Hi John I would be cautious, if I were you, in assuming a Bell-Blennerhassett link if you haven't got back before 1780. There was a great deal of Cumbrian settlement in Ireland in the period 1650-1750, especially from areas close to Whitehaven (as Flimby is). The BELL surname is extremely common in West Cumberland, and more than one Bell family would have moved to Ireland. However, it may be that you have pointers, other than Catholicism, that suggest a link.  Bear in mind that families which settled in Ireland tended to maintain contacts with Cumbrian relatives, and flit back and forth over the Irish Sea, for quite some time. Cumbrian records could provide indirect clues as well as direct evidence. I would suggest that, first, you find our about the Blennerhassett ownership of Flimby, e.g. http://www.stevebulman.f9.co.uk/cumbria/flimby_f.html . Hudleston's 'Cumberland Families and Heraldry' comments that Thomas Blennerhasset of Flimby, who was mayor of Carlisle a number of times and later MP for Carlisle, was granted BallyCarty Castle and other forfeited estates of Lord Desmond in 1590. However, Hudleston isn't always accurate and other sites might provide a better account - e.g. http://blennerhassettfamilytree.com/ . You should also explore Flimby records to see whether any Bells are mentioned. Flimby doesn't have any parish BMD until 1703, but as a Chapelry of Camerton it may be included there - this has patchy BMD from 1599. Camerton also has a surviving Protestation Return 1641-2 - it is conceivable that it may list a Bell as refusing to take the oath. Though I have ancestors in Camerton at around that time, I haven't explored the sources there - sorry. As Peter Freshwater has already suggested, exploring the records of TNA is an absolute must. The easiest way to start is to use TNA Quick Search. Also, a must, check probate records. Flimby relatives may well have mentioned Irish cousins. Chris

Hi John I cannot help directly, but it might be worth your starting with The National Archives at Kew, England (www.nationalarchives.gov.uk) and searching on BLENNERHASSET from 1500 to 1700. The Cumberland Blennerhasset name seems to crop up in a number of collections of family papers, and might give you pointers as to where to go next. You have probably exhausted the Kerry local history collections and what survived from the destruction of the Archives of Ireland in Dublin in 1922, but there is a good article on Irish local and family history and its sources in David Hey's Oxford Companion to Local and Family History - again, this might suggest other avenues to explore. I hope that this is of some help. Good hunting! All best wishes, Peter Peter B Freshwater MA, DipLib, FSA Scot Edinburgh, Scotland peter@hillfoot.demon.co.uk Researching FRESHWATER, SWINGLER, BRUCE, PERKINS, FOLWELL, NEWCOMB(E) (Beds, Leics, Northants) HAUGHAN, RICHARDSON (Cumbria, Durham) DOW, GRAY, HUNTER, KENNEDY, JACKSON, McDOUGALL (Angus, Perthshire, Glasgow)

I'm an Armstrong researcher and another great site is http://www.british-history.ac.uk/Default.aspx You can search by name, location, time period. Lot's of Bells in Scotland and Cumberland and Northumberland. Bobbie Jean Hooser -----Original Message----- From: eng-cumbria-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:eng-cumbria-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of eng-cumbria-request@rootsweb.com Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2011 2:00 AM To: eng-cumbria@rootsweb.com Subject: ENG-CUMBRIA Digest, Vol 6, Issue 13 Today's Topics: 1. Bells of Cumbria? (John Bell) 2. Re: Bells of Cumbria? (Peter Freshwater) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 23:24:47 +0100 From: "John Bell" <belljb@iol.ie> Subject: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Bells of Cumbria? To: <ENG-CUMBRIA@rootsweb.com> Message-ID: <80BA0C28D90442F385442B762D2898A0@Jordan> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I'm trying to establish if my ancestors came from the Cumbrian region. My name is John Bell and I come from Co. Kerry in Ireland. I have traced my family history back to about 1780 in Ireland but cannot go any further. I think that the Bells of Co. Kerry came to Ireland with Thomas Blennerhassett who was granted land near Tralee in the Elizabethan Plantation of Ireland in the early 1600s. Thomas Blennerhassett came form Frimbey Hall in Cumberland and my ancestors, The Bell Family, would have been part of his entourage. My Bell ancestors were builders, roofers, skaters etc and still carry on this trade today. What I want to know, is it possible to get information on the grant of lands in Ireland to Thomas Blennerhassett, and if any information is available on who travelled with him etc. The most common 18th and 19th century names in my family were Joseph Bell, William Bell, and Richard Bell. One peculiar thing is that my Bell family were Catholic even in 1780 and this is not ! the norm for the Bells. This is really a shot in the dark, but any help and advice would be appreciated. I'll look forward to a reply. John Bell ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 07:16:28 +0100 From: "Peter Freshwater" <peter@hillfoot.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Bells of Cumbria? To: <eng-cumbria@rootsweb.com> Message-ID: <8D89247692544BF4BB09B2A4B2FABB27@PETERLAPTOP> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hi John I cannot help directly, but it might be worth your starting with The National Archives at Kew, England (www.nationalarchives.gov.uk) and searching on BLENNERHASSET from 1500 to 1700. The Cumberland Blennerhasset name seems to crop up in a number of collections of family papers, and might give you pointers as to where to go next. You have probably exhausted the Kerry local history collections and what survived from the destruction of the Archives of Ireland in Dublin in 1922, but there is a good article on Irish local and family history and its sources in David Hey's Oxford Companion to Local and Family History - again, this might suggest other avenues to explore. I hope that this is of some help. Good hunting! All best wishes, Peter Peter B Freshwater MA, DipLib, FSA Scot Edinburgh, Scotland peter@hillfoot.demon.co.uk Researching FRESHWATER, SWINGLER, BRUCE, PERKINS, FOLWELL, NEWCOMB(E) (Beds, Leics, Northants) HAUGHAN, RICHARDSON (Cumbria, Durham) DOW, GRAY, HUNTER, KENNEDY, JACKSON, McDOUGALL (Angus, Perthshire, Glasgow) ------------------------------ To contact the ENG-CUMBRIA list administrator, send an email to ENG-CUMBRIA-admin@rootsweb.com. To post a message to the ENG-CUMBRIA mailing list, send an email to ENG-CUMBRIA@rootsweb.com. __________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-CUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body of the email with no additional text. End of ENG-CUMBRIA Digest, Vol 6, Issue 13 ******************************************

I'm trying to establish if my ancestors came from the Cumbrian region. My name is John Bell and I come from Co. Kerry in Ireland. I have traced my family history back to about 1780 in Ireland but cannot go any further. I think that the Bells of Co. Kerry came to Ireland with Thomas Blennerhassett who was granted land near Tralee in the Elizabethan Plantation of Ireland in the early 1600s. Thomas Blennerhassett came form Frimbey Hall in Cumberland and my ancestors, The Bell Family, would have been part of his entourage. My Bell ancestors were builders, roofers, skaters etc and still carry on this trade today. What I want to know, is it possible to get information on the grant of lands in Ireland to Thomas Blennerhassett, and if any information is available on who travelled with him etc. The most common 18th and 19th century names in my family were Joseph Bell, William Bell, and Richard Bell. One peculiar thing is that my Bell family were Catholic even in 1780 and this is not the norm for the Bells. This is really a shot in the dark, but any help and advice would be appreciated. I'll look forward to a reply. John Bell

Much depended on whether the child was baptised / brought up by both parents together or by the mother on her own; in the latter case the child would have had her name. In many parishes all children born out of wedlock bore their mother's names. I suggest that you search for both names to be on the safe side. Good hunting. Peter Peter B Freshwater MA, DipLib, FSA Scot) Edinburgh, Scotland peter@hillfoot.demon.co.uk Researching FRESHWATER, SWINGLER, BRUCE, PERKINS, FOLWELL, NEWCOMB(E) (Beds, Leics, Northants) HAUGHAN, RICHARDSON (Dumfriesshire, Cumbria, Durham) DOW, GRAY, HUNTER, KENNEDY, JACKSON, McDOUGALL (Angus, Perthshire, Glasgow) ----- Original Message ----- From: <user917826@aol.com> To: <eng-cumbria@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 3:56 PM Subject: Re: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Bishop's Transcripts > > Hello, > > It has been my experience that a child is often named using the father's > surname even if the child has been born out of wedlock. > I had found an example of that in Lancashire with my own family. I had > found the entry first in the IGI, which I assumed was a family entry. When > I scanned the films of the actual records, I found that the couple was > unmarried but that the child carried his father's name. > > Bev W > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Broach, Vance C, JR, JR <broach@udel.edu> > To: ENG-CUMBRIA <ENG-CUMBRIA@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sun, Aug 14, 2011 9:46 am > Subject: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Bishop's Transcripts > > > I'm scanning the Bishop's transcripts for Lorton & Wigton parishes, > seeking the > arents' names of a son (possibly forenamed Thomas) born out of wedlock, > robably in the mid 1750s, to an as yet unidentified female surnamed > Lancaster & > n as yet unidentified male surnamed Broatch. > The transcripts list marriages, christenings & burials as well as verbiage > on > ther information. I presume I should be reading the christenings. Their > ormat is Child's forename, son/daughter of father's forename surname. For > an > llegitimate child what would the entry be? That is, would it name the > father > r mother? > The transcripts are hard to read, being microfilms of the "original" > documents. > re there any typed transcriptions of these documents? Are there other > more > eadable sources of the information than that contained in the Bishop's > ranscripts? Are there other questions I should be asking? > Carter > roach@udel.edu<mailto:broach@udel.edu> > > ------------------------------ > o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-CUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com > ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > he message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > ENG-CUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hello, It has been my experience that a child is often named using the father's surname even if the child has been born out of wedlock. I had found an example of that in Lancashire with my own family. I had found the entry first in the IGI, which I assumed was a family entry. When I scanned the films of the actual records, I found that the couple was unmarried but that the child carried his father's name. Bev W -----Original Message----- From: Broach, Vance C, JR, JR <broach@udel.edu> To: ENG-CUMBRIA <ENG-CUMBRIA@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 14, 2011 9:46 am Subject: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Bishop's Transcripts I'm scanning the Bishop's transcripts for Lorton & Wigton parishes, seeking the arents' names of a son (possibly forenamed Thomas) born out of wedlock, robably in the mid 1750s, to an as yet unidentified female surnamed Lancaster & n as yet unidentified male surnamed Broatch. The transcripts list marriages, christenings & burials as well as verbiage on ther information. I presume I should be reading the christenings. Their ormat is Child's forename, son/daughter of father's forename surname. For an llegitimate child what would the entry be? That is, would it name the father r mother? The transcripts are hard to read, being microfilms of the "original" documents. re there any typed transcriptions of these documents? Are there other more eadable sources of the information than that contained in the Bishop's ranscripts? Are there other questions I should be asking? Carter roach@udel.edu<mailto:broach@udel.edu> ------------------------------ o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-CUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of he message

I'm scanning the Bishop's transcripts for Lorton & Wigton parishes, seeking the parents' names of a son (possibly forenamed Thomas) born out of wedlock, probably in the mid 1750s, to an as yet unidentified female surnamed Lancaster & an as yet unidentified male surnamed Broatch. The transcripts list marriages, christenings & burials as well as verbiage on other information. I presume I should be reading the christenings. Their format is Child's forename, son/daughter of father's forename surname. For an illegitimate child what would the entry be? That is, would it name the father or mother? The transcripts are hard to read, being microfilms of the "original" documents. Are there any typed transcriptions of these documents? Are there other more readable sources of the information than that contained in the Bishop's transcripts? Are there other questions I should be asking? Carter broach@udel.edu<mailto:broach@udel.edu>

I am looking for a family that lived in Sebergham & Lime Kiln Nook(what a name!) in the years 1700 thru 1850 or so. These are the names I have & the wives & children. Please advise if you have information concerning them. Nancy Joseph Peascod born @ 1797 & he had a brother named Isaac. m. Mary Steele Barnes married Joseph 1830, she was married to a William Barnes, he died @ 1825, left her w/2 sons, Hodgen & unknown. s. Isaac b. 1827 (1st wife) s. Joseph b. 1832 d. Mary b. 1835 s. William b. 1837 Then the family immigrated to the United States (PA)& had a s. John b. 1840 & d. named Mary Jane in 1843. After they came to the US, Joseph & wife Mary changed their last name from Peascod to Prescot. Joseph’s brother Isaac stayed in the UK. Have a photo of Joseph, very distinctive.

I am researching the above couple and hope that someone maybe able to help. Alexander Moffat b. 1897 to William and Mary in Cockermouth, Cumbria and Isabella Graham b. 1910 to parents ?? They married in 1934 in Cockermouth. I am unsure of any of these dates and have no idea when they both died. Is there anyone out there who can confirm or correct any of these dates Thanks in anticipation Eileen Wyoming NSW

Bev W wrote: > I am new to the list and researching my Rawlins family in the area of Keswick >and possibly Maryport.  When searching the FHC library catalog, it appears that >there are records for churches from 1839.  Are earlier records available?  Would >anyone have suggestions on the best places to look? The LDS have filmed parish records from a number of sources (parish registers, bishops transcripts, modern transcripts, etc.) and, in some parishes, the films take one back into the sixteenth century. I assume that, when you mention 1839, you refer just to Keswick. There is a publication that lists available records, but is out-of-date so far as modern finding aids are concerned. The booklet is: 'Cumberland & Westmorland', Volume 10, Part 3 of the National Index of Parish Registers, by Peter B Park and Janet Arnison, published by the Society of Genealogists, 1999, ISBN1 85951 604 1. Keswick was originally a chapelry of the parish of Crosthwaite. Crosthwaite records go back to 1562, and there is a CWAAS published transcript and index (the SoG Library reference is: http://62.32.98.6/S10312UKStaff/OPAC/TitleView/CompleteDisplay.aspx?FromOPAC=true&DbCode=0&PatronCode=0&Language=english&RwSearchCode=0&BibCodes=3153409). Maryport is a relatively new town. Before 1761, you might do best to look at the records of Crosscanonby. Rawlin might, of course, be spelt Rawling. I don't know much about the spread of the surname, but there was a heavy patch in the area that I research - Lamplugh/Ennerdale (next to Crosthwaite). Chris

Maryport used to be part of Crosscanonby parish until it got its own church, so look at Crosscanonby records. Petra On Tue, 26 Jul 2011 01:00:24 -0600 eng-cumbria-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2011 06:26:46 -0400 (EDT) >From: user917826@aol.com > Subject: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Church records > To: Eng-Cumbria@rootsweb.com > > > Hello, > > I am new to the list and researching my Rawlins family >in the area of Keswick and possibly Maryport. When >searching the FHC library catalog, it appears that there >are records for churches from 1839. Are earlier records >available? Would anyone have suggestions on the best >places to look? > > Thanks so much! > > Bev W >

Hello, I am new to the list and researching my Rawlins family in the area of Keswick and possibly Maryport. When searching the FHC library catalog, it appears that there are records for churches from 1839. Are earlier records available? Would anyone have suggestions on the best places to look? Thanks so much! Bev W

I wish to confirm BMD information for Isaac Lancaster who is supposed to have been born in 1789 in Lorton Parish, Cumberland, England. His parents are reputed to be John Lancaster (born in 1764 in Cumberland, England) & Mary Heaviside or Unknown Forename Rawnson. I live in the United States, so must conduct my research via the Internet. Please advise me how to proceed. Thanks, Carter Broach

Hi Petra Thank you for your prompt reply and information. See my reply to Chris for my d ilema with John Walker. Pam ----- Original Message ----- From: "Petra Mitchinson" <body of the message

Hi Chris, Yes I have been "after" my John Walker through this site a couple of times before. Most entries for my John Walker listed in Ancestry .com, are incorrect as they have John Walker baptised 1821 at St Cuthbert's Carlisle as "my John Walker" although the St Cuthbert John Walker's parents are John Walker , husband man and Elizabeth Flowers. this couple married here in May 1820 and other children are also baptised here I have traced John Walker ( which I believe is John of St Cuthbert's) through the ensuing UK census, 1841, 1851, there being other family names continuing here with his children In the meantime thanks for your prompt reply and other areas in which I can search. Pam Williams ----- >

Hi Pam, Clifton used to be chapel in the parish of Workington. I am not sure for how long the chapel existed, but the Cumbria Record Office also only has registers from 1822 (Marriages from 1833). The Churches in Cumbria website had this bit of information: "St Luke's is a small church between the villages of Great Clifton and Little Clifton. The present building dates from 1900 but this has been a place of worship since at least Norman times." However, it may be that the chapel was not licensed to perform official functions (baptisms, marriages, burials) until 1822 - and the licence for marriages often came later than the other two, which would fit with the dates of the registers. Try the Workington parishes before 1822 - perhaps you will find them there? Petra ----- Original Message ----- > Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2011 12:14:01 -0700 > From: "Brian and Pam Williams" <brianpamw@optusnet.com.au> > Subject: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Walker - Kendall families > > Hi all > > In my endeavours to find the whereabouts of my great grand father, John Walker b.c. 1820 in Cumberland I have searched through a number of IGI films , without success ,in the meantime noting very small mention of the " Kendall " surname > > John' s parents being John Walker a ships captain and Elizabeth Kendall > > However the IGI film for Little-Greater Clifton 1822 - 1890 ( No. 90595 ) threw up several mentions of Walker/ Kendall connections. > > It seems that the Mormon church does not have records for this parish pre 1822. > > Does anyone know of the existence of pre 1822 parish records for this district ?. > > The Christian name Alexander seems to have great significance in my Walker family and I have found through the UK census for 1841- 1871 an Alexander Walker ( born 1801 )and family in this Parish > > John Walker named his first born ( at Aspatria) baptised 12 Dec 1847 Alexander , (film no. 90560 ) ( while several other married John Walker's b.c 1820 in Cumberland have not named their sons Alexander. ( check UK census) > > John Walker was not at home with his family for the 1851 census. He came to Australia in 1853 with his wife and three children. > > Pam Williams

Mar 16, 2011 04:23:50 PM, eng-cumbria@rootsweb.com wrote: Hi Pam, Clifton used to be chapel in the parish of Workington. I am not sure for how long the chapel existed, but the Cumbria Record Office also only has registers from 1822 (Marriages from 1833). The Churches in Cumbria website had this bit of information: "St Luke's is a small church between the villages of Great Clifton and Little Clifton. The present building dates from 1900 but this has been a place of worship since at least Norman times." However, it may be that the chapel was not licensed to perform official functions (baptisms, marriages, burials) until 1822 - and the licence for marriages often came later than the other two, which would fit with the dates of the registers. Try the Workington parishes before 1822 - perhaps you will find them there? Petra ----- Original Message ----- > Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2011 12:14:01 -0700 > From: "Brian and Pam Williams" <brianpamw@optusnet.com.au> > Subject: [ENG-CUMBRIA] Walker - Kendall families > > Hi all > > In my endeavours to find the whereabouts of my great grand father, John Walker b.c. 1820 in Cumberland I have searched through a number of IGI films , without success ,in the meantime noting very small mention of the " Kendall " surname > > John' s parents being John Walker a ships captain and Elizabeth Kendall > > However the IGI film for Little-Greater Clifton 1822 - 1890 ( No. 90595 ) threw up several mentions of Walker/ Kendall connections. > > It seems that the Mormon church does not have records for this parish pre 1822. > > Does anyone know of the existence of pre 1822 parish records for this district ?. > > The Christian name Alexander seems to have great significance in my Walker family and I have found through the UK census for 1841- 1871 an Alexander Walker ( born 1801 )and family in this Parish > > John Walker named his first born ( at Aspatria) baptised 12 Dec 1847 Alexander , (film no. 90560 ) ( while several other married John Walker's b.c 1820 in Cumberland have not named their sons Alexander. ( check UK census) > > John Walker was not at home with his family for the 1851 census. He came to Australia in 1853 with his wife and three children. > > Pam Williams ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ENG-CUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi all In my endeavours to find the whereabouts of my great grand father, John Walker b.c. 1820 in Cumberland I have searched through a number of IGI films , without success ,in the meantime noting very small mention of the " Kendall " surname John' s parents being John Walker a ships captain and Elizabeth Kendall However the IGI film for Little-Greater Clifton 1822 - 1890 ( No. 90595 ) threw up several mentions of Walker/ Kendall connections. It seems that the Mormon church does not have records for this parish pre 1822. Does anyone know of the existence of pre 1822 parish records for this district ?. The Christian name Alexander seems to have great significance in my Walker family and I have found through the UK census for 1841- 1871 an Alexander Walker ( born 1801 )and family in this Parish John Walker named his first born ( at Aspatria) baptised 12 Dec 1847 Alexander , (film no. 90560 ) ( while several other married John Walker's b.c 1820 in Cumberland have not named their sons Alexander. ( check UK census) John Walker was not at home with his family for the 1851 census. He came to Australia in 1853 with his wife and three children. Pam Williams

Pam Williams wrote: > In my endeavours  to find the whereabouts of my great grand father,  John >Walker b.c. 1820 in Cumberland I have searched through a number of IGI films , >without success ,in the meantime noting very small mention of the " Kendall "  >surname > John' s parents being John Walker a ships captain and Elizabeth Kendall > However the  IGI film for Little-Greater Clifton 1822 - 1890  ( No. 90595 )  >threw up several mentions of  Walker/ Kendall connections. > It seems that the Mormon church does not have records for this parish pre 1822. > Does anyone know of the existence of pre 1822 parish records for this district >?. > The Christian name Alexander seems to have great significance in my Walker >family and I have found through the  UK  census for 1841- 1871 an Alexander >Walker  ( born 1801 )and family in this Parish > John Walker named his first born ( at Aspatria)  baptised 12 Dec 1847  >Alexander ,  (film no. 90560 )    ( while several other  married John Walker's >b.c 1820 in Cumberland have not named their sons Alexander. ( check UK census) > John Walker was not at home with his family for the 1851 census. He came to >Australia in 1853 with his wife and three children. I've had a look in the National Index of Parish Registers. Clifton apparently became a separate parish in 1733, but the only register listed starts in 1822, as you've found. It was a chapelry of Workington. I'm pretty sure that I've found Clifton events in earlier Workington registers, so I would suggest you have a look there. Hmm, John Walker, a ship's captain. That sounds familiar. Have you corresponded before about that, or has someone else already researched this line (possibly Jill Coulthard - http://www.jillcoulthard.com/)? As he was a ship's captain, it's likely that he left a will (which may give clues about his origins), such as the will of John Walker of Workington in 1821. There are various wills of Walkers in Workington before that, and probably after - very much worth pursuing if a search for his baptism turns up a blank. Ideally the will of a father who mentions his son, John, now captain of ....! All of these are available on LDS film. Elizabeth Kendal. One possibility is Elizabeth Kendall of High Leys in Lamplugh, born 1804 - though that may be a little too young. Chris

Hi folks, I have added two new sets of transcriptions of Edenhall documents on Chris' Rumbutter site. They are labelled as Set 6 and Set 7 and can be found in the Resources section on Rumbutter or directly at http://www.rumbutter.net/gen-cumb-res-edenhall-home/ . You will need to log in (or register if you have not previously done so). Rumbutter's home page is at http://www.rumbutter.net/ . Sorry about the still missing Set 3, but that label is reserved for transcriptions of documents from a second box of Edenhall material that the seller acquired and is currently offering on eBay. Not all of those documents have appeared on eBay yet, so you'll have to be patient! The new documents are transcriptions of originals in the first box of Edenhall documents which have never appeared on eBay and consist of bundles 17-48, mostly from the 1730s but with a few earlier and later strays. They are 546 original documents, a few of them grouped together. They refer to both Cumberland and Westmorland locations. There are several documents with the tag "Not fully indexed" in each set. This means that not all surnames mentioned in those documents appear in the index because the maximum number of tags possible for each document is only 12. If you want to make sure that you are not missing any occurrences of the surnames you are interested in, you should look at those documents. Alternatively, you can use the search engine to find all occurrences of the names you are after - but that approach will miss spelling variations! There is no .pdf document in the Downloads section this time as the transcription of the originals is ongoing. If anybody is desperate to have a particular document transcription in Word format, please contact me off list. For further explanations, see my email below which I sent in January 2010 when the first set of transcriptions went live. I'd love to know if you find a relative in these documents! Petra ----- Original Message ----- From: Petra Mitchinson Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 6:09 PM Subject: [CUL GOOGLIES] Edenhall Document Transcriptions on Rumbutter In 2009, I saw that a dealer on eBay was selling original documents from the Edenhall estate in Cumbria. These were mainly bills and receipts predominantly from the 18th century, with a few documents from the late 17th century and some from the early 1800s. Most of these documents contain personal names, usually the name of the tradesman who had submitted the bill or signed the receipt in addition to the name of the agent or steward who had paid the bill on behalf of the MUSGRAVE family. Some documents contained whole lists of names. In addition to the obvious relevance to family historians, the documents as a group also give a fascinating insight into the lifestyle of the MUSGRAVE family and the expenses involved in running a large household. The MUSGRAVE baronets had their main seat at Edenhall in Cumberland, but they also held a lot of land in Westmorland (Hartley Castle had been their main seat until the mid-16th century) and in County Durham in the Bishop Auckland area. These documents predominantly refer to Cumberland and Westmorland, but there are a few County Durham documents included as well. It saddened me that a family archive like this was being irretrievably dispersed, and I decided to transcribe the documents still offered for sale from the excellent photographs the seller had provided on eBay. Unfortunately many of the documents had already been sold, and for those the photos were no longer available. My transcription document therefore only contains 183 documents (although some of them consist of several original documents, so the total is almost 200). This represents a small fraction of those in the Edenhall archives. I am extremely grateful to Chris Dickinson for spending an inordinate amount of time, effort and patience in helping me to put my transcriptions onto his Rumbutter site. They are now ready to view. To preserve the formatting of my transcriptions, the transcribed documents are displayed as images, and their text can therefore not be copied. However, you can download my whole transcription document as a pdf file and then copy the text of any transcribed document in which you are interested into your word processor. Rumbutter's search engine fully works for the documents as there is also a "plain" text version below each document which has no formatting but is searchable. The site's "Tag" system has also been used to create an index of standard surnames (e.g. the surnames STEPHENSON, STEVENSON, STIVENSON etc. all appear under the Tag STEPHENSON). The MUSGRAVE Baronets and their agents, who appear in very many documents, have been tagged by full name. Unfortunately the tag system only allows a maximum of 12 tags per document, and six documents contained more than 12 names - these documents were given the tag "Not fully indexed". The Category system has been used for an index of occupations and general locations, mainly counties but also some individual places (Edenhall, Hartley, Carlisle, Penrith, Kendal). My downloadable pdf document has an index of full names and an alphabetical index of place names, giving (as far as I could determine them) each location's parish, county and grid reference. It is worth reading the introduction as it explains the rules I followed when transcribing. And the second page of the introduction contains a list of the MUSGRAVE baronets for quick reference. To view the documents, go to the Resources section http://www.rumbutter.net/gen-cumb-resources-home/ and click on "Edenhall", or go straight to the Edenhall Homepage at http://www.rumbutter.net/gen-cumb-res-edenhall-home . You need to log in. If you have not yet registered with the site, you will need to do so - it is entirely free. There are other excellent resources on the Rumbutter site, it is well worth it. Have fun! Petra P. S.: There is more of this to come in the future...