Elizabeth, You quote: "Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church Here Lie the remains of THOMAS DEVONALD late Merchant of this city Who was born Near Haverford West Pembrokeshire South Wales Died the 11th day of October 1793 aged 34 years" You then give: "Name: Thomas Devonald Arrival Year: 1794 Arrival Place: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Source Publication Code: 1224.2 Primary Immigrant: Devonald, Thomas Annotation: Date and place of death or date and place of mention in the New World. Extracted from Administration Act Books: PROB 6/76 (1700) to 175 (1799); Probate Act Books: PROB 8/93 (1700) to 192 (1799); and Limited Probate Act Book: PROB 9/1 (1781). Name and mari Source Bibliography: COLDHAM, PETER WILSON. English Estates of American Colonists, American Wills and Administrations in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury, 1700-1799. Baltimore, MD: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1980. 140p. Page: 33" How could Thomas Devonald buried in Philadelphia in October 1793 arrive in the USA in 1794? Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 22 2013, 08:06 PM From: "Eliz Hanebury" <elizhgene@gmail.com> To: "Simon Carter" <s.n.carter@btinternet.com> Cc: "Dyfed" <DYFED-L@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Help wanted - Thomas Devonald 1794 The record Ancestry has is 1794 and appears to be his death proving he was in the Colony rather than an actual arrival. If you are a brave and determined researcher, familysearch.org has the Philadelphia ship records Do you have this: Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church Here Lie the remains of THOMAS DEVONALD late Merchant of this city Who was born Near Haverford West Pembrokeshire South Wales Died the 11th day of October 1793 aged 34 years Source Information: Ancestry.com. Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2002. Original data: Clark, Edward L. Record of the Inscriptions on the Tablets and Grave-stones in the Burial-Grounds of Christ Church, Philadelphia. Philadelphia, PA, USA: Colines, Printer, 1864 He also gets a mention in English Estates of American Colonists, 1700-1799 Name: Thomas Devonald Arrival Year: 1794 Arrival Place: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Source Publication Code: 1224.2 Primary Immigrant: Devonald, Thomas Annotation: Date and place of death or date and place of mention in the New World. Extracted from Administration Act Books: PROB 6/76 (1700) to 175 (1799); Probate Act Books: PROB 8/93 (1700) to 192 (1799); and Limited Probate Act Book: PROB 9/1 (1781). Name and mari Source Bibliography: COLDHAM, PETER WILSON. English Estates of American Colonists, American Wills and Administrations in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury, 1700-1799. Baltimore, MD: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1980. 140p. Page: 33 Pennsylvania records at https://familysearch.org/search/collection/list#page=1&countryId=23 There is a lot to be seen Pennsylvania, Births and Christenings, 1709-1950 951,480 09 Mar 2012 Pennsylvania, County Marriages, 1885-1950 2,221,287 08 Sep 2012 Pennsylvania, Eastern District Naturalization Indexes, 1795-1952 231,641 29 Apr 2013 Pennsylvania, Eastern District Petitions for Naturalization, 1795-1931 Browse Images 09 Dec 2011 Pennsylvania, Marriages, 1709-1940 476,245 09 Mar 2012 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Case Files of Chinese Immigrants, 1900-1923 Browse Images 15 Apr 2011 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Births, 1860-1906 1,022,168 24 Jun 2012 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Death Certificates, 1803-1915 2,442,468 28 Jun 2012 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Marriage Indexes, 1885-1951 1,830,468 02 Mar 2013 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger List Index Cards, 1883-1948 1,153,207 29 Apr 2013 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger Lists, 1800-1882 489,494 20 Mar 2013 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger Lists, 1883-1945 971,459 26 Sep 2013 Pennsylvania, Pittsburgh City Deaths, 1870-1905 164,487 05 Nov 2013 Pennsylvania, Probate Records, 1683-1994 Eliz Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold) On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Simon Carter <s.n.carter@btinternet.com>wrote: > Hi, > Does anyone have a World-wide sub to Ancestry and could do a look-up? > > I am trying to find a bit more about Thomas Devonald, a linen draper of > London (but born near Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire) who died in > Philadelphia 11 Oct 1793. His will was proved PCC on 21 Feb 1794 (I have a > copy from TNA - PROB11/1241), but he is buried in Christ Church grave yard, > Philadelphia (I also have the MI). But Ancestry have an Immigration & > Travel entry for a Thomas Devonald to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (I do not > have the date, but I guess it's probably going to be 1792). > This may tell me very little (it might even be the wrong man), but it > would be useful to find out. > > If anyone is looking at this man in their research, I would love to hear > from you. > > Thanks in advance. > > Simon Carter > > ================================ > Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Rhodri

I will work on this more tomorrow Rees is so common as is Price being Welsh in early PA is to be a sardine in a school of Sardines <G> The way I read it, it is more that something about him appeared in 1794, not so much a passenger manifest. I think this explains it Annotation: Date and place of death or date and place of mention in the New World. Extracted from Administration Act Books: PROB 6/76 (1700) to 175 (1799); Probate Act Books: PROB 8/93 (1700) to 192 (1799); and Limited Probate Act Book: PROB 9/1 (1781). This URL might give you COD likely Yellow Fever http://quod.lib.umich.edu/c/clementsmss/umich-wcl-M-1898fis?view=text em you will need to read it but it has this in the index (1799???? what the?) Devonald, Thomas, d. 1793 - 1794 May 25 - 1799 January 17 This will get you a copy of the 1791 Philly directory in transcription but you can hunt the Rees Google found this (odd but maybe useful, after all Christ Church is Episcopal) http://archive.org/stream/earlybaptistsofp00spen/earlybaptistsofp00spen_djvu.txt >From this excellent epistle, the first of the kind extant in this country, has sprung the various styles of circular letters now furnished in our different Associational meetings. All those of the Philadelphia Association would, if gathered together, furnish a valuable, interesting and profitable book. In 1729, for the first time, the names of the messengers (twenty-two in all) to the Association appear. They are as follows : — Jno. David, Ben Stelle, Owen Thomas, Geo. Hugh, Gershom Mott, Joseph Eaton, Jno. Devonald, John Welledge, Wm. Kinnersley, Samuel Osgood, John Clarkson, John Holmes, Jeremiah Kollet, John Bartholomew, John Heart, Robert Chalfant, Elisha Thomas, George Eaton, Dickison Shephard, Jenkin Jones, Ebenezer Smith, Simon Butler. Eliz From greater Downtown Bart, Lancaster Co., PA 45 miles from Philly <G> it is fun to do local work!! Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold) On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 3:53 PM, RHODRI DAFIS <rdafis@fsmail.net> wrote: > Elizabeth, > > You quote: > > "Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church > Here Lie the remains of > THOMAS DEVONALD > late Merchant of this city > Who was born > Near Haverford West Pembrokeshire South Wales > Died the 11th day of October 1793 > aged 34 years" > > You then give: > > "Name: Thomas Devonald Arrival Year: 1794 Arrival Place: Philadelphia, > Pennsylvania Source Publication Code: 1224.2 Primary Immigrant: > Devonald, > Thomas Annotation: Date and place of death or date and place of mention > in > the New World. Extracted from Administration Act Books: PROB 6/76 (1700) > to > 175 (1799); Probate Act Books: PROB 8/93 (1700) to 192 (1799); and Limited > Probate Act Book: PROB 9/1 (1781). Name and mari Source Bibliography: > COLDHAM, > PETER WILSON. English Estates of American Colonists, American Wills and > Administrations in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury, 1700-1799. > Baltimore, MD: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1980. 140p. Page: 33" > > How could Thomas Devonald buried in Philadelphia in October 1793 arrive in > the USA in 1794? > > Rhodri > > > > > > > > ======================================== > Message Received: Dec 22 2013, 08:06 PM > From: "Eliz Hanebury" <elizhgene@gmail.com> > To: "Simon Carter" <s.n.carter@btinternet.com> > Cc: "Dyfed" <DYFED-L@rootsweb.com> > Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Help wanted - Thomas Devonald 1794 > > The record Ancestry has is 1794 and appears to be his death proving he was > in the Colony rather than an actual arrival. > > If you are a brave and determined researcher, familysearch.org has the > Philadelphia ship records > Do you have this: > > Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church > Here Lie the remains of > THOMAS DEVONALD > late Merchant of this city > Who was born > Near Haverford West Pembrokeshire South Wales > Died the 11th day of October 1793 > aged 34 years > > Source Information: > Ancestry.com. Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church > [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2002. > Original data: Clark, Edward L. Record of the Inscriptions on the Tablets > and Grave-stones in the Burial-Grounds of Christ Church, Philadelphia. > Philadelphia, PA, USA: Colines, Printer, 1864 > > He also gets a mention in English Estates of American Colonists, > 1700-1799 > > Name: Thomas Devonald Arrival Year: 1794 Arrival Place: Philadelphia, > Pennsylvania Source Publication Code: 1224.2 Primary Immigrant: > Devonald, > Thomas Annotation: Date and place of death or date and place of mention > in > the New World. Extracted from Administration Act Books: PROB 6/76 (1700) > to > 175 (1799); Probate Act Books: PROB 8/93 (1700) to 192 (1799); and Limited > Probate Act Book: PROB 9/1 (1781). Name and mari Source Bibliography: > COLDHAM, > PETER WILSON. English Estates of American Colonists, American Wills and > Administrations in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury, 1700-1799. > Baltimore, MD: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1980. 140p. Page: 33 > > Pennsylvania records at > https://familysearch.org/search/collection/list#page=1&countryId=23 > There is a lot to be seen > Pennsylvania, Births and Christenings, 1709-1950 951,480 09 Mar 2012 > Pennsylvania, County Marriages, 1885-1950 2,221,287 08 Sep 2012 > Pennsylvania, Eastern District Naturalization Indexes, 1795-1952 > 231,641 29 Apr 2013 > Pennsylvania, Eastern District Petitions for Naturalization, 1795-1931 > Browse Images 09 Dec 2011 > Pennsylvania, Marriages, 1709-1940 476,245 09 Mar 2012 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Case Files of Chinese Immigrants, 1900-1923 > Browse Images 15 Apr 2011 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Births, 1860-1906 1,022,168 24 Jun > 2012 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Death Certificates, 1803-1915 > 2,442,468 28 Jun 2012 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Marriage Indexes, 1885-1951 1,830,468 02 > Mar 2013 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger List Index Cards, 1883-1948 > 1,153,207 29 Apr 2013 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger Lists, 1800-1882 489,494 20 Mar > 2013 > Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger Lists, 1883-1945 971,459 26 Sep > 2013 > Pennsylvania, Pittsburgh City Deaths, 1870-1905 164,487 05 Nov 2013 > Pennsylvania, Probate Records, 1683-1994 > > Eliz > Not Today and Not without a Fight > (Anon) > > For all that has been, thanks. > For all that will be, yes. > (Dag Hammarskjold) > > > On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Simon Carter <s.n.carter@btinternet.com > >wrote: > > > Hi, > > Does anyone have a World-wide sub to Ancestry and could do a look-up? > > > > I am trying to find a bit more about Thomas Devonald, a linen draper of > > London (but born near Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire) who died in > > Philadelphia 11 Oct 1793. His will was proved PCC on 21 Feb 1794 (I > have a > > copy from TNA - PROB11/1241), but he is buried in Christ Church grave > yard, > > Philadelphia (I also have the MI). But Ancestry have an Immigration & > > Travel entry for a Thomas Devonald to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (I do > not > > have the date, but I guess it's probably going to be 1792). > > This may tell me very little (it might even be the wrong man), but it > > would be useful to find out. > > > > If anyone is looking at this man in their research, I would love to hear > > from you. > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > Simon Carter > > > > ================================ > > Dyfed list REVISED resources > http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ================================ > Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > Rhodri >

Hello Simon You don't tell us what his age was at death. I did look at the pre-1813 marriage fiches for Rhos, Narberth, Dungleddy and Dewisland Hundreds and found just one possible marriage that may be relevant: George Devonald and Sarah Rees date given as 1749/50 (Julian calendar) at Haverfordwest St Mary parish church. I have no connection with this family, but a GGG aunt and a first cousin four times removed married Devonalds in 1839 and 1833 respectively. Very few Pembrokeshire parishes have records before 1750. Gerry Lewis On 22/12/2013 14:54, "Simon Carter" <s.n.carter@btinternet.com> wrote: >Hi, >Does anyone have a World-wide sub to Ancestry and could do a look-up? > >I am trying to find a bit more about Thomas Devonald, a linen draper of >London (but born near Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire) who died in >Philadelphia 11 Oct 1793. His will was proved PCC on 21 Feb 1794 (I have >a copy from TNA - PROB11/1241), but he is buried in Christ Church grave >yard, Philadelphia (I also have the MI). But Ancestry have an Immigration >& Travel entry for a Thomas Devonald to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (I do >not have the date, but I guess it's probably going to be 1792). >This may tell me very little (it might even be the wrong man), but it >would be useful to find out. > >If anyone is looking at this man in their research, I would love to hear >from you. > >Thanks in advance. > >Simon Carter > >================================ >Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html >[Dec2012] > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message

City Direct…Philadelphia 1791 Delany, Sharp (p. 31) Devonald and Price, merchants, 71 So Front. City Directories Pennsylvania City Direct…hiladelphia 1793 Demer, Lewis (p. 35) on this page is Devonald and Price Merchants 26 No. Front St There is no entry in 1794, there isn't a Price I can associate with Thomas. Eliz Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold) On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Simon Carter <s.n.carter@btinternet.com>wrote: > Hi, > Does anyone have a World-wide sub to Ancestry and could do a look-up? > > I am trying to find a bit more about Thomas Devonald, a linen draper of > London (but born near Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire) who died in > Philadelphia 11 Oct 1793. His will was proved PCC on 21 Feb 1794 (I have a > copy from TNA - PROB11/1241), but he is buried in Christ Church grave yard, > Philadelphia (I also have the MI). But Ancestry have an Immigration & > Travel entry for a Thomas Devonald to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (I do not > have the date, but I guess it's probably going to be 1792). > This may tell me very little (it might even be the wrong man), but it > would be useful to find out. > > If anyone is looking at this man in their research, I would love to hear > from you. > > Thanks in advance. > > Simon Carter > > ================================ > Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

The record Ancestry has is 1794 and appears to be his death proving he was in the Colony rather than an actual arrival. If you are a brave and determined researcher, familysearch.org has the Philadelphia ship records Do you have this: Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church Here Lie the remains of THOMAS DEVONALD late Merchant of this city Who was born Near Haverford West Pembrokeshire South Wales Died the 11th day of October 1793 aged 34 years Source Information: Ancestry.com. Philadelphia, Tombstone Inscriptions from Christ Church [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2002. Original data: Clark, Edward L. Record of the Inscriptions on the Tablets and Grave-stones in the Burial-Grounds of Christ Church, Philadelphia. Philadelphia, PA, USA: Colines, Printer, 1864 He also gets a mention in English Estates of American Colonists, 1700-1799 Name: Thomas Devonald Arrival Year: 1794 Arrival Place: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Source Publication Code: 1224.2 Primary Immigrant: Devonald, Thomas Annotation: Date and place of death or date and place of mention in the New World. Extracted from Administration Act Books: PROB 6/76 (1700) to 175 (1799); Probate Act Books: PROB 8/93 (1700) to 192 (1799); and Limited Probate Act Book: PROB 9/1 (1781). Name and mari Source Bibliography: COLDHAM, PETER WILSON. English Estates of American Colonists, American Wills and Administrations in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury, 1700-1799. Baltimore, MD: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1980. 140p. Page: 33 Pennsylvania records at https://familysearch.org/search/collection/list#page=1&countryId=23 There is a lot to be seen Pennsylvania, Births and Christenings, 1709-1950 951,480 09 Mar 2012 Pennsylvania, County Marriages, 1885-1950 2,221,287 08 Sep 2012 Pennsylvania, Eastern District Naturalization Indexes, 1795-1952 231,641 29 Apr 2013 Pennsylvania, Eastern District Petitions for Naturalization, 1795-1931 Browse Images 09 Dec 2011 Pennsylvania, Marriages, 1709-1940 476,245 09 Mar 2012 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Case Files of Chinese Immigrants, 1900-1923 Browse Images 15 Apr 2011 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Births, 1860-1906 1,022,168 24 Jun 2012 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Death Certificates, 1803-1915 2,442,468 28 Jun 2012 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Marriage Indexes, 1885-1951 1,830,468 02 Mar 2013 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger List Index Cards, 1883-1948 1,153,207 29 Apr 2013 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger Lists, 1800-1882 489,494 20 Mar 2013 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Passenger Lists, 1883-1945 971,459 26 Sep 2013 Pennsylvania, Pittsburgh City Deaths, 1870-1905 164,487 05 Nov 2013 Pennsylvania, Probate Records, 1683-1994 Eliz Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold) On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Simon Carter <s.n.carter@btinternet.com>wrote: > Hi, > Does anyone have a World-wide sub to Ancestry and could do a look-up? > > I am trying to find a bit more about Thomas Devonald, a linen draper of > London (but born near Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire) who died in > Philadelphia 11 Oct 1793. His will was proved PCC on 21 Feb 1794 (I have a > copy from TNA - PROB11/1241), but he is buried in Christ Church grave yard, > Philadelphia (I also have the MI). But Ancestry have an Immigration & > Travel entry for a Thomas Devonald to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (I do not > have the date, but I guess it's probably going to be 1792). > This may tell me very little (it might even be the wrong man), but it > would be useful to find out. > > If anyone is looking at this man in their research, I would love to hear > from you. > > Thanks in advance. > > Simon Carter > > ================================ > Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi, Does anyone have a World-wide sub to Ancestry and could do a look-up? I am trying to find a bit more about Thomas Devonald, a linen draper of London (but born near Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire) who died in Philadelphia 11 Oct 1793. His will was proved PCC on 21 Feb 1794 (I have a copy from TNA - PROB11/1241), but he is buried in Christ Church grave yard, Philadelphia (I also have the MI). But Ancestry have an Immigration & Travel entry for a Thomas Devonald to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (I do not have the date, but I guess it's probably going to be 1792). This may tell me very little (it might even be the wrong man), but it would be useful to find out. If anyone is looking at this man in their research, I would love to hear from you. Thanks in advance. Simon Carter

I wanted to add that I went to the launch of Pembroke People in his house somewhere towards Paddington, as I recall. This was a huge amount of effort to produce, and has been useful to me down the years and will stand as a fitting epitaph to his research. ----- I don't think I have seen it posted anywhere else yet, but John and Sheila Rowlands revised 2nd Edition book on The Surnames of Wales has just been published. It is a real gem, and for example has a wonderful map showing how the use of patronymics dropped out across Wales from 1600 to 1850 in fifty year contour lines, based on a huge survey of wills from the NLW. Of course, chock full of useful ideas based on a lifetime of research in this field. http://www.gomer.co.uk/index.php/books-for-adults/history-and-culture/the-su rnames-of-wales.html John Rowlands will be speaking at WDYTYA 2014 on Thursday 20th February at 4.15-5.00 pm on: The perpetual incognito of being a Jones': overcoming problems with surnames in Wales The website has a pop-up box which describes what he will be discussing in more detail. http://www.whodoyouthinkyouarelive.com/workshop-schedule Beryl Evans from the NLW is speaking on The Welsh Experience of World War One, 1914-1918, from 10.15-11.00 am on the Friday, 21st February. And on Tracing Your Welsh Ancestors on Saturday 22nd February And as a personal plug, I have the graveyard slot on the Saturday from 16.45 to 17.30 on DNA and Welsh Family History. That of course, is the one criticism I would level at the Rowlands book, there is no mention of DNA in it at all. I am sure this is deliberate, as I know they have an interest in the De Cantington or Canton families from Pembrokeshire and run a DNA Project on them. However DNA will revolutionise the study of all surnames. At least two companies, Full Genomes and FTDNA, are now offering DNA sequencing of a big chunk of the Y-Chromosome [up to 1/3 of it, maybe, but certainly the section of most interest to folk doing family history]. There are figures of one single base change happening on the Y-chromosome every 2-3 generations at this degree of resolution. If those locations can be mapped with a high degree of precision, then this starts to change everything. Again this need for precision comes from the need to identify correctly all the differences which can occur in complex multi-genetic human disease. This is called Next-Generation sequencing, and will revolutionise healthcare as well as this field. David Cameron has announced recently Britain's NHS involvement in a 100,000 genomes project over the next few years and this is the same technology which is making recovery of Ancient DNA becoming more feasible. Much of this will also be showcased at WDYTYA. So how you link paper reconstruction of your ancestral trails to the DNA revolution will continue to develop intensely over the next few years. The Irish are well down this road, partly as so many of them went to America and partly because of the well-known destruction of so many paper-based records. The grandchildren arrive today, so as us older members can remember when the TV transmitters used to break down occasionally: Normal Service Will Be Resumed As Soon As Possible Brian -----Original Message----- From: dyfed-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dyfed-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joy Sent: 17 December 2013 15:04 To: dyfed@rootsweb.com Subject: [Dyfed] Richard Rose I am sure that those members of this list who have read "Pembroke People" will be sad to learn of the sad death its author - Richard Rose - on Monday 16th December. Although not a Pembrokeshire man himself he became fascinated by the partly encrypted diary of Matthew Campbell, Customs Officer of Pembroke, which he had found on a London antiques market stall. Over a number of years he worked on compiling a vast amount of information on the people who lived Pembroke and Pembroke Dock between 1800 and 1837 which most of us have found invaluable in our researches. Even with a computer, sorting all the information collected from such extensive sources was a mammoth task entailing many visits to Pembrokeshire, as well as the Carmarthenshire RO, the NLW and many other archive collections, from his home in London. His contribution to the history of Pembrokeshire will remain as a standard work and he will always be remembered as a scholar and a gentleman. With fond remembrance Joy

That is sad news Joy. Sorry to hear that. I didn't know him, but have had a look at the book and have seen his messages on this list. Regards Sandra -----Original Message----- From: dyfed-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:dyfed-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joy Sent: 17 December 2013 15:04 To: dyfed@rootsweb.com Subject: [Dyfed] Richard Rose I am sure that those members of this list who have read "Pembroke People" will be sad to learn of the sad death its author - Richard Rose - on Monday 16th December. Although not a Pembrokeshire man himself he became fascinated by the partly encrypted diary of Matthew Campbell, Customs Officer of Pembroke, which he had found on a London antiques market stall. Over a number of years he worked on compiling a vast amount of information on the people who lived Pembroke and Pembroke Dock between 1800 and 1837 which most of us have found invaluable in our researches. Even with a computer, sorting all the information collected from such extensive sources was a mammoth task entailing many visits to Pembrokeshire, as well as the Carmarthenshire RO, the NLW and many other archive collections, from his home in London. His contribution to the history of Pembrokeshire will remain as a standard work and he will always be remembered as a scholar and a gentleman. With fond remembrance Joy ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am sure that those members of this list who have read "Pembroke People" will be sad to learn of the sad death its author - Richard Rose - on Monday 16th December. Although not a Pembrokeshire man himself he became fascinated by the partly encrypted diary of Matthew Campbell, Customs Officer of Pembroke, which he had found on a London antiques market stall. Over a number of years he worked on compiling a vast amount of information on the people who lived Pembroke and Pembroke Dock between 1800 and 1837 which most of us have found invaluable in our researches. Even with a computer, sorting all the information collected from such extensive sources was a mammoth task entailing many visits to Pembrokeshire, as well as the Carmarthenshire RO, the NLW and many other archive collections, from his home in London. His contribution to the history of Pembrokeshire will remain as a standard work and he will always be remembered as a scholar and a gentleman. With fond remembrance Joy

Hello List, Wonder if somebody has come across the Lloyd-family in 1841-1861 at Blaenporth or Bettws Evan. Found James Lloyd b 1837 at Blaenporth from 1871 census up to 1901. He could possibly been at Blaensilltyn in 1911. James died in 1925 and his wife Alice earlier in 1914. Buried at Bryngwyn,Brongwyn. Would like to know who the father was to James. Elwyn - netherlands. ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ----- Geen virus gevonden in dit bericht. Gecontroleerd door AVG - www.avg.com Versie: 2013.0.3462 / Virusdatabase: 3658/6915 - datum van uitgifte: 12/12/13

Hello List, Wonder if somebody has come across the Lloyd-family in 1841-1861 at Blaenporth or Bettws Evan. Found James Lloyd b 1837 at Blaenporth from 1871 census up to 1901. He could possibly been at Blaensilltyn in 1911. James died in 1925 and his wife Alice earlier in 1914. Buried at Bryngwyn,Brongwyn. Would like to know who the father was to James. Elwyn - netherlands.

Hal, the Welsh Tract is around Philadelphia PA, towns like Merion, Berwyn and Ardmore and on and on were named for Wales (when it was fashionable *G*) Eliz Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold) On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 2:13 PM, Hal McCawley <HalMac@cox.net> wrote: > Hello Down Under. Thanks Bettye for responding. > Could you tell me about "Welsh Tract"- where is it, who founded it, when, > was it a church or a geographical area..? > Have their records been published or on WWW? > I have traced my Wm & Thomas GEORGE through New Britain,Great Valley, > Montgomery Valley, Brandywine, in PA, Hopewell, NJ, to Rhydwilym Chapel > where my Wm & Thomas GEORGE were bapt in 1709 & 1712. > I appreciate your help, and, > Happy Holidays. > Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 > 760-941-4716 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Lance Kirkwood > To: Hal McCawley > Sent: Monday, December 09, 2013 8:17 PM > Subject: Re: Pem Genealogy > > > Dear Hal, > > I sent you the material I had.....and the Parish name is Llandissilio. > > In my own research I had a Baptist family who left Pembrokeshire in the > early 1700’s and went to Pennsylvania........and the information about them > was to be found in the Mormon records in America.........I believe there > are > some emigrants who wrote up their own stories and the Mormons have them > ...probably on line....so look at their data bases. I looked at the > information I have in my possession and there is no record of anyone > surnamed George joining the people who settled at Welsh Tract where those I > was interested in travelled. > I’m in Australia, so probably even more remote from the records than you > are > yourself. > Regards, > Bettye Kirkwood. > > From: Hal McCawley > Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 11:26 AM > To: Lance Kirkwood > Subject: Pem Genealogy > > > Greetings from California, USA, > Rootsweb indicates you have relatives/contacts and experience in > Pembrokeshire, Wales. > My gf William GEORGE b ca 1696 of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 > @ > Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel, Pembrokeshire, Wales. In the 1720s he migrated > to the Great Valley Bapt Church in Devon, PA, USA which was founded in 1711 > by Welsh immigrants from Rhydwilym Chapel of Pembrokeshire, W Wales, ENG. I > do not know of his wife, parents, relatives in Wales. > They also have a 17 Aug 1712 bapt for an unknown Thomas GEORGE of Narberth > Parish. > Could you please offer suggestions for accessing the records of Rhydwilym > Chapel?- marriages, deaths, list of baptisms, cemetery records.. or > Ancestry.com, FHS files.. > Also other civil, migration, ports available, the Chapels part in > establishing/supporting new churches in USA.. > Any help you can offer will be greatly appreciated. > Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA > 760-941-4716 > > > ================================ > Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

Hal there is quite a lot of info online, ie Wikipedia, various genealogical sites, just do a search.. have fun. Rachel Boyd CT, usa ________________________________ From: Hal McCawley <HalMac@cox.net> To: Lance Kirkwood <lki59595@bigpond.net.au> Cc: DYFED Wales <DYFED@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 2:13 PM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Pem Genealogy for GEORGE ca 1700 Hello Down Under. Thanks Bettye for responding. Could you tell me about "Welsh Tract"- where is it, who founded it, when, was it a church or a geographical area..? Have their records been published or on WWW? I have traced my Wm & Thomas GEORGE through New Britain,Great Valley, Montgomery Valley, Brandywine, in PA, Hopewell, NJ, to Rhydwilym Chapel where my Wm & Thomas GEORGE were bapt in 1709 & 1712. I appreciate your help, and, Happy Holidays. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: Lance Kirkwood To: Hal McCawley Sent: Monday, December 09, 2013 8:17 PM Subject: Re: Pem Genealogy Dear Hal, I sent you the material I had.....and the Parish name is Llandissilio. In my own research I had a Baptist family who left Pembrokeshire in the early 1700’s and went to Pennsylvania........and the information about them was to be found in the Mormon records in America.........I believe there are some emigrants who wrote up their own stories and the Mormons have them ...probably on line....so look at their data bases.  I looked at the information I have in my possession and there is no record of anyone surnamed George joining the people who settled at Welsh Tract where those I was interested in travelled. I’m in Australia, so probably even more remote from the records than you are yourself. Regards, Bettye Kirkwood. From: Hal McCawley Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 11:26 AM To: Lance Kirkwood Subject: Pem Genealogy Greetings from California, USA, Rootsweb indicates you have relatives/contacts and experience in Pembrokeshire, Wales. My gf William GEORGE b ca 1696 of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 @ Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel, Pembrokeshire, Wales. In the 1720s he migrated to the Great Valley Bapt Church in Devon, PA, USA which was founded in 1711 by Welsh immigrants from Rhydwilym Chapel of Pembrokeshire, W Wales, ENG. I do not know of his wife, parents, relatives in Wales. They also have a 17 Aug 1712 bapt for an unknown Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish. Could you please offer suggestions for accessing the records of Rhydwilym Chapel?- marriages, deaths, list of baptisms, cemetery records.. or Ancestry.com, FHS files.. Also other civil, migration, ports available, the Chapels part in establishing/supporting new churches in USA.. Any help you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA 760-941-4716 ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html  [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Down Under. Thanks Bettye for responding. Could you tell me about "Welsh Tract"- where is it, who founded it, when, was it a church or a geographical area..? Have their records been published or on WWW? I have traced my Wm & Thomas GEORGE through New Britain,Great Valley, Montgomery Valley, Brandywine, in PA, Hopewell, NJ, to Rhydwilym Chapel where my Wm & Thomas GEORGE were bapt in 1709 & 1712. I appreciate your help, and, Happy Holidays. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: Lance Kirkwood To: Hal McCawley Sent: Monday, December 09, 2013 8:17 PM Subject: Re: Pem Genealogy Dear Hal, I sent you the material I had.....and the Parish name is Llandissilio. In my own research I had a Baptist family who left Pembrokeshire in the early 1700’s and went to Pennsylvania........and the information about them was to be found in the Mormon records in America.........I believe there are some emigrants who wrote up their own stories and the Mormons have them ...probably on line....so look at their data bases. I looked at the information I have in my possession and there is no record of anyone surnamed George joining the people who settled at Welsh Tract where those I was interested in travelled. I’m in Australia, so probably even more remote from the records than you are yourself. Regards, Bettye Kirkwood. From: Hal McCawley Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 11:26 AM To: Lance Kirkwood Subject: Pem Genealogy Greetings from California, USA, Rootsweb indicates you have relatives/contacts and experience in Pembrokeshire, Wales. My gf William GEORGE b ca 1696 of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 @ Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel, Pembrokeshire, Wales. In the 1720s he migrated to the Great Valley Bapt Church in Devon, PA, USA which was founded in 1711 by Welsh immigrants from Rhydwilym Chapel of Pembrokeshire, W Wales, ENG. I do not know of his wife, parents, relatives in Wales. They also have a 17 Aug 1712 bapt for an unknown Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish. Could you please offer suggestions for accessing the records of Rhydwilym Chapel?- marriages, deaths, list of baptisms, cemetery records.. or Ancestry.com, FHS files.. Also other civil, migration, ports available, the Chapels part in establishing/supporting new churches in USA.. Any help you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA 760-941-4716

Hal, I'll make a researcher out of you yet. Try the following links: http://isys.llgc.org.uk/ Search Archives and Manuscripts for Rhydwilym. http://lists.rootsweb.ancestry.com/ Again search for Rhydwilym. I know there have been numerous questions on the DyfedList and possibly others over the years, and it should give further references to investigate. Estate Papers are at the NLW, Local Record Offices in England and Wales, Libraries, Universities and Colleges and the National Archives. Do not assume they will be held locally. They can be anywhere in the UK or even the USA. Best wishes, Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 05 2013, 03:32 AM From: "Hal McCawley" To: rdafis@fsmail.net, dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire  RD, I have read all of the assigned readings below which I found very interesting and informative. I note that the History of Rydwilym states that they founded many churches in Wales as well as the USA. My gf William GEORGE was a member of one of those- William GEORGE was a member ca 1720-Jul 1730 @ Great Valley Baptist Church which still exists in modern day Devon, PA, USA whose records state that they were founded in 1711 by Welsh immigrants from Rhydwilym Chapel in Pembrokeshire, W Wales, ENG, I now have the following questions: 1) What records of Rydwilym are available for 1650-1750 era- membership, marriages, baptisms..? Where/how? 2) How about estates? I appreciate your input. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, I am not a preacher, although I may sound like one. There is little benefit in compiling a list of names your ancestors. You need to understand their beliefs, their social conditions, and what drove them to emigrate. I do not intend giving you the answers on a plate as that defeats the object of researching your ancestry, unless you want to get back to Adam before Christmas. Here are a few links for you to explore. http://www.bcgv.org/about/rootsinwales/ http://www.rhydwilym.com/ https://archive.org/details/historyofwelshba00davi Read, and absorb, then come back with any questions. Best wishes, Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 04 2013, 12:31 AM From: "Hal McCawley" To: rdafis@fsmail.net, dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire  Thanks Rhodri for your prompt and succinct response. Just what I needed. I greatly appreciate your taking the time to inform me. Will respond within- Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 2:31 PM Subject: RE: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, Where does your information come from? The belief that my GEORGE were Baptist comes from tracing my gf William GEORGE through 4 states in USA of Baptist membership. One of these churches was founded by the Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel where my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 and Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712 . I believe I understand what you are saying. Can I now assume that that my GEORGEs were residents of Landissillip & Narberth Parish that had no Baptist churches in the 1709-12 era and they attended Rydwilym Chapel as their only church?? Are the records of Rydwilym available? Where/how? Baptists were Nonconformists and on principle did not frequent their local Parish Church. They believed in adult Baptism when the individual Baptised was old enough to decide for himself whether he subscribed to the beliefs of the Baptist Church. Rhydwilym and Rushacre before it in the 1600's was the mother Chapel of most Baptist Chapels in West Wales, and in its early days drew members from Cardiganshire, Pembrokeshire and Carmarthenshire. Some of the members came from 40 or more miles away. If there were Baptist Chapels in West Wales in the 1709-12 era? If so, then I must ask why my guys were not bapt there instead of Rhydwilym? Don't assume that because the surname is the same, that they are related. I suggest you start by learning about the Baptist faith, and Rydwilym in particular. There is plenty of information On-line. Just Google. Thanks for reminding me. I often overlook them! God helps those who help themselves! Amen! Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 03 2013, 07:59 PM From: "Hal McCawley" To: dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hi Y'all, I need some local education. I have my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish bapt 22 Aug 1709, AND, Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712, both bapt @Rhydwilym Chapel, Pembrokeshire. All appear to be of the Baptist religion? Questions: 1) Why were they not bapt in their local Parish?? 2) Were these Parish adjoining, close..? Map available? 3) Where/how are these Parish records available? Thanks for your assistance. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA 760-941-4716 ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Rhodri Rhodri Rhodri

RD, I have read all of the assigned readings below which I found very interesting and informative. I note that the History of Rydwilym states that they founded many churches in Wales as well as the USA. My gf William GEORGE was a member of one of those- William GEORGE was a member ca 1720-Jul 1730 @ Great Valley Baptist Church which still exists in modern day Devon, PA, USA whose records state that they were founded in 1711 by Welsh immigrants from Rhydwilym Chapel in Pembrokeshire, W Wales, ENG, I now have the following questions: 1) What records of Rydwilym are available for 1650-1750 era- membership, marriages, baptisms..? Where/how? 2) How about estates? I appreciate your input. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, I am not a preacher, although I may sound like one. There is little benefit in compiling a list of names your ancestors. You need to understand their beliefs, their social conditions, and what drove them to emigrate. I do not intend giving you the answers on a plate as that defeats the object of researching your ancestry, unless you want to get back to Adam before Christmas. Here are a few links for you to explore. http://www.bcgv.org/about/rootsinwales/ http://www.rhydwilym.com/ https://archive.org/details/historyofwelshba00davi Read, and absorb, then come back with any questions. Best wishes, Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 04 2013, 12:31 AM From: "Hal McCawley" To: rdafis@fsmail.net, dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire  Thanks Rhodri for your prompt and succinct response. Just what I needed. I greatly appreciate your taking the time to inform me. Will respond within- Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 2:31 PM Subject: RE: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, Where does your information come from? The belief that my GEORGE were Baptist comes from tracing my gf William GEORGE through 4 states in USA of Baptist membership. One of these churches was founded by the Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel where my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 and Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712 . I believe I understand what you are saying. Can I now assume that that my GEORGEs were residents of Landissillip & Narberth Parish that had no Baptist churches in the 1709-12 era and they attended Rydwilym Chapel as their only church?? Are the records of Rydwilym available? Where/how? Baptists were Nonconformists and on principle did not frequent their local Parish Church. They believed in adult Baptism when the individual Baptised was old enough to decide for himself whether he subscribed to the beliefs of the Baptist Church. Rhydwilym and Rushacre before it in the 1600's was the mother Chapel of most Baptist Chapels in West Wales, and in its early days drew members from Cardiganshire, Pembrokeshire and Carmarthenshire. Some of the members came from 40 or more miles away. If there were Baptist Chapels in West Wales in the 1709-12 era? If so, then I must ask why my guys were not bapt there instead of Rhydwilym? Don't assume that because the surname is the same, that they are related. I suggest you start by learning about the Baptist faith, and Rydwilym in particular. There is plenty of information On-line. Just Google. Thanks for reminding me. I often overlook them! God helps those who help themselves! Amen! Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 03 2013, 07:59 PM From: "Hal McCawley" To: dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hi Y'all, I need some local education. I have my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish bapt 22 Aug 1709, AND, Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712, both bapt @Rhydwilym Chapel, Pembrokeshire. All appear to be of the Baptist religion? Questions: 1) Why were they not bapt in their local Parish?? 2) Were these Parish adjoining, close..? Map available? 3) Where/how are these Parish records available? Thanks for your assistance. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA 760-941-4716 ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Rhodri Rhodri

Yes Ma'am, Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, I am not a preacher, although I may sound like one. There is little benefit in compiling a list of names your ancestors. You need to understand their beliefs, their social conditions, and what drove them to emigrate. I do not intend giving you the answers on a plate as that defeats the object of researching your ancestry, unless you want to get back to Adam before Christmas. Here are a few links for you to explore. http://www.bcgv.org/about/rootsinwales/ http://www.rhydwilym.com/ https://archive.org/details/historyofwelshba00davi Read, and absorb, then come back with any questions. Best wishes, Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 04 2013, 12:31 AM From: "Hal McCawley" To: rdafis@fsmail.net, dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire  Thanks Rhodri for your prompt and succinct response. Just what I needed. I greatly appreciate your taking the time to inform me. Will respond within- Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 2:31 PM Subject: RE: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, Where does your information come from? The belief that my GEORGE were Baptist comes from tracing my gf William GEORGE through 4 states in USA of Baptist membership. One of these churches was founded by the Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel where my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 and Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712 . I believe I understand what you are saying. Can I now assume that that my GEORGEs were residents of Landissillip & Narberth Parish that had no Baptist churches in the 1709-12 era and they attended Rydwilym Chapel as their only church?? Are the records of Rydwilym available? Where/how? Baptists were Nonconformists and on principle did not frequent their local Parish Church. They believed in adult Baptism when the individual Baptised was old enough to decide for himself whether he subscribed to the beliefs of the Baptist Church. Rhydwilym and Rushacre before it in the 1600's was the mother Chapel of most Baptist Chapels in West Wales, and in its early days drew members from Cardiganshire, Pembrokeshire and Carmarthenshire. Some of the members came from 40 or more miles away. If there were Baptist Chapels in West Wales in the 1709-12 era? If so, then I must ask why my guys were not bapt there instead of Rhydwilym? Don't assume that because the surname is the same, that they are related. I suggest you start by learning about the Baptist faith, and Rydwilym in particular. There is plenty of information On-line. Just Google. Thanks for reminding me. I often overlook them! God helps those who help themselves! Amen! Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 03 2013, 07:59 PM From: "Hal McCawley" To: dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hi Y'all, I need some local education. I have my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish bapt 22 Aug 1709, AND, Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712, both bapt @Rhydwilym Chapel, Pembrokeshire. All appear to be of the Baptist religion? Questions: 1) Why were they not bapt in their local Parish?? 2) Were these Parish adjoining, close..? Map available? 3) Where/how are these Parish records available? Thanks for your assistance. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA 760-941-4716 ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Rhodri Rhodri

Dear Achwr Thanks for the comments. Very interesting. I'm sure I have seen a bible with a slice cut out of a family page somewhere. Illegitimacy might indeed account for those hard to trace. Its not only bibles and "records" that are amended. Yesterday a group of us were talking about "amending the past" and one friend mentioned his family of yesteryear who had been very early settlers in the USA (Russian Jewish, and English I think). Two tomb stones are known to have been "edited" in both families. One getting a Star of David removed for fear of desecration, and the other getting a KKK symbol edited out. Then followed a deep discussion on passing moral judgement. Thanks again Jen ________________________________ From: yr achwr <achwr@fsmail.net> To: Jennifer Cairns <jennifercairns@yahoo.com>; "dyfed@rootsweb.com" <dyfed@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, 2 December 2013, 16:03 Subject: RE: *** SPAM *** [Dyfed] Family Disgrace... Jennifer, Many families particularly strict nonconformists had skeletons in their cupboards. I have not seen an entry cut or crossed out, but have seen an entry added as a child, when she was a Grandchild. Eldest daughter had an illegitimate son in the late 1830's. He was entered in the bible as a child of his grandmother. The Birth Certificate named his father, but the family would not accept the evidence. It was only when I found his paternal grandfathers will, that named him, his mother and his address, as the illegitimate son of his deceased son, that they accepted the evidence. Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Dec 02 2013, 11:25 AM From: "Jennifer Cairns" <jennifercairns@yahoo.com> To: "dyfed@rootsweb.com" <dyfed@rootsweb.com> Cc: Subject: *** SPAM *** [Dyfed] Family Disgrace... On Saturday I was chatting with an acquaintance, who said she had a ancestral relation (from the Lampeter area - don't want to name the exact village!) who had had her name physically cut out of the family bible. Was this a common or "not unheard of" occurrence? Jen   ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ACHWR

Just a reminder that ‘High Hats and Harps’, the life and times of Lord and Lady Llanover is still available from me, www.glensideprinting.com, or www.nicklebysbookstore.co.uk. It would make a great stocking filler! Helen http://augustaladyllanover.coffeecup.com

Hal, I am not a preacher, although I may sound like one. There is little benefit in compiling a list of names your ancestors. You need to understand their beliefs, their social conditions, and what drove them to emigrate. I do not intend giving you the answers on a plate as that defeats the object of researching your ancestry, unless you want to get back to Adam before Christmas. Here are a few links for you to explore. http://www.bcgv.org/about/rootsinwales/ http://www.rhydwilym.com/ https://archive.org/details/historyofwelshba00davi Read, and absorb, then come back with any questions. Best wishes, Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 04 2013, 12:31 AM From: "Hal McCawley" To: rdafis@fsmail.net, dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: Re: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire  Thanks Rhodri for your prompt and succinct response. Just what I needed. I greatly appreciate your taking the time to inform me. Will respond within- Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 760-941-4716 ----- Original Message ----- From: RHODRI DAFIS To: Hal McCawley ; dyfed@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 2:31 PM Subject: RE: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hal, Where does your information come from? The belief that my GEORGE were Baptist comes from tracing my gf William GEORGE through 4 states in USA of Baptist membership. One of these churches was founded by the Rhydwilym [Baptist] Chapel where my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish was bapt 22 Aug 1709 and Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712 . I believe I understand what you are saying. Can I now assume that that my GEORGEs were residents of Landissillip & Narberth Parish that had no Baptist churches in the 1709-12 era and they attended Rydwilym Chapel as their only church?? Are the records of Rydwilym available? Where/how? Baptists were Nonconformists and on principle did not frequent their local Parish Church. They believed in adult Baptism when the individual Baptised was old enough to decide for himself whether he subscribed to the beliefs of the Baptist Church. Rhydwilym and Rushacre before it in the 1600's was the mother Chapel of most Baptist Chapels in West Wales, and in its early days drew members from Cardiganshire, Pembrokeshire and Carmarthenshire. Some of the members came from 40 or more miles away. If there were Baptist Chapels in West Wales in the 1709-12 era? If so, then I must ask why my guys were not bapt there instead of Rhydwilym? Don't assume that because the surname is the same, that they are related. I suggest you start by learning about the Baptist faith, and Rydwilym in particular. There is plenty of information On-line. Just Google. Thanks for reminding me. I often overlook them! God helps those who help themselves! Amen! Rhodri ======================================== Message Received: Dec 03 2013, 07:59 PM From: "Hal McCawley" To: dyfed@rootsweb.com Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] GEORGE of early 1700s Pembrokeshire Hi Y'all, I need some local education. I have my gf William GEORGE of Landissillip Parish bapt 22 Aug 1709, AND, Thomas GEORGE of Narberth Parish bapt 17 Aug 1712, both bapt @Rhydwilym Chapel, Pembrokeshire. All appear to be of the Baptist religion? Questions: 1) Why were they not bapt in their local Parish?? 2) Were these Parish adjoining, close..? Map available? 3) Where/how are these Parish records available? Thanks for your assistance. Hal McCawley, 4178 Pindar Way, Oceanside, CA 92056 USA 760-941-4716 ================================ Dyfed list REVISED resources http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html [Dec2012] ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to DYFED-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Rhodri Rhodri