The Posse Comitatus didn't quite include all males over 16. It was males eligible for military service, so it excluded those over 60, & those who were already in the army, navy, or militia. It also included anyone (male, female, any age) who had transport (draught or riding animals, carts, etc) which might be pressed into service. It's useful. I've found the occupations of several ancestors from it, & indications of the wealth of some through their possession of horses, waggons, etc. But absence from it doesn't mean much. I wholeheartedly agree with the rest of your advice. Access to Archives (put A2A into Google.co.uk & restrict it to UK sites) is also handy. It's an index of documents in public archives, such as court records. One such record, of a removal case, turned up a wealth of information - where an ancestor lived at various times over the previous 30 years, his employers, his sons & their wives, which of them were in the army, which regiment, when joined . . . . Even the index itself yields lots of useful stuff. And don't despise search engines. Paul > > From: Sandra J Smith <[email protected]> > Date: 2004/10/28 Thu AM 11:36:07 GMT > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [ENG-BUCK] Where else can I look? > > In the case of Buckinghamshire - use the Posse Comitatus - almost the > equivalent of a simple late 18th century census, listing all males over 16. > Sandra > ----------------------------------------- Email provided by http://www.ntlhome.com/

Hi Edgar and Peter, You cant beat looking at the actual records - or at least microfilm copies of the same. Don't rely on the IGI - there are some glaring errors and omissions, even from their extraction program of parish registers. Winslow registers I seem to remember are very difficult to read prior to 1813. I dont know whether any of the local societies have attempted to transcribe them. One thing to bear in mind is that families did move around between villages. Get hold of a good map (or use Parloc) to identify villages in the surrounding area. Start with a five mile radius and then start searching each one. Use Hugh Wallis's site to access the different parish registers on the IGI - this will at least give you a clue as to whether the family name is in that parish. Use something like the National Burial INdex to see where deaths of people of the same surname (possible parents?) are occuring. Reconstruct small family trees for ones you find who might be related. In the case of Buckinghamshire - use the Posse Comitatus - almost the equivalent of a simple late 18th century census, listing all males over 16. Were your people tradesmen? Trade directories might help although I am not sure what is available for Bucks at this time. Did anyone of the family name leave a will? Sometimes a grandparent could mention a grandchild or an uncle mention a favourite nephew. And you dint have to be a wealthy person to make a will. Just a few pointers - hope it helps Sandra Peter Nelms wrote: > I've got the same problem, Edgar. > > I have got back to John ELMS of Shabbington, Bucks who died in 1774 > but I cannot find anything of his birth or earlier. > > I'll be interested to see what advice you get. Regards, > > Peter J. Nelms > Canberra, Australia > > [email protected] > OFHS Member # 4540 > Researching NELMS / NELMES of Oxon (Great Haseley, Great Milton), > Bucks (Ickford, Shabbington) & Australia (Brisbane, Queensland). > Other surnames: RADBONE, LOVEGROVE, DINGLE, NORTH, HUDSON, CLAYDON, > WISE, KING, BOX > > http://Peter_Nelms.tripod.com/Family_History.html > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> From: Edgar Cross <[email protected]> >> Reply-To: [email protected] >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: [ENG-BUCK] Where else can I look? >> Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2004 06:20:58 -0700 (PDT) >> >> I've had a hard time finding information on my >> ancestors before 1800. I know that my ggg-grandfather >> George CROSS was born in Winslow, Bucks in 1796 to >> George CROSS and Zillah EAGLETON. I also know that >> George Sr. was born about 1767 in Winslow. >> >> I ordered a search of the parish records for BUCKS but >> the Burial database is missing the period after 1716 >> and the Birth database ends in 1745. >> >> I don't know where else to look. Can someone please >> offer some other suggestions? >> >> Thanks all. >> >> Edgar Cross > > > > > ============================== > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237 > >

I've got the same problem, Edgar. I have got back to John ELMS of Shabbington, Bucks who died in 1774 but I cannot find anything of his birth or earlier. I'll be interested to see what advice you get. Regards, Peter J. Nelms Canberra, Australia [email protected] OFHS Member # 4540 Researching NELMS / NELMES of Oxon (Great Haseley, Great Milton), Bucks (Ickford, Shabbington) & Australia (Brisbane, Queensland). Other surnames: RADBONE, LOVEGROVE, DINGLE, NORTH, HUDSON, CLAYDON, WISE, KING, BOX http://Peter_Nelms.tripod.com/Family_History.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >From: Edgar Cross <[email protected]> >Reply-To: [email protected] >To: [email protected] >Subject: [ENG-BUCK] Where else can I look? >Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2004 06:20:58 -0700 (PDT) > >I've had a hard time finding information on my >ancestors before 1800. I know that my ggg-grandfather >George CROSS was born in Winslow, Bucks in 1796 to >George CROSS and Zillah EAGLETON. I also know that >George Sr. was born about 1767 in Winslow. > >I ordered a search of the parish records for BUCKS but >the Burial database is missing the period after 1716 >and the Birth database ends in 1745. > >I don't know where else to look. Can someone please >offer some other suggestions? > >Thanks all. > >Edgar Cross

Could SKS look up Thomas RUSSELL and his wife Maria (formerly HENDRY). I Thomas was born in 1785 so he would be about 66 years old. He was probably living in London. Thank you, Edgar Cross ===== Edgar H Cross View My Genealogy Research and Guide at http://www.ehcross.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Hello list, Thanks to Wendy and Carol for your help. Lesley

I've had a hard time finding information on my ancestors before 1800. I know that my ggg-grandfather George CROSS was born in Winslow, Bucks in 1796 to George CROSS and Zillah EAGLETON. I also know that George Sr. was born about 1767 in Winslow. I ordered a search of the parish records for BUCKS but the Burial database is missing the period after 1716 and the Birth database ends in 1745. I don't know where else to look. Can someone please offer some other suggestions? Thanks all. Edgar Cross ===== Edgar H Cross View My Genealogy Research and Guide at http://www.ehcross.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Hi Hope this helps THOMAS BUNCE christened 10 feb 1850 HALTON father THOMAS mother ELIZABETH A thomas bunce married a elizabeth no maiden name 28 dec 1847 halton also found THOMAS BUNCE burial 7 sept 1830 age 81 which matches HALTON ST MICHEALS AND ALL ANGELS COUNTY BKM sorry couldnt find anything for a marriage best wishes wendy. ----- Original Message ----- From: "keith BLACKLAWS" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 8:33 PM Subject: [ENG-BUCK] Bunce > Hello list, > > I am looking for the birth around 130 to 1750, of Thomas Bunce possible in Halton in Bucks. If possible, I am also looking for a marriage and a death for Thomas. > > Thanks > > > Lesley Blacklaws (nee Bunce) > > > > > ============================== > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237 >

Hello list, I am looking for the birth around 130 to 1750, of Thomas Bunce possible in Halton in Bucks. If possible, I am also looking for a marriage and a death for Thomas. Thanks Lesley Blacklaws (nee Bunce)

Hi Lesley, I came across Bunces in Padbury when I was researching Swannells. I know it's an unusual name. Carol -----Original Message----- From: keith BLACKLAWS [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 2:33 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [ENG-BUCK] Bunce Hello list, I am looking for the birth around 130 to 1750, of Thomas Bunce possible in Halton in Bucks. If possible, I am also looking for a marriage and a death for Thomas. Thanks Lesley Blacklaws (nee Bunce) ============================== Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237

I am collecting references to the sizes of yardlands and acres in different parishes in Buckinghamshire. If anyone knows of any source for the size of the local yardland or acre in any parish or township or manor in the county I would be very grateful for details of it. And since the size of the local acre itself depended on the length of the rod/pole/perch used to measure land in that place, any information on those would also be received with gratitude. Some explanation of what I mean by the local yardland, acre and rod/pole/perch might be useful. YARDLAND: in the late middle ages, and in some places well into the modern period, the standard landholding unit was the yardland, also known as the virgate. Its size varied from place to place. It could be as little as 10 acres, or as big as 80 acres or more, though 25-30 acres was probably the most typical size. However all the yardlands in any given manor were always the same size - the variation was only between the yardlands of different manors or parishes. Quite often old records will mention the size of the local yardland - it is references of this sort that I am hoping to hear about. ACRE, and ROD/POLE/PERCH: again, the size of the acre varied from place to place. A measured acre was always an area 4 rods wide and 40 rods long, but the length of a rod (also called a pole or perch) varied throughout England. The most common length was the statutory one of 16 and a half feet (which is the one we use today), but in many places shorter or longer rods were in use, and these resulted in smaller or bigger acres. Common lengths for local or customary rods were 16 feet (which gave a customary acre equal to only 0.94 of a modern acre), 18, 20, 22 and 24 feet (respectively 1.19, 1.47, 1.78 and 2.12 modern acres). Old records almost never stated explicitly how long the local customary rod/pole/perch was, but they did sometimes give the area of the same piece of land in both statutory and local acres - which makes it possible to work out the ratio. If anyone knows of any such document I'd be very pleased to be told about it. Thank you, Matt Tompkins Blaston, Leics

Hi Julia, I have a booklet entitled "Old Aylesbury" which is mainly old black and white photographs. There are two which may be of interest to you and I could try and scan them for you if need be. The first has the caption: " Bakers-Lane Chapel, the first Baptist meeting place in the town, built in 1733 in Bakers Lane, now Cambridge Street, on a site behind the row of shops next to the Odeon cinema. It was subsequently occupied by other denominations, including the Plymouth Brethren, and was demolished in 1938. The second: Seventeenth and eighteenth-century cottages on Rickfords Hill opposite The Friarage with the brewery in the background, photographed before 1895. Part of the "Saracen's Head" can be seen on the left with its original brick front. Next to it is the entrance to Quakers' meeting house and beyond are two cottages which have been completely refronted. If there are other places of interest in Aylesbury which you would like me to check, I am happy to do so. Regards, Bev, Sydney (Aust) Julia Crawley <[email protected]> wrote: Dear Listers In a journal which belonged to my g-g grandmother, Grace Cockburn-Campbell [nee Spence] there is a very pretty watercolour of the above's cottage with a building either side. The caption underneath reads - "Old Meeting Room, Hannah Griffin's Cottage, New Meeting Room. Kingswood near Aylesbury, Buckinghamshire. Sept. 1860". There is no clue as to who painted it but it may well have been Grace as the writing is similar to hers. Grace was from a Quaker family, and born in Birstwith,Yorkshire. Her husband was one of the founders of the Plymouth Brethren. If there is anyone who would like a copy, please email me and if there is anyone who could give me further details about the buildings I would be delighted. Regards, Julia Western Australia ============================== Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237 --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.

Dear Listers In a journal which belonged to my g-g grandmother, Grace Cockburn-Campbell [nee Spence] there is a very pretty watercolour of the above's cottage with a building either side. The caption underneath reads - "Old Meeting Room, Hannah Griffin's Cottage, New Meeting Room. Kingswood near Aylesbury, Buckinghamshire. Sept. 1860". There is no clue as to who painted it but it may well have been Grace as the writing is similar to hers. Grace was from a Quaker family, and born in Birstwith,Yorkshire. Her husband was one of the founders of the Plymouth Brethren. If there is anyone who would like a copy, please email me and if there is anyone who could give me further details about the buildings I would be delighted. Regards, Julia Western Australia

I have been give copies of these books (bound digests of the monthly magazine, I presume). They do contain some church records for those years (baptisms, marriages, burials) if anyone is interested. Heatha

Thanks very much, Paul, for sharing another great resource. I also found someone who, in 1871, got 14 days for being drunk and riotous. He was aged 30 though. You've also given me another puzzle though, because I didn't have him before. Peter J. Nelms Canberra, Australia [email protected] OFHS Member # 4540 Researching NELMS / NELMES of Oxon (Great Haseley, Great Milton), Bucks (Ickford, Shabbington) & Australia (Brisbane, Queensland). Other surnames: RADBONE, LOVEGROVE, DINGLE, NORTH, HUDSON, CLAYDON, WISE, KING, BOX http://Peter_Nelms.tripod.com/Family_History.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >From: Paul Irving <[email protected]> >Reply-To: [email protected] >To: [email protected] >Subject: [ENG-BUCK] Aylesbury 1870s prisoners database >Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2004 20:25:23 +0100 > >Prisoners admitted to Aylesbury Gaol in the 1870s. May be interesting to >some people. I've found the brother of an ancestor doing 14 days for "Drunk >and riotous" in 1871, aged 19. Maybe he was celebrating his birthday - he >was sentenced not long afterwards. > >http://www.buckscc.gov.uk/bucks_prisoners/index.htm >

Mark, I wonder if wouldn't mind doing a search for me. I am after John Nelmes of Ickford who went into Aylesbury goal for 14 days on 6 Feb 1871, aged 30. Thanks, Peter J. Nelms Canberra, Australia [email protected] OFHS Member # 4540 Researching NELMS / NELMES of Oxon (Great Haseley, Great Milton), Bucks (Ickford, Shabbington) & Australia (Brisbane, Queensland). Other surnames: RADBONE, LOVEGROVE, DINGLE, NORTH, HUDSON, CLAYDON, WISE, KING, BOX http://Peter_Nelms.tripod.com/Family_History.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >From: "Mark Ware" <[email protected]> >Reply-To: [email protected] >To: [email protected] >Subject: [ENG-BUCK] Look-ups Available >Date: Sat, 25 Sep 2004 13:01:56 +0100 > >I currently have access to the Bucks 1851 & 1891 census and am willing >to do look-ups for anybody that may need them. > >Many thanks >Mark >

Prisoners admitted to Aylesbury Gaol in the 1870s. May be interesting to some people. I've found the brother of an ancestor doing 14 days for "Drunk and riotous" in 1871, aged 19. Maybe he was celebrating his birthday - he was sentenced not long afterwards. http://www.buckscc.gov.uk/bucks_prisoners/index.htm

I would like to exchange information with anyone interested in the COWPER or COUPER families who lived in and around Winslow, Little Horwood and Great Horwood in the 15th and 16th centuries. I have already collected quite a bit about them from the Great Horwood records (mostly the manor court rolls), but the families seem to have moved back and forth between Great Horwood, Winslow (including Shipton) and Little Horwood, so I am hoping that someone else will have collected similar information from the other two parishes. In particular I am hoping to find someone who has notes of the wills at Herts RO, dating from 1437, 1481, 1484, 1488 and 1521, relating to Cowpers of Winslow, Shipton and Little Horwood - but any other information from the 15th or 16th centuries would be very useful. In return I'd be happy to supply all the information I have collected from the Great Horwood records. Regards, Matt Tompkins Blaston, Leics

Sandra mentioned the "blocked mail" at the ENG-BUCKINGHAMSHIRE admin pages, and Matt said: > Interesting - on Tuesday morning I sent an email to > ENG-Bucknghamshire-L-request from my university address trying to subscribe to the list from that > address. I was wondering why I hadn't heard anything back yet. Is there some > kind of bottleneck at rootsweb? Don't panic ;-) No, no problems at all. The "blocked mail" to which Sandra (herself a list admin) referred is a page each list admin has where undesirable mail collects for review prior to being junked. Just occasionally the tweaking lets real posts arrive there and languish, but only rarely. You have the privileged position of being the owner of the only "real" message I've ever had in "blocked mail" on this list - and I can't see why you've been so honoured ;-) Let me know offlist which address you'd like subscribed! Wendy List Admin [email protected] <[email protected]>

Interesting - on Tuesday morning I sent an email to ENG-Bucknghamshire-L-request from my university address trying to subscribe to the list from that address. I was wondering why I hadn't heard anything back yet. Is there some kind of bottleneck at rootsweb? Matt Tompkins

I have sent several messages to [email protected] To unsubscribe but nothing has happened. I suspect that my emails are sitting in the BLOCKED MAIL at the admin pages. I am going away and do not want my mailbox to overflow. Bright Blessings Sandra ~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~* www.visionsplendid.homestead.com/familynames.html MSN Messenger - Fedelmar ICQ - Fedelmar (201309494) ~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~* Knowledge speaks and wisdom listens!!!! ~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~* -- _______________________________________________ Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pages http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10