Have checked the marriage today. St Leonards. Middleton. 26 Dec 1836. Page 277. Number 830. Joseph Howarth. Labourer of this parish and Ann Whitworth. Spinster of this parish. (Neither signed). Wits - Joseph Latham and Wm. Hy. Kenyon (both signed). By banns. Curate - Robt. Charles Willm. Wilkinson. Doreen. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: 16/07/2005

Hello Helen, Have found two baptisms for a Betty in the registers 1806-07. St Leonards. Middleton. 8 Jan 1806. Betty d/o John Howarth, weaver, and Betty his w. of Middleton. 26 April 1807. Betty d/o James Howarth, cotton spinner, and Ann his w. of Middleton. Doreen. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: 16/07/2005

Hi Helen. Manchester & Lancashire Fam. Hist. Soc. have an Oldham branch - have you tried them? The Society 'library' have copies of most censuses, and the IGI. I suggest you contact them for more info and help. Regards, Rita. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Ghgel@aol.com> To: <ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 11:58 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 > Thanks, Alan-Actually, I have only discovered my family came from Oldham > this week, and I know very little about what is available there. I found > my 3x > Great-Grandfather, John Kay, was born there 14 May, 1820, christened at > Greenacres Ind. Methodist Church on Sept. 10, 1820, and his first two sons > were > christened there, too, in the 1840s. > > I guess I am looking for an address for him and his wife, Rachel. Do you > have access, by any chance, to the 1841 census? They would have been > newlyweds > at that time. > > His parents' address would also interest me, as well as their dates of > birth > and death. They are Hannah and James Kay (I know, totally common names...) > Church registers? Haven't found much available online. > > I wonder if there is a way to know where he was employed as a cotton > spinner > in Oldham. I think his father had the same occupation. > > I also wonder (and I am looking for information online) about how many > people emigrated from Oldham in the 1840s to Philadelphia, and why, etc. > > Is KAY still a common name in Oldham? > > Any good sources you can direct me to, or museums in the area you can > point > me to should I manage to get over there (I live in Germany) would be much > appreciated. But esp., a look-up in the 1841 census for John and his > parents > would be fantastic! > > Many thanks for your friendliness, > Helen > > Helen Kay Gelinas > Stoeffelbergweg 7 > 72124 Pliezhausen > Germany > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~emmaw/ for free Web Editor software. > Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. > RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 267.9.2 - Release Date: 19/07/2005 > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 267.9.2 - Release Date: 19/07/2005

Hi Helen Just chipping in with my two penn'orth! I can't at the moment help you with the 1841 Census - I have purchased the CDs, but Oldham is a huge area to search, and I just don't have the time right now. Maybe someone else will have access to an Index which will have all the KAYs listed. I really just wanted to direct you to the Oldham Local Studies website if you haven't already been there - http://www.oldham.gov.uk/community/local_studies.htm It lists a lot of the sources available at the library, which someone may be able to look up for you if you have details of what you need. I know that there are really helpful volunteers at the library too, so it may be worth an email to them. Good luck with your research Janet Curran >From: Ghgel@aol.com >Reply-To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com >To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 >Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 06:58:22 EDT > >Thanks, Alan-Actually, I have only discovered my family came from Oldham >this week, and I know very little about what is available there. I found my >3x >Great-Grandfather, John Kay, was born there 14 May, 1820, christened at >Greenacres Ind. Methodist Church on Sept. 10, 1820, and his first two sons >were >christened there, too, in the 1840s. > >I guess I am looking for an address for him and his wife, Rachel. Do you >have access, by any chance, to the 1841 census? They would have been >newlyweds >at that time. > >His parents' address would also interest me, as well as their dates of >birth >and death. They are Hannah and James Kay (I know, totally common names...) >Church registers? Haven't found much available online. > >I wonder if there is a way to know where he was employed as a cotton >spinner >in Oldham. I think his father had the same occupation. > >I also wonder (and I am looking for information online) about how many >people emigrated from Oldham in the 1840s to Philadelphia, and why, etc. > >Is KAY still a common name in Oldham? > >Any good sources you can direct me to, or museums in the area you can point >me to should I manage to get over there (I live in Germany) would be much >appreciated. But esp., a look-up in the 1841 census for John and his >parents >would be fantastic! > >Many thanks for your friendliness, >Helen > >Helen Kay Gelinas >Stoeffelbergweg 7 >72124 Pliezhausen >Germany > > >==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== >http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~emmaw/ for free Web Editor software. >Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. >RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. > _________________________________________________________________ Be the first to hear what's new at MSN - sign up to our free newsletters! http://www.msn.co.uk/newsletters

Hi Alen, this is just the thing, I do not have any details on George or Edna's parents, I have nothing at all. Mum and Dad (Harry Taylor) had 7 children and now have 36 grand children and 15 great grand children and my aim is to make sure we keep records of our family in the UK. Dad only had his birth registration on him when he arrived here, but no birth certificate, the registration only states his birth date and location. Sorry I can not give you more info. Regards Colleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan" <alan@heyside.freeserve.co.uk> To: <ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 8:12 AM Subject: RE: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 > Hi Colleen > > A quick look at Lancashire BMD has > http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/cgi/pma.cgi?date=1940&county=lancashire&refe > rence=CEA%2f6%2f63&file=B&pos=53270&area=OM > > a potential BOWKER TAYLOR marriage in 1940 ... What was George's fathers > name? .. > > Alan > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Colleen Wells [mailto:colleenhasell@ozemail.com.au] > Sent: 20 July 2005 22:14 > To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 > #118 > > > Hi Alen, > > I am wondering if you can help me. > > I live in Australia and my father (Harry Taylor) was born in Flyde > Blackpool > 10th March 1925, he arrived in Oz during > WW2 with the British Navy, he met my mother in NSW, married her and had 7 > children, he never > returned to the UK, so now I am trying to find details on my Grand parents > in England. > > Can you find any details or point me in the right direction for birth and > marriage details on: > > GEORGE TAYLOR AND EDNA BOWKER - Oldham, Blackpool, Layton ?? not sure > which. > > All I know is George Taylor (grandfather) was a photographer during summer > season in Blackpool > and also worked in the Theatre. Edna his 2nd wife, had 5 children to > George, > Harry, John, Joan, > Madge and Peter. I think they married in Oldham and I don't think they > married until late in life, > maybe as late as 1940, not sure on this. > > Am I on the correct mailing list for Blackpool ?? if not which one should > I > be listed with ? > > Thank you for your time. > > Regards > Colleen (Australia) > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alan" <alan@heyside.freeserve.co.uk> > To: <ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 4:17 AM > Subject: RE: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 > > >> Hi Helen >> This is the nearest we get ...there is a list for Mossley / Saddleworth >> which is east of Oldham ... >> Why ..... do you fancy starting one? >> >> If you have something specific you are interested in I'm in Oldham if i >> can >> help I'll try !! >> Cheers Alan >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ghgel@aol.com [mailto:Ghgel@aol.com] >> Sent: 20 July 2005 12:28 >> To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 >> #118 >> >> >> Hi, Can someone tell me if there is another list for OLDHAM? If so, how >> do >> I >> subscribe to it? >> >> Thanks in advance, >> Helen >> >> >> >> >> ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== >> Make your own home page with IMS >> Web Dwarf. Free HTML Editor http://www.webdwarf.com >> >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/53 - Release Date: 20/07/2005 >> >> >> >> ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== >> Create your own home page with Web Dwarf, a FREE HTML Editor >> http://www.vmims.com/dwarf.htm >> > > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > Create your own home page with Web Dwarf, a FREE HTML Editor > http://www.vmims.com/dwarf.htm > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/53 - Release Date: 20/07/2005 > > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > Check out the Middleton site for up-dates > http://www.vmims.com/middleton.htm >

Hi Colleen, I think you really need to start off by buying the full birth certificate for your father. This will confirm his parents names. Alan has found a marriage for you in Oldham that could very well be the second marriage of your grandfather in 1940 in Oldham, and you will also need the first marriage record as your father was born in 1925. The marriage certs will then give you the name of Georges father, and with a bit of luck, you can then find Georges fathers family on the 1901 census, to take you further back. Taylor is quite a popular name in this area. Have you checked the BMD sites online? There is freeBMD and 1837online, and the LancsBMD that Alan mentioned. Best of luck, Doreen. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: 16/07/2005

Thank you very much, Janet- I will have a look at that site (may have seen it at some point, my mind is overwhelmed with new facts and places, etc.). I certainly understand about the time pressure, so do not worry. An index would be better at first, I suppose. I'll let you know what I uncover! Thanks again, Helen Helen Kay Gelinas

Hi Alen, I am wondering if you can help me. I live in Australia and my father (Harry Taylor) was born in Flyde Blackpool 10th March 1925, he arrived in Oz during WW2 with the British Navy, he met my mother in NSW, married her and had 7 children, he never returned to the UK, so now I am trying to find details on my Grand parents in England. Can you find any details or point me in the right direction for birth and marriage details on: GEORGE TAYLOR AND EDNA BOWKER - Oldham, Blackpool, Layton ?? not sure which. All I know is George Taylor (grandfather) was a photographer during summer season in Blackpool and also worked in the Theatre. Edna his 2nd wife, had 5 children to George, Harry, John, Joan, Madge and Peter. I think they married in Oldham and I don't think they married until late in life, maybe as late as 1940, not sure on this. Am I on the correct mailing list for Blackpool ?? if not which one should I be listed with ? Thank you for your time. Regards Colleen (Australia) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan" <alan@heyside.freeserve.co.uk> To: <ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 4:17 AM Subject: RE: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 > Hi Helen > This is the nearest we get ...there is a list for Mossley / Saddleworth > which is east of Oldham ... > Why ..... do you fancy starting one? > > If you have something specific you are interested in I'm in Oldham if i > can > help I'll try !! > Cheers Alan > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ghgel@aol.com [mailto:Ghgel@aol.com] > Sent: 20 July 2005 12:28 > To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 > #118 > > > Hi, Can someone tell me if there is another list for OLDHAM? If so, how do > I > subscribe to it? > > Thanks in advance, > Helen > > > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > Make your own home page with IMS > Web Dwarf. Free HTML Editor http://www.webdwarf.com > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/53 - Release Date: 20/07/2005 > > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > Create your own home page with Web Dwarf, a FREE HTML Editor > http://www.vmims.com/dwarf.htm >

Thanks, Alan-Actually, I have only discovered my family came from Oldham this week, and I know very little about what is available there. I found my 3x Great-Grandfather, John Kay, was born there 14 May, 1820, christened at Greenacres Ind. Methodist Church on Sept. 10, 1820, and his first two sons were christened there, too, in the 1840s. I guess I am looking for an address for him and his wife, Rachel. Do you have access, by any chance, to the 1841 census? They would have been newlyweds at that time. His parents' address would also interest me, as well as their dates of birth and death. They are Hannah and James Kay (I know, totally common names...) Church registers? Haven't found much available online. I wonder if there is a way to know where he was employed as a cotton spinner in Oldham. I think his father had the same occupation. I also wonder (and I am looking for information online) about how many people emigrated from Oldham in the 1840s to Philadelphia, and why, etc. Is KAY still a common name in Oldham? Any good sources you can direct me to, or museums in the area you can point me to should I manage to get over there (I live in Germany) would be much appreciated. But esp., a look-up in the 1841 census for John and his parents would be fantastic! Many thanks for your friendliness, Helen Helen Kay Gelinas Stoeffelbergweg 7 72124 Pliezhausen Germany

Doreen No offers as yet; would much appreciate a lookup on your next visit to the library Alan Quoting doreen EL-AHWANY <doreen@elahwany.freeserve.co.uk>: > Alan, > Has anyone offered to look at this marriage for you yet? > If not, can do on next visit to the library. > > Doreen. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > Could anyone with access to Middleton St Leonard marriage records, > please > > make a search for the marriage of Joseph HOWARTH to Ann WHITWORTH on > 26 > > Dec 1836. Thanks in anticipation > > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: > 16/07/2005 > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > If you have a home page with content interesting to subscribers of the > Middleton List send an email to emmap@virtualmechhanics.com > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- This e-mail has been sent via JARING webmail at http://www.jaring.my

Hi Colleen A quick look at Lancashire BMD has http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/cgi/pma.cgi?date=1940&county=lancashire&refe rence=CEA%2f6%2f63&file=B&pos=53270&area=OM a potential BOWKER TAYLOR marriage in 1940 ... What was George's fathers name? .. Alan -----Original Message----- From: Colleen Wells [mailto:colleenhasell@ozemail.com.au] Sent: 20 July 2005 22:14 To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 Hi Alen, I am wondering if you can help me. I live in Australia and my father (Harry Taylor) was born in Flyde Blackpool 10th March 1925, he arrived in Oz during WW2 with the British Navy, he met my mother in NSW, married her and had 7 children, he never returned to the UK, so now I am trying to find details on my Grand parents in England. Can you find any details or point me in the right direction for birth and marriage details on: GEORGE TAYLOR AND EDNA BOWKER - Oldham, Blackpool, Layton ?? not sure which. All I know is George Taylor (grandfather) was a photographer during summer season in Blackpool and also worked in the Theatre. Edna his 2nd wife, had 5 children to George, Harry, John, Joan, Madge and Peter. I think they married in Oldham and I don't think they married until late in life, maybe as late as 1940, not sure on this. Am I on the correct mailing list for Blackpool ?? if not which one should I be listed with ? Thank you for your time. Regards Colleen (Australia) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan" <alan@heyside.freeserve.co.uk> To: <ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 4:17 AM Subject: RE: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 #118 > Hi Helen > This is the nearest we get ...there is a list for Mossley / Saddleworth > which is east of Oldham ... > Why ..... do you fancy starting one? > > If you have something specific you are interested in I'm in Oldham if i > can > help I'll try !! > Cheers Alan > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ghgel@aol.com [mailto:Ghgel@aol.com] > Sent: 20 July 2005 12:28 > To: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-L] Re: ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON-D Digest V05 > #118 > > > Hi, Can someone tell me if there is another list for OLDHAM? If so, how do > I > subscribe to it? > > Thanks in advance, > Helen > > > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > Make your own home page with IMS > Web Dwarf. Free HTML Editor http://www.webdwarf.com > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/53 - Release Date: 20/07/2005 > > > > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== > Create your own home page with Web Dwarf, a FREE HTML Editor > http://www.vmims.com/dwarf.htm > ==== ENG-LAN-MIDDLETON Mailing List ==== Create your own home page with Web Dwarf, a FREE HTML Editor http://www.vmims.com/dwarf.htm -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/53 - Release Date: 20/07/2005

Alan, Has anyone offered to look at this marriage for you yet? If not, can do on next visit to the library. Doreen. ----- Original Message ----- > Could anyone with access to Middleton St Leonard marriage records, please > make a search for the marriage of Joseph HOWARTH to Ann WHITWORTH on 26 > Dec 1836. Thanks in anticipation -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/47 - Release Date: 16/07/2005