Dear Lynne, Mr. Turner-Thomas has suggested Scofield......it is more likely "Scourfield", particularly as William Scourfield's estate (died c. 1622) included "One-fourth part of the manor of Honyborough held of the Prince of Wales as his lordship of Haverfordwest by knight's service, being of the clear annual value of 3s. 4d." as per page 152 of Francis Green's article "Scourfield of New Moat". Somewhere I have another article written about the Scourfields exploding some myths, if I remember ....I shall see if I can find it. Quite often spouse names were omitted in the old pedigrees ..sometimes generations. I'm pretty sure the Reeds trace to Green Castle (Castle Moel) Carmarthen...... and I will have to try and find the notebook I was working in many years ago when I was looking at this family myself. Bettye Kirkwood. Australia. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arthur Turner-Thomas" <arthur.turnerthomas@live.com> To: <dyfed@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2009 4:14 AM Subject: [Dyfed] Batemans of Honeyborough, Pembroke Dear Lynne The entry SGOFEN is extracted the table GWEHYLYTH LLAN LLAWEN found at page 173 of Heraldic Visitations of Wales by Lewys Dwnn. This is the only entry found within his entire work, which may indicate an error of spelling or speech. The surname as indicated may be Scofield. Some of the cymraeg found within Dwnn's work may be local dialect, therefore would be specific either to that area or may be Dwnn's own iaith (language), which has presented some difficulty for those persons whom are strangers of the welsh language, and has confounded numerous genealogists for many years. Amusingly this was a gripe (although tongue in cheek) of the late Peter Bartrum when I met him at the National Library of Wales in 2008, when the subject of Dwnn's work was raised. Irrespective Dwnn's genealogies still represent the backbone of welsh genealogy, a subject I feel which should be discussed in a differing posting. I would suggest further research within this work. Returning to Bartrum's Welsh Genealogies 1400-1500, the entry found within Batman p. 60 for William the spouse is omitted. Which is in line with his policy, if unreliable or no evidence could be found the entry was often omitted. Chwaer literally translated is sister, so Catherine was the sister of Gruffudd Ryd. The Pembrokeshire historian: journal of the Pembrokeshire Local History Society No. 2-1966 Rickeston and Scotsborough does mention: "William ap Rice, the second brother, enjoyed the estates. Described as "de Brydeth, gentleman", he served on a jury in the Great Sessions in 1550-1, and in 1566-68 was escheator for the county. He married, before 1548, Elizabeth daughter and coheiress of Thomas Bateman of Honeyborough, by Catherine Reed his first wife. This was the Thomas Bateman who had married the widowed Alice of Rickeston so that he was step-father as well as father-in-law to the bridegroom." But sheds no light on your query. As an aside Catherine Reed may be of the Reeds of Roche. May I suggest you contact the National Library of Wales, who may provide further information as they are transcribing Bartrum's work. Regards Arthur E Turner-Thomas Genealogist to H.R.H. the Countess of Wessex ............................. From: Lynne Simpson < lsimpson@netspeed.com.au> Subject: [Dyfed] Batemans of Honeyborough, Pembroke Date: Sat, 01 Aug 2009 22:32:10 +1000 References: <mailman.127.1249110022.5938.dyfed@rootsweb.com> In-Reply-To: <mailman.127.1249110022.5938.dyfed@rootsweb.com> Hi to the list I am currently looking at the family and descendants of Jenkin Batman of Honeyborough who was living there in the late 1400s / early 1500s. Jenkin Batman > John > William (m Jane Laugharne of St Bride's) > Philip Batman. Philip Batman of Honeyborough married Jane Wogan (d/o Sir John Wogan and Maude Klement). Philip had the following: Thomas Batman m (1) Jane Wogan, (2) Katrin Ryd (3) Alson Martin with Margaret Ginlytes as a possible mistress John Batman m Sian (Jane) verch John ap David ap Gwilym ap Rys of Lystyn William m SGOFEN of Ros (parents of Hari Batman) This information was taken from a family tree prepared by John Batman in 1591 (provided by Bettye Kirkwood .... thank you!). My question is: who or what is SGOFEN? I can find nothing on the web to indicate that this is a person's name, nor that it is the name of a place. I presume Ros is RHOS near Milford Haven. Delighted to hear from anyone who has any ideas. Cheers Lynne Simpson Canberra Australi _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Messenger: Thanks for 10 great years—enjoy free winks and emoticons. http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/157562755/direct/01/ ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message