Hmm, I'm not sure that I have a great deal of sympathy for the sheep rustlers and worse of the Debateable Lands; but then, I have no Armstrongs or Grahams in my ancestry. All my Cumbrian lot were down south round the Cockermouth area, and probably found that sort of raucous entertainment very disconcerting! I have, anyway, just discovered another reason for voting for Manchester - go to the website image of the bahs and press your mouse and you can twirl them round and round (Brackenhill is just still shots)! http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/programmes/restoration/gallery/brackenhill_gallery.shtml http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/programmes/restoration/gallery/victoria_gallery.shtml Chris (I've just noticed the bahs, but thought it too good to correct. Guess that's what happens when Armstrongs swirl sheep round and round)