Hi, I'm looking for any information on my gg grandfather David Halket born in Perth, Scotland in 1793 and died 13th January 1864 at Gresham Place Newcastle-upon-Tyne. I have found in various census records and other papers he was, amongst other things, a Patent Nail Manufacturer, Timber Merchant, Ship Surveyor, Insurance Agent and Convict Ship Owner. I think he may have had his business in or near Gateshead. Two of his children were buried in St Andrews Cemetery but I have been unable to find where he is buried. Any help would be most appreciated Ken Mason in a cold (for us) South Australia

Are you sure that this the same David Halket? In the 1858 Northumberland Directory there is a David Halket at 9, Eldon Street, Newcastle. In the Directories for Liverpool 1825-1827-1829 there is a David Halket, timber merchant, also in 1825 surveyor for shipping, at 35 Grafton Street, Liverpool. In the London Directories for 1841 and 1852 there is another David Halket, (born 1793 in Scotland) insurance broker, shipping and general agent at 19 St. Helens Place, he is also in the 1851 Census with his family at St. Helen Middlesex. There are also three David Halkets in the 1841 census for Scotland. Regards Stan Mapstone

In a message dated 03/06/2007 08:30:07 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Hi, I'm looking for any information on my gg grandfather David Halket born in Perth, Scotland in 1793 and died 13th January 1864 at Gresham Place Newcastle-upon-Tyne. I have found in various census records and other papers he was, amongst other things, a Patent Nail Manufacturer, Timber Merchant, Ship Surveyor, Insurance Agent and Convict Ship Owner. I think he may have had his business in or near Gateshead. Two of his children were buried in St Andrews Cemetery but I have been unable to find where he is buried. Rather than looking at cemetery records "at random", trying to discover in which one he was buried, why not look at local newspapers, where there may well have been a death notice? You have the date of death, so there would not be much searching involved. Death notices usually mentioned the name of the cemetery where the interment was to take place. Between them, Newcastle Central Library (c/o Civic Centre, Barrass Bridge, Newcastle) and Gateshead Public Library (Coatsworth Road, Gateshead) should have all the newspapers you will need. Geoff Nicholson

Stan: In addition to what we have both mentioned already, I have a note, in a pedigree which I have called "Davison of Whickham, Tanfield and Ryton" that a Jane Davison who lived 1772-1805 was "of Sister Wham". She was buried at Tanfield in 1805. Her father was John Davison (1742-), who was baptised at Whickham 1742/43 Mar 13, and who married at Ryton in 1771 to Isabel Nixon. Isabel died c1782/83 when Jane would have been aged about 10 or 11. Her father later re-married, at Ryton in 1787, to Mary Stokoe. Geoff Nicholson

Hi Everyone. How are you. I have a Edward Seamer-Seymour that might have been born in Whickham, Durham England or maybe else where. He married a Grace Robson on the 31 Oct 1682 at Whickham Durham England. I have no idea of his parents. Please help. >From Annette.

Geoff, Thanks for your reply. I have found two references in Durham Record Office which mention Sisterwham, I have searched the old map of the Beamish area but have been unable to find it. Interestingly there is the reference to "all tolls on the Beamish Parke to Sisterwham roadway" in 1598. Ref No. D/CG 16/651 10 December 1737 (1) Gilbert Spearman of Bishop Middleham, Esq. (2) George Smith of Burnhall, Esq. and Thomas Bedford, late of Burnhall, now of Durham (3) George Wilson of Symonds Inn, Middlesex, gent. Draft release by way of mortgage (1) and (2) to (3) of Easter Tanfield, Sisterwham alias Sisterswham &the Sisterwham Nook to secure £2575 7s.11d. by (1) to (3). Recites previous deeds Consideration: £500 (3) to Smith for the use of Elizabeth Smith, £1300 (3) to Bedford and £775 7s.11d. (3) to (1) (1 file) Tanfield and Beamish Ref No. D/X 654/1 3 July 1598 (1) Henry Jackman of London, Esquire (2) Thomas Harbottle of Tanfield, gentleman (3) Anthony Shaftoe of Tanfield, gentleman and Robert Lainge of Fulbrigghouse, yeoman Feoffment and a bargain and sale by (1) to (2) of the West Demesnes and another tenement at Tanfield with all lands belonging thereto to secure £277 l0s 8d by way of mortgage. Covenant regarding outstanding term of eight years vested in (2). Reservation of profits of justice, amercements, ullage on cattle etc and all tolls on the Beamish Parke to Sisterwham roadway to (1). Appointment of (3) as attorney to deliver seisin, with livery endorsed, 14 August' 1598 Rent: £1 5/- p.a. to the crown £3 8s 8d p.a. to (1) as is usually paid to the Lord of the Manor of Beamish, until Pentecost 1608 (parchment, 2 membranes, Latin) Regards Stan Mapstone

In a message dated 01/06/2007 09:23:16 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: In a message dated 31/05/2007 23:11:41 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Does anyone know where or what Sister Wham Tanfield could be, from this baptism entry? Baptisms, Lanchester District Parish/Church: Tanfield (St. Margaret) 7 Aug 1825 Robert Forster, of Sister Wham, son of Thomas Forster (labourer) by his wife Mary Regards Stan Mapstone Stan: Further to my earlier reply, the only reference I have found so far is from Surtees' "History of the County Palatine of Durham", in the Tanfield Chapter of the "Gateshead Section" (p112 of my edition). It says "30 Jul 1611, James Shafto, Gent, and Thomas his son and heir, took by fine of Anthony Shafto, Gent, and Susanna his wife, half of 120 acres in Beamish called Sisterwham; 15 Jul 1612, James and Thomas Shafto took by fine of Williiam and Ann Porter and Jane their daughter and heir, half the meadow called Sisterwham. I interpret this as the Shaftos buying up all of Sisterwham, half of it from Anthony Shafto in 1611 and the other half a year later from the Porters. That would give them the whole of the 120 acres of meadow. Surtees mentions this under "Beamish" - ie Beamish township/manor itself, immediately after a paragraph about Foulbrigg, the modern Foulbridge, where Beamish museum have their workshops, just up the road from Beamish Hall. Presumably Sisterwham was fairly close to there. Surtees gives a pedigree of Shafto of Tanfield but it does not mention any Anthony. Also, it would appear from it that while James was indeed the head of that family at that time, Thomas his son "and heir" was only one year old, and was not the eldest son as he had a four-year-old brother. Perhaps these are different Shaftos: Anthony at least could have been the Anthony Shafto of the Whickham and Swalwell family who was living in 1590 (and later: had had a child baptised in 1593/94) but their pedigree in Surtees does not include any suitable James and Thomas. Maybe we have to go right back to the Shaftos of Shafto in Northumberland to find who they were - though it is rather off-topic for Sisterwham. Geoff Nicholson

In a message dated 01/06/2007 03:13:49 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: He married a Grace Robson on the 31 Oct 1682 at Whickham Durham England. I have no idea of his parents. If Edward Seymour (etc) married in 1682 then there seems a good chance he was born during the "Commonwealth period", between the end of the Civil War and the Restoration of the monarchy (roughly, the very late 1640s and all the 1650s). During that period many of our local parish registers were not well kept and there is no doubt that very many (probably most) of the children born during the 1650s were either not baptised at all, baptised but not in a church approved of by the authorities or were indeed baptised in the C of E but either the event was not recorded in the parish register or, if it was, then the register has not survived. Your first step should be to decide whether the non-local, and probably originally Scottish, surname of Seymour was present in Whickham parish in the 1660s, something that could be done by referring to the Hearth Tax Returns of the 1660s. The originals of these are in TNA but Durham County Record Office, and probably Tyne and Wear Archives, have copies covering their own districts. Be careful to read up about the Hearth Tax first, because there are several sets of returns, some being of those who paid (solvents), some of those who did not (non-solvents), some of Assessments, not what was actually paid and some of Arrears! Not all types of return exist for every year and only heads of households are listed. If there are no Seymours in Whickham, you could check adjacent parishes (Ryton, Lamesley and Gateshead in Co Durham and all four of the Newcastle parishes in "Northumberland"). If a likely Seymour family is found in Co Durham (and even if not), then you could look at the Protestation Returns of 1641. They are arranged by parish and the Co Durham ones have been conveniently printed by the Surtees Society. They amount to a listing of all able-bodied males aged over ?16 (or between 16 and 60?) and are the nearest you will get to a 17th-century census. Roman Catholics refused to take the Protestation, but the list of those who took it is followed by a list of those who are being reported for refusing, so if someone is not on one list they will be on the other. Another Surtees Society publication is the "Proceedings of the County Committees for Compounding with Delinquent Royalists", and covers mainly the early 1650s. I am not so much suggesting that your Seymours were wealthy Royalists as that they might possibly have rented a cottage from a major land-owner who was. Some of the delinquents' estates are given in detail, down to "one cottage at XXX, in the occupation of XXX at XXs per annum". A further angle on this is to recognise that Seymour is probably a Scottish surname and at that time Scots on Tyneside were either (a) keelman, many of whom were Edinburgh-based, travelling to Tyneside for the summer and returning to Edinburgh each winter (the coal trade was seasonal at that time) or (b) among either the Covenanters' Army which crossed the Tyne at Newburn in 1640 and then camped at Whickham before entering Newcastle from the south or with the later Scottish Army which laid seige to Newcastle in 1644, after which they again occupied the City. Personally I would suggest that an origin with a keelman's family is more likely. In that case you should perhaps, after checking out Whickham, look hard at Newcastle All Saints parish, as Sandgate, in that parish, was where many were concentrated. The story is that when the Hearth Tax was first imposed, in the early 1660s, the collectors met with a solid refusal to pay when they went to Sandgate. Indeed, the keelmen rioted and kept the inspectors out of Sandgate altogether. Their argument was something like "We are all Scottish, so we shouldn't have to pay English taxes"! However, later Hearth Taxes were collected and there is a printed list of all Newcastle households that paid in 1665, compiled by Richard Welford and printed in Archaeologia Aeliana, 3rd series, Vol 7, pp49-76. That book was published about a century ago and is now fairly rare but you might find one in a reference library. Geoff Nicholson

In a message dated 31/05/2007 23:11:41 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Does anyone know where or what Sister Wham Tanfield could be, from this baptism entry? Baptisms, Lanchester District Parish/Church: Tanfield (St. Margaret) 7 Aug 1825 Robert Forster, of Sister Wham, son of Thomas Forster (labourer) by his wife Mary Regards Stan Mapstone Stan: I've come across the name before though, like you, I know nothing about the detail of what it was, I expect it was a single farm or isolated cottage. The biggest it is likely to have been is a single pit. I'll write again if I find any further reference to it today (unless someone else does so!). Geoff Nicholson

Does anyone know where or what Sister Wham Tanfield could be, from this baptism entry? Baptisms, Lanchester District Parish/Church: Tanfield (St. Margaret) 7 Aug 1825 Robert Forster, of Sister Wham, son of Thomas Forster (labourer) by his wife Mary Regards Stan Mapstone

Thanks again Geoff for that extra info, that's another lead I will follow up. I also realised that I didn't mention in my haste that Edward Ross was married in Bishopwearmouth in Feb. 1816, so feel that at some stage the family must have moved to Co Durham from NBLD. I have researched all the census info from 1901 back so know that I have the correct family & ages are all consistent & I take your point about not knowing where born. The info on the census is consistent in 1841, 1851, saying born at Benton NBL but obviously he was baptised somewhere else, & the age is consistent. His wife's census info says she was born in South Shields hence the reason for trying to obtain apprentice records for those two areas. I've always suspected the my Ross family at some stage must have been from Scotland & have been trying to find out when this happened, but getting Edward's parents' names has been a real battle. I will certainly try to obtain the Newcastle church records & hope for a bit more success. Regards Dorothy

She was living with her husband a gardener at No. 208 Gilesgate in 1851, a widow at No. 207 as a Bedes Woman in 1861, and again at No. 207 in 1871 with nothing in the occupation column. You can see details of various charities at http://www.tomorrows-history.com/Items/LargeIE/ItemIN0200010217.htm Regards Stan Mapstone

Working my way through 1861 census for St. Nicholas and found this in occupation field. I am just curious - perhaps someone could enlighten me. I was born nearby so I know the Bede was important in the cathedral - was itn alms type of pension? Maureen

In a message dated 30/05/2007 15:54:56 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Working my way through 1861 census for St. Nicholas and found this in occupation field. I am just curious - perhaps someone could enlighten me. I was born nearby so I know the Bede was important in the cathedral - was itn alms type of pension? Maureen Maureen: I note you entitle your message "Cedes woman ....." and then refer to Bede. That makes me think that perhaps the description is really "Bedeswoman". a Bedesman or a Bedeswoman was usually an occupant of Almshouses - ie one who lived on charity. However, I'm not at all sure how that would fit with Durham Cathedral, which has no Almshouses directly attached to it. It is possible, however - even likely - that close to the Cathedral, on Palace Green, there would have been such Almshouses. I wonder whether (although I have never heard about it from a contemporary source) her occupation of an Almshouse was dependent on her doing some job around the Cathedral - cleaning it, perhaps. Geoff Nicholson

In a message dated 30/05/2007 15:54:55 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: I am just curious - perhaps someone could enlighten me. I was born nearby so I know the Bede was important in the cathedral - was itn alms type of pension? _________________________________________________ Hi Maureen, Can you give the census reference, or the name of the person? Regards Stan Mapstone

Many thanks Geoff for your prompt reply, I wil follow up the leads you have given. It seems the parents names just don't seem to be on any records, & the Ross family has come to a dead end but I wil keep trying. Thanks again, Dorothy

In a message dated 29/05/2007 10:44:57 GMT Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Many thanks Geoff for your prompt reply, I wil follow up the leads you have given. It seems the parents names just don't seem to be on any records, & the Ross family has come to a dead end but I wil keep trying. Thanks again, Dorothy Dorothy: First, my apologies for the various typos in my first message. I hope the sense of what I wrote still managed to come through! Second, looking at the problem again, I notice that you have not said what your evidence is that Edward Ross was born in Benton in 1788. Given that you said "born" and not "baptised", it seems to me not impossible that you have obtained it from a census age and birthplace. Census ages are notoriously unreliable, but I did search 1785-1790, inclusive, thus allowing for your date to be a few years out. It is the "Benton" that now worries me. The sort of thing that often happened, and may have happened here, is that a person may not really have known whee they were born, it never having seemed important to him before, and his parents being either dead or living some distance away, he couldn't check with them at census time. If the earliest he could remember was when he lived in Benton, he may just have assumed that was where he had been born. He may therefore have been born almost anywhere else! Another possible explanation is that perhaps he really was born in Benton but his parents were not C of E. They could have taken him to the nearest Methodist of Presbyterian (say) church for baptism. 1788 is rather early for a Methodist church - at least for one with surviving registers - but on Tyneside Presbyterian churches tended to be concentrated in the ports of Newcastle and North Shields. Of the two, Newcastle is probably a better bet than North Shields (N Shields tended to have the Scottish sailors and their families). By no means all the Presbyterian and Independant churches of Newcastle have had their registers included on, say, the IGI, so a baptism could well be hiding there. Most local Presbyterians were first or second generation immigrants from Scotland (the Church of Scotland is Presbyterian), and in your case the surname Ross does tend to bear that out as an origin for the family. Perhaps a search of Newcastle Presbyterian registers of the period is called for. If so, I would suggest you give some priority to the John Know Presbyterian Church in the Graot Market, as that was not only one of the main ones, but it received comparatively little attention from modern transcribers and indexers (though H M Wood did transcribe it about a century ago!). Geoff Nicholson

Hi Jan I think this may be him: 1841: Bishops Middleham, Durham Cuthbert WESTGARTH 50 Publican YES Ann WESTGARTH 50 YES Ann WESTGARTH 5 YES 1851: Three Tons, Bishop Middleham, Durham Ann WESTGARTH head Widow 63 Victualler b. Yorkshire, Cowton Ann WESTGARTH grandaur unm 15 b. Durham, B Middleham Elizabeth COULSON grandaur 10 b. Durham, Cassop I think this confirms that Cuthbert died before 1851. The one you have probably found is a different Cuthbert? This may be the death of your Cuthbert: WESTGARTH Cuthbert died March quarter 1847 Stockton &C 24 191 nb Stockton covers Bishop Middleham An ANN WESTGARTH died March qu 1858 Stockton district 10a 24 This may be his wife? Hope this helps a little. Louise ----- Original Message ----- From: "Janet Hasler" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 6:13 PM Subject: [ENG-DURHAM] 1841 census > Hi > I wonder if anyone could help me I am trying to find a > CUTHBERT WESTGARTH > CHRISTENED 10 NOV 1788 > STANHOPE > PARENTS GEORGE & MARGARET they both died before 1799. > I believe that CUTHBERT died in 1852 which means that I should be able to > find him on the 1841/1851 census but I can find any trace of him. > Thank you to anyone who can help. > Jan. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.8.0/821 - Release Date: 27/05/2007 > 15:05 > >

Hi I wonder if anyone could help me I am trying to find a CUTHBERT WESTGARTH CHRISTENED 10 NOV 1788 STANHOPE PARENTS GEORGE & MARGARET they both died before 1799. I believe that CUTHBERT died in 1852 which means that I should be able to find him on the 1841/1851 census but I can find any trace of him. Thank you to anyone who can help. Jan.

Posting my interests:- REED (Staindrop, St Helens Auckland) BOLTON (Evenwood, formerly of Whitehaven Cumberland) MORLEY (West Auckland) DIXON (Cockfield) LAW (Evenwood, West Auckland) ARMSTRONG (Evenwood)