Hi List. Could someone please do a look up for me on a Earnest Pert DOB1878 in Portsmouth and James Howes DOB 1880 in Portsmouth In the 1881 Census they are living with Maria Pert They are Her Grandson's We are trying to find out who there Parents are Could be in 1891 Census Kind Regards Dave & Marian In OZ Perth WA

Hi, Here's a possible death index for the children's mother: Martha Ann Pert, aged 22, March qtr 1879 Portsea, ref 2b 352 Kind regards, Jon -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.16 - Release Date: 5/24/05

IThis should help Jenny _http://www.stmarysalv.free-online.co.uk/history.htm_ (http://www.stmarysalv.free-online.co.uk/history.htm) Linda and Tony n a message dated 25/05/05 17:16:01 GMT Daylight Time, Genes@cedarbank81.fsnet.co.uk writes: Additional question: if an extracted record cites merely "Alverstoke, Hampshire, England" it presumably refers to the Parish Church. What is the name (and address?) of that Church? -- Jenny M Benson

FreeBMD have transcribed 100,000,000 records so far and that basically but not fully covers 1837-1908 so you can see there are still loads to go before they reach the end of the records. -----Original Message----- From: Edna & Ken [mailto:ekbrit@rogers.com] Sent: 24 May 2005 12:02 To: ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] 1940's Hi, Those Free B-M-Ds only go up so far. Even at the LDS, their records for births don't go beyond 1920's or so. Edna - Ottawa ----- Original Message ----- From: <bob.newell@ntlworld.com> To: <ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2005 5:41 AM Subject: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] 1940's Can anyone give me tips on looking for people born in the 1940's on free BMD, it doesn't appear to be able to cover England and Wales, or any other tips for sites Bob ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== Treat others as you wish to be treated yourselves, with respect Visit the knightroots website at www.knightroots.co.uk ============================== View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find marriage announcements and more. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx ______________________________

In message <003501c560ff$c53b9330$cb610050@default>, bob.newell@ntlworld.com writes >I have a relation with cause of death Porte Faix can anyone give me a >translation please The literal translation is "carrying a burden" so it might mean something vague like "exhaustion" or it is perhaps a specific French medical term the meaning of which I don't know. -- Jenny M Benson

In message <000601c560ef$69abe390$0400000a@theboss>, dgmthomas <dgmthomas@bigpond.com> writes >Could someone please do a look up for me >on a Earnest Pert DOB1878 in Portsmouth >and James Howes DOB 1880 in Portsmouth >In the 1881 Census they are living with Maria Pert >They are Her Grandson's >We are trying to find out who there Parents are >Could be in 1891 Census Ernest still living with Grandma in 1891. No James Howes, but there is this family: House, Eliza abt 1862 Portsmouth, Hampshire / Hantshaving Head Portsea Hampshire House, James abt 1881 Portsmouth, Hampshire / Hantshaving Son Portsea Hampshire House, Nellie abt 1884 Portsmouth, Hampshire / Hantshaving Daughter Portsea Hampshire House, Rose abt 1887 Portsmouth, Hampshire / Hantshaving Daughter Portsea Hampshire FreeBMD has a James Howes born in Portsea Sept qtr 1880 ( GRO Ref is Portsea vol 2b page 505) and an Ernest Wells Pert born in Portsea June qtr 1877 (GRO Ref is Portsea vol 2b page 487.) Their Birth Certificates will tell you at least who their mothers were if these are the right boys. -- Jenny M Benson

I have a relation with cause of death Porte Faix can anyone give me a translation please Bob

Thank you all for your explanations I am now a bit wiser in the genealogy jargon Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda & Tony" <bestcover@lineone.net> To: <ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2005 9:12 PM Subject: RE: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] Abreviations > Hi Bob > It is not an abbreviation - it is a latin word meaning "as it was > written". > It is usually seen in a sentence where there appears to be a spelling > mistake but is in fact an exact transcription of the original piece. If > you > say you have seen it in a census, presumably you mean on a transcription > rather than on the enumerators return. > An example would be Tony & Linda Knite (sic) > > -----Original Message----- > From: bob.newell@ntlworld.com [mailto:bob.newell@ntlworld.com] > Sent: 24 May 2005 20:37 > To: ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] Abreviations > > Can someone tell me what (sic) means in Census after names > > Bob > > > ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== > Are they called brickwalls because there is always MORTAR find? > > ============================== > Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. > Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx > > > > > ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== > Are they called brickwalls because there is always MORTAR find? > > ============================== > Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. > Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx >

Linda and Tony - have been trying to contact you off list, but mail keeps bouncing back! Anyway, I would be grateful of any info you can turn up on Mary Jane ROUTLEDGE as per earlier posting. You were kindly able to dig up details of her brother, James, for me a while back, (although it turned out that was from the St Thomas baptism records, not Forton )- but anything is possible as the family were moved to Bermuda between these births (c.1855-1863) and had another child while they were out there. I presume they would not necessarily have been returned to the same area of Gosport, even though Mary and James' father (William) was still in the R.A. Will keep fingers and everything else crossed that you can find something for me, and thankyou in advance for your trouble! Regards, Sue --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos

Hi Bob It is not an abbreviation - it is a latin word meaning "as it was written". It is usually seen in a sentence where there appears to be a spelling mistake but is in fact an exact transcription of the original piece. If you say you have seen it in a census, presumably you mean on a transcription rather than on the enumerators return. An example would be Tony & Linda Knite (sic) -----Original Message----- From: bob.newell@ntlworld.com [mailto:bob.newell@ntlworld.com] Sent: 24 May 2005 20:37 To: ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] Abreviations Can someone tell me what (sic) means in Census after names Bob ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== Are they called brickwalls because there is always MORTAR find? ============================== Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx

Can someone tell me what (sic) means in Census after names Bob

Normally the word "sic" means "intentionally so written" and could used for example to confirm an unusual spelling of a name, to confirm that it is not a spelling error. There may of course be an esoteric meaning in a census, but the normal meaning would make sense. David ----- Original Message ----- From: <bob.newell@ntlworld.com> To: <ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2005 3:36 PM Subject: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] Abreviations > Can someone tell me what (sic) means in Census after names > > Bob > > > ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== > Are they called brickwalls because there is always MORTAR find? > > ============================== > Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. > Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx >

In message <007401c5604d$d340e140$cb610050@default>, bob.newell@ntlworld.com writes >Maybe its me doing something wrong as usual but it comes up with the >information I have put in and says they have a match That's where the paying bit comes in! You then have to View (that's what it says on the button) the page on which they are saying the record you want *might* appear and in order to View you need to purchase credits. What you will actually see is a list of people listed by surname, such that the name you are searching for would fall within the first and last on that page. I hope that's clear. -- Jenny M Benson

Maybe its me doing something wrong as usual but it comes up with the information I have put in and says they have a match ----- Original Message ----- From: <Hillmoore@aol.com> To: <ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2005 11:28 AM Subject: Re: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] 1940's > Hi Bob, > It is exactly the same information you have on Free BMD since you see the > register details ie Surname, Christian Name, Quarter the B,M orD is > registered, the registration District and reference. What clues are you > looking for? > > It beats straining your eyes looking at a microfiche record of dubious > quality in the local library while the car park charges clock up! > > Mike > Waterlooville > > > ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== > Don't go barking up the wrong tree be like a good chef and ALWAYS check > your SOURCES > > ============================== > Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the > areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. > Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >

yes but how do you know you have the right person on 1837 do they not give you a glimpse of any clues ----- Original Message ----- From: <Hillmoore@aol.com> To: <ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2005 10:48 AM Subject: Re: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] 1940's > Hi Bob > > They hav'nt got that far yet. The FreeBMD site shows you the progress so > far. Your best bet is the 1837 online site but you have to pay of course. > > Mike > Waterlooville > > > ==== ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT Mailing List ==== > Family historian love graveyards they are the sort of places they like to > visit to meet up with old relatives > > ============================== > View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find > marriage announcements and more. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx >

Can anyone give me tips on looking for people born in the 1940's on free BMD, it doesn't appear to be able to cover England and Wales, or any other tips for sites Bob

Hi Martin, I can throw some more ideas, and even facts, into the pot. 1) The Boys Sec School vs Portsmouth Grammar School - The GS was founded in Penny Street in 1732 by Dr Smith but by 1860 it was in sorry shape, educationally speaking. A movement to revitalize it, spearheaded by the Rev E.P. Grant, vicar of Portsmouth, started in the 1870s and a new building was erected at the top of the High Street: it opened in 1879. In 1927 the school moved to the former Cambridge Barracks in the High Street, which were converted to become "one of the finest [school buildings] in the country and its opening was the occasion for high compliments and well-merited praise" (City of Portsmouth: Records of the Corporation 1835-1927, W.G. Gates, Charpentier, Portsmouth, 1928, pp. 139, 320). I believe it is still in the same location. Although intended to be a free school it apparently never was (Pigot's Directory, 1830, p. 204). It seems it evolved into a grant-aided, fee-paying school, probably oriented to academic study with a view to university admission. - I can't find any positive references to the Boys Sec School. A Higher Grade School was opened in 1888 in temporary premises at Mile End (Gates, p. 166). This was a School Board undertaking. The School Board was set up in 1871 with responsibility for elementary education. Education to age 10 became compulsory in 1880. In 1903 the Board was transferred to the municipal corporation under the provisions of the Education Act 1902 (Gates, pp. 119, 213). It would seem that the Higher Grade School was then (1903) the only "secondary" school in Portsmouth. In 1904 the Higher Grade School (in Fawcett Road, Southsea?) became a secondary school (Gates, p. 219). I'm not sure how this jibes with the information sent by Ken Grubb and Brian. In any event, the Boys Sec School would have been a free school, concentrating I believe more on vocational studies (trades & technical) than on academics. If any records have survived I suppose they would be with the present school board or the Portsmouth City Records Office (www.portsmouthrecordsoffice.co.uk). - It might be of interest to readers to mention here the Dockyard School (DS), founded in 1843. This was for Dockyard apprentices and it was an entry point to the Navy's college system which culminated with the Royal Naval College Greenwich. Admission to the DS was at times highly competitive - private cramming schools developed to prepare boys for the rigorous examination - and those who completed the full five-year DS course graduated with, it's said, the equivalent of a bachelor degree. This programme was a most attractive one for ambitious parents of kids with potential, particularly since tuition was free. 2) Rev. Clayton - The "modern" St Mary's Church is the third on the site, the earliest dating to at least 1170. The consecration of the third structure in 1889 marked "a period in the life of the parish of Portsea which caused it to become known throughout the Church of England" (The Parish Church of St Mary Portsea: A brief history and guide, 1974, p. 4). Four successive vicars - Edgar Jacob (1878-1896), Cosmo Lang (1896-1901), Bernard Wilson (1901-1909) and Cyril Garbett (1909-1919) - led the church through a time of intense Christian social activism two of them (Lang and Garbett) going on to become archbishops, of Canterbury and York respectively. During Lang's incumbency the staff grew to include sixteen assistant curates. - Of Garbett it is said: "Cyril Garbett was perhaps the most famous of all the Vicars of Portsea. He was responsible for running the parish with the efficiency and skill which made it at the time the paragon of modern parishes. Assisted by a large staff, including the Revd Philip 'Tubby' Clayton, later to found Toc H, Cyril Garbett found a large following as preacher, pastor and organiser of a vast network of organisations for youngsters and adults. Garbett and his team, now much diminished, brought help and comfort to hundreds of families bereaved during the First World War" (The Parish Church ..., p. 5). - The social work was managed through five mission churches in the parish. "Each Mission Church had its own groups and organisations. These were the Women's Fellowship, the long established Men's clubs and the various youth organisations. Men's clubs had sports clubs for cricket and football teams, and club rooms. Some of the clubs retained the title 'Company'. This dated from the end of the nineteenth century and was suggested by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's book The White Company. St. Boniface Mission had the White Company, St. Barnabas Mission the Blue Company and St. Mary's Mission the Red Company" (Memories of Fratton, W.E.A., Portsmouth, 1997, p. 12). My father (born 1893) was a member of the White Company. I can remember his talking about Tubby Clayton so I suppose the Rev. was involved with it. Toc H still exists: it has an excellent website (www.toch.org.uk), which discusses Clayton's work . 3) Baptism record Can't help. 4) Burlington Road Can't help with name(s) of occupant(s). The road is shown on a modern street map but not in the 1896 Ordnance Survey map of Portsmouth North End (Alan Godfrey Edition, no date): development then stopped at Drayton Street, four roads to the west. The street would have been a residential one of typical late-Victorian row housing. 5) Municipal College Opened in 1908 in a purpose-built complex near the Guildhall (Gates, p. 230). I think Ken Grubb has the subsequent evolution down correctly. It was still the Municipal College in 1950 when I contemplated taking courses there after leaving school. It became the Regional College of Technology in 1956 and Portsmouth Polytechnic in 1969 - "a major national institution" (The Portsmouth Region, B. Stapleton & J.H. Thomas, Alan Sutton, Gloucester, 1989, p. 216), and eventually a university: "The University of Portsmouth was inaugurated in 1992. The former Portsmouth Polytechnic, one of the largest and most successful in the UK, itself grew from the Portsmouth and Gosport School of Science and Arts, founded in 1869" (University website ww.port,ac.uk). I don't know how that fits in with Gates's account. Surviving records would I suppose be in the University archives or at the Portsmouth City Records Office. Best wishes, Peter Gawn Sechelt, B.C., Canada. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Willcocks" <martinwill2@comcast.net> To: <ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2005 10:11 PM Subject: Portsmouth Education in 1906-16 > Hi All: > > Can anyone tell me more about the following educational organizations in > Portsmouth, please? > > My father I know went to Portsmouth Grammar School between February 1894 > and about 1898. This school is of course still in existence. We > visited Portsmouth in 1991 and in 1997, and I have located it on the Web. > > I have just received the military records of my uncle, Percy Squire > WILLCOCKS. Among the information he gave in his application for officer > cadet training, he stated that he was educated at Portsmouth Boys > Secondary School, and Portsmouth Municipal College. Assuming he entered > secondary school 10-11 years after his birth on 12 Feb 1896, this would > mean he started there about 1906. I would guess at a five year period > there, followed by a spell at the college, probably 1911-1914. > > As he was trained as a chemist and druggist and qualified on 9 Jul 1919, > he must have had some period of apprenticeship to an established > chemist. His older brother Edmund qualified as a chemist and druggist > on 8 Oct 1908. At that time, his residence was given as 142 High St., > Walthamstow, Essex. It is also clear from the record that Percy was at > the same address when he was recruited by the Army. He was placed in A1 > condition by the Recruiting Medical Board in Dec 1916 at Leytonstone, > Essex. (this address is close to Whipps Cross Hospital in > Leytonstone.) He enlisted, according to the record, on 22 Jan 1917. > This address was used throughout his career in the Army, and he was > promoted to 2nd. Lieut. after seeing action at the Battle of Arras, on > 28 Mar 1918. He gave the same address when he qualified as a chemist, > but there is one other address on his military record, 8 Burlington Rd., > Portsmouth. > > He also mentioned as references Dr. G. J. Parks, c/o Boys Secondary > School, Portsmouth, and Rev. P.. Clayton, c/o St. Mary's Vicarage, > Portsea, Portsmouth. This was part of an application he signed and > dated 3 Feb 1918. > > Questions: > 1. Is the Boys Secondary School a different entity from Portsmouth > Grammar School? Where is it located, if still in existence, or where > was it located in 1906-1911? Are any school records available? I would > expect his reference was probably head of that school; between what > years was he there (possibly he was head in 1918 still)? > > 2. When was the Rev. Clayton the incumbent at St. Mary's Portsea? > > 3. Is there a baptism record for Percy at St. Mary's Portsea, shortly > after 12 Feb 1896? > > 4. Who was living at 8 Burlington Rd., Portsmouth, in October 1918? > His father, Edmund Squire Willcocks, died in 1908, and Edmund's widow, > Alice Ann Willcocks, may still have lived in the area, and would have > been about 57. > > 5. Is the Municipal College still in existence? Where is (or was) it > located? Would this be likely to have provided an > upper school education in chemistry in the 1911-1914 period? And are > there any records of students there for those years that could be > searched for Percy? > > As always, in this research, there are more questions raised by about > every answer! > > Percy was the only uncle my brother and I ever met. Louis Horace > Willcocks seems to be a complete mystery, though we are aware that he > married, and may have one son. > > Any help on these topics (Portsmouth related) would be appreciated. > > TIA and regards, > Martin Willcocks > Taylorsville, UT, USA. > > ______________________________

Has anyone done any research into people immigrating to New Zealand in the sixties and can give me a good site to start. Bob

Portsmouth Municipal College aka Portsmouth College of Technology aka Portsmouth University. The original building is still behind the Guildhall with a 1950s extension at the next road junction and by the Swimming Pool Pete -----Original Message----- From: Brian Vine [mailto:bovine@upnaway.com] Sent: 23 May 2005 14:24 To: ENG-HAM-PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [PORTSMOUTH-GOSPORT] Portsmouth Education in 1906-16 Hi Martin From Kellys 1911 - Council Secondary School (Boys), Victoria Rd North. built 1892 and enlarged 1911, and is under the control of the Higher Education Committee. The buildings inclue well equipped laboratories for practical chemistry & physics, workshops for for wood & metalwork, & lecture rooms; preparation is given for preceptors' , dockyard apprentices' & Civil Service examinations & public examinations generally: the school is availavle for 440 boys: George John Parks D.Sc. Univ. of London, head master. The Borough of Portsmouth Municipal College was in Park Rd, Landport. Fred Beddow D.Sc, Ph.D. was Instructor of chemistry. H T H Brian in Perth West Oz ______________________________

Hello Listers, My ggf, Joseph ROBINS, was born in Guernsey in 1812. However, the family later moved to Hampshire - his mother, Anne ROBINS née BOWEN, being buried in Alverstoke on 26 May 1822. She was noted in the Burial Register as wife of Joseph, so her husband (my 2 x ggf) was still alive then. The youngest of Joseph's siblings was born in Guernsey in 1813, so the time frame for the move is late 1813 to mid-1822, and could have been at any time in those years. I have a couple of questions that may help to find the answer. Firstly, are there school records for Alverstoke for these years? Secondly, are there employment records for the Ordnance Depot at Priddy's Hard, Portsmouth? Joseph snr is believed to have worked there for some time (according to Joseph jnr's obit of 1898 - which could be a bit imaginative I suppose). Joseph jnr arrived in Australia in late 1851, so he should be on both the 1841 and 1851 Censuses somewhere. So far I have only found 3 of his sisters on the 1841 Census Any ideas about tracking down the family a bit would be most gratefully received. Many thanks. Pam cliveden@acenet.net.au Beaudesert, Queensland, Australia.