Hi Buddug, Can I start by asking if you have information on the following? Abode given in the baptism register Baptisms pre-1813 (are you eliminating the Margaret bapt in 1812?) You do not list the bapt in Dec 1813 of Margaret dau of John & Mary Jones, Gafriw - is it a possible? I have an index (unchecked) to Llannarth & Llanina registers, but it does not immediately identify any of your Margarets in the marriages. Pre-1853 there were no ages in the marriage register - everyone was 'ofa', which is a bit unhelpful. Regards Bill G-J In a message dated 19/02/2012 11:14:43 GMT Standard Time, [email protected] writes: Hello Complete shot in the dark . I have an almost impossible problem in trying to find the parents of a Margaret Jones born c 1813 in the parish of Llanarth . As her age differs from census to census as well as on her death certificate ,it's not possible to pin down the exact year of birth . It's somewhere between 1813 and 1815 .However ,I found 4 possibles in the free reg . Mgt christened Feb 1813 to William and Maria Mgt chris .July 1813 to Lewis and Mary Mgt chris. Sept 1814 to David and Mary Mgt chris. October 1815 to Jenkin and Elizabeth. She married a Daniel Evans in 1832 . I was wondering if there 's a possibility that a subscriber would have any of these Margarets in their tree so that I can elminate one or two as being my ancestor ! I've also given up on who Daniel's parents could be .He was born c 1806 again in the Llanarth area !! many thanks Buddug Hollett ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I wonder if there is any kind soul who could help me out with a colour photograph of this cemetary taken from the gate and showing the graves, for me to use in a Monumental Inscription booklet. I have been publishing the Memorial Inscriptions booklets for the Cardiganshire FHS and have included a colour photo of the church or chapel in it's booklet. I would like to do the same with this cemetary but I live in Anglesey. I can possibly get down there on the 26th. but was hoping to take the completed booklet with me then. Your work would be acknowledged but I'm afraid we can't manage a fee! This is the last of the first batch of 19 that have been waiting to be published for many years. We are about to move into this century and I have published 2 CD, the third will be an index of the 19 MI booklets, giving basic information, If anyone has recorded the inscription in any other Cardiganshire graveyard, have the copyright and would be willing to allow name, date and year of death and residence to be included, please get in touch. I hope to continue this work to make a major finding aid for the county. Thanks very much for any help that anyone can offer. Best wishes, Dave (publications person, Cardiganshire FHS)

Darryl, Your surname alone suggests, that your family were not originally from the area. Gwynne is derived from Gwyn, translated as White. One of your ancestors was either an Albino, or had a particularly fair complextion, and aquired this epiphet, which his descendants adopted as a surname. Your roots are undoubtedly north of the Landsker. George Owen was one of the first of what may be described as "County Historians". Lord of the Barony of Cemmaes in Nevern Parish (by purchase). George Owen was an Enigma, To him we owe a debt for the position in Pembrokeshire in the 16th Century. He was also interesed in Genealogy and also Geology. He is credited as being the father of English Geologists. He left a (for the time) a large collection of writings and pedigrees. Many of these have not seen the light of day. A correspondent of Camden, he provided the map of Pembrokeshire for the first edition of Camden to include County Maps. It is a matter of conjecture who was the first to Record the term Little England Beyond Wales, which Camden refers to as Anglia Trans Wallia. The printed versions of his Work are: Owens Pembrokeshire. 3 Volumes printed by the Cymmrodorion Record Series.The Volume that includes the description of Pembrokeshire is Vol. 1, and if I remember correctly Chapter 1. I cannot lay my hands on my copy at present. Extracts are included in Elizabethan Pembrokeshire - The evidence of George Owen. Pembrokeshire Record Series 1973. For a scholarly treatise on the man and his work see:: George Owen of Henllys - A Welsh Elizabethan by B G Charles. National Library of Wales Press, Aberystwyth 1973. ISBN 0 901833 69 X. B G Charles also compled his entry in The Dictionary of Welsh Biography: http://wbo.llgc.org.uk/en/s-OWEN-GEO-1552.htm which gives further information and links. B G Charles lists 72 extant manuscripts (or copies of manuscripts -so there may be an element of duplication) "confined to the contemporary or earliest known copies of George Owen's notes on antiquarian, historical, topographical, genealogical and heraldic subjects. Brian might find it interesting, that the Genealogical work of the "bore" of Henllys found its way via David Edwardes and William Lewes LLwynderw. " a great deal of Owen's genealogical learning were transmitted by way of David Edwardes of Rhydygors and Wiliam Lewes of Llwynderw to later generations: the tree that had its roots in sixteenth century Henllys spread and grew. The great corpus of Welsh Pedigree known as the Golden Grove Books and the Protheroe manuscripts in the College of Arms have their origin in Henllys." George Owen was writing about the Pembrokeshire he knew. As far as contemporary descriptions, he is no doubt accurate, and can be accepted at face value. When it comes to a historical analysis, this comes complete with the bagage of upbringing, and the limitations of the records that were readily available to him. He should not be accepted at face value. The access via the Internet etc., we have today casts doubt on some of his utterances. Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Feb 18 2012, 01:30 PM From: "Darryl Gwynne" To: "[email protected]" Cc: "Marcus Griffiths" , "Gareth" , "Dyfed List" Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Was Llanreath now Landsker Thanks so much for this interesting discussion. Achwyr can you please post the "George Owen" reference and any other sources? I would like to read more about this. My father's lineage is almost all from the area south of Milford Haven (if fact this summer I plan on exploring ancestral locations such as Tenby, Manorbier, Pwllcrochan and Penfro by walking this part of the Pembrokeshire coastal trail). Darryl ------------------------------------------------- Darryl Gwynne, Glen Williams, Canada (GWYNNE WADE SKONE YOUNG ADAMS) -------------------------------------------------- On 2012-02-17, at 6:47 PM, yr achwr wrote: > Marcus, > I agree with you that the position is not completely Black and White. > > There is a common perception, that below the Landsker Line, the indigenous Welsh population were "wiped out". > This is probably true of Rhos Hundred, where the Flemmings were settled. There is scarcely a place name that is Welsh in Origin, or a Church dedicated to a Celtic SaInt. George Owen, refers to the hatred of the Flemmings who "reading between the lines" had indulged in ethnic cleansing. > Manorbier Hundred however, which is South of the Haven, and the original area settled by the Normans reveals a completely different story. > The survival of so many names derived from Welsh, and the numerous Churches dedicated to Welsh or Celtic Saints, in the area, suggests that for the bulk of the population, it was simply a matter of a change of Overlord. > There are extant Deeds at the National Archives, from the 13th Century which I believe confirms this. > The very survival of names like Pembroke - Penfro, Tenby - Dinbych y Pysgod ( to distinguish it from Dinbych - Denbigh in North Wales), Manorbier - Maenorbir, Pwllcrochan etc. is evidence of the survival of an articulate local population, who passed on the names. > It probably took several generations before they were completely assimilated, and lost their native tongue. > Pembrokeshire Parsons in WWHR gives several incumbents whose name included "ap", around 1500 in Manorbier Hundred. These were undoubtedly Welsh Speaking, and presumably brought up their offspring to be Bi-Lingual. > There was also a lot more intercourse between the landowning classes in South Pembrokeshire and further afield than is generally recognised. > There are examples of migration of Warrens from Kilgerran and Nevern in North Pembs to the Hundred of Manorbier in the 1700's. > Such an emigre might well have named his property by a Welsh Name. > There are probably hundreds of houses in Wales at present, named Bella Vista. In 400 years without the benefit of any records or documents might not our descendents believe that the name dated from Roman Times? > Achwr > > > > ======================================== > Message Received: Feb 17 2012, 11:13 PM > From: "Marcus Griffiths" > To: "Gareth" > Cc: "Dyfed List" > Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Was Llanreath now Landsker > > Gareth and Gerry > Thanks for your comments. > I am fairly well aware of the Landsker and it's history (I will spell it > correctly this time!) and have some of Brian John's writings. Indeed I met > his wife and possibly Brian years ago at his wife's candle workshop. > > I was really musing about the scattered Welsh names in the otherwise > English speaking areas and whether there was' even before the railway' > enough movement to suggest a possible explanation for some of these > examples. There were, of course, a reasonable number of Welsh speakers who > migrated to the industry of South Pembrokeshire particularly the Dockyard > which being a government establishment would not have encouraged 'yr hen > iaith' as the national anthem calls Welsh (the old language) > Marcus > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ACHwr > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ACHWR

Has an extended genealogy been done on Meurig ap Llewlyn? I have an immigrant, William Myrick/Merrick/etc, who is "supposed to be" a descendant of Meurig. William was in America by the early 1630's.. I have a copy of a newspaper article stating the Massachusetts Meyrick's descended from Meurig came through the branch that went to Pembrokeshire from Gwynedd. Article has no newspaper name or date. Lewis Dwnn doesn't seem to have tracked my William's branch of the family. Unfortunately the hundreds of Myrick postings on the internet quote each other verbatim and, according to Dwnn, those postings are not correct. Thanks Kay in California

What about my ancestry? Devereux in Lamphey. Vera

Is anyone aware of a comprehensive list of surnames for Wales that have been classified in the past by the Heralds, etc. as "Advenae"? I need this information in my hip pocket for WDYTYA next week and a meeting with Dr. Turi King. Brian -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of yr achwr Sent: 17 February 2012 23:47 To: Marcus Griffiths; Gareth Cc: Dyfed List Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Was Llanreath now Landsker Marcus I agree with you that the position is not completely Black and White. There is a common perception, that below the Landsker Line, the indigenous Welsh population were "wiped out". This is probably true of Rhos Hundred, where the Flemmings were settled. There is scarcely a place name that is Welsh in Origin, or a Church dedicated to a Celtic SaInt. George Owen, refers to the hatred of the Flemmings who "reading between the lines" had indulged in ethnic cleansing. Manorbier Hundred however, which is South of the Haven, and the original area settled by the Normans reveals a completely different story. The survival of so many names derived from Welsh, and the numerous Churches dedicated to Welsh or Celtic Saints, in the area, suggests that for the bulk of the population, it was simply a matter of a change of Overlord. There are extant Deeds at the National Archives, from the 13th Century which I believe confirms this. The very survival of names like Pembroke - Penfro, Tenby - Dinbych y Pysgod ( to distinguish it from Dinbych - Denbigh in North Wales), Manorbier - Maenorbir, Pwllcrochan etc. is evidence of the survival of an articulate local population, who passed on the names. It probably took several generations before they were completely assimilated, and lost their native tongue. Pembrokeshire Parsons in WWHR gives several incumbents whose name included "ap", around 1500 in Manorbier Hundred. These were undoubtedly Welsh Speaking, and presumably brought up their offspring to be Bi-Lingual. There was also a lot more intercourse between the landowning classes in South Pembrokeshire and further afield than is generally recognised. There are examples of migration of Warrens from Kilgerran and Nevern in North Pembs to the Hundred of Manorbier in the 1700's. Such an emigre might well have named his property by a Welsh Name. There are probably hundreds of houses in Wales at present, named Bella Vista. In 400 years without the benefit of any records or documents might not our descendents believe that the name dated from Roman Times? Achwr Message Received: Feb 17 2012, 11:13 PM From: "Marcus Griffiths" To: "Gareth" Cc: "Dyfed List" Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Was Llanreath now Landsker Gareth and Gerry Thanks for your comments. I am fairly well aware of the Landsker and it's history (I will spell it correctly this time!) and have some of Brian John's writings. Indeed I met his wife and possibly Brian years ago at his wife's candle workshop. I was really musing about the scattered Welsh names in the otherwise English speaking areas and whether there was' even before the railway' enough movement to suggest a possible explanation for some of these examples. There were, of course, a reasonable number of Welsh speakers who migrated to the industry of South Pembrokeshire particularly the Dockyard which being a government establishment would not have encouraged 'yr hen iaith' as the national anthem calls Welsh (the old language) Marcus ==================== Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks so much for this interesting discussion. Achwyr can you please post the "George Owen" reference and any other sources? I would like to read more about this. My father's lineage is almost all from the area south of Milford Haven (if fact this summer I plan on exploring ancestral locations such as Tenby, Manorbier, Pwllcrochan and Penfro by walking this part of the Pembrokeshire coastal trail). Darryl ------------------------------------------------- Darryl Gwynne, Glen Williams, Canada (GWYNNE WADE SKONE YOUNG ADAMS) -------------------------------------------------- On 2012-02-17, at 6:47 PM, yr achwr <[email protected]> wrote: > Marcus, > I agree with you that the position is not completely Black and White. > > There is a common perception, that below the Landsker Line, the indigenous Welsh population were "wiped out". > This is probably true of Rhos Hundred, where the Flemmings were settled. There is scarcely a place name that is Welsh in Origin, or a Church dedicated to a Celtic SaInt. George Owen, refers to the hatred of the Flemmings who "reading between the lines" had indulged in ethnic cleansing. > Manorbier Hundred however, which is South of the Haven, and the original area settled by the Normans reveals a completely different story. > The survival of so many names derived from Welsh, and the numerous Churches dedicated to Welsh or Celtic Saints, in the area, suggests that for the bulk of the population, it was simply a matter of a change of Overlord. > There are extant Deeds at the National Archives, from the 13th Century which I believe confirms this. > The very survival of names like Pembroke - Penfro, Tenby - Dinbych y Pysgod ( to distinguish it from Dinbych - Denbigh in North Wales), Manorbier - Maenorbir, Pwllcrochan etc. is evidence of the survival of an articulate local population, who passed on the names. > It probably took several generations before they were completely assimilated, and lost their native tongue. > Pembrokeshire Parsons in WWHR gives several incumbents whose name included "ap", around 1500 in Manorbier Hundred. These were undoubtedly Welsh Speaking, and presumably brought up their offspring to be Bi-Lingual. > There was also a lot more intercourse between the landowning classes in South Pembrokeshire and further afield than is generally recognised. > There are examples of migration of Warrens from Kilgerran and Nevern in North Pembs to the Hundred of Manorbier in the 1700's. > Such an emigre might well have named his property by a Welsh Name. > There are probably hundreds of houses in Wales at present, named Bella Vista. In 400 years without the benefit of any records or documents might not our descendents believe that the name dated from Roman Times? > Achwr > > > > ======================================== > Message Received: Feb 17 2012, 11:13 PM > From: "Marcus Griffiths" > To: "Gareth" > Cc: "Dyfed List" > Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Was Llanreath now Landsker > > Gareth and Gerry > Thanks for your comments. > I am fairly well aware of the Landsker and it's history (I will spell it > correctly this time!) and have some of Brian John's writings. Indeed I met > his wife and possibly Brian years ago at his wife's candle workshop. > > I was really musing about the scattered Welsh names in the otherwise > English speaking areas and whether there was' even before the railway' > enough movement to suggest a possible explanation for some of these > examples. There were, of course, a reasonable number of Welsh speakers who > migrated to the industry of South Pembrokeshire particularly the Dockyard > which being a government establishment would not have encouraged 'yr hen > iaith' as the national anthem calls Welsh (the old language) > Marcus > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ACHwr > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

There is also currently free access to Canadian birth, marriage, death and obituary records. Jonathan Pike -----Original Message----- From: Dai & Angela Bevan Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2012 7:42 AM To: dyfed Subject: [Dyfed] US 1930 census. Hi All, Anyone with connections in the USA may be interested to know that Ancestry.com are offering free access to the US 1930 census this weekend. Happy hunting, Dai ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi All, Anyone with connections in the USA may be interested to know that Ancestry.com are offering free access to the US 1930 census this weekend. Happy hunting, Dai

Marcus, I agree with you that the position is not completely Black and White. There is a common perception, that below the Landsker Line, the indigenous Welsh population were "wiped out". This is probably true of Rhos Hundred, where the Flemmings were settled. There is scarcely a place name that is Welsh in Origin, or a Church dedicated to a Celtic SaInt. George Owen, refers to the hatred of the Flemmings who "reading between the lines" had indulged in ethnic cleansing. Manorbier Hundred however, which is South of the Haven, and the original area settled by the Normans reveals a completely different story. The survival of so many names derived from Welsh, and the numerous Churches dedicated to Welsh or Celtic Saints, in the area, suggests that for the bulk of the population, it was simply a matter of a change of Overlord. There are extant Deeds at the National Archives, from the 13th Century which I believe confirms this. The very survival of names like Pembroke - Penfro, Tenby - Dinbych y Pysgod ( to distinguish it from Dinbych - Denbigh in North Wales), Manorbier - Maenorbir, Pwllcrochan etc. is evidence of the survival of an articulate local population, who passed on the names. It probably took several generations before they were completely assimilated, and lost their native tongue. Pembrokeshire Parsons in WWHR gives several incumbents whose name included "ap", around 1500 in Manorbier Hundred. These were undoubtedly Welsh Speaking, and presumably brought up their offspring to be Bi-Lingual. There was also a lot more intercourse between the landowning classes in South Pembrokeshire and further afield than is generally recognised. There are examples of migration of Warrens from Kilgerran and Nevern in North Pembs to the Hundred of Manorbier in the 1700's. Such an emigre might well have named his property by a Welsh Name. There are probably hundreds of houses in Wales at present, named Bella Vista. In 400 years without the benefit of any records or documents might not our descendents believe that the name dated from Roman Times? Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Feb 17 2012, 11:13 PM From: "Marcus Griffiths" To: "Gareth" Cc: "Dyfed List" Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Was Llanreath now Landsker Gareth and Gerry Thanks for your comments. I am fairly well aware of the Landsker and it's history (I will spell it correctly this time!) and have some of Brian John's writings. Indeed I met his wife and possibly Brian years ago at his wife's candle workshop. I was really musing about the scattered Welsh names in the otherwise English speaking areas and whether there was' even before the railway' enough movement to suggest a possible explanation for some of these examples. There were, of course, a reasonable number of Welsh speakers who migrated to the industry of South Pembrokeshire particularly the Dockyard which being a government establishment would not have encouraged 'yr hen iaith' as the national anthem calls Welsh (the old language) Marcus ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ACHwr

Hi Gareth, It's something that never crossed my mind. However I think Joseph's family out there would have had some knowledge if it had happened. Having married a school teacher nearly 52 years ago I could not agree with you more. John. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gareth Morgan" <[email protected]> To: "Dyfed FamHist" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2012 1:02 AM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] 1881 Census Hello John Their younger brother went to Australia. Could other members of the family have gone out to? As for having to give up schoolmistressing, her gran and her mother were both schoolmistresses, so I can't see her retiring completely upon getting married. Gareth --- On Wed, 15/2/12, John <[email protected]> wrote: Hi List, Could someone please check the 1881 census for a lodger at 1 Monkton Lane, Pembroke St Mary, Pembrokeshire, Wales. Looking for RICHARDS, Sarah/Sarah Jane/Sarah Mary. ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2112/4811 - Release Date: 02/15/12 ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2112/4814 - Release Date: 02/16/12

Gareth and Gerry Thanks for your comments. I am fairly well aware of the Landsker and it's history (I will spell it correctly this time!) and have some of Brian John's writings. Indeed I met his wife and possibly Brian years ago at his wife's candle workshop. I was really musing about the scattered Welsh names in the otherwise English speaking areas and whether there was' even before the railway' enough movement to suggest a possible explanation for some of these examples. There were, of course, a reasonable number of Welsh speakers who migrated to the industry of South Pembrokeshire particularly the Dockyard which being a government establishment would not have encouraged 'yr hen iaith' as the national anthem calls Welsh (the old language) Marcus

The Quakers made a centralised, indexed digest of all their baptisms, marriages and burials before they surrendered their registers in 1837 - and I think this applied to Wales. That is in Class RG 6 at the TNA - and is online, I think with Origins. You seem to need subscriptions to three organisations these days to be sure you get all databases. And that is before you start talking newspapers or Deaths Online. All of these resources are fairly vital in a DNA project if you are trying to trace people forwards. Brian -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Lynne Ingalls Sent: 17 February 2012 17:05 To: Gwyneth Guy; [email protected] Subject: Re: [Dyfed] CMN Llangunnor PEM Haverfordwest SMITH andPUDDICOMBE1800s Sorry that didn't work out, Gwyneth. If Rebecca was from a Quaker family, I don't think you'll find a baptismal record as they don't baptize. I don't know how they recorded births. Maybe someone on the mail list is more knowledgeable. If from a non-Quaker family and if her baptism is recorded in parish records, I would suggest you keep checking FamilySearch as I think they are currently transcribing and indexing other baptismal records for Wales. There is at least one other person researching Rebecca Smith Puddicombe on Ancestry.com: Arbre généalogique de VAN EYCK Have you contacted them? Lynne -----Original Message----- From: Gwyneth Guy Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 4:49 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Dyfed] CMN Llangunnor PEM Haverfordwest SMITH and PUDDICOMBE1800s Thanks, Lynne and Brian I have the later history of Rebecca in Carmarthen, but don't have access to any birth/baptism registers for Haverforwest which would cover her possible birth date of c1797. I checked out the non-Conformist registered birth and it was a Quaker record covering Herefordshire, Worcestershire, and Wales, but referred to a Rebecca Smith birth in Stourbridge. Gwyneth ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi: there was a comment made in one of the past newsletters regarding schoolmistresses keeping their jobs. I don't know if they kept their jobs in the UK or not but in North Central Illinois in the 1890's a woman teacher lived on a prosperous farm with her husband and children. Her husband died. The people in the area came and sold the farm out from under the schoolteacher. they took her children away from her because she could not possibly raise them alone. And then the Board of Education informed her that she could no longer teach. My grandfather tried to stop them. He was a schoolteacher in the same school as the woman teacher. He became so angry at the discrimination against this woman teacher that he eventually quit teaching school in the State of Illinois. Illinois prides itself on being the "Land of Lincoln." ????? Annie

And another article The term 'landsker' in Pembrokeshire by G. M. Awbery. http://welshjournals.llgc.org.uk/browse/viewpage/llgc-id:1165908/llgc-id:1166168/llgc-id:1166202/get650 Gareth Genuki Wales http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/ Help Page http://home.clara.net/tirbach/hicks.html Cwmgors a'r Waun http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cwmgors/Waun.html -----Original Message----- From: Gareth Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 6:03 PM To: Dyfed List Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Llanreath Hi Marcus To add a little to what Gerry said. The article "The linguistic significance of the Pembrokeshire landsker" by Brian S.John that Gerry mentions on my Help Page feature he referred you to is now online on Welsh Journals Online http://welshjournals.llgc.org.uk/browse/viewpage/llgc-id:1041698/llgc-id:1041935/llgc-id:1041944/get650 Gareth Genuki Wales http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/ Help Page http://home.clara.net/tirbach/hicks.html Cwmgors a'r Waun http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cwmgors/Waun.html -----Original Message----- From: Gerry Lewis Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 5:52 PM To: Dyfed List Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Llanreath On 17/2/12 16:50, "Marcus griffiths" <[email protected]> wrote: > I think we need to remember that however marked the Lansker line might > be the distances are not far (22 miles Llandewi Velfry to Stackpole - > they moved via Narberth and Manobier over a few years). > > I would be interested in others comments. > > Marcus Griffiths Hello Marcus 22 miles can be described as not far now, but before the coming of the railway to Pembrokeshire (1854) people did not travel very far and the Landsker then was a language dividing line [see http://home.clara.net/tirbach/HelpPagepearlsPEM.html#Landsker for an analysis of some parishes north, on and south of the line in 1891]. Most marriages in Llandewi Velfrey before 1812 were between couples who both lived in the parish. See my posting to the Dyfed list:- http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/th/read/DYFED/2007-02/1170529269. Gerry Lewis ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Marcus To add a little to what Gerry said. The article "The linguistic significance of the Pembrokeshire landsker" by Brian S.John that Gerry mentions on my Help Page feature he referred you to is now online on Welsh Journals Online http://welshjournals.llgc.org.uk/browse/viewpage/llgc-id:1041698/llgc-id:1041935/llgc-id:1041944/get650 Gareth Genuki Wales http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/ Help Page http://home.clara.net/tirbach/hicks.html Cwmgors a'r Waun http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cwmgors/Waun.html -----Original Message----- From: Gerry Lewis Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 5:52 PM To: Dyfed List Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Llanreath On 17/2/12 16:50, "Marcus griffiths" <[email protected]> wrote: > I think we need to remember that however marked the Lansker line might > be the distances are not far (22 miles Llandewi Velfry to Stackpole - > they moved via Narberth and Manobier over a few years). > > I would be interested in others comments. > > Marcus Griffiths Hello Marcus 22 miles can be described as not far now, but before the coming of the railway to Pembrokeshire (1854) people did not travel very far and the Landsker then was a language dividing line [see http://home.clara.net/tirbach/HelpPagepearlsPEM.html#Landsker for an analysis of some parishes north, on and south of the line in 1891]. Most marriages in Llandewi Velfrey before 1812 were between couples who both lived in the parish. See my posting to the Dyfed list:- http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/th/read/DYFED/2007-02/1170529269. Gerry Lewis ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

On 17/2/12 16:50, "Marcus griffiths" <[email protected]> wrote: > I think we need to remember that however marked the Lansker line might > be the distances are not far (22 miles Llandewi Velfry to Stackpole - > they moved via Narberth and Manobier over a few years). > > I would be interested in others comments. > > Marcus Griffiths Hello Marcus 22 miles can be described as not far now, but before the coming of the railway to Pembrokeshire (1854) people did not travel very far and the Landsker then was a language dividing line [see http://home.clara.net/tirbach/HelpPagepearlsPEM.html#Landsker for an analysis of some parishes north, on and south of the line in 1891]. Most marriages in Llandewi Velfrey before 1812 were between couples who both lived in the parish. See my posting to the Dyfed list:- http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/th/read/DYFED/2007-02/1170529269. Gerry Lewis

Rather belatedly I am entering this discussion. My father was born in Pembroke Dock, where my grandfather worked in the Dockyard till it closed in the 1920's. I have always been interested in the names around this supposedly very 'English' area of South Pembs. which have obvious Welsh origins - even if corrupted over the years. I have assumed there are both 'old' names that have survived ?e.g. Pwllcrochen and ?neighbouring Rhoscrowther. In P.D itself Llanion (presumably 'churches' or enclosures). There also seem to be more recent (?17-19th centuries) names of some farms - including where some of my ancesters worked (eg Trewent near Stckpole Elidor). On both sides of my grandparents family there were Welsh speakers from Llandewi Velfry, Wiston, Bletherston etc. I just wonder if they went to work on farms where the owners were also Welsh-speaking and so had named their farms accordingly. I think we need to remember that however marked the Lansker line might be the distances are not far (22 miles Llandewi Velfry to Stackpole - they moved via Narberth and Manobier over a few years). I would be interested in others comments. Marcus Griffiths

Hi Anthony Thank you for letting me know that you found it interesting. I am pleased to hear it. Best Wishes Sylvia Pembrokeshire Census, Memorials, Hearths, Orielton CD's and Baptist Sketches at www.cenquest.co.uk <http://www.cenquest.co.uk/> _____ From: Anthony Jenkins [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: 17 February 2012 13:58 To: Sylvia Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Orielton Hi Sylvia A fascinating read on Orielton - especially as my great great grandfather and my great, great great grandfather worked on the estate. Thank you for making this information available Anthony Jenkins On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 1:14 PM, Sylvia <[email protected]> wrote: Dear All I have been asked if I have anything else on Orielton. Log onto www.cenquest.co.uk <http://www.cenquest.co.uk/> and click on History you will then see Orielton, click on it. You may find that an interesting read. Best Wishes Sylvia Pembrokeshire Census, Memorials, Hearths, Orielton CD's and Baptist Sketches at www.cenquest.co.uk

Dear All I have been asked if I have anything else on Orielton. Log onto www.cenquest.co.uk <http://www.cenquest.co.uk/> and click on History you will then see Orielton, click on it. You may find that an interesting read. Best Wishes Sylvia Pembrokeshire Census, Memorials, Hearths, Orielton CD's and Baptist Sketches at www.cenquest.co.uk <http://www.cenquest.co.uk/>