Charani The "dim and distant past" is only one use of DNA information to understand our roots (e.g. The National Genographic Project that seeks to understand past migrations etc of our ancestors.) However, there are more "fine scale" analyses that can be very useful to family history studies e.g. confirming hypotheses from studies of documents. An example: I inherit my surname from my 3x g grandmother Mary, a single mum who died in her 30s in the Pembroke Workhouse. The only lead I had to the paternity of her surviving son James Gwynne was the "father" on his marriage certificate, a James "Meriless". I had no evidence that the paths of Mary and James M. had even crossed but censuses etc uncovered a suspect - James Merrilees living in south Wales at the right time, but miles from Pembroke in Whitland Abbey, but with an occupation (steward) that matched that on James Gwynne's marriage certificate. It was my luck that the Scottish Merrilees clan were conducting a world wide Y chromosome study and my Y DNA sequence (37 loci) was a near perfect match for other extant Merrilees males, thus confirming my hypothesis beyond any reasonable doubt that Merrilees had inseminated my 3x great grandmother. Cheers Darryl ------------------------------------------------- Darryl Gwynne Glen Williams, Canada -------------------------------------------------- On 2012-03-17, at 11:29 AM, Charani <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Until DNA can tell me the name of my 5xgr grandfather's father was > (for instance) Luke and his father was Matthew and that Luke had a > younger son called Mark, it will remain a gimmick and "must have" that > has no real place in family history. That DNA *might* tell me my > origins lie in Africa or that a family with no known paper connection > to mine *may* be related isn't good enough for me. Knowing where my > origins *probably* lie in the dim and distant past is irrelevant to my > current research which is millenia later. OK, I'm related to Moses > but NOT *the* Moses, just a guy who was named after him about 250 > years ago and who is now long dead. > > DNA has a place in the sciences but not, as far as I'm concerned, in > family history. > > I'd rather see OCR brought closer to perfection and Latin documents > accompanied by an accurate modern language translation before DNA is > given more credence than perhaps it deserves. > > -- > Charani (UK) > OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM > Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM > http://wsom-opc.org.uk > http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/ > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Photos of: St Stephen's Church, Old Radnor, RAD; St Mary's Church, Newtown, MGY; Crescent Presbyterian Church, Newtown, MGY; God the Holy Ghost RC Church, Newtown, MGY Dear Listers, In the past week I have added the following subjects to my 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection': St Stephen's Church, Old Radnor, in the county of Radnorshire. (Photography by John Ball) St Mary's Church (ruins of), Newtown, in the county of Monmouthshire. (Photography by John Ball) Crescent Presbyterian Church, Newtown, in the county of Montgomeryshire. (Photography by John Ball and Google StreetView) God the Holy Ghost Roman Catholic Church, Newtown, in the county of Montgomeryshire. (Photography by John Ball and Google StreetView) Go to www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/churches/search-fram.htm and scroll down the index to the relevant Old Radnor and Newtown links. Kind regards, John -------------------- John Ball, Brecon, Mid-Wales, UK E-mail: [email protected] Website: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/ Images of Wales: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/ Welsh Family History Archive: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/wales/ Joint Webmaster - Breconshire Local & Family History Society http://www.blfhs.c.uk/ GENUKI Breconshire Maintainer: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/BRE/ Administrator - Powys (& BRE/MGY/RAD) RootsWeb mailing lists

Brian P. Swann wrote: > Well - let's try and widen the debate a bit. > I wonder if anyone on this list watched any of RootsTech in Salt Lake City > about just over a month ago? I heard about it but didn't watch it at all. 8>< > I did watch the team from Ancestry through their whole 1 hour presentation. 8>< > But Optical Character Recognition and indexing of handwriting remains a bit > of a holy grail. And you have to do that before you can get into latin and > other real paleographical challenges. But if anyone can tackle that - I > think they can. I think the challenge of OCR definitely needs addressing and Ancestry are the most likely to be able to crack it. When and if they can, it's going to open a fantastic insight into the past, not just for the family connections. TBH, if Ancestry can afford to spend $12-15m, then I'd rather see them working with FMP to digitise as many of the parish registers and old documents as they can between them and share their databases for safety as much as anything. I'm not knocking the efforts of FreeREG at all: not everyone can afford the annual subs. A transcript is better than nothing. It can also be quicker to skim through a transcript to find a family member than struggle through a parish register that looks as though a drunken spider that's fallen in an ink pot has staggered across a sheet of vellum. The image can then be used to confirm (or not). Many libraries have Ancestry, some have FMP as well, but it's more convenient to be able to access them from home, which is something Ancestry won't allow (AIUI). Much depends, I believe, on the type of licence the County Library has purchased. With the economic climate as it is currently, some libraries are looking at cutting back on the number of such subscriptions they'll take out. > Essentially that is where the family history revolution is heading now, in > my opinion - back more into 17th century and earlier research by far more > people, faster than ever. Agreed :)) I'm seeing more and more researchers who are that far back and further. At one time researchers considered themselves lucky to get into the early to mid 18th century. Once back into the 17th century, sources other than parish registers are needed as the PRs start to thin out or cease to be extant. > So all those estate records start to become important for Wales - let alone > the Court of the Great Sessions material. Not just for Wales, although that is the primary focus as far as this list is concerned. > But OCR scanning and indexing directly of older documents would be a > game-changer for everyone, as will DNA. Absolutely, although there is another obstacle to be overcome. and that is the resistance of some diocese to allowing their holdings to be put online at all, let alone on a subscription site. This is something that affects parts of England but I'm not sure Wales is similarly affected. There are some archives and record offices which are resistent as well because, rightly or wrongly, they fear for their jobs. Until DNA can tell me the name of my 5xgr grandfather's father was (for instance) Luke and his father was Matthew and that Luke had a younger son called Mark, it will remain a gimmick and "must have" that has no real place in family history. That DNA *might* tell me my origins lie in Africa or that a family with no known paper connection to mine *may* be related isn't good enough for me. Knowing where my origins *probably* lie in the dim and distant past is irrelevant to my current research which is millenia later. OK, I'm related to Moses but NOT *the* Moses, just a guy who was named after him about 250 years ago and who is now long dead. DNA has a place in the sciences but not, as far as I'm concerned, in family history. I'd rather see OCR brought closer to perfection and Latin documents accompanied by an accurate modern language translation before DNA is given more credence than perhaps it deserves. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/

Well - let's try and widen the debate a bit. I wonder if anyone on this list watched any of RootsTech in Salt Lake City about just over a month ago? It runs for 3 days, now attracts about 3,000 folk (nearly all Americans, of course) - and is becoming the place to go to for the latest in IT in relation to family history. I did watch the team from Ancestry through their whole 1 hour presentation. Two things stuck in my mind - they have spent $12 to $15 million dollars on DNA over the past year, in terms of upgrading their game. In anyone's language that is a non-trivial sum of money. If they can put most of London and Middlesex parish registers online - they can do most things. But Optical Character Recognition and indexing of handwriting remains a bit of a holy grail. And you have to do that before you can get into latin and other real paleographical challenges. But if anyone can tackle that - I think they can. Essentially that is where the family history revolution is heading now, in my opinion - back more into 17th century and earlier research by far more people, faster than ever. So all those estate records start to become important for Wales - let alone the Court of the Great Sessions material. But OCR scanning and indexing directly of older documents would be a game-changer for everyone, as will DNA. Brian -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Charani Sent: 17 March 2012 11:00 To: 'Dyfed List' Subject: Re: [Dyfed] NLW scanning Welsh newspapers to put online Brian P. Swann wrote: Think this is a perfectly valid reason to get excited. I have certainly made quite extensive use of them in the USA to reconstitute families. I agree. Newpapers can add plenty of meat to the bare bones of a family as well as pointers for further research. So much stuff is going online now - it is getting quite difficult to remember where to go. Agreed - again :)) I bookmark any new site or database but I have so many, I forget I have them. We have a talk on Wednesday at the West Surrey FHS by Jeannie Bunting entitled - Is the Internet Spoiling the Fun of the Chase? I think the answer is NO - but I will be interested to see which side she comes down on Another agreement :)) The chase is still there and the internet is making it a LOT easier to chase down families all over the country and all over the world. It's no longer necessary to wait weeks or months to get replies to queries or copy documents or to find the time to visit archives. What has changed is the joy of being able to handle original registers and often other documents as well. So much is now on fiche or film. There is definitely a magic in holding and reading a register 200+ years old or an agreement dating from the 1600s and earlier. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/ ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Joan - I do not know. Maybe someone in Wales can tell us. L. -----Original Message----- From: Gary Williams Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2012 11:16 AM To: Lynne Ingalls Subject: Re: [Dyfed] NLW scanning Welsh newspapers to put online Are these newspaper written in Welsh or English? Joan Williams, Florida Sent from my iPad On Mar 17, 2012, at 1:36 PM, "Lynne Ingalls" <[email protected]> wrote: > Brian/Charani - I thought I might jump into the debate a little. While > I > missed the Roots Tech presentation, I do think DNA studies are of some use > to researchers. I had a lady in Florida contact me about my surname and > wanted my brother to submit a DNA sample so that she and her friends could > determine if their Ingles ancestors were related to our Ingalls ancestors. > It turned out some of them were barking up the wrong tree, so it saved > them > a lot of time researching the wrong family. For those who were a match, > it > reinforced the information we had tracing the family back to England > (Lincolnshire) in the late 1590's. We assume we were part of the Viking > invasion? > > I'd like to tie into someone's DNA on my mom's side of the family now - > the > Obray's from Pembrokeshire. I think it may be the only way thru the block > wall I've encountered. I'm heading to Salt Lake later this summer to find > a > male Obray willing to undergo a grueling DNA test (kidding). Then I hope > to > find an Aubrey somewhere in Wales to see if it’s a match. In the > meantime, > I look forward to the newspapers coming on-line. > > Lynne in Tucson > > -----Original Message----- > From: Charani > Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2012 8:29 AM > To: Brian P. Swann > Cc: 'Dyfed List' > Subject: Re: [Dyfed] NLW scanning Welsh newspapers to put online > > Brian P. Swann wrote: >> Well - let's try and widen the debate a bit. > > > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

Brian P. Swann wrote: > Think this is a perfectly valid reason to get excited. > > I have certainly made quite extensive use of them in the USA to reconstitute > families. I agree. Newpapers can add plenty of meat to the bare bones of a family as well as pointers for further research. > So much stuff is going online now - it is getting quite difficult to > remember where to go. Agreed - again :)) I bookmark any new site or database but I have so many, I forget I have them. > We have a talk on Wednesday at the West Surrey FHS by Jeannie Bunting > entitled - Is the Internet Spoiling the Fun of the Chase? > > I think the answer is NO - but I will be interested to see which side she > comes down on Another agreement :)) The chase is still there and the internet is making it a LOT easier to chase down families all over the country and all over the world. It's no longer necessary to wait weeks or months to get replies to queries or copy documents or to find the time to visit archives. What has changed is the joy of being able to handle original registers and often other documents as well. So much is now on fiche or film. There is definitely a magic in holding and reading a register 200+ years old or an agreement dating from the 1600s and earlier. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/

Brian/Charani - I thought I might jump into the debate a little. While I missed the Roots Tech presentation, I do think DNA studies are of some use to researchers. I had a lady in Florida contact me about my surname and wanted my brother to submit a DNA sample so that she and her friends could determine if their Ingles ancestors were related to our Ingalls ancestors. It turned out some of them were barking up the wrong tree, so it saved them a lot of time researching the wrong family. For those who were a match, it reinforced the information we had tracing the family back to England (Lincolnshire) in the late 1590's. We assume we were part of the Viking invasion? I'd like to tie into someone's DNA on my mom's side of the family now - the Obray's from Pembrokeshire. I think it may be the only way thru the block wall I've encountered. I'm heading to Salt Lake later this summer to find a male Obray willing to undergo a grueling DNA test (kidding). Then I hope to find an Aubrey somewhere in Wales to see if it’s a match. In the meantime, I look forward to the newspapers coming on-line. Lynne in Tucson -----Original Message----- From: Charani Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2012 8:29 AM To: Brian P. Swann Cc: 'Dyfed List' Subject: Re: [Dyfed] NLW scanning Welsh newspapers to put online Brian P. Swann wrote: > Well - let's try and widen the debate a bit.

Dear Alison Think this is a perfectly valid reason to get excited. I have certainly made quite extensive use of them in the USA to reconstitute families. So much stuff is going online now - it is getting quite difficult to remember where to go. We have a talk on Wednesday at the West Surrey FHS by Jeannie Bunting entitled - Is the Internet Spoiling the Fun of the Chase? I think the answer is NO - but I will be interested to see which side she comes down on Brian -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Alison Bryan Sent: 17 March 2012 08:27 To: [email protected]; Dyfed List Subject: [Dyfed] NLW scanning Welsh newspapers to put online Dear all Something to look forward to, NLW are digitalising Welsh newspapers (which are out of copyright) and will be freely available online: http://www.llgc.org.uk/blog/?p=3499 I'm probably more excited about this than I should be! Alison ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear all Something to look forward to, NLW are digitalising Welsh newspapers (which are out of copyright) and will be freely available online: http://www.llgc.org.uk/blog/?p=3499 I'm probably more excited about this than I should be! Alison

Dear List   Those who don't watch tv (like me) might have missed this lovely story of the brothers of Nantllwyd   http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-mid-wales-17301811   Jen

Hello Thanks very much for your help and the information . regards, Buddug ----- Original Message ----- From: "Delyth & Dave Wilson" <[email protected]> To: "'Buddug Hollett'" <[email protected]> Cc: "Dyfed list" <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 11:07 AM Subject: RE: [Dyfed] monumental inscriptions > Cardiganshire FHS have produced 19 booklets of MI including Eglwys Newydd > all available from the society or via genfair. Strata Florida was produced > by Evan & Auronwy James and is available in the NLW, Ceridigion Archives & > Aberystwyth library. I am (with help) at the moment producing an index of > all the MI in the county of Ceridigion, very much a work in progress and > relies on producers of transcripts making an index available for me to > include. > To answer your question, there is no Mary JONES with a Memorial in Eglwys > Newydd, nearest is 1829 There is no Mary JONES memorial in Ystradfflur, > the > nearest is 1831. Sorry not much help. Dave > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Buddug Hollett > Sent: 11 March 2012 08:11 > To: [email protected] > Subject: [Dyfed] monumental inscriptions > > Hi > Despite having some good results whilst searching the burial index (find > my > past),I have now hit a brick wall .There are a few entries I'm interested > in where the original document is not viewable ,this means that I can't > tell > the abode of the person . > I wonder if there's anyone with access to the monumental inscriptions for > Strata Florida and /or Eglwys Newydd who might be prepared to check to see > if there's anything on a Mary Jones died /buried 1835 ,one in Eglwys > Newydd > and the other in Strata Florida . > Many thanks again > Buddug Hollett > > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in > the subject and the body of the message >

I wrote up my wartime experiences which follow on from the book I recently made available on the list. If anyone would like to read that I will send it. Vera

Cardiganshire FHS have produced 19 booklets of MI including Eglwys Newydd all available from the society or via genfair. Strata Florida was produced by Evan & Auronwy James and is available in the NLW, Ceridigion Archives & Aberystwyth library. I am (with help) at the moment producing an index of all the MI in the county of Ceridigion, very much a work in progress and relies on producers of transcripts making an index available for me to include. To answer your question, there is no Mary JONES with a Memorial in Eglwys Newydd, nearest is 1829 There is no Mary JONES memorial in Ystradfflur, the nearest is 1831. Sorry not much help. Dave -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Buddug Hollett Sent: 11 March 2012 08:11 To: [email protected] Subject: [Dyfed] monumental inscriptions Hi Despite having some good results whilst searching the burial index (find my past),I have now hit a brick wall .There are a few entries I'm interested in where the original document is not viewable ,this means that I can't tell the abode of the person . I wonder if there's anyone with access to the monumental inscriptions for Strata Florida and /or Eglwys Newydd who might be prepared to check to see if there's anything on a Mary Jones died /buried 1835 ,one in Eglwys Newydd and the other in Strata Florida . Many thanks again Buddug Hollett ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Despite having some good results whilst searching the burial index (find my past),I have now hit a brick wall .There are a few entries I'm interested in where the original document is not viewable ,this means that I can't tell the abode of the person . I wonder if there's anyone with access to the monumental inscriptions for Strata Florida and /or Eglwys Newydd who might be prepared to check to see if there's anything on a Mary Jones died /buried 1835 ,one in Eglwys Newydd and the other in Strata Florida . Many thanks again Buddug Hollett

Jen   It was in Vol 3, nos. 1-4 1956-1959.  The easy way to find it is to go to the Welsh Journals on Line site and enter "seasonal migration" into the search box.   Megan ________________________________ From: Jennifer Cairns <[email protected]> To: Megan Roberts <[email protected]>; Dyfdd List <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, 10 March 2012, 10:56 Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Old Journals Dear Megan,   Many thanks. What journal year and edition number did the piece on Spitting Cardies come from?    Incidentally, I wonder if statistics show that the incidence of TB went up when the our baccie chewing ancestors arrived in the Vale of Glamorgan? - Spitting in the streets was discouraged from the 1880s to try to control the spread of this disease.   Jen ________________________________ From: Megan Roberts <[email protected]> To: Dyfdd List <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, 10 March 2012, 10:28 Subject: [Dyfed] Old Journals I have from time to time been reading through the some of the journals that are available at “Welsh Journals on Line” site which is a fantastic resource for people wanting to know more about life in past times..Recently I have been reading back issues of the Journal of the Cardiganshire Antiquarian Society and thought list members might be interested in a few snippets from them...snip I had always supposed that my ancestors who left West Wales for the mines in South East Wales did so solely as part of the industrial revolution and the move away from agriculture.  Whilst this was part of it there had been seasonal migrations of harvest gangs from Cardiganshire and Pembrokeshire for years before this returning home after the harvest.   Apparently in the Vale of Glamorgan the “Cardies” were known for their thrift and piety.  They slept in the farmer’s barns, which at night rang with the music of old Welsh hymns, and on Sunday’s filled the “free seats” in the Nonconformist Chapels.  They did however, have one habit that the local Chapel caretakers did not like, namely chewing tobacco.  Apparently they would chew throughout the service, and the more they like the service the more they chewed and spat!   Megan

Dear Megan,   Many thanks. What journal year and edition number did the piece on Spitting Cardies come from?    Incidentally, I wonder if statistics show that the incidence of TB went up when the our baccie chewing ancestors arrived in the Vale of Glamorgan? - Spitting in the streets was discouraged from the 1880s to try to control the spread of this disease.   Jen From: Megan Roberts <[email protected]> To: Dyfdd List <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, 10 March 2012, 10:28 Subject: [Dyfed] Old Journals I have from time to time been reading through the some of the journals that are available at “Welsh Journals on Line” site which is a fantastic resource for people wanting to know more about life in past times..Recently I have been reading back issues of the Journal of the Cardiganshire Antiquarian Society and thought list members might be interested in a few snippets from them...snip I had always supposed that my ancestors who left West Wales for the mines in South East Wales did so solely as part of the industrial revolution and the move away from agriculture.  Whilst this was part of it there had been seasonal migrations of harvest gangs from Cardiganshire and Pembrokeshire for years before this returning home after the harvest.   Apparently in the Vale of Glamorgan the “Cardies” were known for their thrift and piety.  They slept in the farmer’s barns, which at night rang with the music of old Welsh hymns, and on Sunday’s filled the “free seats” in the Nonconformist Chapels.  They did however, have one habit that the local Chapel caretakers did not like, namely chewing tobacco.  Apparently they would chew throughout the service, and the more they like the service the more they chewed and spat!   Megan

I have from time to time been reading through the some of the journals that are available at “Welsh Journals on Line” site which is a fantastic resource for people wanting to know more about life in past times.   Recently I have been reading back issues of the Journal of the Cardiganshire Antiquarian Society and thought list members might be interested in a few snippets from them.   Lead mining was a key activity in Cardiganshire not only for the lead ore itself but also for the silver ore that was there.  In 1698 Sir Humphrey Mackworth of Neath decided to raise money for the development of his mines.  His Yorkshire born mine manager put together a prospectus which promised investors an annual profit of £171,970 9s. 9d. from the sale of lead alone.  Silver ore profits would be in addition to this.  Sir Humphrey had bought the shares in his company for £15,000.  Even in today’s money those amounts would be large numbers and provide an amazing return.  The National Archives estimate that £15,000 is about £1.7 million and that £171,000 is about £13 million in today’s terms.   At about the same time gunpowder began to be used in mines reducing the costs of extraction by about 90 per cent (according to Lewis Morris).  I could not find an equivalent analysis of the effect on the miners themselves.  Although there is a note that some miners were forced to buy extortionately priced provisions from shops which had been opened by mining company agents.  Lewis Morris fired one such agent in 1763.   I had always supposed that my ancestors who left West Wales for the mines in South East Wales did so solely as part of the industrial revolution and the move away from agriculture.  Whilst this was part of it there had been seasonal migrations of harvest gangs from Cardiganshire and Pembrokeshire for years before this returning home after the harvest.   Apparently in the Vale of Glamorgan the “Cardies” were known for their thrift and piety.  They slept in the farmer’s barns, which at night rang with the music of old Welsh hymns, and on Sunday’s filled the “free seats” in the Nonconformist Chapels.  They did however, have one habit that the local Chapel caretakers did not like, namely chewing tobacco.  Apparently they would chew throughout the service, and the more they like the service the more they chewed and spat!   Megan

Photos of: Bethel Chapel, Newtown, MGY; Capel Coffa, Newtown, MGY; Severn Place Methodist Church, Newtown, MGY; St Nicholas's Church, New Moat, PEM; Soar-Maesyrhaf Chapel, Neath, GLA Dear Listers, In the past week I have added the following subjects to my 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection': Bethel Calvinistic Methodist Chapel, Newtown, in the county of Montgomeryshire. (Photography by John Ball and Google StreetView) Capel Coffa (Gofa) Independent Chapel, Newtown, in the county of Monmouthshire. (Photography by John Ball) Severn Place Methodist Church, Newtown, in the county of Montgomeryshire. (Photography by John Ball) St Nicholas's Church, New Moat, in the county of Pembrokeshire. (Photography by Dai Bevan, Ceridwen, and Google StreetView) Soar-Maesyrhaf Independent Chapel, Neath, in the county of Glamorgan. (Photography by Gwyn Rowlands and Google StreetView) Go to www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/churches/search-fram.htm and scroll down the index to the relevant Newtown, and New Moat links. Kind regards, John -------------------- John Ball, Brecon, Mid-Wales, UK E-mail: [email protected] Website: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/ Images of Wales: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/ Welsh Family History Archive: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/wales/ Joint Webmaster - Breconshire Local & Family History Society http://www.blfhs.c.uk/ GENUKI Breconshire Maintainer: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/BRE/ Administrator - Powys (& BRE/MGY/RAD) RootsWeb mailing lists

Hello Rachel The only John Powis I can see is the one living in Cardigan with his wife Phoebe and family in 1841 and 1851 as there isn't a John Powis in Haverfordwest in the 1841 census as far as I can see. I can see Thomas and his wife Elizabeth and family in 1841 etc. I expect you have the marriage of Thomas Powis to Elizabeth Griffiths in Haverfordwest St Mary in 1809. There is a marriage of a Thomas Powis to Martha Thomas in Haverfordwest St Martin's in 1777 which could very well be the parents of Thomas and possibly John. There is a Will on the NLW site for a John Powis of Mathry signed in 1828 where he leaves everything to "his brother Thomas Powis". It was witnessed by Elizabeth Powis and J lewis. It states that probate was granted to Thomas Powis of the parish of St Martin. The question is which generation is being referenced. The other Powis will is of John Powis in 1700. Let me know if you can access them OK. All for now Pat In message <[email protected]>, Rachel Boyd <[email protected]> writes >I am revisiting a brick wall, and am hopeful that new parish records may have >seen the light of day in the last year or so, and that sks can help me find >them. I know it's a long shot. >I am looking for parents of Thomas Powis and his assumed brother John Powis, >both resident in H'west in 1841, both born in county. Thomas's headstone in >churchyard of St Thomas, H'west, reads : "Thomas Powis who died January 28, 1861 >in the 77th year of his age." making his birth 1785. John was born 1782, later >moved his family to Cdg, where he died 1862. >  >Rachel Boyd >CT, USA > >================================ >Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] >with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of >the message -- pat

I am revisiting a brick wall, and am hopeful that new parish records may have seen the light of day in the last year or so, and that sks can help me find them. I know it's a long shot. I am looking for parents of Thomas Powis and his assumed brother John Powis, both resident in H'west in 1841, both born in county. Thomas's headstone in churchyard of St Thomas, H'west, reads : "Thomas Powis who died January 28, 1861 in the 77th year of his age." making his birth 1785. John was born 1782, later moved his family to Cdg, where he died 1862.   Rachel Boyd CT, USA