Hi Karen :) On Elizabeth's birth certificate (from Durham) it says mother's name is "Dorothy Armstrong, formerly Waugh". On her death certificate it says the same. I've ordered William Edward's birth certificate (her last son) which I'm hoping will arrive either tomorrow, Saturday or Monday if they send it as quickly as they did the death certificate so I'll have to let you know when I receive it. In any case, unless they blatantly lied, they were married prior to the children's births. Dorothy, the twins and John Jr. emigrated to Australia aboard the Empire of Peace which left Liverpool in May 1860 or possibly landed in Australia on that date. There was a possibility that John Sr. stayed in England and was killed in a tragic mining accident in 1861. A John Armstrong was listed as having left a wife Dorothy and 2 children, but I wasn't convinced he was my John. Not long after I was made aware of this information I discovered two further children born in Australia so that rules out John being killed in a mining accident in England. He is listed as father to both children. It's been suggested that I check out the baptismal records for Elizabeth and Thomas (the twins) and see if perhaps there are any Armstrong/Waugh marriages at the same church just prior to their births. At the moment that's not an option, I've blown my budget buying certificates so it'll have to wait. I haven't had any offers of lookups so it's either a "nasty" job (one which I probably wouldn't want to volunteer for myself either! ;D) or no one travels in that direction or lives close by. I'll find them eventually, it's just so frustrating at the moment not being able to point somewhere and say "that's where it'll be!"!! Take care, Rob. IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany, Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Lynn Karen To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:46 PM Subject: [ENG-DUR] RE: Marriage indexes > -----Original Message----- > From: Robyn Leeds [mailto:honey@honeyshome.com] > > With her children's births in her maiden name, > however, it's making it very hard to find her!! Is that how the children's birth certificates record Dorothy's name? Do they have any information about the father recorded? Is it possible that Dorothy WAUGH and John ARMSTRONG married some while _after_ the children were born? Where there later children born after Elizabeth and Thomas ... and if so do their birth certificates record their mother's name in any different way? I think you said Dorothy died in Australia and that her death certificate describes her as having been married in Durham. Do you know when they emigrated from Durham? Could they have left marrying until just before they left to regularise everything before they went? Karen ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== ENG-DURHAM list specificaly covers all of County Durham http://website.lineone.net/~pjoiner/genuki/DUR/parishes.html

Hello again Rob Just to add more of my thoughts on this... It would seem that there are a number of possibilities: 1. Dorothy & John never married. This (however unlikely) needs to be considered a possibility, especially if Dorothy (or John) had married previously. 2. It is very unlikely that a marriage would appear in PRs if there is no marriage certificate found in Civil Registration. 3. The surname WAUGH is also likely to be mistranscribed/misheard in lots of ways, as you can imagine. Have you tried all the possible different spellings? E.g. Wough, Warr, Worr, War etc... 4. Similarly, ARMSTRONG is not without its transcription possibilities/problems. 5. Treat death cert. info with a large pinch of salt. Information on these tends to be that gained from the informant and the Registrar often took it on trust that what was being said was true. Hope this helps Regards Mike > > It's been suggested that I check out the baptismal records for Elizabeth > and Thomas (the twins) and see if perhaps there are any Armstrong/Waugh > marriages at the same church just prior to their births. At the moment > that's not an option, I've blown my budget buying certificates so it'll > have to wait. I haven't had any offers of lookups so it's either a > "nasty" job (one which I probably wouldn't want to volunteer for myself > either! ;D) or no one travels in that direction or lives close by. > > I'll find them eventually, it's just so frustrating at the moment not > being able to point somewhere and say "that's where it'll be!"!! > > Take care, > > Rob. > IBSSG > Stuttgart, Germany, > Honey's Home of Genealogy > www.honeyshome.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Lynn Karen > To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:46 PM > Subject: [ENG-DUR] RE: Marriage indexes > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Robyn Leeds [mailto:honey@honeyshome.com] > > > > With her children's births in her maiden name, > > however, it's making it very hard to find her!! > > Is that how the children's birth certificates record Dorothy's name? Do > they have any information about the father recorded? > > Is it possible that Dorothy WAUGH and John ARMSTRONG married some while > _after_ the children were born? Where there later children born after > Elizabeth and Thomas ... and if so do their birth certificates record > their mother's name in any different way? > > I think you said Dorothy died in Australia and that her death > certificate describes her as having been married in Durham. Do you know > when they emigrated from Durham? Could they have left marrying until just > before they left to regularise everything before they went? > > Karen > > > > > ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== > ENG-DURHAM list specificaly covers all of County Durham > http://website.lineone.net/~pjoiner/genuki/DUR/parishes.html > > ______________________________