Hello Pam If it any help the following are listed in Whit's Directory of Hampshire, 1859 under Havant. Robins, Miss Mary, West Street (no occupation given) Robins, Cath., West Street, bookseller. There is no listing in Portsmouth for a Robins as a surgeon at that date. As regards Surgeons, they were often trained as apprentices under an established surgeon, often a member of their family. After about 1850 surgery was regulated by civil law and controlled by the Royal College of Surgeons. Training as a surgeon had then to be within a recognised training school, university or hospital. Doctors (physicians) could apply for registration as surgeons but were required to drop their title of "Doctor" in deference to the many surgeons who were registered under the "grandfather" clause. Hence, even today, a surgeon is known as "Mister". Prior to registration by the Royal College surgeons were, as I said, trained by an existing surgeon and were licenced by the Bishop of the Diocese in which they trained. The application to the Bishop for the licence was usually endorsed either by two surgeons under whom he had trained or by twelve "men of substance", i.e. owners of property. I have examples of both in my own family history. Licences for surgeons and midwives can sometimes be found in the county reference library of the diocese in which the surgeon trained, if prior to about 1850. If after about 1850 you would need to look at the alumni lists for each of the teaching hospitals and universities specialising in surgery. If you can find the diocese in which your ancestor trained it would be a good starting point to look to see if any Bishops Licences have survived. Colyn. ----- Original Message ----- From: "PMR" <cliveden@acenet.net.au> To: <ENG-HAMPSHIRE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 9:28 AM > Hello Listers > > In her Will of 1837, Sophia ROBINS left property to her > brother-in-law (husband's brother), listing him as a Surgeon of Havant. > > Is there any way in which I can find out more about him please? > > James married Theresa KNAPP in St Faith's Havant in 1807, with > his 3 known children baptised in the Brockhampton RC church in 1808 > (Catherine Mary), 1810 (James-Joseph) & 1812 (Mary Theresa) respectively. > > I have a note that the two 'girls' aged 38 and 40 were > Stationers in Havant at the time of the 1851 Census and that James was in > Portsmouth or Portsea aged 67. I have no Census entry for Theresa and > nothing more than his baptism for James-Joseph. > > Any help in any other way would also be greatly appreciated. > > Many thanks. > > Pam > cliveden@acenet.net.au > > Beaudesert, Queensland, Australia > > > > ============================== > Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. > New content added every business day. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx >

Hello Colyn Many thanks for your very interesting and most informative message. I knew that surgeons were called Mr lbut I didn't know why - now I do, thanks to you. I'm glad to have Mary and Cath(erine)'s info for 1859. I've found Catherine's death in 1870 but Mary eludes me. She apparently died before 1881 as I can't find her on the Census. That's interesting about the Bishop's Licence for surgeons. James may have trained either in the Diocese of Portsmouth or over the border in the Diocese of Chichester. The family moved back and forth between the two places with great regularity!! His son, James Joseph, is listed as his Assistant in the 1841 Census, so maybe he was training under his father. He was 30 at the time (JJ that is not Dad!). I'll have to give some more thought to this issue. Cheers. Pam cliveden@acenet.net.au Beaudesert, Queensland, Australia