Sorry everyone, I've done it again...replied to the list when I meant to reply to Bob. Just ignore that last message of mine!!!!!! Josie

Dear Bob, Thanks for the email...I didn't rush to reply as you said you were off to France, then there was an email from you this morning...so here I am replying! I was able to go to CKS yesterday after all. John changed his day with his mother so I booked in and took Hannah (younger daughter) with me...she explored the many retail delights of Maidstone (Topshop, H and M, etc, etc) while I got on with far more interesting things. Mainly getting examples for my October talk. I shall probably go up next week with Celia (older daughter) as she is doing a dissertation as part of course this year and wants to be shown round. But let me know about when you and Pat are there following that. Either day you mention should be good for me. I am going in to school to help in a friend's class one morning a week but we haven't yet set up a day for that. Why did you ask if I was looking at early baptisms on film at Dover? I didn't know they had them! I haven't looked at early baptisms. best wishes, Josie ----- Original Message ----- From: "BOB CHOWN" <bob.chown@btinternet.com> To: <eng-ken-woodchurch@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, September 02, 2007 7:37 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Epidemic of October 1678- March 1680 -followup questions > Good morning Josie > > Many thanks. Very interesting indeed. I had identified 'Religion and Society in Kent, 1640-1914' as a possible source of Epidemic information for this time. I will go to Canterbury Library on Monday morning and see if they have a copy. Some sort of timeline might be informative. > > I started 1675-1754 Marriages yesterday in Canterbury Archives and 1679-1680 appear to be busy marriage years with lots of widowers and widows. > > I need to complete the de Launy 1538-1600 transcriptions before looking at marriages with you. I have reached the letter R. We will not be going to CKS until the second half of this month. I am leading a week long D-Day and Normandy Battlefield tour for some American friends next week. I will let you know when I start to make bookings as we can get adjacent tables if we organize ourselves some time in advance. Pat and I favour Tuesdays and Fridays (11-5 with free bus passes) as these are David Hills days - three heads are better than two or one with Secretary Script - four are even better. CKS are closed Mondays and CA Fridays. > > Are you are reading the film for early Woodchurch Baptisms at Dover Library? > > I have volunteered to assist FreeBMD in photographing the early Births, Marriages and Deaths Indexes. The Family Record Centre is closing soon and direct access to the original Indexes will cease. Very understandable as they are showing definite signs of wear with their continual use. Digital cameras were not around when they were originally photographed. Pat and I will do this on Monday 8th October when the local Mormons run a bus up to the Family Record Centre in London. The specification requirement is quite something. No flash. 3 mega pixels per picture so 2 megabytes per image and no more than 10 megabytes per email attachment. I have a 2 gigabyte flash card for just such occasions. Best done on the floor by a large window we are advised. We hope to do at least 100 but they are not continuous so a lot of running about with those huge books. Pat has agreed to hold the pages flat - vital. We think it is an important project and where would we all be without FreeBMD. > > Best wishes - Bob Chown > >

Dear Jennie That is a wonderful piece of information. Well found. Best wishes - Bob Chown Jennie Light <jennie.light@totalise.co.uk> wrote: In February 1778 Mr Wells and Mr Button were paid seven shillings and sixpence for removing the smallpox people. {Woodchurch 1123, Kent Archives} Jennie. ----- Original Message ----- From: "BOB CHOWN" To: "Woodchurch Ancestry Group" Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 8:15 AM Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Epidemic of October 1678- March 1680 - followup questions > Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group > > I was asked a number of questions about this epidemic. The expectation > was that about 18 would have died naturally over the 18 month period > concerned instead of the 68 so, it appears, about 50 or 10% of the > population died unnaturally. All lists are in date order as recorded so > January 1st to March 25th (Lady Day) are recorded in the previous calender > year. > > Three families lost members who appear to have been closely related. > > Family 1 - The Cheesmans > > Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 > Frances the Daughter of Robert Cheesman & Tamsin his Wife was buried April > 3rd 1679 > Joane Cheesman Widow was buried April 21th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th > 1679 > > Family 2 - The Ramsdens > > Richard Ramsden was buried Oct 26th 1678 > Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 > Richard Ramsden was buried March 14th1678 > > Family 3 - The Weeks > > John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 > Sarah the Daughter of Richard Weeks was buried Oct. 29th 1679 > Richard Weeks was buried Janu. 13th 1679 > > This would suggest a contagious disease. However because no mention is > made in the burial records of what killed these unfortunate people I > suspect it was well known rather than a disease like bubonic plague which > carried implications such as quarantine and was more prevalent in the > crowded cities. Jessop in his History of Kent suggests that the 1666 > bubonic plague outbreak had ended by 1679. The best candidate would appear > to be Small Pox. > > There are only 6 references to deaths as a result of Small Pox in the > Burials Register but these are between 1760 and 1787. > > The epidemic peaked in June 1679 when there were 9 burials, 5 in four > days. > > William Hannakin was buried June 3rd 1679 > Anne Carpenter Widow was buried June 4th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Thomas the Son of John Wimsherst & Mary his Wife was buried June 7th 1679 > Catherine the Daughter of Elizabeth Ditton Widow was buried June 12th 1679 > Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th > 1679 > Thomas Gibbirshson was buried June 25th 1679 > John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 > > 13 'wives' were buried during the period concerned. Some may not have > been of child bearing age, but many were. Anne Ramsden, my ancestor, was > 39 and had had 7 children including one in the year she died. > > Mary Pell the Wife of Stephen Pell was buried Oct 31th 1678 > Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 > Elizabeth the Wiffe of Matthew Waker was buried Dec. 27th 1678 > Mary the Wife of Richard Brown was buried January 17th 1678 > Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 > Rebekah the Wife of Edward Butcher was buried March 24th 1678 > Sarah the Wife of Uriah Parker was buried April 26th 1679 > Catherine the Wife of John Piper was buried May 14th 1679 > Mary the Wife of Edward Brisly was buried Decem 21th 1679 > Sarah the Wife of John Cooke was buried Decem 30th 1679 > Mary the Wife of John Glover was buried January 2nd 1679 > Mary the Wife of Stephen Holeman was buried January 2nd 1679 > Margaret the Wife of William Hilton was buried Jan. 11th 1679 > > I have been unable to find any references to any epidemics around this > period on the internet or in my book collection other than a reference to > an outbreak of Small Pox in 1678 in New England. I would welcome any > comments or further questions. > > Best wishes - Bob Chown > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.13.2/983 - Release Date: 9/1/2007 > 4:20 PM > > -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for private users. It has removed 830 spam emails to date. Paying users do not have this message in their emails. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks for the heads up on this, Tony. Now fixed. Gary On 04.09.2007 09:20, tony.afj.powell@bt.com wrote: > Unable to get into any wood church census information either today or > yesterday . Is there a problem with this part of the site ?

Unable to get into any wood church census information either today or yesterday . Is there a problem with this part of the site ?

In February 1778 Mr Wells and Mr Button were paid seven shillings and sixpence for removing the smallpox people. {Woodchurch 1123, Kent Archives} Jennie. ----- Original Message ----- From: "BOB CHOWN" <bob.chown@btinternet.com> To: "Woodchurch Ancestry Group" <ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 8:15 AM Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Epidemic of October 1678- March 1680 - followup questions > Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group > > I was asked a number of questions about this epidemic. The expectation > was that about 18 would have died naturally over the 18 month period > concerned instead of the 68 so, it appears, about 50 or 10% of the > population died unnaturally. All lists are in date order as recorded so > January 1st to March 25th (Lady Day) are recorded in the previous calender > year. > > Three families lost members who appear to have been closely related. > > Family 1 - The Cheesmans > > Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 > Frances the Daughter of Robert Cheesman & Tamsin his Wife was buried April > 3rd 1679 > Joane Cheesman Widow was buried April 21th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th > 1679 > > Family 2 - The Ramsdens > > Richard Ramsden was buried Oct 26th 1678 > Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 > Richard Ramsden was buried March 14th1678 > > Family 3 - The Weeks > > John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 > Sarah the Daughter of Richard Weeks was buried Oct. 29th 1679 > Richard Weeks was buried Janu. 13th 1679 > > This would suggest a contagious disease. However because no mention is > made in the burial records of what killed these unfortunate people I > suspect it was well known rather than a disease like bubonic plague which > carried implications such as quarantine and was more prevalent in the > crowded cities. Jessop in his History of Kent suggests that the 1666 > bubonic plague outbreak had ended by 1679. The best candidate would appear > to be Small Pox. > > There are only 6 references to deaths as a result of Small Pox in the > Burials Register but these are between 1760 and 1787. > > The epidemic peaked in June 1679 when there were 9 burials, 5 in four > days. > > William Hannakin was buried June 3rd 1679 > Anne Carpenter Widow was buried June 4th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 > Thomas the Son of John Wimsherst & Mary his Wife was buried June 7th 1679 > Catherine the Daughter of Elizabeth Ditton Widow was buried June 12th 1679 > Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th > 1679 > Thomas Gibbirshson was buried June 25th 1679 > John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 > > 13 'wives' were buried during the period concerned. Some may not have > been of child bearing age, but many were. Anne Ramsden, my ancestor, was > 39 and had had 7 children including one in the year she died. > > Mary Pell the Wife of Stephen Pell was buried Oct 31th 1678 > Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 > Elizabeth the Wiffe of Matthew Waker was buried Dec. 27th 1678 > Mary the Wife of Richard Brown was buried January 17th 1678 > Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 > Rebekah the Wife of Edward Butcher was buried March 24th 1678 > Sarah the Wife of Uriah Parker was buried April 26th 1679 > Catherine the Wife of John Piper was buried May 14th 1679 > Mary the Wife of Edward Brisly was buried Decem 21th 1679 > Sarah the Wife of John Cooke was buried Decem 30th 1679 > Mary the Wife of John Glover was buried January 2nd 1679 > Mary the Wife of Stephen Holeman was buried January 2nd 1679 > Margaret the Wife of William Hilton was buried Jan. 11th 1679 > > I have been unable to find any references to any epidemics around this > period on the internet or in my book collection other than a reference to > an outbreak of Small Pox in 1678 in New England. I would welcome any > comments or further questions. > > Best wishes - Bob Chown > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.13.2/983 - Release Date: 9/1/2007 > 4:20 PM > > -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for private users. It has removed 830 spam emails to date. Paying users do not have this message in their emails. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len

Hi, Do the churchyard survey books have the names of those in unmarked graves/plots and their position in the churchyard - a few of mine are unmarked and I'd like to know roughly where they are! Phil. -----Original Message----- From: eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Gary Samson Sent: 02 September 2007 19:28 To: eng-ken-woodchurch@rootsweb.com Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Dr Jack Gillett's transcription of MIs at StMichaels, Tenterden For information. ----- St. Michael & All Angels PCC Are you interested in the history of the village? Have you family connections in the village? We have a new churchyard survey of monumental inscriptions from 1863 -until 2007 Please come along to a presentation in the church on Saturday 15th September at 4pm. There will be a short talk on the survey followed by tea and cakes. The Churchyard Survey Books and Burial Records from 1863 to March 2007 will be available for sale on the day. Please come along - all very welcome. For more details contact Carol Stevens on 01580 762703 ----- ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have James Poune from Woodchurch marrying Harriet Edwards from High Halden in High Halden on 23rd Dec 1848.. The couple are not recorded in any subsequent census records but there is a Harriet Poune born c 1825 and J.H.Poune born c 1850. listed on the New York Passenger list for Nov.1874 I assume this was mother and son. The ship Cienfuegos is shown as departing from Nassau in the Bahamas. I also have a James Poune enlisting in the Union Army in 1861. in Wisconsin. I assume he was Harriet's husband but cannot prove it. There seems to be a Wisconsin connection as a John. H. Poune married Myrtle Tulledge in Wisconsin in 1905. Can any member tell me if there any web sites that give emigration records from the UK in the eighteen hundreds. ? Are there any of our American friends that have access to records which could positively connect Harriet, James and John H..Poune ?. Best wishes to all. Ernie Smith

For information. ----- St. Michael & All Angels PCC Are you interested in the history of the village? Have you family connections in the village? We have a new churchyard survey of monumental inscriptions from 1863 –until 2007 Please come along to a presentation in the church on Saturday 15th September at 4pm. There will be a short talk on the survey followed by tea and cakes. The Churchyard Survey Books and Burial Records from 1863 to March 2007 will be available for sale on the day. Please come along - all very welcome. For more details contact Carol Stevens on 01580 762703 -----

Dear Pauline There must be a research nurse or clinician among our members who will tell us if what is being suggested is feasible. Does the disease linger, how does the virus die out, what is the gestation period, how long does an Epidemic of this type normaly last. I just do not know these things. The abnormal number of burials occurred over 18 months and peaked in June 1679. Deep down Pauline, I am a bean counter! And Ceteris Paribus is never true. Sorry - Bob Chown Pauline Gardiner <pauline@gardiners.fslife.co.uk> wrote: This is fascinating. the only observation I would make is that the "wives" all died during the winter months. Nothing between May and December 1679, whereas the epidemic was during June. Does this suggest that there were two diseases as the cold of winter kills off many germs, whereas a large number flourish in the warm summer months? Pauline Pauline Gardiner 01233 860579 -----Original Message----- From: eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of BOB CHOWN Sent: 31 August 2007 08:16 To: Woodchurch Ancestry Group Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Epidemic of October 1678- March 1680 - followup questions Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group I was asked a number of questions about this epidemic. The expectation was that about 18 would have died naturally over the 18 month period concerned instead of the 68 so, it appears, about 50 or 10% of the population died unnaturally. All lists are in date order as recorded so January 1st to March 25th (Lady Day) are recorded in the previous calender year. Three families lost members who appear to have been closely related. Family 1 - The Cheesmans Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 Frances the Daughter of Robert Cheesman & Tamsin his Wife was buried April 3rd 1679 Joane Cheesman Widow was buried April 21th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th 1679 Family 2 - The Ramsdens Richard Ramsden was buried Oct 26th 1678 Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 Richard Ramsden was buried March 14th1678 Family 3 - The Weeks John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 Sarah the Daughter of Richard Weeks was buried Oct. 29th 1679 Richard Weeks was buried Janu. 13th 1679 This would suggest a contagious disease. However because no mention is made in the burial records of what killed these unfortunate people I suspect it was well known rather than a disease like bubonic plague which carried implications such as quarantine and was more prevalent in the crowded cities. Jessop in his History of Kent suggests that the 1666 bubonic plague outbreak had ended by 1679. The best candidate would appear to be Small Pox. There are only 6 references to deaths as a result of Small Pox in the Burials Register but these are between 1760 and 1787. The epidemic peaked in June 1679 when there were 9 burials, 5 in four days. William Hannakin was buried June 3rd 1679 Anne Carpenter Widow was buried June 4th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Thomas the Son of John Wimsherst & Mary his Wife was buried June 7th 1679 Catherine the Daughter of Elizabeth Ditton Widow was buried June 12th 1679 Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th 1679 Thomas Gibbirshson was buried June 25th 1679 John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 13 'wives' were buried during the period concerned. Some may not have been of child bearing age, but many were. Anne Ramsden, my ancestor, was 39 and had had 7 children including one in the year she died. Mary Pell the Wife of Stephen Pell was buried Oct 31th 1678 Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 Elizabeth the Wiffe of Matthew Waker was buried Dec. 27th 1678 Mary the Wife of Richard Brown was buried January 17th 1678 Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 Rebekah the Wife of Edward Butcher was buried March 24th 1678 Sarah the Wife of Uriah Parker was buried April 26th 1679 Catherine the Wife of John Piper was buried May 14th 1679 Mary the Wife of Edward Brisly was buried Decem 21th 1679 Sarah the Wife of John Cooke was buried Decem 30th 1679 Mary the Wife of John Glover was buried January 2nd 1679 Mary the Wife of Stephen Holeman was buried January 2nd 1679 Margaret the Wife of William Hilton was buried Jan. 11th 1679 I have been unable to find any references to any epidemics around this period on the internet or in my book collection other than a reference to an outbreak of Small Pox in 1678 in New England. I would welcome any comments or further questions. Best wishes - Bob Chown ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Good morning Josie Many thanks. Very interesting indeed. I had identified 'Religion and Society in Kent, 1640-1914' as a possible source of Epidemic information for this time. I will go to Canterbury Library on Monday morning and see if they have a copy. Some sort of timeline might be informative. I started 1675-1754 Marriages yesterday in Canterbury Archives and 1679-1680 appear to be busy marriage years with lots of widowers and widows. I need to complete the de Launy 1538-1600 transcriptions before looking at marriages with you. I have reached the letter R. We will not be going to CKS until the second half of this month. I am leading a week long D-Day and Normandy Battlefield tour for some American friends next week. I will let you know when I start to make bookings as we can get adjacent tables if we organize ourselves some time in advance. Pat and I favour Tuesdays and Fridays (11-5 with free bus passes) as these are David Hills days - three heads are better than two or one with Secretary Script - four are even better. CKS are closed Mondays and CA Fridays. Are you are reading the film for early Woodchurch Baptisms at Dover Library? I have volunteered to assist FreeBMD in photographing the early Births, Marriages and Deaths Indexes. The Family Record Centre is closing soon and direct access to the original Indexes will cease. Very understandable as they are showing definite signs of wear with their continual use. Digital cameras were not around when they were originally photographed. Pat and I will do this on Monday 8th October when the local Mormons run a bus up to the Family Record Centre in London. The specification requirement is quite something. No flash. 3 mega pixels per picture so 2 megabytes per image and no more than 10 megabytes per email attachment. I have a 2 gigabyte flash card for just such occasions. Best done on the floor by a large window we are advised. We hope to do at least 100 but they are not continuous so a lot of running about with those huge books. Pat has agreed to hold the pages flat - vital. We think it is an important project and where would we all be without FreeBMD. Best wishes - Bob Chown Josie Mackie <josie.mackie@tesco.net> wrote: Good Morning Bob, I have found a few references which may interest you. It's very likely that the high number of deaths was, as you said, contagious disease related: Hay and Rogers ('Eighteenth Century English Society' OUP 1997, p77) say, (bearing in mind they are talking about the whole of England, not the SE in particular) "...with the possible exception of the late 1720s, famine -related mortality disappeared by the second quarter of the seventeenth century......it appears that in early-modern times such crises probably accounted for no more than 10 per cent of normal mortality...." Arthur Ruderman ('A History of Ashford' Phillimore 1994, p.30) (For our overseas members, Ashford is about seven miles from Woodchurch) : "The burial registers give us some idea of incidence of disease over the centuries. If the number of burials in any year is more than twice the average for the decade, it can be assumed that some form of epidemic occured. For Ashford, this happened in 1578, 1584, 1594, 1625, 1687, and 1741. In 1625 this was due to an outbreak of plague, some 100 persons being marked in tthe registeras dying from this disease. The situation was so bad that the Justices levied a special tax on the neighbourhood to relieve those without means of support, or, as they phrased it, 'lest the sick should be forced for the succour of their lives to break forth of the town to the great danger of the country'. " [Sounds as they they need to be congratulated as Eyam] To continue: "In 1741 the deaths were almost certaily due to smallpox, since, although the registers give no indication, several cases are recorded in other documents at this time." He goes on to give examples of smallpox deaths 1717 onwards. Then, from 'Religion and Society in Kent, 1640-1914', I made the following notes. [I do not have the book myself, so can only say what I noted down, but it's in main libraries. There may be more of interest, for late 17th century, on this topic in the book]. Outbreak of smallpox at Folkestone: 1720 , 145 died. 140 died at Canterbury in 1729. 33 died at Deal and 61 at Dover in 1725-6. Inoculation virtually unknown in Kent in 1724. Other illnesses at time [I'm not sure whether the author is referring to his whole period or not] were tuberculosis, typhus, typhoid, influenza, scarlatina, diphtheria. Best wishes, Josie ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

This is fascinating. the only observation I would make is that the "wives" all died during the winter months. Nothing between May and December 1679, whereas the epidemic was during June. Does this suggest that there were two diseases as the cold of winter kills off many germs, whereas a large number flourish in the warm summer months? Pauline Pauline Gardiner 01233 860579 -----Original Message----- From: eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of BOB CHOWN Sent: 31 August 2007 08:16 To: Woodchurch Ancestry Group Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Epidemic of October 1678- March 1680 - followup questions Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group I was asked a number of questions about this epidemic. The expectation was that about 18 would have died naturally over the 18 month period concerned instead of the 68 so, it appears, about 50 or 10% of the population died unnaturally. All lists are in date order as recorded so January 1st to March 25th (Lady Day) are recorded in the previous calender year. Three families lost members who appear to have been closely related. Family 1 - The Cheesmans Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 Frances the Daughter of Robert Cheesman & Tamsin his Wife was buried April 3rd 1679 Joane Cheesman Widow was buried April 21th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th 1679 Family 2 - The Ramsdens Richard Ramsden was buried Oct 26th 1678 Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 Richard Ramsden was buried March 14th1678 Family 3 - The Weeks John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 Sarah the Daughter of Richard Weeks was buried Oct. 29th 1679 Richard Weeks was buried Janu. 13th 1679 This would suggest a contagious disease. However because no mention is made in the burial records of what killed these unfortunate people I suspect it was well known rather than a disease like bubonic plague which carried implications such as quarantine and was more prevalent in the crowded cities. Jessop in his History of Kent suggests that the 1666 bubonic plague outbreak had ended by 1679. The best candidate would appear to be Small Pox. There are only 6 references to deaths as a result of Small Pox in the Burials Register but these are between 1760 and 1787. The epidemic peaked in June 1679 when there were 9 burials, 5 in four days. William Hannakin was buried June 3rd 1679 Anne Carpenter Widow was buried June 4th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Thomas the Son of John Wimsherst & Mary his Wife was buried June 7th 1679 Catherine the Daughter of Elizabeth Ditton Widow was buried June 12th 1679 Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th 1679 Thomas Gibbirshson was buried June 25th 1679 John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 13 'wives' were buried during the period concerned. Some may not have been of child bearing age, but many were. Anne Ramsden, my ancestor, was 39 and had had 7 children including one in the year she died. Mary Pell the Wife of Stephen Pell was buried Oct 31th 1678 Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 Elizabeth the Wiffe of Matthew Waker was buried Dec. 27th 1678 Mary the Wife of Richard Brown was buried January 17th 1678 Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 Rebekah the Wife of Edward Butcher was buried March 24th 1678 Sarah the Wife of Uriah Parker was buried April 26th 1679 Catherine the Wife of John Piper was buried May 14th 1679 Mary the Wife of Edward Brisly was buried Decem 21th 1679 Sarah the Wife of John Cooke was buried Decem 30th 1679 Mary the Wife of John Glover was buried January 2nd 1679 Mary the Wife of Stephen Holeman was buried January 2nd 1679 Margaret the Wife of William Hilton was buried Jan. 11th 1679 I have been unable to find any references to any epidemics around this period on the internet or in my book collection other than a reference to an outbreak of Small Pox in 1678 in New England. I would welcome any comments or further questions. Best wishes - Bob Chown ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Good Morning Bob, I have found a few references which may interest you. It's very likely that the high number of deaths was, as you said, contagious disease related: Hay and Rogers ('Eighteenth Century English Society' OUP 1997, p77) say, (bearing in mind they are talking about the whole of England, not the SE in particular) "...with the possible exception of the late 1720s, famine -related mortality disappeared by the second quarter of the seventeenth century......it appears that in early-modern times such crises probably accounted for no more than 10 per cent of normal mortality...." Arthur Ruderman ('A History of Ashford' Phillimore 1994, p.30) (For our overseas members, Ashford is about seven miles from Woodchurch) : "The burial registers give us some idea of incidence of disease over the centuries. If the number of burials in any year is more than twice the average for the decade, it can be assumed that some form of epidemic occured. For Ashford, this happened in 1578, 1584, 1594, 1625, 1687, and 1741. In 1625 this was due to an outbreak of plague, some 100 persons being marked in tthe registeras dying from this disease. The situation was so bad that the Justices levied a special tax on the neighbourhood to relieve those without means of support, or, as they phrased it, 'lest the sick should be forced for the succour of their lives to break forth of the town to the great danger of the country'. " [Sounds as they they need to be congratulated as Eyam] To continue: "In 1741 the deaths were almost certaily due to smallpox, since, although the registers give no indication, several cases are recorded in other documents at this time." He goes on to give examples of smallpox deaths 1717 onwards. Then, from 'Religion and Society in Kent, 1640-1914', I made the following notes. [I do not have the book myself, so can only say what I noted down, but it's in main libraries. There may be more of interest, for late 17th century, on this topic in the book]. Outbreak of smallpox at Folkestone: 1720 , 145 died. 140 died at Canterbury in 1729. 33 died at Deal and 61 at Dover in 1725-6. Inoculation virtually unknown in Kent in 1724. Other illnesses at time [I'm not sure whether the author is referring to his whole period or not] were tuberculosis, typhus, typhoid, influenza, scarlatina, diphtheria. Best wishes, Josie

Tony , what do you know about your Rebecca Knowlden ? I have Knowlden's in Tenterden . Regards , Lynn ----- Original Message ----- From: <tony.afj.powell@bt.com> To: <ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:02 PM Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Thomas boorman Willis > > Bob has now shed new light on my family tree > He has added a baptism of a Thomas boorman Willis 2nd may 1784 son of > Ann Willis > Has any body got him in their family tree ? I assume that Ann was > unmarried at the time & that boorman may have been the father of the > child as it was custom to add the surname of the father for unmarried > mothers. > Due I also assume that Ann married Robert levet in 1791 . > If this is the case & this Thomas later married Rebecca knowlden & > started my (& Shelia s ) Willis line in wood church then I have an > awful lot wrong > Tony Powell > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.12.12/979 - Release Date: 29/08/07 8:21 PM > >

Yes please Bob , regards Lynn & Ross ----- Original Message ----- From: "BOB CHOWN" <bob.chown@btinternet.com> To: "Woodchurch FHS" <ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:37 PM Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] The Woodchurch Epidemic October 1678 to March1680 > Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group > > I was intrigued by the email exchanges on the bubonic plague and other possible epidemics in Woodchurch. As we now have baptisms and burials complete from 1676 I decided to use this data, unavailable before, to check the period 1676-1700 for signs of possible epidemics. > > I produced two sets of charts using MS Works Spreadsheet, one set of five showing baptisms per month for each five year period and the second set of five showing burials per month for each five year period. There appeared to be a significant rise in burials between October 1678 and March 1680. Further analysis of the two sets of data showed, using a 21 month moving average, showed that baptisms averaged about 1.5 per month from January 1676 to September 1678. For the same period burials averaged about 1.0 per month. Ceteris paribus, (other things remaining equal) there was a net village population gain of about 15 between January 1676 and September 1678. > > Between October 1678 and March 1680 there were 68 burials, an average of 3.78 per month. The net gain of 15 from January 1676 became a net loss of 29 by April 1680. The Curate at the period, while not giving cause of death in the Burial Register, gave family relationships and marital status. 12 of the 68 burials were wives. > > Burials spiked again between October 1680 and November 1681 when there were 35, an average of 2.5 per month. 5 of the 35 burials were wives. The number of baptisms per month fell to under 1.0 from 1680 to 1684 when it recovered to about 1.5. Ceteris paribus, the net loss to the population of Woodchurch between January 1676 and March 1684 reached 72. Baptisms and burials returned to the normal monthly averages of about 1.5 and 1.0 respectively for the rest of the century and by December 1700 the net population loss from January 1676 was only 3. > > I then attempted to make some sort of total village population calculation using the same data. Using as a model a study done in Kingsthorpe, Northampton, where the Chowns came from, I calculated an 11 year moving average which I then multiplied by 30 and 35 to produce an approximate spread. This calculation works well I have found when checked against known totals provided the population does not change rapidly. For 1681, the earliest year by this method, this calculation produced a total population for Woodchurch of between 458 and 535. The death of 68 villagers in a 20 month period represented a loss of between 15% and 13% respectively, or about 1 in 7! I can think of no comparative modern loss of life including two world wars and Spanish Flu that could possibly equate. > > The 10 charts I produced are available on request in PDF Format but will need to be sent to requesters direct. > > Best wishes - Bob Chown > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.12.12/979 - Release Date: 29/08/07 8:21 PM > >

Dear Tony You are correct in assuming Ann Willis was unmarried at the time of the birth of Thomas Boorman Willis. There is a good chance the father's name was Thomas Boorman. Usually 'base born' or 'base begotten' was added by the Curate but Richard Jones, the Curate at this time, was entering minimal information. How different in 1731 when the following information was given for an illegitimate birth; 'March 15th 1730 William base born Son of Elizabeth Pray by Thomas Wild a Weaver & Stranger de Vita periclitans domi baptizat. [his life slipping away he was baptized at home according to the official way] This Strumpet had a Bastard before for which she did Penance in 1729; this was buried Ap. 29th last. See Burial in this register buried Mar. 28.' Elizabeth had four different illegitimate children by four different men and gave each child the surname of the father as a second forename. The Minister gave up getting her to do Penance after the second child! Good hunting - Bob Chown tony.afj.powell@bt.com wrote: Bob has now shed new light on my family tree He has added a baptism of a Thomas boorman Willis 2nd may 1784 son of Ann Willis Has any body got him in their family tree ? I assume that Ann was unmarried at the time & that boorman may have been the father of the child as it was custom to add the surname of the father for unmarried mothers. Due I also assume that Ann married Robert levet in 1791 . If this is the case & this Thomas later married Rebecca knowlden & started my (& Shelia s ) Willis line in wood church then I have an awful lot wrong Tony Powell ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Nothing at present have not done that side of family yet -----Original Message----- From: eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-ken-woodchurch-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Ross and Lynn Humphreys Sent: 31 August 2007 09:16 To: eng-ken-woodchurch@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Thomas boorman Willis Tony , what do you know about your Rebecca Knowlden ? I have Knowlden's in Tenterden . Regards , Lynn ----- Original Message ----- From: <tony.afj.powell@bt.com> To: <ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:02 PM Subject: [ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH] Thomas boorman Willis > > Bob has now shed new light on my family tree > He has added a baptism of a Thomas boorman Willis 2nd may 1784 son of > Ann Willis Has any body got him in their family tree ? I assume that > Ann was unmarried at the time & that boorman may have been the father > of the child as it was custom to add the surname of the father for > unmarried mothers. > Due I also assume that Ann married Robert levet in 1791 . > If this is the case & this Thomas later married Rebecca knowlden & > started my (& Shelia s ) Willis line in wood church then I have an > awful lot wrong > Tony Powell > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.12.12/979 - Release Date: 29/08/07 8:21 PM > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-KEN-WOODCHURCH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group I was asked a number of questions about this epidemic. The expectation was that about 18 would have died naturally over the 18 month period concerned instead of the 68 so, it appears, about 50 or 10% of the population died unnaturally. All lists are in date order as recorded so January 1st to March 25th (Lady Day) are recorded in the previous calender year. Three families lost members who appear to have been closely related. Family 1 - The Cheesmans Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 Frances the Daughter of Robert Cheesman & Tamsin his Wife was buried April 3rd 1679 Joane Cheesman Widow was buried April 21th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th 1679 Family 2 - The Ramsdens Richard Ramsden was buried Oct 26th 1678 Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 Richard Ramsden was buried March 14th1678 Family 3 - The Weeks John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 Sarah the Daughter of Richard Weeks was buried Oct. 29th 1679 Richard Weeks was buried Janu. 13th 1679 This would suggest a contagious disease. However because no mention is made in the burial records of what killed these unfortunate people I suspect it was well known rather than a disease like bubonic plague which carried implications such as quarantine and was more prevalent in the crowded cities. Jessop in his History of Kent suggests that the 1666 bubonic plague outbreak had ended by 1679. The best candidate would appear to be Small Pox. There are only 6 references to deaths as a result of Small Pox in the Burials Register but these are between 1760 and 1787. The epidemic peaked in June 1679 when there were 9 burials, 5 in four days. William Hannakin was buried June 3rd 1679 Anne Carpenter Widow was buried June 4th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Avery Cheesman & his Son John were buried June 5th 1679 Thomas the Son of John Wimsherst & Mary his Wife was buried June 7th 1679 Catherine the Daughter of Elizabeth Ditton Widow was buried June 12th 1679 Thomas the Son of William Cheesman & Bridget his Wife was buried June 17th 1679 Thomas Gibbirshson was buried June 25th 1679 John Weeks was buried June 25th 1679 13 'wives' were buried during the period concerned. Some may not have been of child bearing age, but many were. Anne Ramsden, my ancestor, was 39 and had had 7 children including one in the year she died. Mary Pell the Wife of Stephen Pell was buried Oct 31th 1678 Anne the Wife of Richard Ramsden was buried Nov: 28th 1678 Elizabeth the Wiffe of Matthew Waker was buried Dec. 27th 1678 Mary the Wife of Richard Brown was buried January 17th 1678 Anne the Wife of Avery Cheesman was buried January 25th 1678 Rebekah the Wife of Edward Butcher was buried March 24th 1678 Sarah the Wife of Uriah Parker was buried April 26th 1679 Catherine the Wife of John Piper was buried May 14th 1679 Mary the Wife of Edward Brisly was buried Decem 21th 1679 Sarah the Wife of John Cooke was buried Decem 30th 1679 Mary the Wife of John Glover was buried January 2nd 1679 Mary the Wife of Stephen Holeman was buried January 2nd 1679 Margaret the Wife of William Hilton was buried Jan. 11th 1679 I have been unable to find any references to any epidemics around this period on the internet or in my book collection other than a reference to an outbreak of Small Pox in 1678 in New England. I would welcome any comments or further questions. Best wishes - Bob Chown

That's very interesting , Bob. It's going to take me a few readings to understand it all! Yes, please send on your charts to me. Also the 20 month period you refer to...did the deaths occur fairly regularly or were there peaks and troughs? Thanks, Josie

Dear Members of Woodchurch Ancestry Group I was intrigued by the email exchanges on the bubonic plague and other possible epidemics in Woodchurch. As we now have baptisms and burials complete from 1676 I decided to use this data, unavailable before, to check the period 1676-1700 for signs of possible epidemics. I produced two sets of charts using MS Works Spreadsheet, one set of five showing baptisms per month for each five year period and the second set of five showing burials per month for each five year period. There appeared to be a significant rise in burials between October 1678 and March 1680. Further analysis of the two sets of data showed, using a 21 month moving average, showed that baptisms averaged about 1.5 per month from January 1676 to September 1678. For the same period burials averaged about 1.0 per month. Ceteris paribus, (other things remaining equal) there was a net village population gain of about 15 between January 1676 and September 1678. Between October 1678 and March 1680 there were 68 burials, an average of 3.78 per month. The net gain of 15 from January 1676 became a net loss of 29 by April 1680. The Curate at the period, while not giving cause of death in the Burial Register, gave family relationships and marital status. 12 of the 68 burials were wives. Burials spiked again between October 1680 and November 1681 when there were 35, an average of 2.5 per month. 5 of the 35 burials were wives. The number of baptisms per month fell to under 1.0 from 1680 to 1684 when it recovered to about 1.5. Ceteris paribus, the net loss to the population of Woodchurch between January 1676 and March 1684 reached 72. Baptisms and burials returned to the normal monthly averages of about 1.5 and 1.0 respectively for the rest of the century and by December 1700 the net population loss from January 1676 was only 3. I then attempted to make some sort of total village population calculation using the same data. Using as a model a study done in Kingsthorpe, Northampton, where the Chowns came from, I calculated an 11 year moving average which I then multiplied by 30 and 35 to produce an approximate spread. This calculation works well I have found when checked against known totals provided the population does not change rapidly. For 1681, the earliest year by this method, this calculation produced a total population for Woodchurch of between 458 and 535. The death of 68 villagers in a 20 month period represented a loss of between 15% and 13% respectively, or about 1 in 7! I can think of no comparative modern loss of life including two world wars and Spanish Flu that could possibly equate. The 10 charts I produced are available on request in PDF Format but will need to be sent to requesters direct. Best wishes - Bob Chown