Its that Lancashire lad again. I have contacted Workington Council, and one or two other Cumbrian Dept, and they have no records of any Haughing' been buried around that area. Anyone with any Information please contact me. I asked the Workington Newspaper to put a letter in the letters page, but I have not had a reply Is there anyone out there/ :-) Cheers Bert

Help needed To my cumbrian friends, trying to find HAUGHIN. If you look at the 1881 census, you will find just 1 George Haughin in the UK aged 8. If you look on the 1901 census you will find just 1 George HAUGHIN aged 14 so they are not the same George. I have a death cert for a George Haughin died aged 75 in 1956, that makes him 20 in 1901 and born in1881. Where do this Georges disappear and and appear from? From a Lancashire Lad

Hi If someone was out at sea with a fishing fleet around 1850- 1900, would they be on a census, if so where? If someone was buried at sea where would the event be recorded? cheers Bert

Dorothy Gaunt writes: >Can anyone suggest where or what the First Fryits Office in >London was? I came across it in a Newcastle Courant >item of 1792. <snip> I guess this should read 'First Fruits'. The phrase 'First Fruits and Tenths' refers traditionally to the first year's income from a benefice [annates] and 10% of the income in following years. This used to be a tax paid to the Pope, but after the Reformation went to the Crown and was administered by the Court of First Fruits and Tenths and then by the Exchequer. Queen Anne relinquished this income to set up a fund for poor Clergy called 'Queen Anne's Bounty' - after 1940, administered by the Church Commissioners. So I should think that the First Fruits Office refers to the office administering this fund. But where that was I don't know - you may be able to find it by googling or by emailing the Church Commissioners. Or possibly there is a PRO leaflet on it. Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net

Monday, December 2, 2002, 6:03:26 AM, you wrote: DG> Can anyone suggest where or what the First Fryits Office in London was? I DG> came across it in a Newcastle Courant item of 1792. It read "Last week DG> after a long and tedious illness, Mrs Bacon, wife of Mr William Bacon, at DG> Louth near Carlisle; brother to John Bacon Esq of the First Fryits Office, DG> London" Dorothy, My feeling is this should be the First Fruits Office. This site gives this info: http://www.familychronicle.com/wanted.htm According to The Family Historian's Enquire Within, by Pauline Saul and F.C. Markwell, First Fruits "were the profits of an ecclesiastical benefice for the first year after a vacancy." The authors report that records are held in classes E.331 to 344 PRO Chancery Lane, and span the period from the mid 16th century to the early 19th century. The concept of First Fruits finds its origin in Proverbs 3:9, which states: "Honor the Lord with your substance, and with the first fruits of all your produce, then your barns will be filled with plenty." http://www.stevebulman.f9.co.uk/cumbria/worthies.html gives this on John Bacon: Bacon, John, Esq. of the First Fruits Office, London; well known for his hospitality and benevolence. To his patronage and encouragement the History of Cumberland is not a little indebted. He is a native of Kirklinton. (J) Google on First Fruits Office and you should get about 14 hits. -- Cheers, Anne mailto:docwras@yahoo.co.uk The Docwra Family Research Project http://resource.at/docwra

Can anyone suggest where or what the First Fryits Office in London was? I came across it in a Newcastle Courant item of 1792. It read "Last week after a long and tedious illness, Mrs Bacon, wife of Mr William Bacon, at Louth near Carlisle; brother to John Bacon Esq of the First Fryits Office, London" I googled, but to no avail...Any suggestions would be welcome. Dorothy G New Zealand

Hi I have a number of copies of marriage certs which may be of interest to some of you 1 William John Ferguson and Rachel Graves Married 8 Sept 1892 Aspatria 2 Joseph Temple Armstrong and Faith McVay Married 20 Aug 1984 Aspatria 3 James Johnstone and Ruth Hewitson Married 6 Feb 1892 Aspatria 4 George Irving Armstrong and Mary Robinson 22 Sept 1900 Aspatria 5 Joseph Graham and Ann Sumpton 15 Oct 1842 Isell 6 Joseph Turner and Elizabeth IREDALE 10 Jun 1842 Isell Regards Gerald Sandwith _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

I am doggedly chasing up all of my CASSON ancestors, but I have come to a full stop. There appear to have been a number of distinct groupings in the early 1800s - a few at Cockermouth, some at Workington and Whitehaven, and at most villages on the way to Ulpha. Presumably they all came from the southern tip of Copeland, but putting them together is proving difficult. The furthest back I have gone is Mark Casson who married Margaret Ritson in 1784 @ Workington St Michael - he is listed on the register and on the IGI as CARSON, so it took some finding. Then I found his son Henry's children listed all together on a separate sheet in the original Ennerdale register. If Whitehaven RO had not allowed me to look at the original register I would never have found them at all! Can I appeal to all listers seraching early Copeland registers to keep a look out for MARK CASSON - born c 1745 - 50 where and to whom I don't know. Has anyone any useful ideas please? Ann Lavery

Hi All. I am looking for my PICKUP/ELLIS ancestors. Martha PICKUP married George ELLIS 22 Aug 1864 in St Martins Church Castleton Moor. Martha was aged 25 & George 23, they give their residence as Brick Field Blue Pits Martha states her father to be John PICKUP and George's father is listed as George ELLIS deceased.(on mge Cert.) They had a daughter Elizabeth Ann in 1865, in Blue Pits, before coming to New Zealand c1875 and settling in Christchurch. Has anyone come across any of these families? I'd be really grateful for any leads. Michelle.

Hi Everyone In checking St George's Anglican Cemetery Barton Twp Wentworth County Ontario Canada for Sandwith's I found the memorial for a John Bell b Jan 6 1838 d Jun 6 1901 and described as a native of Cumberland England. Also there are a lot of Pearson names some of which had Yorkshire connections. The site address is www.interment.net/data/canada/ontario/wentworth/bart/stgeorge.htm Hope that this may be of interest to someone. Gerald Sandwith Looking for all Sandwith's with Cumberland connections _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

Carol Orr wrote: <snip> >ROBERT PERIE. born 23.10.1766, St Nicholas, Whitehaven, Cumberland. Son of Mary Perie >Does anyone have access to the parish records from St Nicholas and perhaps look this entry up to see what other information might be had. Much to my surprise, we've got a little bit of a result here. I had a look today at the Cumbria FHS transcript of the St Nicholas Baptisms 1694-1837. This has two relevant entries: 1759 9th September Betty of Mary Tirie 1766 23rd October Robert of Mary Perie, Queen Street No father mentioned, so the children (if Mary Tirie is the same as Mary Perie) look illegitimate. This, however, comes from the 1762 Census for Whitehaven: Queen Street Proprietor Mary Burrow Inhabitants ---- Wido. Mary Pearson Wido. Will Morland Sailor Will Sharp Mason John Ily Collier Ann Anderson Wido. Charles Haris Sailor Imprest Eleanor Drape Wido. Henry Dawson Mason Mongo Perry Sailor Eleanor Devotie Wido. Thomas Carter Labr James Ogilby Invalid Husband, father, brother? Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net

Ann Brownrigg wrote: >Does anyone by chance have a list of the Vicars of Whicham for >the 1600 & 1700s? rectors, no less. -1535 John Wodall -1591 Henry Wailes 1592-1620 William Tubman, M.A. 1620-1680 John Tubman, B.A. 1680-1720 Richard Crompton, B.A. 1720-1745 John Sawrey 1746-1794 William Smith 1794-1804 Robert Scott 1804 James Satterthwaite 1814 Allison Stebble 1832 Alexander Scott, M.A. 1847 George Wilkinson, B.A. 1865 John Mordaunt Lowther 1874 James Taylor 1894 William Pelisier Ingledow I suppose there may also be vicars or curates. Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net

> >ROBERT PERIE. born 23.10.1766, St Nicholas, Whitehaven, > Cumberland. Son of Mary Perie > > >Does anyone have access to the parish records from St Nicholas > and perhaps look this entry up to see what other information > might be had. > > > Much to my surprise, we've got a little bit of a result here. > > I had a look today at the Cumbria FHS transcript of the St > Nicholas Baptisms 1694-1837. This has two relevant entries: > > 1759 9th September > Betty of Mary Tirie > > 1766 23rd October > Robert of Mary Perie, Queen Street > > > No father mentioned, so the children (if Mary Tirie is the same > as Mary Perie) look illegitimate. AMAZING!! Chris.....I have looked twice for Robert in the appropriate times in the BT's for St. Nicholas......he is just plain not there. However.....as I said to Carole.......there could have been an omission in the transcripts. When I couldn't find my Bowness/Allanby marriage in the BT's for Flimby, I ordered in the original FHC parish records and they were in there.......a few pages had been skipped, obviously, by the clerk. So I guess it pays to go to the ORIGINAL records rather than the BT's if one can find them. Thanks Chris....and I am sure Carole thanks you. Mind you, I did have fun finding all the names and events in the St. Nicholas film once I couldn't find Perie....... Cheers.....Heather > >

Hi All...... Yesterday I was trying to find a baptism for one of our Listers and didn't, but in the meantime, I kept tripping over names that I see on these Lists, so wrote quite a few of them down, but not all of them, by any means. Maybe the interested researchers already have these people, but I will put them out here just in case.....and believe me, there are more of each. These are all from the LDS film for St. Bees & St. Nicholas, Film No. 90658. The dates I have transcribed are early to mid 1700's, but this film goes back earlier (plus later) and I have it on indefinite loan, so let me know if you need any research. It goes from about 1676 to 1837, but there are years missing in the 1800's. This will be strictly chronological as I have over two pages of them. They are baptisms, marriages and burials, so I just wrote them down as I saw them......no attempt at being alphabetical or in 'event' order......have fun and I hope these aid someone...... Some of the many names I saw were MOSSOP, DIXON, and the following.......(I hope I got the town/village names right) Burial of Anne BROWNRIGG, wife of George Brownrigg of Howman, 23 Sept. 1704. Burial of Elizabeth, daughter of Ellin BORRADALE of St. Bees, 29 Nov 1704 Baptism of Henry, son of Jacob BROWNRIGGS of Rodderlake?, 24 Oct 1704 (yes, it did have an 's' at the end) Burial of James, son of Jame HAYTON of St. Bees 19 Dec 1704 Baptism of Dorothy, daughter of William BORRADALE of Middle Coulderton? 30 Sept 1704...........followed by burial on 13 Oct 1704. Baptism of Henry, son of Joseph DICKINSON of Whitehaven, 22 Sept 1704 Burial of Joseph DICKINSON of Whitehaven, 20 Apr. 1705 Marriage of Anthony STEEL and Alice BROWNRIGG 26 June 1705 SATTERTHWAITE, Thomas......baptism of son Henry on 14 Oct 1705, followed by burials of Isabel, his daughter, 24 Oct 1705, and his son Henry, 28 Oct 1705.......all of Whitehaven. Baptism, 23 Nov 1719 of Mary, daughter of Jacob BORADALE of Middletown. Baptism 7 Oct 1720 of Margaret, daughter of Francis DICKINSON, of the Abbey Burial 12 May 1721 of Elizabeth, daughter of Henry DICKINSON of Endside Burial 12 June 1721 of Anthony BORADALE of Whitehaven Baptism 18 Aug 1721 of Thomas, son of William DICKINSON of Coal Grove Bank Baptism 6 Apr 1722 of Hester, daughter of Henry DICKINSON of Endside Marriage 29 Apr 1722 of Peter FISHER and Elizabeth BROWNRIGG, by banns Baptism 14 June 1724 of Anne, daughter of Francis DICKENSON of the Abbey Marriage 20 Aug 1724 of Thomas TROUTBECK and Elizabeth BORADALE, by banns Burial 13 Sept 1724 of Margaret, daughter of Francis DICKINSON of the Abbey (4 years old) Marriage 26 Mar 1733 of George RICHARDSON of Whitehaven to Anne HAYTON of St. Bees Marriage 9 Feb 1728 of George PONSONBY and Mary Ann BORROWDALE (banns). ..........jumping now to mid 1700's...... Burial of William DICKINSON, of Upper Couldorton, Yeoman, 21 Sept. 1766 Marriage of Nicholas DICKINSON, yeoman, and Mary YOUNG, spinster of Upper Couldorton, by banns, 7 Apr 1766 Baptism 3 Dec 1766 of William, son of Nicholas DICKINSON of Rothersike Marriage 31 Dec 1767 of Charles HAMES and Mary HAYTON, spinster, both of Whitehaven, by banns ----------------- Cheers.......Heather looking for that elusive John BOWNESS, married to Mary ALLANBY in Flimby in 1764, but lived and died (1787) in Whitehaven.

Does anyone by chance have a list of the Vicars of Whicham for the 1600 & 1700s? I have two: Rev. William Tubman who d. in 1620 (1592-1620 Rector of W) and his son the Rev. John Tubman who lived 1597-1680 and (1620-1680 Rector of W). Ann Brownrigg

Jennifer (<jtinnion>) wrote: >I wonder if anyone has the 1861 or 1871 census index for >Whitehaven and could do me a lookup, please. I am >trying to find my husband's 2x great grandparents, >Robert and Isabella Cooper. A son, William, was >born in 1856 and they were living at 73 George Street then. Sorry that you haven't had any replies to this. I guess it may be that the task could turn out to be quite a difficult one. Though it is possible to get some transcripts or/and indexes for the 1841, 1861 and 1871 Census, you can't as a general rule of thumb (yet). Maybe people could post details of anything for the area that is available - on or off line. I don't know what the situation is for Whitehaven, but your request probably will entail someone looking at the actual Census returns, rather than at any index - and in a largish town like Whitehaven that can be very time-consuming (if George Street turns out not to be the right address). If you don't get any offer to do the lookup, a solution (assuming that you are able to visit an LDS, which may not be an option for you) is to order the film at your local LDS. The Whitehaven 1861 Census (unlike the 1871) is all on one LDS film - 0543211 - so it would be quite easy to order and use. There can be very big advantages to doing the research yourself, rather than relying on a lookup. It gives you an idea of what the neighbourhood is like. Quite often you spot a relative or a familiar name elsewhere in the street. And after searching for two hours through illegible handwriting, on a bad quality microfilm, on a nasty little machine that's not much bigger than your head (that's unfair to the LDS, who have good quality machines - I had a momentary flit to the London Family History Centre, where I'll probably be tomorrow), you do get a great sense of achievement! Of course, probably someone will now post to say that 1871 Whitehaven is all transcribed and available .... oh well! Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net

It was suggested that I contact Michael Moon, Bookseller in Whitehaven. I did and got a rather strange response -- in summary, there is a demand for the book (however small) but the solicitors have withdrawn it from sale. Mr. Moon states: The book is complelely unavavailable. The Solicitor who handled the late authors affairs will not even reply to our letters or phone calls. We would have made an offer for all ( upto a thousand copies) existing unsold stock, and I presume he knows where the stock is, if there still is any? I have tried several times and given up..which is not I would suspect what the author wanted in the first place. Because it was self published, the author gave very little trade discount ane then added carriage costs which made it an uneconomic book to stock. Sad but there you have it. I have seen one copy since the author died which we sold for £25.00. Cordially, Michael Moon _____________________ Tim Anderson Gaithersburg, Maryland ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rod Neep" <rod@neep.demon.co.uk> To: <ENG-CUL-COPELAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 8:22 PM Subject: Re: [CUL-COP] "Cumbria, Slavery, and the Textile Industrial Revolution," A. N. Rigg, Penrith,1994 > In article <5.1.1.6.2.20021125093750.00a057d0@postoffice.trump.net.au>, > Robert Tanner <rtanner@trump.net.au> writes > >How about getting Rod Neep interested? > > > >http://www.rod-neep.co.uk/ > > > >Regards, > >Robert. > > I'm listening ;-) > It is obviously a book which is out of print but still in copyright. > Given the necessary permissions, then I could do it if enough people > were interested. > > Regards > Rod > > > > > >At 04:35 PM 24-11-02, you wrote: > >>Ann -- > >>Thanks, I read it from cover to cover yesterday and then sent it > >>back (I had it on interlibrary loan from Harvard). I found this > >>book by Rev. A. Neville Rigg to be extremely well researched. He > >>cites primary sources as well as such things as unpublished Ph.D. > >>dissertations. There are page after page of names and dates. I > >>would think that someone (or group) interested in Cumbrian genealogy > >>might want to consider making a reprint of this book (with whatever > >>arrangements are appropriate with the author and his solicitors). > >>I have found an email address for Michael Moon and will make an > >>inquiry there. > >>Tim > >>----- Original Message ----- > >>From: "Ann Brownrigg" <rmbcgg@racsa.co.cr> > >>To: <ENG-CUL-COPELAND-L@rootsweb.com> > >>Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 12:51 AM > >>Subject: [CUL-COP] "Cumbria, Slavery, and the Textile Industrial > >>Revolution," A. N. Rigg, Penrith,1994 > >> > >> > >> > A kind friend skimmed through this at the BL. It is a strange > >>book: no > >> > publisher, just the address 'Hewitson and Harker, Kirkby Stephen, > >>solicitors > >> > acting for Rev. A.N Rigg'. If anyone wants to obtain a copy and if > >>the > >> > solicitors are not forthcoming, it was suggested that they try > >>Michael Moon > >> > of Whitehaven, an antiquarian bookseller specialising in Cumbrian > >>local > >> > history. > >> > > >> > >> > >>============================== > >>To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, > >>go to: > >>http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > > > >Robert Tanner In Aus, phone (03) 6231 0794 > >PO Box 539 From OS, phone +61 3 6231 0794 > >North Hobart > >Tasmania 7002 rtanner@trump.net.au > >Australia > > > >http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~robtan/home.html > > > > > > > >============================== > >To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > >http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > > > > -- > > ARCHIVE CD BOOKS - > A project to reproduce old books on CD for genealogists > and pay for the restoration of books in Record Offices, Libraries, etc. > Mailing list : CDBOOKS-L@rootsweb.com (for discussions) > Weekly News : CDBOOKS-NEWS-L@rootsweb.com (weekly announcements & news) > E-mail : enquiries@archivecdbooks.org > Web : http://www.archivecdbooks.org >

Hi Carol...... I was over at the FHC today and I searched in vain for your Robert Perie. He definitely is not in the St. Bees/St. Nicholas BT's for the date you mention. I checked about 5 years on each side of that date and no Peries. But for the rest of the List.......when I get time to type them out, I found all sorts of names on that film that I see on here. Some from circa 1700 and others around the 1766 date that Carol was looking for. How come I can't remember what I ate for lunch......but when it comes to genealogy and names.......I never forget one......grin!! Nope.....didn't find any hint of my John Bowness on there either. He has to be from Planet Zarg like Malcolm's Borrowdales.......... YO, Malcolm......found lots of Boradales. They belong to you??? Cheers.....Heather > Hello list, > > I am looking for a kind soul who might give me some help. I thought I would > try this list for a change as opposed to the cumberland list. A kind lady on > the Cumberland list found this for me: > > ROBERT PERIE. born 23.10.1766, St Nicholas, Whitehaven, Cumberland. Son of > Mary Perie > > Does anyone have access to the parish records from St Nicholas and perhaps > look this entry up to see what other information might be had. It doesnt > sound as if the father was put in the record. Any help greatly appreciated. > Thank you > > Carol/NZ > > > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 >

A true and perfect inventory of the goods and Chattels of John Simpson who died on board of his Majesties Ship the Lyon on the 6th of Jan:ry Anno Dom: 172? appraized by John Willson of Whitehaven Mariner and James Ismay of Corkikle farmer the 10th day of March Anno Dom: 1728/9 his Purse and Apparel valud to £3:00:00 his Wages in such Service from 3rd of Apr:l 1727 to 6th of January 1727/8 valud to £10:17:16 sum of £13:17:6 John Willson James Ismay his mark Quite interesting in that it gives you an exact wage rate per day, if you want to calculate it. And rather unusual to describe someone as farmer rather than yeoman or husbandman. James Ismay's mark is a V with an additional downstroke. I'm always intrigued as to whether these human marks are the same as the smit marks on farm animals. Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net

Lanc: Branthat of Whitehaven, 1695 A 12th part of the Ship Orange 10:00:00 A 16th part of the Ship Rubie 50:00:00 Jane Branthwaite of Whitehaven, widow 1702 A Sixteenth part of the Ship Rubie 30:00:00 A Sixteenth part & a two & thirtieth part of the ship Charity 40:00:00 A two & thritieth part of the 20:00:00 Ship Isabel Daniel Branthwaite of Whitehaven, 1705 A Sixteenth of the Ruby 12:00:00 A Sixteenth of the Europe 12:00:00 A Sixteenth of the Loyalty 10:00:00 A Two & Thirtieth of the Isabel 5:00:00 Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net