Hesket in the Forest - 9th June 1831 A man unknown, found hanged in a plantation near Baxter`s Cottage - About 30

Hesket in the Forest - 4th July 1822 Mary Harvey, a soldier`s wife, killed by the overturning of the baggage cart - aged 39

Hesket in the Forest - 16th July 1821 A woman travelling north, and found at Nether Hesket in a stupor - About 50

Dear Listers I have been on the list for a couple of weeks but after logging on had a family member rushed into ICU. So I have not been able to keep up even with reading mail. Been searching for a CHRISTOPHER BELL born Burgh By Sands 1796. Wife MARY CLARK... they had three sons born Holm Cultram WILLIAM (b. 1819) JOHN (b. 1822) (Gr. Gr. Grandfather) and PATTINSON (b.1824) Unfortunately cannot find CHRISTOPHER (husbandman)- seems he left cumberland by the 51 Census. No luck finding his death. Found JOHN and PATTINSON in Lancs. John later moved to Gateshead. No luck with William. From what I have found Christopher was born to parents CHRISTOPHER BELL and JANE PATTINSON other siblings include MARTHA (b. 1780), MARY(b. 1781), JANE(b. 1786), JOHN (b. 1788), and SARAH (b.1792) All born in Burgh By Sands. Do these names ring any Bell's ? Sarah (Ont. Can)

Jennett or Jane Grave married William Brownrigg of Millbeck(1577-1658) on June 2, 1611, P. of Crosthwaite. Her second husband was Robert Bankes of Workington, yeoman.

Hi Everybody, While searching for my 4x great grandparents in the Hesket in the Forest registers, I came across the marriage of John Nicholson and Margaret Irving who are the prime candidates. Their marriage entry states "John Nicholson of Sewell Houses in this Parish a Minor & Margaret Irving of Low Hesket in the said Parish Single Woman were married in this Church by Banns, with consent of Parents, this eleventh day of February in the year of our Lord One thousand eight hundred & two, by me ------------------ Wm. Kirkbride Minister." The entry states that John Nicholson was a "Minor", can anyone tell me how old he would have been to be classed as a "minor". I can assure you it is not a misspelling for Miner! Regards, Bryan

Whilst searching the St Mary's Parish Registry Records today I came across this rather unusual and very sad baptism entry. St Mary's Parish Registry Baptisms 1830 April 16 Mary Gate, found March 31st 1830 in Caldewgate apparently about six months old. Malcolm Hills http://www.county-surnames.co.uk/index.mv Local Research undertaken - very reasonable rates - reply off-list for details

Made a slight mistake here which won't please some. It was the BI ship "Uganda" which was requisitioned for the Falklands War, not "Nevasa". "Nevasa" was the last ship I sailed on as an employee of the company so had a special place in my affections especially since I stood by her during her conversion from a troopship in Falmouth Docks. My husband served on "Uganda" when she was a passenger ship on the London-East India run just before she was converted to a school ship. No Cumbrian ports were used by these ships but I'm sure we had the pleasure of taking Cumbrian schoolchildren on board so it may bring back happy memories for some of a bygone era. Jill

Thanks Jill and others who told me about the memorial on Tower Hill - I hadn't known anything about it. And the website about the merchant navy is brilliant - a timely reminder of how many lost their lives at sea. Cheers Bridget On 12/11/02 6:18 am, "John & Jill Coulthard" <jjcoulthard@btinternet.com> wrote: > The official UK and Commonwealth Merchant Navy and Fishing Fleet War > Memorial is on Tower Hill in London. It is dedicated to "the men of the > Merchant Navy and Fishing Fleets who gave their lives to preserve the nation > and who have no grave but the sea". It was extended after WWII from that > commemorating the Mercantile Marine as the service was known at the time of > WWI during which your great-grandfather died. A picture of it can be seen > on Commonwealth War Graves site at > > http://www.cwgc.org/lit/towerhill.pdf > > I found this website which might be of interest to you in recording the > contribution, loss of life and ships, etc. of this service at > > http://www.british-merchant-navy.co.uk/ >

That brings back memories...I sailed on Uganda on those very school trips. what an education!! I am told I also sailed on her as a baby coming home from Kenya in the 1960's. Mandy

Dear Bridget and List Having had myself, husband, his grandfather and very many friends in the Merchant Navy I was glad that you brought up the subject of the memorials to those who died at sea whilst assisting the armed services by carrying troops and much needed supplies in wartime. Merchant ships can be commandeered at any time by the Government in a case of Emergency as were the cruise ship "QE2", school ship "Nevasa" amongst several others during the Falklands War and their civilian officers and crew go with them. We are all very proud of belonging to this service and tradition. The official UK and Commonwealth Merchant Navy and Fishing Fleet War Memorial is on Tower Hill in London. It is dedicated to "the men of the Merchant Navy and Fishing Fleets who gave their lives to preserve the nation and who have no grave but the sea". It was extended after WWII from that commemorating the Mercantile Marine as the service was known at the time of WWI during which your great-grandfather died. A picture of it can be seen on Commonwealth War Graves site at http://www.cwgc.org/lit/towerhill.pdf I found this website which might be of interest to you in recording the contribution, loss of life and ships, etc. of this service at http://www.british-merchant-navy.co.uk/ The major Merchant Navy ports have most likely their own memorials. Southampton has dedicated the bombed church of Holyrood to this effect. A new memorial has recently been dedicated in Liverpool to the MN dead of both World Wars. A picture is at http://www.ku.edu/~kansite/ww_one/naval/mnmemliv.htm Seafaring towns around the coast have their own personal memorials. St. James, Grimsby is one I know of whilst Aberdaron in Wales has its War Memorial almost exclusively dedicated to men of this service. In fact we make a point of looking out for them to reassure ourselves that these men and women have not been forgotten. We rightly pay tribute to our armed services but these men and women made a massive contribution and are quite often unsung. Can anyone add anything further to this? Jill

Dear Gerald, I wonder if the following will help. I looked up 1881 census and found John Bigrigg born Cockermouth and Mary Ann born Cornwall. You said their son William was born the same year. Free BMDs. Found a marriage in September Quarter 1880 in Cockermouth Registration District. The female names on the same page were Elizabeth Glaister and Martha Madron or Madrom. Looked at 1901 census index and found John Bigrigg straight away living in Cockermouth as a Mason Labourer. His age corresponded to that of 1881 census. I brought up all the Bigriggs living in Cockermouth and from the Page ID (obtained as I was told by hovering over the far left column next to the name and reading off the bottom task bar). I am not 100% sure how all this works but the same Page ID brought up Martha aged 44 born Cumberland, Egremont Jonathan 17 Margaret 7 George 4 Florence 2 Mary 2 mths Does this sound like your family or part of it? If you think so then no doubt you could check by downloading the page. Looked IGI baptisms for a Martha Madrom or Madron around 1857. Madrom is obviously a misspelling. Madron also brought up Maddern and all found by IGI were in Cornwall. Getting warmer. There was a Martha baptised 1854 at Sancreed daughter of James and Mary which was the closest. Back to 1881 census to see if a James or Mary, the parents, were in Cumberland but I could not find them. There were quite a few MADDIRN and MADDERN all born Cornwall in Cumberland at that time. One was a JAMES MADDON, born c. 1857 in St. Just (the St. Just near Lands End is about four miles from Sancreed) , Iron Miner boarding in Egremont. I wondered if he could be a brother? This might give you something to look into. My own feeling is that there is a mixture between the two lots of census information. The correct name should be Martha and her birthplace might either have been Cornwall as in 1881 census or Egremont as in 1901 census. The family may have come to Egremont when she was a small child for her father to work in the Iron Mines there. I hope this helps and please let us know how you get on with your search. Jill

Since Chris suggested remembering our relatives killed in action, a mention of my Great Grandfather, Frederick Kidd. Not a Cumbrian , though his children grew up in Cumbria. Fred was born in Skipton, Yorkshire in 1869 and was a commercial traveller in cotton reels. He was married to Nancy Billinge, but they had a stormy relationship; when Fred joined a volunteer regiment and took off to fight in the Boer War, Nancy took a job as teacher at Longtown school, and brought up her three sons on her own. Fred did not return to his family until war broke out again in 1914. He then joined the merchant Navy and died when his ship the Stuart Prince was torpedoed in March 1917. Does anyone know if there is any memorial to those who died in the merchant service in the First World War? Bridget

----- Original Message ----- From: "pauline.stanley1" <pauline.stanley1@ntlworld.com> To: "Chris Dickinson" <chris@dickinson.uk.net> Sent: 10 November 2002 19:32 Subject: Tenant/owner Hi listers Many thanks to you Chris, for your E mail which advised me to look at the Tithe Apportionment Book for the year 1840,this was done with the help of Barry Lawman It proved in this case that the census was correct my grandparent did own land, be it ever so small The book and with the help of the tithe map showed the piece of land lay on the right hand side of the road leaving Hethersgill towards Syke Head, the property was shown on the map H24 call The Backside of the Know, without your advise I would not ever have known of these books and perhaps this knowledge will help other members in their research. Armed with this knowledge I then move to the fact that between 1871-81 the Turner's seemed to have sold the land in favour of an annuity allowing my Gt Gt Grandmother to work and live on the land until her death in 1907. Would I find the change of ownership in the Tithe apportionment books for the years 1871-1881? Many thanks for any more advise you could pass on to me Regards Pauline Chris I have tried to send this to the list but twice it failed sorry to send it to you perhaps you could pass it on to the list on my behalf

Hi Everyone I am having problems tracing the maiden name for the wife of John Bigrigg born 1851 in Cockermouth (son of Jonathon Bigrigg and Sarah Sherlock) In the 1881 census John Bigrigg was lodging in Ulverston with a Mawson family and his wife Mary Ann was staying in Cockermouth with Rose Watt. I think that she may have been pregnant at the time as a son William was born the same year. William and his brother Jonathon's births appear not to have been registered. In the 1901 census they are not traceable unless some strange spelling has been used. John was alive in 1909. Mary Ann may have been born in Cornwall or have had parents born there as her father may have been an Iron Ore miner but I have no concrete evidence to support this. Please can anyone help to solve this one? I am also researching the following Sandwith esp 1600 and 1700,s, Dodd, Law Graham and Vickers in Cumberland _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

Hi Folks....... I was just composing a post with regard to Chris' BBC statements on the subject of the order of children when a friend of mine who also does transcribing for a Jamaican site sent me this for the Cumberland researchers. It just goes to point out that the younger sons did EXTREMELY well in some instances.....pardon the HTML, but wanted to present it as Dorothy Kew did when she sent it to me........ Dorothy is an excellent genealogist who taught me what genealogy was all about and I know that she has interests in a Sewell in the CUL region, but so far hasn't found them. So enjoy and in particular......notice how many properties this man owned!!! (Pens are smaller estates). And Chris.....for the record, the BBC never met my family, grin........we don't fit into their classifications at all!! I am the oldest.....and have never been the quiet one, lol. Best..........Heather ---------------------------------------- >From the Daily Gleaner and DeCordova's Advertising Sheet, October 15, 1872: THE LATE WILLIAM SEWELL There are few to whom Trelawny has been more largely indebted than to the lamented gentleman whose decease we deplore. Large districts of the parish have undoubtedly, through his instrumentality alone, been maintained in cultivation. It is indeed no exaggeration to say, that most, if not all, of the numerous estates with which as attorney, lessee, or proprietor, he from time to time became connected, were by his skilful management, to the benefit of all classes, redeemed from threatened abandonment. The large measure of success which has attended his career as a sugar planter, a career in this parish extending over a period of thirty-four years, has been the well-merited result of the exercise of the soundest judgment ... and unswerving rectitude which characterized his every dealing... Mr. Sewell died possessed of Vale Royal, Arcadia, Lottery, Water Valley, and Gibraltar Estates, and Grange Pen, in Trelawny; Drax Hall and Cave Valley Estates, and Home Castle, Dornock, Hyde Park, and Dover Castle Penns, in St. Ann; all left by him in the highest state of cultivation. He was a native of Cumberland, but from his 21st year was a resident in Jamaica, engaged from first to last in agricultural pursuits. He died at Georgia Estate in this parish, the residence of Simon Thomson, Esquire, and was interred in Swanswick Church yard on the morning of the 8th. DQ

Hi everyone, Have a link for you all it is the London Gazettes homepage and they have online gazettes published during both World Wars. The pages are many but if you go to the archive section you can do searches of the wars and honours and awards given. It lists all services and gives details of soldiers rank etc. Hope it is of use. http://www.gazettes-online.co.uk/index.asp?webType=0 regards Maxine --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.417 / Virus Database: 233 - Release Date: 08/11/2002

Been passed this address - http://www.ww2roll.gov.au put in the surname and see if any of your were in the Australian forces - at a first try out I have found a couple of J Grahams from Carlisle serving - gives their date of birth and next of kin. Good luck Lynne

A recent BBC programme has suggested that: (1) If you put two siblings in a room alone with their mother, the younger child will seek attention by being disruptive and the older child will seek attention by being non-disruptive; (2) this behaviour is continued into adult life; (3) many of the great innovators of history have been younger children. [presumably, middle children are disruptive in one environment and non-disruptive in another, and throughly unpredictable when all siblings are present?] The traditional historical argument is that younger sons of well-to-do families emigrated or started businesses because the older ones inherited - but could it be more to do with personality? What about the youngest daughter? She should be rebellious, but was often the one who had to remain at home to look after the ageing parents. Personality turmoil? So, what evidence do you have from your Cumbrian researches? Onlist, not to me privately, please. Chris chris@dickinson.uk.net

Answered via email coz Chris scares me........ Only kidding, folks. He is really a 'pussycat' under that stern Listowner disguise......(VBG) Heather > My Norton Anti virus will not allow me to open any of my family tree > subscribsion lists. > Is this normal ? or is there a problem with the lists ? > Please advise. > Sue > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <ENG-CUL-CARLISLE-D-request@rootsweb.com> > To: <ENG-CUL-CARLISLE-D@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 3:00 AM > Subject: ENG-CUL-CARLISLE-D Digest V02 #50 > > > > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >