I'm sorry, Diane. I should have made clear I was talking about the IGI records from the old FamilySearch site which many people still use. I often go back to the "Previous Site" and use Advanced Search when using FamilySearch. That allows me to separately access the IGI, or the U.S. Social Security Death Index, or Ancestral File, etc. for what I want. I can many times find the name and address of the submitter on Ancestral File and contact them for more information as they are probably distant cousins. I've received so much more information, as well as pictures and family stories that would never be available to me otherwise. I've also been able to find which of the descendants are from straight male lines for DNA purposes. You are correct about the new FAmilySearch site. The old records were sorted out, as well as the name(s) of the submitters. Lynne -----Original Message----- From: Diana Trenchard Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 5:04 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Dyfed] The Written word. Lynne wrote: Some of the entries on the IGI were extracted from parish records and are, therefore, ok. Other entries were submitted by people in the Mormon Church because they were asked to submit names to the Church fathers so that the deceased person could be baptized by proxy in the Temple. I don't think it was done from malice, but from ignorance. Unfortunately, these records are all combined together on the IGI, and one has to look at each entry to find if it was an extraction (transcription) or a submission. I think the FHL is now in the process of sorting all of that out. [End of quote] Lynne, you are rather out of date. The IGI was sorted some time back so that any information submitted by members is now in a separate database, and those extracted directly from parish registers are now the 'normal' search. Check the Source codes if you don't believe me. They also apparently include records from the Vital Records Index but these are easily distinguishable. The IGI also includes variant spellings, so that 'Tritchard' and 'Transherde' appear for 'Trenchard' I've recently been reconciling my records, obtained personally many moons ago directly from the parish records, with those in the Mormon 'Family Search'. Of the several thousand records I've only found one error, which is understandable as to why it appears. It was for a female named Philip (in the time several centuries back when English women were frequently given male names), and that was the name on the memorial in the parish church erected by her son - and he should certainly have known what his mother was called. It had been erroneously transcribed as Philis. This is in contrast with Ancestry where, on average, one in five entries has an error in my experience of looking at what must be well into thousands of records. Most of these are minor, but the most recent one was where 'Rebekah' had been transcribed as 'Obadiah'. Such major errors can introduce a serious block in research if reliance is placed only on databases of transcriptions such as Ancestry or FindMyPast and, to a lesser extent in the IGI. Since we no longer have access to original parish records, I would recommend that the most reliable databases are those done by the local Family History Societies, frequently obtainable on CD or fiche, then the IGI and last the commercial databases. Note that it is no use the latter providing access to the original parish record if it has been wrongly transcribed in the first place. Diana ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear All, Have been following the conversation with great interest as my experiences have been replicated across the full spectrum so my response is a mixture. My tree on Ancestry is private. It was the only way I could get certain information from near relatives. This then allows me to invite anyone who is interested as a guest so they can see the documentary evidence on the understanding that photos and private documents are no to be copied to a public tree; only two people have bot complied which has caused me problems. My approach attempts to be sensitive and respectful of the work these people have undertaken yet the responses have been as varied as those described. Two examples of the positive variety. Having pointed out the documentary evidence on their tree regarding the death registration of my great grandmother the person concerned removed the same reference for her great grandmother and thanked me. The other was an approach out of the blue to the great granddaughter of a great uncle who knew nothing of her ancestry beyond her grandfather. She was delighted to receive the details of the family going back to Ceredigion as she only knew about the Manchester facts and we are now very good friends. Now an example of an indifferent result. I contacted a person who had some wrong information from four and five generations back who was not happy but was prepared to enter a conversation. I gave him access to my tree and he garnered what he needed and was grateful. Recently he has altered the material in his tree on Ancestry back to the original mistaken version thereby rejecting my documented version. A third scenario concerns another descendant from a common ancestor who having originally placed that information on that tree changed it while we were talking about it on the grounds that my tree was private whereas another one was public and he could see it. I sent him all the documentary proof and offered to make him a guest on my tree and he has steadfastly rejected to alter his stance. Of course I have a number of people who have been plain rude and told me where to get off. If their tree is a public one on Ancestry I then post a comment on the appropriate person for others to take note and I find this works wonders as the information is soon altered. After this happens I remove the comment. All the best to everyone Edward > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 21:21:28 +0100 > From: yr achwr <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Dyfed] The Written word. > To: robert williams <[email protected]>, [email protected] > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Robert, > Been there done that and had the T-shirt, or should I say the in the > invective. > That is why I prefer to use a Pseudo Name when posting to the list. > Anonymity means that I can be brutally honest, without fear or favour. > I have no interest in protracted correspondence with those who "know > better", without any documentary evidence to back their stance. > I have removed my Ancestry from all the various websites where it was once > posted, as I found that so many, would take a name from my tree, and > ascribe descendants that fitted their requirement, but which were factually > inaccurate. > Sharing information, is one thing, contributing to the dissemination of > misinformation by those, who appear to be more interested in numbers than > accuracy, which is replicated ad-infinitum is another. > Where do you draw the line? > Achwr > ======================================== > Message Received: Mar 19 2012, 06:05 PM > From: "robert williams" > To: [email protected] > Cc: > Subject: [Dyfed] The Written word. > > Many Years ago I had an E.Mail off somebody who had traced their family > history using nothing but the I.G.I; Their facts were therefore based on > what somebody else had told them,and more importantly, NO research in to > the Actual Parish Registers had been done whatsoever. How did I know that? > Because I had the Parish Registers here at home. Well,Photocopies of the > originals,but the closest you could get,and much better than depending on > Heresay,and wishful thinking. Well,You should have heard what I was called > after correcting their errors! I was in no way correct as far as they were > concerned,as the Mormons or their transcribers more likely, would Never get > it wrong! Besides which,They didn?t like the truth thrown their way,coz it > didn?t look half as good as they had it written down! Cheers Graham. > ================================ Dyfed list > http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send > an email to DYFED! > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message > > > > ACHWR > >

Annie   I think you may have misunderstood my email.  I was talking only about the records in Cardigan town, St Mary's Parish.   Megan ________________________________ From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, 20 March 2012, 0:01 Subject: [Dyfed] Regarding the name of Evans Someone mentioned that they couldn't find the name of "Evans" in the early registers.  Did they look for these names: Ieuan, Ifan, Iwan, Jevan, Ievan - they are all Welsh names for Evans.  I found Evans in the 1600's St. David's Diocese.    Annie ------------------------------Message: 2Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:46:50 +0000 (GMT)From: Megan Roberts <[email protected]>Subject: [Dyfed] Parish RegistersTo: Dyfdd List <[email protected]>,    car list    <[email protected]>Message-ID:    <[email protected]>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1As many of you will know Findmypast issued the following press release on 1 March 2012:?We have just published almost 4 million Welsh parish registers on findmypast.co.ukThis is the first time that the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online and is fantastic news for anyone with Welsh ancestors. The records cover Cardiganshire, Carmarthenshire, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Glamorganshire. Further details are as follows:     * Baptisms: 1,418,921 records covering 1538-1911    * Marriages: 950,254 records covering 1539-1926    * Banns: 340,002 records covering 1701-1926    * Burials: 1,1! 69,685 records covering 1539-2007Coming soon are records for the following counties: Anglesey, Brecknockshire, Caernarvonshire, Merionethshire, Monmouthshire, Montgomeryshire, Pembrokeshire and Radnorshire. ?Regretably this is not entirely accurate.? I know from my own research in Aberystwyth that the records for Cardigan St Mary go back to at least 1669.? If for instance you search Parish Records on the basis of "Evans" (surname) in Cardigan for baptisms they only go back to 1808, marriages back to 1755 and burials back to 1655 - of course in the latter case these come from the National Burial Index.?I haven't been looking for "Evans", but I thought that I would pick a very common name to illustrate my point.? I have asked FMP for a comment, and if I get one I will pass it on.? ?Megan------------------------------ *************** ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Achwr said; <A Burial and MI for the same person counties as two records. I'm interested, do you have evidence for this ? - the parish registers, being the stated source, don't include MIs as such. <I may well be wrong, and hope I am, but cannot see how they can arrive at the total they claim, unless there is an element of Double Counting These numbers relate to 5 particular counties, what do you feel the total should be if they have it so wrong ? I have no idea. I agree that the phrase "the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online" taken by itself gives an 'optimistic' view of what they have there. The word 'complete' is reckless since it is patently not so at present, and it is unforgivable to confuse burial records with death records. As a matter of interest the FMP site does have a list of parishes that opted out of this exercise. http://www.findmypast.co.uk/content/welsh-collection/parish-registers Gareth Genuki Wales http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/ Gareth's Help Page http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ukwales2/hicks.html Cwmgors a'r Waun http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cwmgors/Waun.html -----Original Message----- From: yr achwr Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 7:05 PM To: Megan Roberts ; Dyfdd List ; car list Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Parish Registers Megan, As I stated in a previous post, they are exaggerating to some extent. A Burial and MI for the same person counties as two records. As far as Marriages are concerned, although only one entry in Parish Registers, I suspect they are counting Bride and Groom seperately, hence doubling these entries. For Baptisms, I suspect they are counting names of Child, and both parents as three entries. I may well be wrong, and hope I am, but cannot see how they can arrive at the total they claim, unless there is an element of Double Counting. They call it marketing! Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Mar 19 2012, 01:48 PM From: "Megan Roberts" To: "Dyfdd List" , "car list" Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] Parish Registers As many of you will know Findmypast issued the following press release on 1 March 2012: We have just published almost 4 million Welsh parish registers on findmypast.co.uk This is the first time that the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online and is fantastic news for anyone with Welsh ancestors. The records cover Cardiganshire, Carmarthenshire, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Glamorganshire. Further details are as follows: * Baptisms: 1,418,921 records covering 1538-1911 * Marriages: 950,254 records covering 1539-1926 * Banns: 340,002 records covering 1701-1926 * Burials: 1,169,685 records covering 1539-2007 Coming soon are records for the following counties: Anglesey, Brecknockshire, Caernarvonshire, Merionethshire, Monmouthshire, Montgomeryshire, Pembrokeshire and Radnorshire. Regretably this is not entirely accurate. I know from my own research in Aberystwyth that the records for Cardigan St Mary go back to at least 1669. If for instance you search Parish Records on the basis of "Evans" (surname) in Cardigan for baptisms they only go back to 1808, marriages back to 1755 and burials back to 1655 - of course in the latter case these come from the National Burial Index. I haven't been looking for "Evans", but I thought that I would pick a very common name to illustrate my point. I have asked FMP for a comment, and if I get one I will pass it on. Megan ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ACHWR ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Achwr said; <That is why I prefer to use a Pseudo Name when posting to the list. <Anonymity means that I can be brutally honest, without fear or favour. I'm genuinely surprised anyone should feel the need to hide behind a pseudonym as some form of protection, from ......... ? Being honest is quite normal behaviour, I assume that the ' brutal ' aspect you allude to is being overly blunt, or pointed, in your comments. Over the life of this list I've developed a 'bed side manner' (survival technique?) which is to soften a contradictory response in some way without lessening its meaning - it usually works, has it ? <I have removed my Ancestry from all the various websites where it was once posted, as I found that so many, would take a name from my tree, and ascribe descendants that fitted their <requirement, but which were factually inaccurate.Sharing information, is one thing, contributing to the dissemination of misinformation by those, who appear to be more interested in <numbers than accuracy, which is replicated ad-infinitum is another. I subscribe to the opposite approach and have maintained comprehensive family trees online for a dozen or so years without becoming aware of the problems you describe. Perhaps I'm being naive. Go on Achwr, reveal yourself, you know you want to really :-) Gareth Genuki Wales http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/ Gareth's Help Page http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ukwales2/hicks.html Cwmgors a'r Waun http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cwmgors/Waun.html -----Original Message----- From: yr achwr Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 8:21 PM To: robert williams ; [email protected] Subject: Re: [Dyfed] The Written word. Robert, Been there done that and had the T-shirt, or should I say the in the invective. That is why I prefer to use a Pseudo Name when posting to the list. Anonymity means that I can be brutally honest, without fear or favour. I have no interest in protracted correspondence with those who "know better", without any documentary evidence to back their stance. I have removed my Ancestry from all the various websites where it was once posted, as I found that so many, would take a name from my tree, and ascribe descendants that fitted their requirement, but which were factually inaccurate. Sharing information, is one thing, contributing to the dissemination of misinformation by those, who appear to be more interested in numbers than accuracy, which is replicated ad-infinitum is another. Where do you draw the line? Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Mar 19 2012, 06:05 PM From: "robert williams" To: [email protected] Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] The Written word. Many Years ago I had an E.Mail off somebody who had traced their family history using nothing but the I.G.I; Their facts were therefore based on what somebody else had told them,and more importantly, NO research in to the Actual Parish Registers had been done whatsoever. How did I know that? Because I had the Parish Registers here at home. Well,Photocopies of the originals,but the closest you could get,and much better than depending on Heresay,and wishful thinking. Well,You should have heard what I was called after correcting their errors! I was in no way correct as far as they were concerned,as the Mormons or their transcribers more likely, would Never get it wrong! Besides which,They didn’t like the truth thrown their way,coz it didn’t look half as good as they had it written down! Cheers Graham. ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ACHWR ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Robert, Been there done that and had the T-shirt, or should I say the in the invective. That is why I prefer to use a Pseudo Name when posting to the list. Anonymity means that I can be brutally honest, without fear or favour. I have no interest in protracted correspondence with those who "know better", without any documentary evidence to back their stance. I have removed my Ancestry from all the various websites where it was once posted, as I found that so many, would take a name from my tree, and ascribe descendants that fitted their requirement, but which were factually inaccurate. Sharing information, is one thing, contributing to the dissemination of misinformation by those, who appear to be more interested in numbers than accuracy, which is replicated ad-infinitum is another. Where do you draw the line? Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Mar 19 2012, 06:05 PM From: "robert williams" To: [email protected] Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] The Written word. Many Years ago I had an E.Mail off somebody who had traced their family history using nothing but the I.G.I; Their facts were therefore based on what somebody else had told them,and more importantly, NO research in to the Actual Parish Registers had been done whatsoever. How did I know that? Because I had the Parish Registers here at home. Well,Photocopies of the originals,but the closest you could get,and much better than depending on Heresay,and wishful thinking. Well,You should have heard what I was called after correcting their errors! I was in no way correct as far as they were concerned,as the Mormons or their transcribers more likely, would Never get it wrong! Besides which,They didn’t like the truth thrown their way,coz it didn’t look half as good as they had it written down! Cheers Graham. ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ACHWR

Megan, As I stated in a previous post, they are exaggerating to some extent. A Burial and MI for the same person counties as two records. As far as Marriages are concerned, although only one entry in Parish Registers, I suspect they are counting Bride and Groom seperately, hence doubling these entries. For Baptisms, I suspect they are counting names of Child, and both parents as three entries. I may well be wrong, and hope I am, but cannot see how they can arrive at the total they claim, unless there is an element of Double Counting. They call it marketing! Achwr ======================================== Message Received: Mar 19 2012, 01:48 PM From: "Megan Roberts" To: "Dyfdd List" , "car list" Cc: Subject: [Dyfed] Parish Registers As many of you will know Findmypast issued the following press release on 1 March 2012: We have just published almost 4 million Welsh parish registers on findmypast.co.uk This is the first time that the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online and is fantastic news for anyone with Welsh ancestors. The records cover Cardiganshire, Carmarthenshire, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Glamorganshire. Further details are as follows: * Baptisms: 1,418,921 records covering 1538-1911 * Marriages: 950,254 records covering 1539-1926 * Banns: 340,002 records covering 1701-1926 * Burials: 1,169,685 records covering 1539-2007 Coming soon are records for the following counties: Anglesey, Brecknockshire, Caernarvonshire, Merionethshire, Monmouthshire, Montgomeryshire, Pembrokeshire and Radnorshire. Regretably this is not entirely accurate. I know from my own research in Aberystwyth that the records for Cardigan St Mary go back to at least 1669. If for instance you search Parish Records on the basis of "Evans" (surname) in Cardigan for baptisms they only go back to 1808, marriages back to 1755 and burials back to 1655 - of course in the latter case these come from the National Burial Index. I haven't been looking for "Evans", but I thought that I would pick a very common name to illustrate my point. I have asked FMP for a comment, and if I get one I will pass it on. Megan ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ACHWR

Someone mentioned that they couldn't find the name of "Evans" in the early registers. Did they look for these names: Ieuan, Ifan, Iwan, Jevan, Ievan - they are all Welsh names for Evans. I found Evans in the 1600's St. David's Diocese. Annie ------------------------------Message: 2Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 13:46:50 +0000 (GMT)From: Megan Roberts <[email protected]>Subject: [Dyfed] Parish RegistersTo: Dyfdd List <[email protected]>, car list <[email protected]>Message-ID: <[email protected]>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1As many of you will know Findmypast issued the following press release on 1 March 2012:?We have just published almost 4 million Welsh parish registers on findmypast.co.ukThis is the first time that the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online and is fantastic news for anyone with Welsh ancestors. The records cover Cardiganshire, Carmarthenshire, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Glamorganshire. Further details are as follows: * Baptisms: 1,418,921 records covering 1538-1911 * Marriages: 950,254 records covering 1539-1926 * Banns: 340,002 records covering 1701-1926 * Burials: 1,169,685 records covering 1539-2007Coming soon are records for the following counties: Anglesey, Brecknockshire, Caernarvonshire, Merionethshire, Monmouthshire, Montgomeryshire, Pembrokeshire and Radnorshire. ?Regretably this is not entirely accurate.? I know from my own research in Aberystwyth that the records for Cardigan St Mary go back to at least 1669.? If for instance you search Parish Records on the basis of "Evans" (surname) in Cardigan for baptisms they only go back to 1808, marriages back to 1755 and burials back to 1655 - of course in the latter case these come from the National Burial Index.?I haven't been looking for "Evans", but I thought that I would pick a very common name to illustrate my point.? I have asked FMP for a comment, and if I get one I will pass it on.? ?Megan------------------------------ ***************

Many Years ago I had an E.Mail off somebody who had traced their family history using nothing but the I.G.I; Their facts were therefore based on what somebody else had told them,and more importantly, NO research in to the Actual Parish Registers had been done whatsoever. How did I know that? Because I had the Parish Registers here at home. Well,Photocopies of the originals,but the closest you could get,and much better than depending on Heresay,and wishful thinking. Well,You should have heard what I was called after correcting their errors! I was in no way correct as far as they were concerned,as the Mormons or their transcribers more likely, would Never get it wrong! Besides which,They didn’t like the truth thrown their way,coz it didn’t look half as good as they had it written down! Cheers Graham.

Brian has mentioned that nothing was around pre 1975 Family History Wise? No Societies etc.; The Society of Genealogists has been going for quite a while now. There are many reference books in print with Family History Family Trees. I've got many here at home. Examples of Limbus Patrum et Morgannie.Also the updated version by J.Barry DAVIES. Dwnn’s Welsh Genealogies.[Incidentally,I am related to Lewis DWNN] Also by Thomas NICHOLAS.[1874] BURKE’s Extinct Peerage,and many others. Lots of books on Royal Connections.[I go back to William the Conqueror on at least six lines] I don’t agree with the DNA angle myself. I don’t want to know beforehand if I am related to any given surname in the world. I would prefer to do the research myself,rather than being a Cheat with a shortcut,as it takes away the Chase of Family History. It maybe alright if you are up a “Brick wall” on one of the many lines you are researching,to find out you are related to the above aforementioned William I, King of England. I already have that knowledge through many hours of research in Cardiff Central Library looking at the many wonderful selection of books on offer for family historians. Cheers Graham.

I meant to send this to list.. sorry Gareth you will get it twice. ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Rachel Boyd <[email protected]> To: Gareth <[email protected]> Sent: Mon, March 19, 2012 8:07:44 PM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Parish Registers Interesting..  I thought Diocese of St Davids covered part of Pembrokeshire as well (ie Narberth area and south).  Did it in days gone by? Rachel Boyd CT, USA ________________________________ From: Gareth <[email protected]> To: Dyfdd List <[email protected]> Sent: Mon, March 19, 2012 7:22:25 PM Subject: Re: [Dyfed] Parish Registers As a matter of interest the FMP site does have a list of parishes that opted out of this exercise. http://www.findmypast.co.uk/content/welsh-collection/parish-registers Gareth Genuki Wales http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/ Gareth's Help Page http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ukwales2/hicks.html Cwmgors a'r Waun http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cwmgors/Waun.html

Robert - Some of the entries on the IGI were extracted from parish records and are, therefore, ok. Other entries were submitted by people in the Mormon Church because they were asked to submit names to the Church fathers so that the deceased person could be baptized by proxy in the Temple. I don't think it was done from malice, but from ignorance. Unfortunately, these records are all combined together on the IGI, and one has to look at each entry to find if it was an extraction (transcription) or a submission. I think the FHL is now in the process of sorting all of that out. I'm sorry you encountered some upset people when you told them their records were wrong. I would prefer to know if any of my records were wrong. I've learned to rely only on original records (or a photocopy thereof) because I prefer the truth. Good for you for trying to help. Lynne -----Original Message----- From: robert williams Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 11:04 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [Dyfed] The Written word. Many Years ago I had an E.Mail off somebody who had traced their family history using nothing but the I.G.I; Their facts were therefore based on what somebody else had told them,and more importantly, NO research in to the Actual Parish Registers had been done whatsoever. How did I know that? Because I had the Parish Registers here at home. Well,Photocopies of the originals,but the closest you could get,and much better than depending on Heresay,and wishful thinking. Well,You should have heard what I was called after correcting their errors! I was in no way correct as far as they were concerned,as the Mormons or their transcribers more likely, would Never get it wrong! Besides which,They didn’t like the truth thrown their way,coz it didn’t look half as good as they had it written down! Cheers Graham. ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Dai Interesting Point - and I believe the name "Western telegraph" may only used from 1916 after John Thomas bought it. However in Feb 2004 there was a 150th celebration as shown in the extract below. I have a scan of an extract from the front page of the very first edition on Wednesday February 1st 1854 when it was called "Haverfordwest & Milford Haven Telegraph" price fourpence. It was printed in an article in the telegraph on January 21st 2004 with various articles on the history of the paper. You can't read the body of the text but if anyone want's a copy of the front page extract just for interest let me know. Cheers Pat "Birthday for The Western Telegraph 13 February 2004 The Western Telegraph, Wales's biggest selling local weekly newspaper, has celebrated its 150th anniversary. The paper marked the landmark with a 40-page supplement which went out this week highlighting some of the best stories it has covered over the past century and a half. The Telegraph will produce special sections throughout the year and is marking the milestone by supporting a charity pram push to raise money for the Cystic Fibrosis Trust. Later in the year children will be participating in a schools history competition organised by the paper. The anniversary celebrations have been given a royal seal of approval with a letter from the Queen, congratulating the staff, editor and management on the paper's anniversary." In message <[email protected]>, Dai & Angela Bevan <[email protected]> writes > Hello Pat, > Are you sure that the Western Telegraph existed before 1911, Pat?  > They are only digitising out-of-copyright papers, which they say > are generally before 1911.  The Western Telegraph, I believe, only > started in 1934, being the successor to the Pembrokeshire > Telegraph, which itself only started in 1919. Before 1919 there was > the wonderfully titled 'Haverfordwest & Milford Haven Telegraph and > General Weekly Reporter for the Counties of Pembroke, Cardigan, etc > '.  That is in the list being digitised, for the years 1857 to > 1910. > > Regards, > Dai > > -- pat

As many of you will know Findmypast issued the following press release on 1 March 2012:   We have just published almost 4 million Welsh parish registers on findmypast.co.uk This is the first time that the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online and is fantastic news for anyone with Welsh ancestors. The records cover Cardiganshire, Carmarthenshire, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Glamorganshire. Further details are as follows: * Baptisms: 1,418,921 records covering 1538-1911 * Marriages: 950,254 records covering 1539-1926 * Banns: 340,002 records covering 1701-1926 * Burials: 1,169,685 records covering 1539-2007 Coming soon are records for the following counties: Anglesey, Brecknockshire, Caernarvonshire, Merionethshire, Monmouthshire, Montgomeryshire, Pembrokeshire and Radnorshire.   Regretably this is not entirely accurate.  I know from my own research in Aberystwyth that the records for Cardigan St Mary go back to at least 1669.  If for instance you search Parish Records on the basis of "Evans" (surname) in Cardigan for baptisms they only go back to 1808, marriages back to 1755 and burials back to 1655 - of course in the latter case these come from the National Burial Index.   I haven't been looking for "Evans", but I thought that I would pick a very common name to illustrate my point.  I have asked FMP for a comment, and if I get one I will pass it on.    Megan

I have had DNA testing on myself and family members. I think the autosomal testing is very useful. You will find cousin connections. Some are very hard to trace via paper trails, but others show obvious connections or at least they narrow down possible common ancestry. I have found it very helpful, and I am looking forward to breaking down brick walls as more and more matches show up. Once I see common ancestors for several matches, I can pursue a common, as yet unknown ancestor. The patrilineal and matrilineal testing are very interesting but each is respectively limited only to the father's father's father (etc. ad infinitum) and likewise the mother's mother's mother's mother (ad infinitum) without allowing for any of the names married into the lines to be shown at all. So it is interesting, but very limited in what it can tell you about your ancestry. I highly recommend autosomal testing, and I also blog about it. Susan

The FamilyHistory Library (called something else before then) was founded in 1894 to gather genealogical records and help Mormon families with their genealogical research. -----Original Message----- From: robert williams Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 10:53 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [Dyfed] Pre 1975 recording. Brian has mentioned that nothing was around pre 1975 Family History Wise? No Societies etc.; The Society of Genealogists has been going for quite a while now. There are many reference books in print with Family History Family Trees. I've got many here at home. Examples of Limbus Patrum et Morgannie.Also the updated version by J.Barry DAVIES. Dwnn’s Welsh Genealogies.[Incidentally,I am related to Lewis DWNN] Also by Thomas NICHOLAS.[1874] BURKE’s Extinct Peerage,and many others. Lots of books on Royal Connections.[I go back to William the Conqueror on at least six lines] I don’t agree with the DNA angle myself. I don’t want to know beforehand if I am related to any given surname in the world. I would prefer to do the research myself,rather than being a Cheat with a shortcut,as it takes away the Chase of Family History. It maybe alright if you are up a “Brick wall” on one of the many lines you are researching,to find out you are related to the above aforementioned William I, King of England. I already have that knowledge through many hours of research in Cardiff Central Library looking at the many wonderful selection of books on offer for family historians. Cheers Graham. ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks for the tip, Megan. -----Original Message----- From: Megan Roberts Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 6:46 AM To: Dyfdd List ; car list Subject: [Dyfed] Parish Registers As many of you will know Findmypast issued the following press release on 1 March 2012: We have just published almost 4 million Welsh parish registers on findmypast.co.uk This is the first time that the complete Welsh parish baptism, marriage and death records have been published online and is fantastic news for anyone with Welsh ancestors. The records cover Cardiganshire, Carmarthenshire, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Glamorganshire. Further details are as follows: * Baptisms: 1,418,921 records covering 1538-1911 * Marriages: 950,254 records covering 1539-1926 * Banns: 340,002 records covering 1701-1926 * Burials: 1,169,685 records covering 1539-2007 Coming soon are records for the following counties: Anglesey, Brecknockshire, Caernarvonshire, Merionethshire, Monmouthshire, Montgomeryshire, Pembrokeshire and Radnorshire. Regretably this is not entirely accurate. I know from my own research in Aberystwyth that the records for Cardigan St Mary go back to at least 1669. If for instance you search Parish Records on the basis of "Evans" (surname) in Cardigan for baptisms they only go back to 1808, marriages back to 1755 and burials back to 1655 - of course in the latter case these come from the National Burial Index. I haven't been looking for "Evans", but I thought that I would pick a very common name to illustrate my point. I have asked FMP for a comment, and if I get one I will pass it on. Megan ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

If you live within easy reach of London and would like to hear Brian's talk on 8 September, or attend any other London Branch meeting, you can find details on our website:http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~wlslbfhs/meetings.htm Anyone with an interest in Welsh family history is very welcome to attend. Anna At 22:13 18/03/2012, Brian P. Swann wrote: >I should add then - as a personal plug - I will be speaking on DNA and Welsh >Family History at the London Branch of the Wales Family History Societies on >8th September. > >And at Merthyr Tydfil as part of the 1-day Event being organised there by >the Glamorgan FHS on the 13th October. > >The talk will be based on my own experiences with Picton as a relatively >uncommon Welsh surname and the Phillips DNA Project as a relatively common >Welsh surname. But the conclusions are of general utility to anyone >researching surname origins in Wales. > >With its long bardic traditions and many oral and written pedigrees running >back a long time - Wales has a lot of potential to make an important >contribution in the origin and standardisation of surnames debate. This >will grow and grow as more DNA correlations get published and the procedures >get taken up by mainstream family historians. > >The members of the Guild of One-Name Studies are showing what can be done - >but Phillips, Williams and Griffith/Griffiths/Griffen have substantial >efforts underway - and there is a Wales DNA page at FTDNA where all Welsh >surnames under evaluation are listed. > >So hope to see you at one or the other of the venues above! > >Brian > >-----Original Message----- >From: Eliz Hanebury [mailto:[email protected]] >Sent: 18 March 2012 21:34 >To: Brian P. Swann >Cc: Dyfed List >Subject: Re: [Dyfed] DNA Testing for Unknown Ancestry > >I think it would be great if this is kept on list, no matter how sporadic. I >think you are being helpful to lots of us <G> > >I am loving the explanations of how it has helped people and I have male >cousins who could help me find my 2 X ggf in Wales. > > > >Eliz > >On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 5:25 PM, Brian P. Swann <[email protected]> >wrote: > > Dear Paul > > > > I can help you to some extent - but there are far more experienced > > people in the USA who have done DNA testing to answer this very question. > > > > I can suggest two things. If you want to discuss it with the real > > experts face-to-face - then come to Who Do You Think You Are, 2013, next >February. > > > > I would suggest otherwise you need both a standard 37-marker Y-DNA > > test and also a Family Finder test from FTDNA. I am almost certain > > there will be a discount if you order both together. > > > >================================ >Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I should add then - as a personal plug - I will be speaking on DNA and Welsh Family History at the London Branch of the Wales Family History Societies on 8th September. And at Merthyr Tydfil as part of the 1-day Event being organised there by the Glamorgan FHS on the 13th October. The talk will be based on my own experiences with Picton as a relatively uncommon Welsh surname and the Phillips DNA Project as a relatively common Welsh surname. But the conclusions are of general utility to anyone researching surname origins in Wales. With its long bardic traditions and many oral and written pedigrees running back a long time - Wales has a lot of potential to make an important contribution in the origin and standardisation of surnames debate. This will grow and grow as more DNA correlations get published and the procedures get taken up by mainstream family historians. The members of the Guild of One-Name Studies are showing what can be done - but Phillips, Williams and Griffith/Griffiths/Griffen have substantial efforts underway - and there is a Wales DNA page at FTDNA where all Welsh surnames under evaluation are listed. So hope to see you at one or the other of the venues above! Brian -----Original Message----- From: Eliz Hanebury [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: 18 March 2012 21:34 To: Brian P. Swann Cc: Dyfed List Subject: Re: [Dyfed] DNA Testing for Unknown Ancestry I think it would be great if this is kept on list, no matter how sporadic. I think you are being helpful to lots of us <G> I am loving the explanations of how it has helped people and I have male cousins who could help me find my 2 X ggf in Wales. Eliz On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 5:25 PM, Brian P. Swann <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Paul > > I can help you to some extent - but there are far more experienced > people in the USA who have done DNA testing to answer this very question. > > I can suggest two things.  If you want to discuss it with the real > experts face-to-face - then come to Who Do You Think You Are, 2013, next February. > > I would suggest otherwise you need both a standard 37-marker Y-DNA > test and also a Family Finder test from FTDNA.  I am almost certain > there will be a discount if you order both together.

I would just use one word of caution in this game about Ancestry. In this comparison game - size really does matter, i.e. the data pool of other folk who have tested you are going to be comparing against. Ancestry are subsidising a lot of free tests in the USA to help create a database - but I suspect FTDNA still has the larger pool of overall data. Also storing samples long term is very important. So cost is not everything here by a long shot. Brian -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roy Davies Sent: 18 March 2012 21:25 To: Paul Jubbie Cc: Dyfed List Subject: Re: [Dyfed] DNA (was NLW scanning Welsh newspapers to put online) Hello Paul, The y-chromosone is only carried by males and therefore a close match on the y-DNA test would tell you that you and the person you match shared a great, great, great ... grandfather approximately x number of generations ago. You would have to be very lucky to find a match recent enough for your to overcome your brick wall. However as the databases grow in size the chances of finding a relatively recent match should increase. It is a bit like waiting for Premium Bond prizes to come up. If you want a chance of finding matches sharing a reasonably recent common paternal ancestor e.g. one who lived not more than two or three centuries ago, you need to test a reasonably large number of markers, e.g. Ancestry's Y-46 test. There is an MTDNA test that covers the purely maternal line, i.e. your mother, her mother, your mother's mother's mother etc. but while such tests can prove you and someone else do NOT have a recent great, great ... great grandmother in common even if you do have a perfect match that does not prove you do have a recent common maternal ancestor - unless you have all your mitochondrial DNA analysed which is pretty expensive. Family Tree's full sequence mt-DNA test costs $299 and even it can only prove that you and an exact match share a common maternal ancestor some time within the last 16 generations, which is still not very specific. Autosomal DNA tests can find matches on any of your ancestral lines but they are only reliable going back a few generations, e.g. they can often identify distant relations as far back as 4th cousins but beyond that are less useful because although they may be able to say that you and someone else probably share a common ancestor they cannot say with any certainty how far back that ancestor lived if you and the other person are more distantly related than 4th cousins. Family Tree DNA offer an autosomal test (as well as Y-DNA and mtDNA tests) and they occasionally have sales so itif you are thinking of taking a test with them it might be worth waiting about 3 months and checking their website every week just in case they have a sale in the near future. Ancestry.com currently offer y-DNA and mt-DNA tests. I don't think their current mt-DNA test is specific enough to identify anyone with whom you share a recent common maternal ancestor so I would only consider their y-DNA test using either 33 or 46 markers - a 12 marker test is not much use for proving that you share a RECENT common paternal ancestor with someone. However Ancestry are planning to announce a new test soon - probably an autosomal test but I'm not sure about that. Therefore I would be inclined to wait to see what Ancestry's new test is before making up your mind. Since you have brick walls on both your great grandfather and great grandmother's side I would be inclined to opt for an autosomal DNA test as well as a y-DNA test. However you need not have both at the same time. If they seem too expensive (given that there is no certainty of a close match with anyone already in the database) you could choose one this year and then have the other next year or later still. Ancestry's DNA Tests http://dna.ancestry.com/ Family Tree DNA tests http://www.familytreedna.com Good luck! Roy On Sun, Mar 18, 2012 at 11:53 AM, Paul Jubbie <[email protected]> wrote: >  Hello Roy and others, > I have been reading this thread with great interest and seriously > considering putting some money aside for this.  I have a similar > situation to others on here: > > My great grandfather was a deserted child and grew up in various > instittuions. He never knew who his parents were or when he was born. > No parents names were listed on his marriage certificate and no birth > certifcate circa 1893 can be traced for him despite spending over £100 > looking for one. In the 1901/1911 census he was recorded with two > different surnames; JUBBIE/GUBBIE or STRANGE, and two differerent > places of birth; London or France. > My great grandmother (wife of the above) was fostered as a baby girl > circa > 1892 and never knew her real parents either. In the 1901/1911 census > she was recorded with two different surnames; DAVIES or THOMAS but > same place of birth Llangendeirne.  The marriage certificate does give > a clue to her fathers name but is one of the most common names in > Wales; Tom THOMAS, coal hewer.  There are a couple of possible > candidates for this father in Llangendeirne around the right time but > I have still yet to find any matching birth certificate, depsite > spending well over £100 in search of her birth certicate also. > > I am unsure which type of test/tests would be most appropriate in > helping to find out who the fathers/mothers of the above were and > wonder if anyone might be able to advise me further about it, what > tests would be best and who i would need to get samples from, etc. > > Hoping someone 'in the know' can offer some advice on how to best > achieve a result for this.  Looking forward to any help.  Many thanks. > Paul Jubbie > > ================================ > Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ================================ Dyfed list http://home.clara.net/daibevan/DyfedML.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message