Thankyou to the people who kindly answered my email asking for help to find the above, I recently restarted my interest in tracing my family history after buying this computer, i have done as you suggested, looked at 1841,1851 census & have visited various churches in Herefordshire & surrounding counties, on the whole the reception ive had from most clergy has been helpful. unfortunately ive had some nasty incidents with church wardens & vicars who inform me that they are fed up with family historians making a nuisance of themselves (im putting it in polite words!) 1 church warden even escorted me from the graveyard & i was told not to come back! Being a easy going nonviolent person im a bit wary of visiting churches to do any research, so i apologise if i keep asking for help but i find its safer! i would be interested to hear from anyone else who ha had the same experience. Keith.