I have a death certificate that gives me a very descriptive cause of death, and mentions an inquest was held, but I've been informed that inquest records from Easingwold would be unobtainable. Does anyone know if this is in fact the case for a death in July of 1889, (he died in Bishopwearmouth hospital, in Sunderland)? And does anyone know how I could find a newspaper that might have had a record of the accident he was killed in? Thanks, Mandy ----- Original Message ----- From: <GNicresearch@aol.com> To: <ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 11:19 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG and siblings > > > In a message dated 22/07/2004 10:03:54 GMT Daylight Time, > Stanmapstone@aol.com writes: > > In a message dated 22/07/2004 07:46:53 GMT Daylight Time, > honey@honeyshome.com writes: > I was under the impression that death certificates carried a fair amount of > information, > > > > Non-British ones often do, sometimes amounting to a life-story of the > deceased in themselves - but those from this country are concerned only with the > basics - who it was that had died, how old they were, the place and cause of > death and who the informant was. > > Geoff Nicholson > > 57 Manor Park, Concord, WASHINGTON, Tyne & Wear NE37 2BU > Long-established Professional Genealogist: ask for details of > NBL/DUR family history research by THE local expert, working for YOU. > > > > ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== > query board for Durham gen web > http://www.britishislesgenweb.org/cgi-bin/data/durham.cgi >

In a message dated 22/07/2004 18:16:56 GMT Daylight Time, peter.fellowes@ntlworld.com writes: I am writing a some items for and about Wolviston. The period and time frame I am interested in is 1913 - 1946, plus or minus a year either way. Does any lister have any ideas or information for what may be termed "local newspapers" for that time frame and for Wolviston. Wolviston at the time came under County Durham but I suspect newspapers from perhaps Hartlepool/Stockton on Tees may have covered the area and be termed local, i.e. what the locals read and had delivered to their door. Of course no doubt and knowing my luck, I understand that over the years some newspapers will have closed down and others will have been absorbed and joined others. What today are the newspapers (local) would I have to approach to look at archives for the period 1913-46. Does Stockton or Hartlepool library hold anything in archives of this nature ?, Is it trip to Durham CRO ?. You should enquire at Stockton and Hartlepool Libraries but, yes, I would commence with Durham Record Office, though not necessarily, to begin with, with a trip there. Why not browse their on-line catalogue? In general, I know they have microfilm copies of the "County" newspapers, the Durham County Advertiser and the Durham Chronicle, but who knows what else you may find. If you succeed in finding which newspapers are likely to help most, but cannot track down the relevant issues, then you should try the British Library's Newspaper Section at Colindale, North London who, in theory at least, have copies of all British newspapers. Durham County Library Service may also be able to help. Geoff Nicholson 57 Manor Park, Concord, WASHINGTON, Tyne & Wear NE37 2BU Long-established Professional Genealogist: ask for details of NBL/DUR family history research by THE local expert, working for YOU.

In a message dated 22/07/2004 10:03:54 GMT Daylight Time, Stanmapstone@aol.com writes: In a message dated 22/07/2004 07:46:53 GMT Daylight Time, honey@honeyshome.com writes: I was under the impression that death certificates carried a fair amount of information, Non-British ones often do, sometimes amounting to a life-story of the deceased in themselves - but those from this country are concerned only with the basics - who it was that had died, how old they were, the place and cause of death and who the informant was. Geoff Nicholson 57 Manor Park, Concord, WASHINGTON, Tyne & Wear NE37 2BU Long-established Professional Genealogist: ask for details of NBL/DUR family history research by THE local expert, working for YOU.

Hi Stan :) Thanks for the link, that will come in very handy! :D As for Elizabeth's and Dorothy's death certificates, they died in Australia so this doesn't apply. As for Australian certificates, you can see from this URL ... http://www.westnet.com.au/talltrees/civil_registration.htm ... that they contain a lot of information. Take care, Rob. IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Stanmapstone@aol.com To: honey@honeyshome.com ; ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 11:03 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG and siblings In a message dated 22/07/2004 07:46:53 GMT Daylight Time, honey@honeyshome.com writes: I was under the impression that death certificates carried a fair amount of information, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Have a look at http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/faqs.asp#bmd6 Frequently asked questions Births, marriages and deaths registered in England and Wales, Q6. What information will I see on a certificate? Regards Stan Mapstone www.mapstone.org

Hi Robyn, It's unlikely that Elizabeth's death certificate will be of assistance with other children, siblings that is. But the birth certificate of one of the children born out here should give you date and place of her parents marriage, together with names and ages of other children. John snr.'s death certificate should tell you when he arrived in Australia, but again the accuracy of the information depends on the knowledge of the informant. Judy Thomas --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.725 / Virus Database: 480 - Release Date: 19/07/2004

Hi Judy :) I'll have to look at purchasing William Edward's birth certificate if this is the case. I was under the impression that death certificates carried a fair amount of information, which was why I purchased that rather than a birth certificate. Plus I didn't know about William Edward before yesterday! ;D I'll wait and see what the death certificate holds, or if I'm feeling impatient later today I'll see if I can afford the birth certificate too! :D Take care, Rob. IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Judy Thomas To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 12:58 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG and siblings Hi Robyn, It's unlikely that Elizabeth's death certificate will be of assistance with other children, siblings that is. But the birth certificate of one of the children born out here should give you date and place of her parents marriage, together with names and ages of other children. John snr.'s death certificate should tell you when he arrived in Australia, but again the accuracy of the information depends on the knowledge of the informant. Judy Thomas --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.725 / Virus Database: 480 - Release Date: 19/07/2004 ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== I.G.I. Family Search http://www.familysearch.org/ Public Record Office U.K http://www.pro.gov.uk

Yes, he's a possibility, and that's the site for shipping into Victoria. The actual fiche might provide a bit more information, but not always. Should give his occupation, which could help. I'll be at the local FHS library next week on duty, can have a look at the fiche then for you. Judy Thomas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robyn Leeds" <honey@honeyshome.com> To: <ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 7:02 AM Subject: Fw: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG and siblings > > Hi again Judy :) > > I've found a possible shipping entry for John ... > > ARMSTRONG JOHN Age 34, Feb 1857, Ship: Shooting Star, Port B Fiche 120 Page 005 > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.725 / Virus Database: 480 - Release Date: 19/07/2004

In a message dated 22/07/2004 07:46:53 GMT Daylight Time, honey@honeyshome.com writes: I was under the impression that death certificates carried a fair amount of information, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Have a look at http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/faqs.asp#bmd6 Frequently asked questions Births, marriages and deaths registered in England and Wales, Q6. What information will I see on a certificate? Regards Stan Mapstone www.mapstone.org

"I'll be at the local FHS library next week on duty, can have a look at the fiche then for you." If you could Judy I'd be eternally grateful!! :D If it shows his occupation as Iron Stone Mason, then I'd be more inclined to think it's the right John. If it doesn't show his occupation then I'll just have to figure out some other way of finding him. At least you've managed to find Dorothy and the children for me, and an extra son to boot!! :D I've ordered Elizabeth's death certificate in Australia today, hopefully that will provide a lot more information regarding children. If I'm lucky it may give me more insight into John too, although I'm not holding my breath! Take care, Rob.

Hi again Judy :) I've found a possible shipping entry for John ... ARMSTRONG JOHN Age 34, Feb 1857, Ship: Shooting Star, Port B Fiche 120 Page 005 This makes sense if he had to find work, a home and earn money to bring his family out to Australia too. The age is about the same as Dorothy's so it's possibly the right one. The only other ones I found were nowhere near her age group. I found this at the PROV site, which I'd searched before but had "Elizabeth" and "Dorothy", not "Dorathy" and "Eliza". I'll have to find out whether I can find further information on the above shipping information. Take care, Rob. IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Judy Thomas To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 2:44 PM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG and siblings Hello Robyn, Following one of your earlier queries, I had a look at the shipping indexes, and found the following:- Empire of Peace, May 1860. Dorathy ARMSTRONG, Age 37 Eliza ARMSTRONG, Age 11 John ARMSTRONG, Age 8 Thos ARMSTRONG, Age 11. It would appear that John (father) came out earlier, which was relatively common. If you obtained Dorothy's death certificate, there is a possibility (depending on the knowledge of the informant), that all children would be listed. And in fact, if you obtained the birth certificate of children born in Victoria, you would stand a good chance of getting information on the parents' marriage. Judy Thomas. Melbourne, Oz. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.722 / Virus Database: 478 - Release Date: 18/07/2004 ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== A-Z of BRITISH GENEALOGICAL RESEARCH by Dr Ashton Emery http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/EmeryPaper.html

Hello Robyn, Following one of your earlier queries, I had a look at the shipping indexes, and found the following:- Empire of Peace, May 1860. Dorathy ARMSTRONG, Age 37 Eliza ARMSTRONG, Age 11 John ARMSTRONG, Age 8 Thos ARMSTRONG, Age 11. It would appear that John (father) came out earlier, which was relatively common. If you obtained Dorothy's death certificate, there is a possibility (depending on the knowledge of the informant), that all children would be listed. And in fact, if you obtained the birth certificate of children born in Victoria, you would stand a good chance of getting information on the parents' marriage. Judy Thomas. Melbourne, Oz. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.722 / Virus Database: 478 - Release Date: 18/07/2004

Hi Everyone Is anyone tracing the Gowlands from the St John's Chapel, Westgate and Eastgate parts of Weardale, Co Durham? These are my Gowland connections.... George Gowland - my Gt Grandfather - was born in 1854 at Field Style, Swinhope Burn, Eastgate, Weardale to John and Mary (nee Beadle) Gowland. George's wife was Ada Wearmouth. She was born in December 1853 at Swinhope Burn. They married in 1875. Their children were: William, born 1876 in Stanhope, County Durham. William moved to Canada. John "Jack", born in 1877 in Stanhope, County Durham. Elizabeth "Lizzy" Mary, born in 1880 in Stanhope, County Durham. She married a chap called Alfred Wright in May 1906 - after which they moved to Canada. Emily Ada - b 1884 in Westgate, County Durham. Arthur - b. 1885 in Stanhope, County Durham. Rhoda - b. 1886 in Westgate, County Durham. Rhoda married a chap with the surname of HALL George Ernest - b 1888 in Westgate, County Durham. George died about the age of 30 in 1918. Dora, - b. 1891 in Eastgate, County Durham. d.1953 in Cockfield, County Durham. Dora is my grandmother. She married Jonathan LINSLEY of Cockfield in 1910. Eva May - b. circa 1897 in Eastgate, County Durham. According to an uncle, George Gowland was married twice - Ada Wearmouth was his second wife. I've also been told that he is buried in Hunwick - which is about 2 miles north of Bishop Auckland. His date of death is unknown although I know he and Ada were still alive in 1929. The 1881 census says that they were living at Hill House in Westgate, Weardale. By 1891 they had moved further down the valley to Eastgate and the 1901 census states that they were living at Lark Seat Farm, Eastgate - does any one know if Lark Seat Farm still exists?? Does any of the above ring any bells with anyone?? Regards Patrick Linsley Bournemouth, UK

Hi Judy :) I am just amazed, thank you!!! :D I had no idea where to start looking for their shipping arrangements. Actually, that's not entirely true, I DID start looking, but was so overwhelmed with how many pages were on one site alone, I gave up after about 10 of them!! Do you mind if I ask which site you found these on? I'm certainly making fantastic headway with this family, thanks to the wonderful help you've all given me!!! Thank you just doesn't seem enough, but thank you all!!! :D Take care, Rob. IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Judy Thomas To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 2:44 PM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG and siblings Hello Robyn, Following one of your earlier queries, I had a look at the shipping indexes, and found the following:- Empire of Peace, May 1860. Dorathy ARMSTRONG, Age 37 Eliza ARMSTRONG, Age 11 John ARMSTRONG, Age 8 Thos ARMSTRONG, Age 11. It would appear that John (father) came out earlier, which was relatively common. If you obtained Dorothy's death certificate, there is a possibility (depending on the knowledge of the informant), that all children would be listed. And in fact, if you obtained the birth certificate of children born in Victoria, you would stand a good chance of getting information on the parents' marriage. Judy Thomas. Melbourne, Oz. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.722 / Virus Database: 478 - Release Date: 18/07/2004 ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== A-Z of BRITISH GENEALOGICAL RESEARCH by Dr Ashton Emery http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/EmeryPaper.html

Thanks to those who provided me with information and advice on my census request. The information has enabled me to make a break through in identifying ancestors. However, as is usually the case with new answers come more questions. A couple of people pointed to the 1881 census online. The answer may be staring me in the face but I cannot figure out if I know the name of the household head and address how do I get the LDS family search to generate the names of others in that household ? Thanks to Murray, I now have some great information from the 1891 census. But when I searched Durham Records online that information from the 1891 census wouldn't appear for me. What could I be doing wrong or is there another online source for this census ? Thanks for your help to a relative novice in this research. Keith Thornton Ontario, Canada

Hi everyone :) After a search on the Victorian CDs from Australia, I now have the following information ... Elizabeth ARMSTRONG born 1848, Durham. Thomas ARMSTRONG born 1848, Durham. Esther Ann ARMSTRONG born 1862, Australia, died 1862 (stillborn?) William Edward ARMSTRONG born 1863 Australia, died 1891 Australia aged 27. John ARMSTRONG (father) I have absolutely no information on other than his occupation at the time of Elizabeth's death. Dorothy ARMSTRONG (nee WAUGH, mother) I have as born about 1821 somewhere in England. Dorothy was about 27 when she gave birth to Elizabeth and Thomas so I'm thinking that perhaps she's either had a bad history of infantile deaths, stillborns or miscarriages, or she started having children later in life. Does anyone know if this was a "trend" back at this time? Also, would it be highly unlikely for a child born in say 1862 to be married at the age of 12 or 15? There was a marriage for a William Edward ARMSTRONG on the CDs, but I felt he may be too young. It's not physically impossible, but is it probable? Any thoughts on all of this would be extremely appreciated. Perhaps Geoff can help me with this? You know a lot about that era Geoff, I'd value any input you can give me! :D As for births prior to Elizabeth's, I might have to wait and see if someone will be able to do a parish register lookup for me, to see if there are any previous issue listed on Elizabeth and Thomas' birth records. It may also tell me if Thomas survived the birth. I can't offer anyone my firstborn in "payment" I'm afraid, I "gave" both of them to Susan for going to the records office for me!! ;D Take care, Rob. IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com

Geoff Nicholson wrote: <snip> > There is always the possibility that the > local registrar hereabouts was an over-enthusiastic Scot, in the same > Presbyterian tradition of recording as much data as possible as gave us the "Dade" > parish registers of the midlands and south, the "Barrington" ones locally and, in > 1855, the early Scottish birth certificates! Hmm - unless I'm much mistaken, the county with by far the most Dade registers - and where they originated - is Yorkshire. I suppose from the near-Arctic perspective of Co. Durham <vbg> you might just about call that "midlands and south", but it's not really accurate. Seriously, though, I've seen mention of Barrington registers a few times here - please could someone tell us when were these used, and is there a list anywhere of the parishes where they are found? If anyone is interested in the Yorkshire Dade registers, a list of parishes can be found in Rootsweb's YORKSGEN archives - message subject "Parishes with Dade Registers", posted by Roy Stockdill on 18 Dec 2002. Arthur Kennedy

"I checked with the register office and Elizabeth and Thomas were twins! The number for his certificate is DNLAN7-390. This is if you order it online from the register office. You will find though that the only difference in the certificate is the name, time of birth and sex of the child, so you will need to think about whether it is worth buying at the moment." Susan, I love you TWICE as much as I did before!!! :D Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!! :D :D :D Wow, this is so much to take in, I wasn't expecting TWINS for goodness sake!!! You know, this makes me wonder (which at my age and being blonde is extremely dangerous! lol) about siblings. I know that Dorothy was in her late twenties when Elizabeth and Thomas were born. Why so late? Are there siblings prior to Elizabeth and Thomas? If so, could there be yet another set of twins? Too much to think about, my brain's not functioning properly as it is from a relentless fever!! lol Maybe I'd best leave further investigation until I finish my antibiotics!! ;D I can't thank you enough for this Susan, guess I'd best start preparing both my firstborn daughter AND son to come over there and tend to your garden hadn't I? lol Take care, Rob.

In a message dated 21/07/2004 13:18:57 GMT Daylight Time, akpak@waitrose.com writes: Hmm - unless I'm much mistaken, the county with by far the most Dade registers - and where they originated - is Yorkshire. I suppose from the near-Arctic perspective of Co. Durham <vbg> you might just about call that "midlands and south", but it's not really accurate. Seriously, though, I've seen mention of Barrington registers a few times here - please could someone tell us when were these used, and is there a list anywhere of the parishes where they are found? I know there are many Dade registers in Yorkshire, but am I mistaken in thinking that most of them are in the West Rding or in the extreme southern tip of the North Riding (what is now South Yorkshire)? I also understand that the practice spilled out from Yorkshire into other counties further south. However, if that is not so then I stand corrected. I was always brought up to believe that on the east side of England there were only two northern counties - Northumberland and Co Durham. South of them there was a sort of "no-man's land" called Yorkshire and south of that was "The South", some of which, if we want to make fine distinctions, was known to those who lived there as "The MIdlands". Then I went to school wheer they tried to tell me otherwise, but I never really believed them! I remember, when a student in Hull, putting it thus to my fellow students, from all over the country. Take a map of England and draw an east-west line through its most northerly point (just north of Berwick upon Tweed). Draw a similar east-west line through its most southerly point (The Lizard in Cornwall). Then draw two similar lines, equally spaced between them. Call the "thirds" thus produced "The North", "The Midlands" and "The South". Fair? I think so. The boundary between "The North" and "The Midlands" passes just north of Hull! If you think of Co Durham as being near-arctic, you should try working, as I did, on the north coast of Scotland. From Thurso, Inverness corresponds to "The South", Edinburgh is "The extremely deep South" and anywhere in England is almost unimagineable. As for London - forget it! Anyway: Barrington registers. These have been mentioned several times on this List recently. They cover only 1798 to 1812 (15 years or half a generation) and, having been specified by the Bishop of Durham (Shute Barrington), they are to be found in every parish in his Diocese of Durham (roughly Co Durham, Northumberland and Alston parish in Cumberland). The only anomaly is that Hexhamshire (in its old definition of the parishes of Hexham, Allendale and St John Lee, with their various chapelries etc) was a Special Jurisdiction of the Archbishop of York and so do not have detailed registers for that period. As within that region controlled by the Bishop of Durham the Barrington registers are found "everywhere", there is no need for a list of parishes where they are to be found! Geoff Nicholson 57 Manor Park, Concord, WASHINGTON, Tyne & Wear NE37 2BU Long-established Professional Genealogist: ask for details of NBL/DUR family history research by THE local expert, working for YOU.

Hi Rob I checked with the register office and Elizabeth and Thomas were twins! The number for his certificate is DNLAN7-390. This is if you order it online from the register office. You will find though that the only difference in the certificate is the name, time of birth and sex of the child, so you will need to think about whether it is worth buying at the moment. I had a similar experience. I bought the certificate for my great grandmother and I was just walking down the drive from the register office, when the register came running out crying, "wait! wait!" I went back and she said that she had noticed the time on the certificate and had realised it was a multiple birth and wanted to know if I wanted to buy the other certificate. Of course I did! Regarding John and Dorothy's marriage. They may not have been married in County Durham at all. There was a great number of people coming from all over the UK into Durham as the coal fields were opened. Maybe they came from some other part of the country. My grandmother married in Cumberland and almost straight after the wedding she moved into County Durham and had her children there. Best wishes Susan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robyn Leeds" <honey@honeyshome.com> To: <ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 9:03 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG > Hi Geoff :) > > Thanks very much for clarifying this for me! :D I WILL one day know enough about English genealogy to not have to ask "silly" questions ... well one can hope anyway! :D > > Take care, > > Rob.l > IBSSG > Stuttgart, Germany > Honey's Home of Genealogy > www.honeyshome.com > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: GNicresearch@aol.com > To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com > Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 9:55 AM > Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG > > > > In a message dated 21/07/2004 00:03:05 GMT Daylight Time, > honey@honeyshome.com writes: > > Would the page number be "FC 544243"? That's the only number on the > certificate but that could just be their number from this year, not 1848, couldn't > it? Wait, hang on ... The number in the first column is 389, is THAT the > number you mean? I didn't mention this in my first post either, but the > registration district is/was Lanchester, birth in the sub-district of Lanchester, > County of Durham. > > > > What was meant by the page number is not something you would find on the > certificate irself. It is the number of the page in the Registrar General's > book of copies of certificates. This is the reference to be found in the GRO > indexes (the one we should NOT quote unless we are ordering a certificate from > the FRC in London, who now have those books: it is meaningless to a local > registrar who has his own books). That reference will begin with a code for the > region, possibly "25" for the period you mentioned: later 10a, followed by > the page number. As there were, I think, four certificates per page, multiple > births might have been recorded on the same, or on consecutive pages. You > should check through the GRO indexes (available on line for a fee) for any > entries with the same surname on the same, or an adjacent, page. If you find > any they may, or may not, be of a multiple birth to the same mother. > > I agree that in England the recording of the time of birth was done only > for multiple biirths - as a general rule. However, in Scotland, for the > first few quarters after the introduction of Civil Registration there, in 1855, > it was the norm for all births. There is always the possibility that the > local registrar hereabouts was an over-enthusiastic Scot, in the same > Presbyterian tradition of recording as much data as possible as gave us the "Dade" > parish registers of the midlands and south, the "Barrington" ones locally and, in > 1855, the early Scottish birth certificates! > . > Geoff Nicholson

Hi Geoff :) Thanks very much for clarifying this for me! :D I WILL one day know enough about English genealogy to not have to ask "silly" questions ... well one can hope anyway! :D Take care, Rob.l IBSSG Stuttgart, Germany Honey's Home of Genealogy www.honeyshome.com ----- Original Message ----- From: GNicresearch@aol.com To: ENG-DURHAM-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 9:55 AM Subject: Re: [ENG-DUR] Elizabeth ARMSTRONG In a message dated 21/07/2004 00:03:05 GMT Daylight Time, honey@honeyshome.com writes: Would the page number be "FC 544243"? That's the only number on the certificate but that could just be their number from this year, not 1848, couldn't it? Wait, hang on ... The number in the first column is 389, is THAT the number you mean? I didn't mention this in my first post either, but the registration district is/was Lanchester, birth in the sub-district of Lanchester, County of Durham. What was meant by the page number is not something you would find on the certificate irself. It is the number of the page in the Registrar General's book of copies of certificates. This is the reference to be found in the GRO indexes (the one we should NOT quote unless we are ordering a certificate from the FRC in London, who now have those books: it is meaningless to a local registrar who has his own books). That reference will begin with a code for the region, possibly "25" for the period you mentioned: later 10a, followed by the page number. As there were, I think, four certificates per page, multiple births might have been recorded on the same, or on consecutive pages. You should check through the GRO indexes (available on line for a fee) for any entries with the same surname on the same, or an adjacent, page. If you find any they may, or may not, be of a multiple birth to the same mother. I agree that in England the recording of the time of birth was done only for multiple biirths - as a general rule. However, in Scotland, for the first few quarters after the introduction of Civil Registration there, in 1855, it was the norm for all births. There is always the possibility that the local registrar hereabouts was an over-enthusiastic Scot, in the same Presbyterian tradition of recording as much data as possible as gave us the "Dade" parish registers of the midlands and south, the "Barrington" ones locally and, in 1855, the early Scottish birth certificates! . Geoff Nicholson . 57 Manor Park, Concord, WASHINGTON, Tyne & Wear NE37 2BU Long-established Professional Genealogist: ask for details of NBL/DUR family history research by THE local expert, working for YOU. ==== ENG-DURHAM Mailing List ==== Browse the ENG-DURHAM archives http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/eng-durham